Phoenix is Out of Touch

Started 19 Mar 2019
by defiasbandit
in Tavern
It is no surprise the population is dropping. I write these posts, because I want to help the server. The developers don't seem to understand what players want at this point. Just look at the realm tasks. Zergs teleporting to flags etc.. Let's do a rundown of some of the major issues.


-Stubborness to stick to SI. The server will likely only survive if more zones and content continues to be added. The cosmetics, items, and zones of SI are just dull compared to what came after.

- Task zone teleporting shrinks the frontier and benefits the dominant realm. Same thing every task. Half the frontier is empty due to teleporting. Defending realm teleports mostly kill the action in 2 of the zones. Instead of players roaming zones like Gorge or Collory, you have them teleporting past them. Nobody fights over keeps, because for some reason you can teleport to flags. Instead of fixing the issues, you add a 2 minute port timer. Remove defender teleporting and change teleports to keeps controlled. Add objectives in zones like Gorge and Collory to spread players out. Why are there players under level 40 doing the tasks?

- New New RAs are not rewarding to unlock. Realm and class identity is gone. These changes were made supposedly for balance reasons, when all they did was make ranking up less rewarding. We wanted a few tweaks to Old RA, not a new RA system that doesn't belong here. This was a mistake. Also RR5s should be in the game. The classes here are boring. The custom changes made by the devs have made many classes hollow. Get over your balance concerns, and give players more fun abilities to use.

- Realm/Keep War is irrelevant. The server is just an RP farm in the task zones. Relics mean nothing due to their bonuses and capture mechanic. Keeps mean little since Darkness Falls isn't special. You can XP outside of DF just fine. Feathers are much easier to earn zerging Galla/TG/Sidi. No unique rewards or reputation to farm. Seals are useless outside of salvage. The realm war is non-existent. There could be a realmwide progression system for owning keeps or relics. There could be Keep tasks in between each realm task, where the Realms only fight over keeps for big RP rewards. Have a fight over Relic task separate from the current realm task. The only objective is to fight over relics in a frontier. Have it rotate with the Keep Task. Put relics back in relic keeps. New system where the task rotates between each frontier. Take Midgard relics. If your realm captures the Midgard relics you get the full 10% damage bonus until the next Relic Task. When a new task starts you lose the bonus, but keep the relics in your relic keep. Have it rotate Hibernia - Albion - Midgard. The Realm v Realm focus of the game is pretty much gone, and has been traded in for teleporting near milegates for RP farming.

- Endgame PvE feather disparity. Summoner's Hall and other dungeons don't really matter. The feather rewards are so low that players don't bother. Darkness Falls isn't required since you can just get 15-20k feathers on autostick in a 200 player raid. Dragons are nothing special. They drop little feathers and no unique rewards. Increase the feather rewards in these other zones and add unique drops to them. Trivializing PvE farming is concerning.

- Not much to farm or collect. No reason to farm in the Frontiers if you are level 50. No random or unique drops or reputations. No endgame progression system for PvE. Instead feathers or BP are just used to buy everything, making other types of farming pointless.

- Broken mechanics and classes. Assassins were finally sort of addressed, but there exist many terrible mechanics still. Vanish being one. Det 9 for 22 points on a bunch classes, like Skald. Bard Amnesia should be changed. Range or cast time change. It's so obvious. Lack of speed on classes. Speed potions or charge items at the very least. So misguided to not include these. Entire speed system should be reworked.

Progression and rewards are everything. Too many band-aid fixes that don't even solve the actual problems.

Instead just keep following your vision as the population drops.
Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:31 PM by kratoxin
still better than live imo.
Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:40 PM by fkfreeze
your out of your mind if u think the pop is dropping, maybe fluctuating around realms but it isnt dropping lol.
Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:44 PM by defiasbandit
fkfreeze wrote:
Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:40 PM
your out of your mind if u think the pop is dropping, maybe fluctuating around realms but it isnt dropping lol.
A lot of players feel as I do.

https://unixgeek.com/phoenix.html
Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:48 PM by Aervine
I like your passion towards the game but it's hard to follow when in one paragraph you complain that class uniqueness is gone and in another you complain that speed potions/charges don't exist and more classes don't have speed. Which do you want, uniqueness or to play an arena game where everyone is the same?
Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:51 PM by fastjoe90
I’ve had a great amount of fun the past few months, but I feel like the task zerging is taking some wind out of the sails. I played daoc live over a decade ago. With that said, I remember lots of nights with friends raiding relics and keeps, and defending what we owned. Large scale rvr was the key selling point to daoc. A few days ago on Phoenix, Hibernia took one of the Alb relics and it seemed like nobody could be bothered to pull away from the current task. Funny enough, 15 minutes later someone started a Sidi raid that pulled 100+ ppl. Keeps are taken and lost with next to no defense other than the NPCs. This seems like a glaring issue. I’d like to see all these zergs fighting over something meaningful, instead of just pouncing on any solo/small mans/8 mans they see just for the sake of rps and task credit.
Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:59 PM by defiasbandit
Aervine wrote:
Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:48 PM
I like your passion towards the game but it's hard to follow when in one paragraph you complain that class uniqueness is gone and in another you complain that speed potions/charges don't exist and more classes don't have speed. Which do you want, uniqueness or to play an arena game where everyone is the same?

Speed just like buffing was always a terrible and imbalanced mechanic in this game. There is a reason we have buff potions here. Total mistake by the devs to not overhaul the speed system. Players want to roam the frontiers, not walk around once their hastener buff has fallen off. The custom RA changes are what has killed realm and class identity.
Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:19 PM by DinoTriz
What if the teleporting changed to whomever owned the keeps?

You teleport inside the keep.

Gives a reason to take keeps.
Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:20 PM by Roto23
I disagree with most of your statements, some I agree with.
If there was a thumbs down button, I would have clicked it.

Paragraph 1:
The pop was 2500 NA time last night. I’m super happy with that.

Paragraph2:
We want them to stick to SI. If they bring in TOA, I’ll quit.

