Feels like Valewalker are stuck in pre 1.70 patches style- and abilitywise. Also missing a unique mechanic, no1 knows.

Started 20 Mar 2020
by Failwalker
in Suggestions
Hello.
I was wondering why VW got not a single useful "upgrade" of what have been added to Live Daoc at patches after 1.70 while each and everyone else got magnificant changes to their kits (pala,skald,friar,thane to name some.)
Also i was talking with one of the people that tested VW during alpha or beta and i told him about that mechanic thats unique to VW. Seems like it is not implented, too. No other shard ever got it working to this day, maybe its not possible?)
Anyways will copy paste my report/livetest of it that i made for the other freeshard some years ago^^
Maybe one of your coders get bored and wanna try to implent it.

First off the showing of the "VW special mechanic" that exists since SI release in 2003, as shown from the old ign forum post i found.



MY bugreport for VW special mechanic:

When reading old comments on ign about live-daoc they were talking about some special meleemechanic that only exists for VW as it seems and it looks like it is not working on uth atm(or maybe it does but i missed it
Reproduction Steps

1. Log two meleeclasses of at least 1 has to be a VW that each have access to evade+ evadeopener or parry + parryopener
2. Let charA hit the mob so the mob attacks him. Wait for charA to evade or parry.
3. Let the VW start attacking with his evade- or parrycombo, depending
4. Did the evadeopener(or parry) work ? Y/n?
5. Compare with live
Intended Behavior

Add the missing the meleemechanic to the game if possible

If several VW are fighting the same target and their "victim"(doesnt matter if real enemy or mob) is triggering a evade or parry off one of those VW, all five VW will be able to perform their parry- (Lvl4 style "Sawgrass" or evadecombo (lvl8 "Arboreal Fire".

Or another example. A hero is tanking a mob/enemy and gets a parry or evade(very lucky^^). Any VW nearby, doesnt matter if he is grouped or ungrouped with that hero, could start using their parry- or evadechain right on that mob/enemy.
Evidence

LIVE:VW + hero grouped/ungrouped, Parrycombo against treemobs
https://youtu.be/sX7KnvxyOdM
https://youtu.be/NiSF-WtTu4k

https://youtu.be/0g_xbS0jU6w
2 VW facing(ungrouped) an Armsman, testing with evadechain. Also workes


And from ign forums 2003ish they are talking about just that special mechanic.

http://web.archive.org/web/20030725120424/http://vnboards.ign.com/message.asp?topic=50882722&page=2



"Just FYI for the "Parry topic" above. The pre-requisite for Sawgrass is "you parry", as it states when you delve the style. The pre-requisite for Thorny Shield is "target is parried", even though it does'nt delve that way, that is the manner in which it works. Under the second criteria, if anyone parries your target (including yourself), Thorny Shield will function. This is very useful when you are supporting a primary tank who is holding aggro and has high parry skills, ie; Spear Hero, Celtic Dual BM, or Large Weapon Champ.It does not function when you are parried by an opponent.

I have used this style in this manner literally dozens of times and I am can assure you it works in this manner. Arborial Fire works in the same manner off evade, use it when a Nightshade is tanking and you can start the chain constantly."

"FYI, the evade chain is the same way.
'TARGET IS EVADED'
Thus, valewalkers can do their evade chain if a tank holding aggro evades. This works very well in groups of 2+ valewalkers. LET THE BURNING BEGIN!"



Second, the mainreason i opened this topic... lack of adjustments to VW utilitykit :p




Colored red = currently not available in phoenix
Green= currently available in phoenix
Black text= my opinion /experience

https://camelotherald.fandom.com/wiki/Patch_Notes:_Version_1.78
https://daocpedia.com/index.php?title=Patch_1.78 (german notes)


Valewalker
The Conflagration Scythe Style has been changed to chain off of Arboreal Shield. The style itself has the following attribute adjustments: Medium Attack bonus, Medium Defensive Penalty, High Fatigue, High Damage. [/quote] Would be a great addition for VW to have in rvr dealing with enemy tankgroups. That Anytime twochain made VW a pretty useful counter against pushing zerker and mercs. Nice spikedamage if you knew how to use it. Not overpowered because 2chain. But IF it lands it hurts . Here we are stuck with Damaging Grasp or Sidecombo ... or Taunting Scythe or praying for parry/evades. On the other hand its almost been 8 or 9 years since the last big freeshard had this VW style setting... VW still did fine the other 3 shards after that

https://camelotherald.fandom.com/wiki/Patch_Notes:_Version_1.83
https://daocpedia.com/index.php?title=Patch_1.83 (same in german)

Vlewalker

 - An attack bonus (+to hit) has been added to the Taunting Scythe style.
Would not hurt to get that to hit bonus but doesnt really matter. Low prio
 - The cost of all spells in Valewalking has been decreased slightly.