Paragraph3:
Teleporting was voted on and its close to 50/50 on remove or keep them; so no sense removing them.

Paragraph 4:
New RA’s are great, way better than old RA’s where Albion had broken SOS on Uth, ala group charge.

Paragraph 5:
I agree with you that they have to make Keeps more relevant and based on their history, I bet they will try to improve this.

Paragraph 6:
End game PVE…, DAOC is rarely some ones choice if they want a PvE game. If you’re a PvE-er and you play DAOC, you got what you deserved.

Paragraph 7:
I would like to see more medium level alb grps leveling in their frontier, but this isn’t something that I consider a high or medium priority.

Paragraph 8:
I hate Bard insta amnesia too. I wouldn’t mind box speed like on live. It should be slightly less then hastener speed.
Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:24 PM by defiasbandit
Roto23 wrote:
Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:20 PM
I disagree with most of your statements, some I agree with.
If there was a thumbs down button, I would have clicked it.

Paragraph2:
We want them to stick to SI. If they bring in TOA, I’ll quit.


Nobody is saying add ToA. I am saying adding features from expansions like ToA that are customized for Phoenix. The PvE crowd which is the majority of the population here might enjoy it. I am not suggesting breaking RvR with ToA, but there are only so many Sidi, Galla, TG raids you can zerg before you're over it.
Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:40 PM by Roto23
One thing I would like to see and I don't think you exactly said this but kinda implied is the task system may get stale after another month. I don't want to see it go away, but maybe twice a day have 1 hour of no tasks. And then some how do something special like triple xp in frontier zones on a random schedule for like 2 hours. I dunno.
Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:56 PM by Aervine
Roto23 wrote:
Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:40 PM
One thing I would like to see and I don't think you exactly said this but kinda implied is the task system may get stale after another month. I don't want to see it go away, but maybe twice a day have 1 hour of no tasks. And then some how do something special like triple xp in frontier zones on a random schedule for like 2 hours. I dunno.

The RvR task system is in place to be a RR catch up mechanic for new players and characters. Limiting the time frame that it is active does not help people catch up. The majority of the task system just runs in the background as you RvR in whatever zone you are running around in.

If you are referencing the PvE task system however, disregard.
Tue 19 Mar 2019 7:02 PM by Roto23
Aervine wrote:
Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:56 PM
Roto23 wrote:
Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:40 PM
One thing I would like to see and I don't think you exactly said this but kinda implied is the task system may get stale after another month. I don't want to see it go away, but maybe twice a day have 1 hour of no tasks. And then some how do something special like triple xp in frontier zones on a random schedule for like 2 hours. I dunno.

The RvR task system is in place to be a RR catch up mechanic for new players and characters. Limiting the time frame that it is active does not help people catch up. The majority of the task system just runs in the background as you RvR in whatever zone you are running around in.

If you are referencing the PvE task system however, disregard.

I wasn't referencing the PvE system, and I also agree with you that 2 hours a day will reduce the catch up ability. I think the task system does a great job in getting less fortunate players to RR5. By less fortunate I mean players that are forced to PUG it up alot.
Tue 19 Mar 2019 7:37 PM by Pops999
A new week and yet another thread. Strange how the same small minority constantly posts how things need to change, while the rest of us just keep on truckin'.
Tue 19 Mar 2019 7:45 PM by Aervine
Pops999 wrote:
Tue 19 Mar 2019 7:37 PM
A new week and yet another thread. Strange how the same small minority constantly posts how things need to change, while the rest of us just keep on truckin'.

A lot of people seem to have gotten bent out of shape around these task changes and I don't really understand why. Don't like flags? Stay away from them, Don't like teleporting? Don't use it. Don't want to zerg? Don't go to the task realm.

I've been loving my time here at 50 (pve and leveling is super boring) so far whether it be zerg surfing, small man or solo. I haven't tried much 8 man grouping as it seems much more elitist and whiny than I care for.
Tue 19 Mar 2019 7:48 PM by kratoxin
Pops999 wrote:
Tue 19 Mar 2019 7:37 PM
A new week and yet another thread. Strange how the same small minority constantly posts how things need to change, while the rest of us just keep on truckin'.

i agree here!

+1
i mean look at live, over 20 years old and it's finally dieing down.. this is FREE and more populated. i highly doubt this server will die any time soon.. JS!
Tue 19 Mar 2019 8:13 PM by chryso
defiasbandit wrote:
Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:27 PM
It is no surprise the population is dropping. I write these posts, because I want to help the server.

I don't think you want to help. I think you are miserable and want the rest of us to be miserable too.
Tue 19 Mar 2019 8:49 PM by Gageody
-Play Phoenix and quit crying (as this is FREE and they get nothing for running this server)
-Go back to live
-Make your own private server with all of your great ideas and watch it tank.

Criticism is helpful, but you’re trying to re route the whole server. To me, sounds like you enjoy live better soo... PEACE OUT CUH 🤙
Tue 19 Mar 2019 11:49 PM by alusnova415
You dont have to play in this server you know, is not like you are paying $15.

The only two things that need change is:

RvR tasks should be for lv35+ only , prior to that go to BGs , this will stop the grey /ciding.

Make the keeps and relics valuable, I had a post when they open the beta to take after warhammer ( in that game taking keeps and forts mean something) I wont repost it instead I will make a suggestion topic, taking what I know now about both games and how I hope improves keeps and relics. Other than that rvr tasks are great.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 12:25 AM by Stoertebecker
5h rvr this evening and not 5 mins without inc, seems the OP is playing an other server. Even the breaks at our PK were with inc.

To the OP directly.... instead of writing walls of text about what could be better, join the staff and do it.
It seems you have some deeper insights of how things should be working.

The staff changed some things within the last 4 weeks where i thought it could be better.
Even the point with more charslots, we were told on Ywain that this isn`t sooooo easy, nearly impossible without going deep into the code.
And the Phoenix Team just did it......awesome.

I´m pretty sure that we`re not nailed on the current patchlevel and more things are otw.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 12:35 AM by waffel
“Quit crying, the server is free and you don’t have to play if you don’t want” is the laziest response possible.

Just because something is free doesn’t mean you can’t bring up issues you have with it. I don’t agree with the OP 100% but dismissing anyone that brings up any issue or has a suggestion makes you look dumb.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 1:12 AM by defiasbandit
Stoertebecker wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 12:25 AM
5h rvr this evening and not 5 mins without inc, seems the OP is playing an other server. Even the breaks at our PK were with inc.

To the OP directly.... instead of writing walls of text about what could be better, join the staff and do it.
It seems you have some deeper insights of how things should be working.

The staff changed some things within the last 4 weeks where i thought it could be better.
Even the point with more charslots, we were told on Ywain that this isn`t sooooo easy, nearly impossible without going deep into the code.
And the Phoenix Team just did it......awesome.

I´m pretty sure that we`re not nailed on the current patchlevel and more things are otw.

There are 4 frontiers to fight in. Why is most of the action in the portal zone near AMG? Look at the current task in Hibernia. Hibernia owns all 5 flags. They just teleport and run into Emain. So instead of action in Collory and Gorge or even Breifine, we have just zerging in Emain. Why would you ever let the defending realm teleport?

Why not have action in the border keep zones like Gorge and Collory? Why would you let Hibernia teleport and skip over these zones during Hibernia Task. What is the point of having teleporting if realms are just going to skip over half the frontier? I can understand teleporting for the invading realms, so you can skip over the milegates. The system is so flawed and most of the task Frontier is empty because of this. The suggestion I offered makes keeps a strategic objective, and pushes the battles into the border keep zones where groups can roam.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 5:17 AM by Stoertebecker
defiasbandit wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 1:12 AM
Stoertebecker wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 12:25 AM
5h rvr this evening and not 5 mins without inc, seems the OP is playing an other server. Even the breaks at our PK were with inc.

To the OP directly.... instead of writing walls of text about what could be better, join the staff and do it.
It seems you have some deeper insights of how things should be working.

The staff changed some things within the last 4 weeks where i thought it could be better.
Even the point with more charslots, we were told on Ywain that this isn`t sooooo easy, nearly impossible without going deep into the code.
And the Phoenix Team just did it......awesome.

I´m pretty sure that we`re not nailed on the current patchlevel and more things are otw.

There are 4 frontiers to fight in. Why is most of the action in the portal zone near AMG? Look at the current task in Hibernia. Hibernia owns all 5 flags. They just teleport and run into Emain. So instead of action in Collory and Gorge or even Breifine, we have just zerging in Emain. Why would you ever let the defending realm teleport?

Why not have action in the border keep zones like Gorge and Collory? Why would you let Hibernia teleport and skip over these zones during Hibernia Task. What is the point of having teleporting if realms are just going to skip over half the frontier? I can understand teleporting for the invading realms, so you can skip over the milegates. The system is so flawed and most of the task Frontier is empty because of this. The suggestion I offered makes keeps a strategic objective, and pushes the battles into the border keep zones where groups can roam.

These is action at least in 2Hib and 3 Midzones, just most of the Albs are too lazy to run and stay camping the amg in emain.
If you skip teleporting for the defending realm most of them will wait 1h til the task switches. Or they run with 6-10fg to minimize the chance to wipe.

As a mid i can tell you exactly what fights we`ll find in Hib (75% of the fights against albs), or in Alb (75% against Hibs) and tons of both if the task is in Mid.
The system isn`t that flawed, OF is flawed with this huge number of players and ppl are lazy to run.
There was a community vote against NF, and even if the staff would say *We switch to NF sometime* it would be a huge work.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 6:46 AM by Sepplord
It is no surprise the population is dropping.

One of the few things i agree on...
After initial rushes and people hardcore playing for the first weeks it is expected and completely normal that playtime per account will decrease and some will completely stop. I personally neglected my RL a little bit in the first weeks and are now back to mostly playing on friday/saturday.

And while it is no surprise that the concurrent activity is dropping, it is very surprising that it is dropping so slow and that there are still so many people in RvR every night


Roto23 wrote:
Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:20 PM
Paragraph3:
Teleporting was voted on and its close to 50/50 on remove or keep them; so no sense removing them.


In the same logic it makes just as much sense to keep it. In fact, you could argue, since it was stated very clear and multiple times that there would be no teleporting and no we have a 50/50split, that it would make more sense to remove teleporting again and not keep it. But i guess that ship has sailed
Wed 20 Mar 2019 7:10 AM by Sofely
Weeks after Weeks, days after days, same 10-15 people complaining about everything and making this forum toxic and far away from the reality of IG Life hehehe.

Server is not exactly like you want it to be ?
Build your own and stop complain all day long.

At start devs change the task system only because a bunch of ppl cried during days about it => it became worst than it was.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 7:25 AM by Pao
I don't know why is there an issue with the tasks. I ignore the task already for a while and there is plenty of action in all zones.

Task only for 35+ chars would be great. It's annoying to have 5+ greys adding all the time.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 8:39 AM by Durgrim
defiasbandit,

I have to admit that I strongly refuse your thread. Not because of its content- this is not of relevance here.
It is the thread title which makes me worry about you once more. Your headlines are tabloid style and implement a clear message already (in a very toxic way) - what you actually want to express - to me it sounds like craving attention up to a certain extend.

I found two nice definitions for 'out of touch'
1. 'lacking up-to date information or knowledge' - A lie and assumption.
2. 'lacking in awareness or sympathie' - A lie.

You did not put a question mark behind your title line - you made a clear statement because something (as often) does not fit your expectations. Your signature (destroy), in direct reference to Uthred's (build) showcase what sick personality you obviously have to bear within yourself.

Your constant needling (totally okay if constructive and in line with netiquette) and not being happy with the situation (can be okay once and twice shared with the community) paired with your virtual social behavior allows only one conclusion for me:
Someone must help you getting off this 'Island of Misfortune' and have your account deleted.