 - The following spells have been added to Valewalking:

 28 Thorned Weapons: 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 5.4 DPS damage add, Group buff.
 39 Bristled Weapons: 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 6.4 DPS damage add, Group buff.
 45 Spurred Weapons: 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 7.8 DPS damage add, Group buff.
Never really focused these spells. Nice gimmick but warden dmg add is fine i guess
 40 Blight Swarm: 3.0 second casting time 1500 range/400 radius, Disease.
 44 Blight Burst: Instant cast, 300 radius, Disease. 5 minute recast time.
Would be a nice option but most VW want to skill 50 scythe and so they lack enough points to receive the lvl 44 instant disease ae-spell. So probably not working out for most VW unless they get some discount for that spell
 - The disease amount from the Offensive Proc buff line (Blightstrike) has been increased by 10 per level and the proc rate has been increased by 5% per level.
THIS! Rightnow the disease proc of all tiers are set to 15% proc-chance,same strengh of healreduction... (except for some custom 20% procrate on the lvl46spell which means no more 50 scythe, wth)
So on average(?) 5-6 Hits to get off one _single_ disease is just plain low. We are not dualwielding, nor making roundhoundkicks/whirlwind meleeattacks! Would be fair to get a adjustment towards procchanes of disease.



 - A new 6.0 Group Damage shield (Nature's Vengeance) has been added to Valewalkers at level 45.
For QOL in PVE... but not a big deal :p
 - A new Lifetap which links to a group heal (Immolation) has been added to Valewalkers at level 50. This has a 2.0 second cast time with a 10 second re-use timer. Weird spell, nice to have but w/e if not :p

 - Valewalkers now have access to Protect 1 at level 15.
Thats the only after 1.70 patchstuff VW got on phoenix... i was a little shocked when my VW got intercept and protect...
 - Valewalkers now have access to Intercept at level 19.

 - Valewalkers now have access to Protect 2 at level 23.
W h y
 - Valewalkers now have access to Protect 3 at level 32.

 - The Valewalker ability, Immolation, now has its own separate listing in the spells window, under Arboreal Path. Due to this, Valewalkers will now see two Arboreal Path listings: one listing Immolation and the other listing Baseline spells.









Short version: Please check unique VW mechanic and eventually implent if possible, kk thx
Give VW either the anytime style twochain (Arboreal Shield + Conflag) to deal more pressure against enemy tankgrps
OR adjust diseaseproc of VW on higher tiers so hibgrps have some solid alternative chance of getting disease on their targets without depending on an eld everytime :I

Sorry for engrish, hope you have a look.
Fri 20 Mar 2020 12:53 PM by inoeth
imo vw is in a very good position right now, maybe even too good sometimes.
all other classes you mentioned were like close to unplayable without the changes, thats not the case with vw.
Mon 23 Mar 2020 9:44 AM by Failwalker
As example Thanes in old RA setting were unplayable due to lack of Det and their really broken unique RA (old RA setting pre 1.70) aka Static field.
Cant compare with what they get/have here tbh. Det and a working RA static field.

On phoenix however they added some really useful spells to thane, as you can see originally added on live back in patch 1.82
https://camelotherald.fandom.com/wiki/Patch_Notes:_Version_1.82
A new spell has been added: Energy Debuff Weapon Proc - Self only Buff - Target resistance is lowered. Damage done is of the spell's given damage type. The spells are as follows at the levels specified: 17 Dissipating Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 3% Energy debuff.
23 Routing Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 6% Energy debuff.
36 Sundering Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 9% Energy debuff.
47 Banishing Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 12% Energy debuff.

Why this 1.82 change is "legit" but other 1.78 or 1.83 changes are not? Why do you think VW is in a good shape? What makes you say so? Because he hits like a truck IF he lands his styles? Because he can lifetab you when he got rooted? Or because once every 5-6 hits you get diseased.


Another thing i noticed. Some of the unique stuff of pre 1.70-1.72ish daoc got added into the server while that one unique thing of VW got removed. Critical chance on his proc-styles... especially blizzard blade pbaoe proc. https://web.archive.org/web/20030429020258/http://alain.hetzel.free.fr/daoc/SI/Enorme%20baffe%20du%20faucheur.jpg


And one of the other VW-tester of alpha /beta told me critchance got removed due to being overpowered on reaver levi-proc.
Is that true?
What made you thing reaver procs could crit, aswell ? Reavers unique talent backthen was the ability to rupt with all of their 3 types of pbaoe...
(AoE Attack Debuff Chant, AoE Absorption Debuff Chant or AoE Direct Damage Chant)
And maybe someone can confirm, all reavers auras are rupting on phoenix and yet i hardly see any people playing them ? Levi mustbe too OP.
Mon 23 Mar 2020 10:22 AM by Forlornhope
Failwalker wrote: ↑
Mon 23 Mar 2020 9:44 AM
As example Thanes in old RA setting were unplayable due to lack of Det and their really broken unique RA (old RA setting pre 1.70) aka Static field.
Cant compare with what they get/have here tbh. Det and a working RA static field.