To me this is not freedom of speech. To me, statements like yours in the title are a violation of Rule 8, an unwelcome behavior beyond the limit of civilty.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 9:08 AM by Sofely
Durgrim wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 8:39 AM
To me this is not freedom of speech. To me, statements like yours in the title are a violation of Rule 8, an unwelcome behavior beyond the limit of civilty.

That’s it.
Its pure toxicity and wrong informations.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 9:24 AM by Runental
@ OP. I also do not like many of the features like the PvE End Content or the RvR Situation,- but know what? I just simply dont play them anymore (or atleast less).
Server is still fun though,- if the majority like it im fine with it,- The server lives from population, not from opinions several forum warriors.

/Runen
Wed 20 Mar 2019 10:19 AM by Stoertebecker
Pao wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 7:25 AM
I don't know why is there an issue with the tasks. I ignore the task already for a while and there is plenty of action in all zones.

Task only for 35+ chars would be great. It's annoying to have 5+ greys adding all the time.

Heeeee....my lvl 30 BD solo´d a lvl 48 cleric today !! /flex
Wed 20 Mar 2019 10:28 AM by Greenangel
Keep the majority of players happy the rest can leave.

Numbers allways drop as spring summer comes with better weather in any game

As people hit 50 they play less as well.

This is all normal
Wed 20 Mar 2019 12:57 PM by wubbl0rz
Greenangel wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 10:28 AM
Numbers allways drop as spring summer comes with better weather in any game


any evidence for this claim ? just have a look at stats for steam users. it is nearly the same over the whole year no big drop in spring or summer.

the server is very alive but you can clearly see a player drop in the last 2-3 weeks. what ever the reason may be but i highly doubt its the weather. i have seen a few games die or fail (last one was overwatch) and the first reason with what people come up when player count drop is the weather ... and it never recovered in those games.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 1:11 PM by Ardri
While I disagree overall with OP, i will say the game does feel a bit like a Call of Duty team deathmatch server. There's no realm warfare, keep warfare, relic warfare, none of that. Haven't touched a keep since they implemented the new tasks. Haven't bothered with a relic really the entire existence of the server because they're worthless. Those things are what made DAoC, DAoC. Would be fun to do them every once in awhile.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 1:18 PM by Tritri
Reading Defiasbandit is really starting to hurt my brain

You complain about porting like you are part of a huge majority wanting to get rid of it while we know for a fact since the poll that this isn't even close to the truth

You are so narrow minded and only looking at what you think is best/better without acknowledging any different point of view it's ridiculous


I really don't think you are helping the server at all with your constant flood on this forum, I'm starting to wish for an ignore list and I've never put anyone on ignore in my entire life


Just stop, please.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 1:33 PM by Lollie
Tritri wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 1:18 PM
Reading Defiasbandit is really starting to hurt my brain

You complain about porting like you are part of a huge majority wanting to get rid of it while we know for a fact since the poll that this isn't even close to the truth

You are so narrow minded and only looking at what you think is best/better without acknowledging any different point of view it's ridiculous


I really don't think you are helping the server at all with your constant flood on this forum, I'm starting to wish for an ignore list and I've never put anyone on ignore in my entire life


Just stop, please.

You can add someone as "foe" but not to sure what it actually does.

*edit* actually just tried it, it blocks user posts so ignore away
Wed 20 Mar 2019 2:34 PM by opossum12
I've taken a break for the past week because:

- The RA system isn't great. We wanted OF with adjustments to SoS and GP, instead we got a RA system made to go with ToA without ToA. Just a general RA dump fest. Tanker groups with SoS and no speedwarps, who thought that was a good idea?

- I'm starting to think that players on freeshards are just the general dad (I'm a dad myself) that just wants to sip a beer, run task zones and enjoy a really relaxing game. I have no issues about that, it just seems like it represents 80% of the server population.

- zero siege/keep fights. Keeps in general are useless and irrelevant, might as well just delete them from the map people wouldn't notice.

- OF is plain bad, but again that's part of the experience...

- teleporting around the map is just bad. The tasks are bad. The whole concept of asking players to do specific actions in order to get more realm points is bad. You have a big portion of players that run casually, run task zones 24/7 and never do anything else. There is zero roaming in this game. They could have simply made a buff that you get more RPs per kill when low RR and less when high RR. have that buff last for an hour or so, can only get buff if you capture a specific objective (aka buggane on live). The fact that you allow players to get RPs just for dying makes suiciding on players for RPs a good way to get RPs. It just creates this very odd RvR dynamic of having a bunch of semi-afk people running around looking to die so they can afk and come back in 15 minutes when task restarts.

- The greys running around the frontiers looking to suicide on people is just silly.

- you take a screenshot of a portal keep and all you see is 40-50 people standing afk waiting to ding their RPs.


Edit : I want to add that Phoenix was so much fun in beta. Even if it had almost no population towards the end, people didn't give a crap about the tasks and just roamed. It was so much fun. For sure it was mainly in Emain, I would think mainly because there was maybe 300 players online so you there was a lot of empty space.

I'm sad to see the changes that happened right before the end of beta mostly ruined the server in my opinion. They were so close to getting it perfect, then 2 weeks before the end of beta made huge changes that just wrecked it all up. My 2 cents.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 2:47 PM by Brokenstring
Ardri wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 1:11 PM
While I disagree overall with OP, i will say the game does feel a bit like a Call of Duty team deathmatch server. There's no realm warfare, keep warfare, relic warfare, none of that. Haven't touched a keep since they implemented the new tasks. Haven't bothered with a relic really the entire existence of the server because they're worthless. Those things are what made DAoC, DAoC. Would be fun to do them every once in awhile.

It feels exactly like Call of Duty death match. Or Counter-Strike death match, where everyone just plops into a small zone (or map in CS) and just goes apeshit, dies, respawns right back into the map. It's definitely not DAoC as I remember it from 2002.