On phoenix however they added some really useful spells to thane, as you can see originally added on live back in patch 1.82
https://camelotherald.fandom.com/wiki/Patch_Notes:_Version_1.82
A new spell has been added: Energy Debuff Weapon Proc - Self only Buff - Target resistance is lowered. Damage done is of the spell's given damage type. The spells are as follows at the levels specified: 17 Dissipating Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 3% Energy debuff.
23 Routing Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 6% Energy debuff.
36 Sundering Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 9% Energy debuff.
47 Banishing Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 12% Energy debuff.

Why this 1.82 change is "legit" but other 1.78 or 1.83 changes are not? Why do you think VW is in a good shape? What makes you say so? Because he hits like a truck IF he lands his styles? Because he can lifetab you when he got rooted? Or because once every 5-6 hits you get diseased.


Another thing i noticed. Some of the unique stuff of pre 1.70-1.72ish daoc got added into the server while that one unique thing of VW got removed. Critical chance on his proc-styles... especially blizzard blade pbaoe proc. https://web.archive.org/web/20030429020258/http://alain.hetzel.free.fr/daoc/SI/Enorme%20baffe%20du%20faucheur.jpg


And one of the other VW-tester of alpha /beta told me critchance got removed due to being overpowered on reaver levi-proc.
Is that true?
What made you thing reaver procs could crit, aswell ? Reavers unique talent backthen was the ability to rupt with all of their 3 types of pbaoe...
(AoE Attack Debuff Chant, AoE Absorption Debuff Chant or AoE Direct Damage Chant)
And maybe someone can confirm, all reavers auras are rupting on phoenix and yet i hardly see any people playing them ? Levi mustbe too OP.

The reaver aoe procs really are situational, I generally see people only use the abs debuff because it does not break cc. But if a reaver's locking down two or three casters in the back they can still do it with their two insta lifetaps and dot. It makes it much harder to accidentally break cc at a critical point in the fight. That's just my 2 copper though
Mon 23 Mar 2020 1:40 PM by Razur Ur
What is with Champion? Nobody need Champion in Group without enduchant and acuity debuff and the meele dmg from all Meele Class
is to low vs Caster! Only VW and Savage doing nice dmg :-(. Last time i said in a video with rr11+ Hero with backstyle on Caster cap 360dmg
what is this for shit? Caster doing more dmg and this double with the Caster Time, this server is broken without CL disease or banelords
for Tankgroups vs Caster Groups special vs. alb caster groups.
Mon 23 Mar 2020 2:53 PM by Cadebrennus
Failwalker wrote: ↑
Fri 20 Mar 2020 10:47 AM
Hello.
I was wondering why VW got not a single useful "upgrade" of what have been added to Live Daoc at patches after 1.70 while each and everyone else got magnificant changes to their kits (pala,skald,friar,thane to name some.)
Also i was talking with one of the people that tested VW during alpha or beta and i told him about that mechanic thats unique to VW. Seems like it is not implented, too. No other shard ever got it working to this day, maybe its not possible?)
Anyways will copy paste my report/livetest of it that i made for the other freeshard some years ago^^
Maybe one of your coders get bored and wanna try to implent it.

First off the showing of the "VW special mechanic" that exists since SI release in 2003, as shown from the old ign forum post i found.



MY bugreport for VW special mechanic:

When reading old comments on ign about live-daoc they were talking about some special meleemechanic that only exists for VW as it seems and it looks like it is not working on uth atm(or maybe it does but i missed it
Reproduction Steps

1. Log two meleeclasses of at least 1 has to be a VW that each have access to evade+ evadeopener or parry + parryopener
2. Let charA hit the mob so the mob attacks him. Wait for charA to evade or parry.
3. Let the VW start attacking with his evade- or parrycombo, depending
4. Did the evadeopener(or parry) work ? Y/n?
5. Compare with live
Intended Behavior

Add the missing the meleemechanic to the game if possible

If several VW are fighting the same target and their "victim"(doesnt matter if real enemy or mob) is triggering a evade or parry off one of those VW, all five VW will be able to perform their parry- (Lvl4 style "Sawgrass" or evadecombo (lvl8 "Arboreal Fire".