The tasks are far from perfect, but the server does need a catch up mechanic. That was one of the downfalls of Uthgard, no RP catch up mechanic. However, I think Phoenix has taken it too far. It's turned the server into a RP farm, instead of RP progression. Which is unfortunate. Someone in my guild posted a herald link to a skald that is level 34 but is about realm rank 5 L 5? I mean that's completely bonkers. It just shows to me that the system has spiraled out of control and needs tweaking.

At the very least limit the tasks in the frontier to level 35+ and have the BGs come alive again if players truly want RPs. Make them work at least a tiny bit for RPs. I'm not sure why 35-39 BG isn't on Phoenix, but I'd prefer that as well and have the tasks in the frontier be 40+.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 2:53 PM by opossum12
Brokenstring wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 2:47 PM
The tasks are far from perfect, but the server does need a catch up mechanic. That was one of the downfalls of Uthgard, no RP catch up mechanic. However, I think

All you need is for RPs/kill to scale according to RR.

If you are RR1, you get 1250 RPs per kill, when you are RR10 you get 500 RPs per kill. Boom here you go, I just removed 6 months of task development right there.

Also remove RPs from getting killed. People think that they won't be getting RPs if they don't get any when they die, but honestly all people do is zerg and run task zones 24/7, you will get kills.

Orrrr.... get 10% of potential RPs when dying.

Example:
A RR1 gets a kill in RvR and earns 1250 RPs for it. RR1 dies in RvR and gets 125 RPs for it.
A RR6 gets a kill in RvR and gets 700 RPs for it. RR6 dies in RvR and gets 70 RPs for it.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 2:55 PM by Lollie
Brokenstring wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 2:47 PM
Ardri wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 1:11 PM
At the very least limit the tasks in the frontier to level 35+ and have the BGs come alive again if players truly want RPs. Make them work at least a tiny bit for RPs. I'm not sure why 35-39 BG isn't on Phoenix, but I'd prefer that as well and have the tasks in the frontier be 40+.

This.
Every time I log into Thid or Cale there seems to be less and less people there. Also I'd give my right nut for Molvik
Wed 20 Mar 2019 4:10 PM by SaintRon
First of all your premise that everyone is leaving is false. It's actually pretty steady.

Second of all at least on the Hib and Alb side people are raging anti social assholes in chat. Pick a class or spec these people don't like they trash you. Apparently unless the poorly played 8 mans can't figure out how to use or play your class/spec it's trash.

Hell if you just like something they don't they trash you.

If we're losing people it's people who wanted to play xyz and are told they shouldn't so why bother?
Wed 20 Mar 2019 4:31 PM by defiasbandit
opossum12 wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 2:34 PM
I've taken a break for the past week because:

- The RA system isn't great. We wanted OF with adjustments to SoS and GP, instead we got a RA system made to go with ToA without ToA. Just a general RA dump fest. Tanker groups with SoS and no speedwarps, who thought that was a good idea?

- I'm starting to think that players on freeshards are just the general dad (I'm a dad myself) that just wants to sip a beer, run task zones and enjoy a really relaxing game. I have no issues about that, it just seems like it represents 80% of the server population.

- zero siege/keep fights. Keeps in general are useless and irrelevant, might as well just delete them from the map people wouldn't notice.

- OF is plain bad, but again that's part of the experience...

- teleporting around the map is just bad. The tasks are bad. The whole concept of asking players to do specific actions in order to get more realm points is bad. You have a big portion of players that run casually, run task zones 24/7 and never do anything else. There is zero roaming in this game. They could have simply made a buff that you get more RPs per kill when low RR and less when high RR. have that buff last for an hour or so, can only get buff if you capture a specific objective (aka buggane on live). The fact that you allow players to get RPs just for dying makes suiciding on players for RPs a good way to get RPs. It just creates this very odd RvR dynamic of having a bunch of semi-afk people running around looking to die so they can afk and come back in 15 minutes when task restarts.

- The greys running around the frontiers looking to suicide on people is just silly.

- you take a screenshot of a portal keep and all you see is 40-50 people standing afk waiting to ding their RPs.


Edit : I want to add that Phoenix was so much fun in beta. Even if it had almost no population towards the end, people didn't give a crap about the tasks and just roamed. It was so much fun. For sure it was mainly in Emain, I would think mainly because there was maybe 300 players online so you there was a lot of empty space.

I'm sad to see the changes that happened right before the end of beta mostly ruined the server in my opinion. They were so close to getting it perfect, then 2 weeks before the end of beta made huge changes that just wrecked it all up. My 2 cents.

You actually get it. The population will continue to suffer, unless there are changes. We have users blaming the weather on the population drop. What are we Uthgard?
Wed 20 Mar 2019 5:15 PM by PingGuy
Without data to show how the dip in population breaks down, we're all just talking out of our ***es. Who's not logging in as much? Nobody knows, except the Phoenix team. So in reality, the ones who are out of touch are everybody but the Phoenix team.

I've been heavily focused on Phoenix since the first Saturday it was open, played here every day and time that I could. Last night, for the first time since launch, I had some free time and played something else. Was it because of greys in RvR? Easy RP's? Boredom? Disagreement with the devs vision? No, it's because I haven't played Rocket League in a long time and I wanted to see how much I still suck (It's a lot, yay for consistency). I was still back on Phoenix this morning leveling my Necro.

Temporary number shifts don't mean anything. Mid seems to have lost some active people the last few days, and Hib/Alb haven't picked up as many as Mid lost. So there is some inactivity there sure. Does it mean anything? I don't know. You don't know. It's too soon to tell anything. The Domination porters have been in since February 22nd, and this is the first noticeable decline we've even seen. To be fair, it's barely a noticeable decline, but forum warrioring sometimes requires grasping at straws to have anything to complain about.

Maybe the server is 80% PvE and those players couldn't give a crap about RvR or the Tasks/Porters. Maybe every single person out in RvR is one more task away from just quitting completely. Maybe the whole server is just AI bots designed around the most annoying trolls ever seen on the internet, and we are part of their social experiment. I don't know, you don't know. So lets all just agree on on thing: Nobody ****ing knows. So let's stop pretending that we do.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 5:15 PM by antiflagdan
You sure as shit annoy the hell out of the people running this shard, but I agree with you most the time.

I do think a slight population decline is only natural on a game this old where a large amount of people come for the nostalgia. I don't really think there is a significant loss in active players due to the current direction, but I think it would eventually cause a loss if it stays this way another month or two.

I think the biggest thing that 99% of people agree on, is that they need to make RvR great again. This team deathmatch, afk, mindless RP farming is going to end up killing this shard. I really, really hope they are working on making siege warfare/keeps/relics relevant. They *have* to know how important this is to daoc. I honestly would be fine with no other changes as long as they redirect the focus from tping to flags, mindlessly half afk RP farming to meaningful pvp. PLEASE make keep taking and defense the focus. This would solve so many problems. The zergs will do something productive besides afk at mile gates and then chasing a small man. The 8man purists will have an easier time finding other 8mans without getting assjammed by zergs. Stealthies will have good strategic locations to pick off stragglers that are going to the zerg and will also have MUCH less of their 1v1's interrupted (I ALWAYS see this happen). Giving Zergs a purpose and direction would do wonders for everyone's playstyle. The zerg surfers wanna have large scale pvp with some fun keep battles, the 8 mans will have their competitive 8v8 without as much interruption, and the stealthies will get their 1v1 honorable fights more often.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 5:44 PM by Brokenstring
The whole weather/its summer excuse just seemed like bullshit the Uthgard devs tried to push to justify no changes for their declining population. Gamer nerds that play DAoC don't go outside, they sit inside and drink Dr Pepper and work on their second healer character to get the other spec. If the server is down, they complain in discord (or IRC back in the day) and click refresh until the server comes back up.

(Only half serious here.)
Wed 20 Mar 2019 6:09 PM by Joc
I'm having fun. I'm guessing the pop will dip some as the newness wears off. The good thing is that they have a great responsive staff. They've done a good job in beta and with the live launch. I also think the resting population will be high enough to still log in for quite a long time. The QoL changes did a lot to ensure that.

They can't please everyone, but they've pleased the majority and still kept true to a 1.65 custom server with QoL changes. It seems that's what they set out to do, so I think its been a success.

Side note: Give us Celt NS please.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 6:13 PM by Runental
antiflagdan wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 5:15 PM
This team deathmatch, afk, mindless RP farming is going to end up killing this shard.

+1
Wed 20 Mar 2019 6:17 PM by antiflagdan
Joc wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 6:09 PM
I'm having fun. I'm guessing the pop will dip some as the newness wears off. The good thing is that they have a great responsive staff. They've done a good job in beta and with the live launch. I also think the resting population will be high enough to still log in for quite a long time. The QoL changes did a lot to ensure that.

Agree with the responsiveness. People expect a lot from these guys who are doing this in their spare time. This game was a bigger hit than they expected, probably. Considering their limited resources of time and staff, they have done a tremendous job.

Definitely the best freeshard by far when it comes to QOL and the leveling experience. I don't care a ton for the ROG itemization, removing some of the cooler sought after items from the world but I don't expect the shard to be perfect. Makes it easier to template your character so you are rvr ready, so I get it. I would just like accessibility to some of the cooler visual drops out there. I am really proud of them for what they have done, here.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 6:21 PM by Vkejai
About the people standing around portal keeps waiting on their ding , that's no different to every other server I played waiting for a perfect group set up or not inviting the people they don't know.

This server could do with some tweaks but it's far better than Uthgard.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 6:56 PM by SaintRon
Given how hyper dogmatic the majority of DAoC players are I don't really know how you go about removing kill tasks (pve/pvp).

If I play a Friar I'd at least like to get a chance to progress my character instead of being left to solo pvp and pve.

I love the server, but some of people on the server spend a good chunk of time pushing their philosophy down their realm mates throat with comments like "play a Friar if you want to solo". Funny that this is coming from adults.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 7:00 PM by cere2
So here's my 2 cents if any want to read. Might be a TL/DR thing but oh well
Just got to Phoenix like 2-3 weeks ago from Live...
On and off from Live since inception, took a 3 year break after TOA because the constant PVE BS to get artifact credit/ML raids etc was way to much for me to even think about. I typically have around 2-3 hours a night to play and at the time, some raids were 6-8 hours long. I hate PVE, which is why I tried WoW for about 1 week and never went back.
Daoc is RVRVR period. It's the only reason Live lasted as long as it did. It definitely isn't the awesome graphics or the amazing feeling you get for finally zerging down Legion....barf.
Here is my issues after playing for 2-3 weeks. So, take that with a grain of salt.
Leveling while boring is just fine, takes some time but I am OK with that. See how fast I can get to 50 on second char etc. Only issue I had with it is the constant running from place to place at sprint speed. No speed of hunt or personal horses to get you from where your leveling to the closest TP or horse route etc. Yes i could have just suicide and /rel but losing exp is a real deal again so that wasn't a real option. If i had speed, even just in my own realm not in frontier zones that would be a big improvement for myself and possibly others.

Now onto my limited RVR experience.
I knew XP was higher in rvr zones so I went to Thid to start...holy dead zone? Why? Xp is not really that much more rewarding there (maybe kill tasks in BG's?) and the old keep style is bleh. NF bridges before live went to NNF are some fond memories of Thid for me. Also, where is 35-39 BG's? Wanted to try that out only to find it doesn't exist. I know some friends that "only" played here, and enjoyed every minute of it.
So, headed out to DL, found some stuff to kill, got one-shotted. Ok, I knew the risk, release. Went to DC for possibly safer alternative...suddenly I gained like 2 bubs and went from 1L2-1L4? I think?
Trying to figure out what I did, I found out about just dying in RVR land was rewarding. So, yeah no more PVE in my own frontier. I didn't just AFK but went out to PVE whiile leveling and if I died while out there I was actually like...Thanks broseph!
Then the dreaded lvl 50 came. Ok, now what do I need to do to get templated/competitive? Oh lawdy, I have to run PVE Raids to get feathers? How many? Noooo!!!!
Went on 3 raids, hating it the entire time, got some feathers, got a few items and went out to see what happens. I am getting rolled quite a bit because I am still untemplated but getting some leeching and had my first solo kill! Only to see him turn green after dying...bah!

One thing I have noticed however is the keeps are totally empty like all the time, and at first my thought was....sort of like it was in Thid, old keeps, no wonder no one is defending. Sorry but some things in OF were just bad design, and the old keeps are the biggest of all as far as I can see. NF keeps are just 10x better and had incentives for taking them. I also notice I cant port to "any" keep we own, even if in region chat I see "57 on DC" it's like well ok...what can we do about it? Please for the love of the game change the keeps, and allow TP to keeps rather than flags...

In conclusion, I would like to see either NF keeps or some updated version of the existing keeps (make keeps great again). That was 75% of what created RVR for as long as I can remember. BG's for lvls 10-49, and feathers earned for killing in RVR so I can totally avoid doing more PVE runs.
Even with this I must say a big THANK YOU to all who put time into creating this. Awesome job so far and keep up the good work!!!!

More to come.

Ceremon
Wed 20 Mar 2019 7:33 PM by kmark101
cere2 wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 7:00 PM
So here's my 2 cents if any want to read. Might be a TL/DR thing but oh well
Just got to Phoenix like 2-3 weeks ago from Live...
On and off from Live since inception, took a 3 year break after TOA because the constant PVE BS to get artifact credit/ML raids etc was way to much for me to even think about. I typically have around 2-3 hours a night to play and at the time, some raids were 6-8 hours long. I hate PVE, which is why I tried WoW for about 1 week and never went back.

...

Then the dreaded lvl 50 came. Ok, now what do I need to do to get templated/competitive? Oh lawdy, I have to run PVE Raids to get feathers? How many? Noooo!!!!
Went on 3 raids, hating it the entire time, got some feathers, got a few items and went out to see what happens. I am getting rolled quite a bit because I am still untemplated but getting some leeching and had my first solo kill! Only to see him turn green after dying...bah!

Sounds like a defias forum alt to post same view of the game with slightly different words.
Also it's hard to believe that you play for some 16 years but still has no clue about templating and crafting did not even came to your mind... sounds like totally fake post.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 7:39 PM by cere2
kmark101 wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 7:33 PM
cere2 wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 7:00 PM
So here's my 2 cents if any want to read. Might be a TL/DR thing but oh well
Just got to Phoenix like 2-3 weeks ago from Live...
On and off from Live since inception, took a 3 year break after TOA because the constant PVE BS to get artifact credit/ML raids etc was way to much for me to even think about. I typically have around 2-3 hours a night to play and at the time, some raids were 6-8 hours long. I hate PVE, which is why I tried WoW for about 1 week and never went back.

...

Then the dreaded lvl 50 came. Ok, now what do I need to do to get templated/competitive? Oh lawdy, I have to run PVE Raids to get feathers? How many? Noooo!!!!
Went on 3 raids, hating it the entire time, got some feathers, got a few items and went out to see what happens. I am getting rolled quite a bit because I am still untemplated but getting some leeching and had my first solo kill! Only to see him turn green after dying...bah!

Sounds like a defias forum alt to post same view of the game with slightly different words.
Also it's hard to believe that you play for some 16 years but still has no clue about templating and crafting did not even came to your mind... sounds like totally fake post.

Did you read somewhere I have no clue about crafting and templating? Like I said I just got here. All I said was I don't like the fact that I once again have to PVE for hours and hours to get a decent template. Templates here to me seem like templating in Molvik on live. A few feather items, some rog's and rest is crafted.
I have not had the time to make 6-7 plat to craft an lgm SC lgm AC lgm Alch each. Which is what I was told it would take money wise to get there.
But hey, I am the real deal dude. Anyone that played live knows Ceremon. Prolly as ezpz rpz for most of them. But thanks for the awesome thought out response.
Flame on.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 7:45 PM by tylerforeal
I was pretty vocal a few weeks ago about the status of rvr/tasks but I think tasks are in a much better place now- the action is spread across more zones now and there is more opportunity for solo/small man.

The teleport flats/keeps/relics and the legions of greys in task zone (Grey Z) are the most glaring weaknesses right now that I see.
-Keeps/Relics are still meaningless, devs have the numbers but it seems like 90% don't give two shits what happens with them. Up the RP bonus significantly for takes/defenses to make it more fun and for the love of god make teleports tied to keep ownership (this is painfully obvious).
-Task credit requirement needs to be revamped. There are greys freaking everywhere in task zones now and they add nothing but annoyance and frustration, get them the F out. Even the yellows suiciding is stupid but I grumble as I get fed RPs.. still stupid.

Don't let idiots feed for task credit and don't let greys get task XP/RP.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 7:56 PM by PingGuy
The way to improve the population of this server is definitely to remove the fun of people who are playing in ways you don't like. Find every single thing that is happening that you don't like and suggest that it is changed. Lobby for it aggressively. Eventually it will get changed and those people who are here having fun in a way you don't like will leave. Somehow that will cause many, many, more people to come play on the server. Somehow...

This message is brought to you by the "Greys in RvR literally hurt nothing, except your feelings" Foundation. A Non-Profit Organization dedicated to pointing out things people would realize if they spent a few minutes actually thinking about it.
Wed 20 Mar 2019 8:08 PM by Aervine
PingGuy wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 7:56 PM
The way to improve the population of this server is definitely to remove the fun of people who are playing in ways you don't like. Find every single thing that is happening that you don't like and suggest that it is changed. Lobby for it aggressively. Eventually it will get changed and those people who are here having fun in a way you don't like will leave. Somehow that will cause many, many, more people to come play on the server. Somehow...

This message is brought to you by the "Greys in RvR literally hurt nothing, except your feelings" Foundation. A Non-Profit Organization dedicated to pointing out things people would realize if they spent a few minutes actually thinking about it.

How dare someone enjoy this game differently than I do! /s
Wed 20 Mar 2019 10:22 PM by SaintRon
Aervine wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 8:08 PM
PingGuy wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 7:56 PM
The way to improve the population of this server is definitely to remove the fun of people who are playing in ways you don't like. Find every single thing that is happening that you don't like and suggest that it is changed. Lobby for it aggressively. Eventually it will get changed and those people who are here having fun in a way you don't like will leave. Somehow that will cause many, many, more people to come play on the server. Somehow...

This message is brought to you by the "Greys in RvR literally hurt nothing, except your feelings" Foundation. A Non-Profit Organization dedicated to pointing out things people would realize if they spent a few minutes actually thinking about it.

How dare someone enjoy this game differently than I do! /s

Because it takes away fill their accomplishments in an old game on a free server.

Oh no.... Lol
Wed 20 Mar 2019 11:56 PM by Stoertebecker
cere2 wrote:
Wed 20 Mar 2019 7:39 PM
Did you read somewhere I have no clue about crafting and templating? Like I said I just got here. All I said was I don't like the fact that I once again have to PVE for hours and hours to get a decent template. Templates here to me seem like templating in Molvik on live. A few feather items, some rog's and rest is crafted.
I have not had the time to make 6-7 plat to craft an lgm SC lgm AC lgm Alch each. Which is what I was told it would take money wise to get there.
But hey, I am the real deal dude. Anyone that played live knows Ceremon. Prolly as ezpz rpz for most of them. But thanks for the awesome thought out response.
Flame on.

Even on live you had to do something, it may be some years ago, but yes, you didn`t get it for free. Remember the Cursed Raids before the nerf?
Compared to live i find the system here very relaxing, at least in Midgard with our TG Queen Cercei.
10-12k feathers in 60-70 mins is a time that everyone should be able to invest, if you like pve or not.
It only gets expensive if you plan your templates like you did on live, only then you need tons of feathers.

If you play Midgard gimme a yell for stuff at costs, but i guess you`re playing hib again, like 90% of my former realmmates do.
Thu 21 Mar 2019 12:24 AM by waffel
Y'all complaining about how you don't want to PvE at 50, yet someone announces a raid on Galla/Sidi/TG and within 30 minutes you got 150 people in the BG ready to go. Apparently people don't mind PvE, huh?
Thu 21 Mar 2019 12:58 AM by Cadebrennus
waffel wrote:
Thu 21 Mar 2019 12:24 AM
Y'all complaining about how you don't want to PvE at 50, yet someone announces a raid on Galla/Sidi/TG and within 30 minutes you got 150 people in the BG ready to go. Apparently people don't mind PvE, huh?

More like people NEED to PvE rather than WANT to PvE which is why it fills up so fast. The requirement to regularly PvE in order to RvR is why I and many others burned out on the server.
Thu 21 Mar 2019 2:28 AM by lurker
This doesn't make sense... In what way are you required to pve for rvr after getting your template!?

Cadebrennus wrote: The requirement to regularly PvE in order to RvR is why I and many others burned out on the server.
Thu 21 Mar 2019 4:41 AM by semadin
The whole system constantly around flags is weird. takes the soul out of the game. there's no substance to this constant exchange of flags (which take no effort to do so).

I always thought the domination task around the previous setup was the strangest and had the least to do with the heart of the game - the 'war' - as it just encouraged this stupid dance with no exchange of actual resources (land/relics/whatever).

Anyway, the game feels pointless in this state where the flags facilitate people not fighting over the core war objectives.
Thu 21 Mar 2019 12:26 PM by kratoxin
semadin wrote:
Thu 21 Mar 2019 4:41 AM
The whole system constantly around flags is weird. takes the soul out of the game. there's no substance to this constant exchange of flags (which take no effort to do so).

I always thought the domination task around the previous setup was the strangest and had the least to do with the heart of the game - the 'war' - as it just encouraged this stupid dance with no exchange of actual resources (land/relics/whatever).

Anyway, the game feels pointless in this state where the flags facilitate people not fighting over the core war objectives.

The more i watch streams of Phoenix RvR the more i see this making sense... more people are focused around the flags rather than keeps... REMOVE flags and make it more focused on KEEPS. Not to mention Midgard seems to be the only realm doing objectives but no defence from albion or hibernia.
Thu 21 Mar 2019 1:31 PM by Uthred
kratoxin wrote:
Thu 21 Mar 2019 12:26 PM
The more i watch streams of Phoenix RvR the more i see this making sense... more people are focused around the flags rather than keeps... REMOVE flags and make it more focused on KEEPS. Not to mention Midgard seems to be the only realm doing objectives but no defence from albion or hibernia.


Maybe, instead of watching streams, you should start leveling your toons? Highest toon on your account is level 12. But complaining about the bad rvr situation. Really, i like your kind of humor.

Even though I somehow believe that defias really thinks that opening threads like this one, will help the server, they are doing the opposite. They are spreading toxicity and a mood as if the server is nearly dead just because we (the staff) didnt listen to him and his countless "ideas". Every time you open such a thread, other people will easily jump on the toxicity-train (like the guy i quoted above) and people that really enjoy the server might get the impression, that the end of the world aka the server is near.

Besides that, it is very disrespectful and demotivating for the whole team which spent endless hours every day to offer a stable and fun freeshard. Yes, we dont have any problems if you criticize patches and changes we did. We are even happy to have feedback that is not always positive. But at the moment a lot of threads are totally out of hand and people totally forgot that they are not the only ones on this server.

Maybe at least try to keep this in mind, before you open the next phoenix-is-the-worst-server-ever-thread.

Anyways. Im going to lock this thread now, but will let you know, that there will be some more changes (rvrwise and pvewise) very soon, that will offer some new content and some new features. Stay tuned and have an eye on the "planned changes" section.
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