Or another example. A hero is tanking a mob/enemy and gets a parry or evade(very lucky^^). Any VW nearby, doesnt matter if he is grouped or ungrouped with that hero, could start using their parry- or evadechain right on that mob/enemy.
Evidence

LIVE:VW + hero grouped/ungrouped, Parrycombo against treemobs
https://youtu.be/sX7KnvxyOdM
https://youtu.be/NiSF-WtTu4k

https://youtu.be/0g_xbS0jU6w
2 VW facing(ungrouped) an Armsman, testing with evadechain. Also workes


And from ign forums 2003ish they are talking about just that special mechanic.

http://web.archive.org/web/20030725120424/http://vnboards.ign.com/message.asp?topic=50882722&page=2



"Just FYI for the "Parry topic" above. The pre-requisite for Sawgrass is "you parry", as it states when you delve the style. The pre-requisite for Thorny Shield is "target is parried", even though it does'nt delve that way, that is the manner in which it works. Under the second criteria, if anyone parries your target (including yourself), Thorny Shield will function. This is very useful when you are supporting a primary tank who is holding aggro and has high parry skills, ie; Spear Hero, Celtic Dual BM, or Large Weapon Champ.It does not function when you are parried by an opponent.

I have used this style in this manner literally dozens of times and I am can assure you it works in this manner. Arborial Fire works in the same manner off evade, use it when a Nightshade is tanking and you can start the chain constantly."

"FYI, the evade chain is the same way.
'TARGET IS EVADED'
Thus, valewalkers can do their evade chain if a tank holding aggro evades. This works very well in groups of 2+ valewalkers. LET THE BURNING BEGIN!"



Second, the mainreason i opened this topic... lack of adjustments to VW utilitykit :p




Colored red = currently not available in phoenix
Green= currently available in phoenix
Black text= my opinion /experience

https://camelotherald.fandom.com/wiki/Patch_Notes:_Version_1.78
https://daocpedia.com/index.php?title=Patch_1.78 (german notes)


Valewalker
The Conflagration Scythe Style has been changed to chain off of Arboreal Shield. The style itself has the following attribute adjustments: Medium Attack bonus, Medium Defensive Penalty, High Fatigue, High Damage. [/quote] Would be a great addition for VW to have in rvr dealing with enemy tankgroups. That Anytime twochain made VW a pretty useful counter against pushing zerker and mercs. Nice spikedamage if you knew how to use it. Not overpowered because 2chain. But IF it lands it hurts . Here we are stuck with Damaging Grasp or Sidecombo ... or Taunting Scythe or praying for parry/evades. On the other hand its almost been 8 or 9 years since the last big freeshard had this VW style setting... VW still did fine the other 3 shards after that

https://camelotherald.fandom.com/wiki/Patch_Notes:_Version_1.83
https://daocpedia.com/index.php?title=Patch_1.83 (same in german)

Vlewalker

 - An attack bonus (+to hit) has been added to the Taunting Scythe style.
Would not hurt to get that to hit bonus but doesnt really matter. Low prio
 - The cost of all spells in Valewalking has been decreased slightly.

 - The following spells have been added to Valewalking:

 28 Thorned Weapons: 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 5.4 DPS damage add, Group buff.
 39 Bristled Weapons: 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 6.4 DPS damage add, Group buff.
 45 Spurred Weapons: 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 7.8 DPS damage add, Group buff.
Never really focused these spells. Nice gimmick but warden dmg add is fine i guess
 40 Blight Swarm: 3.0 second casting time 1500 range/400 radius, Disease.
 44 Blight Burst: Instant cast, 300 radius, Disease. 5 minute recast time.
Would be a nice option but most VW want to skill 50 scythe and so they lack enough points to receive the lvl 44 instant disease ae-spell. So probably not working out for most VW unless they get some discount for that spell
 - The disease amount from the Offensive Proc buff line (Blightstrike) has been increased by 10 per level and the proc rate has been increased by 5% per level.
THIS! Rightnow the disease proc of all tiers are set to 15% proc-chance,same strengh of healreduction... (except for some custom 20% procrate on the lvl46spell which means no more 50 scythe, wth)
So on average(?) 5-6 Hits to get off one _single_ disease is just plain low. We are not dualwielding, nor making roundhoundkicks/whirlwind meleeattacks! Would be fair to get a adjustment towards procchanes of disease.



 - A new 6.0 Group Damage shield (Nature's Vengeance) has been added to Valewalkers at level 45.
For QOL in PVE... but not a big deal :p
 - A new Lifetap which links to a group heal (Immolation) has been added to Valewalkers at level 50. This has a 2.0 second cast time with a 10 second re-use timer. Weird spell, nice to have but w/e if not :p

 - Valewalkers now have access to Protect 1 at level 15.
Thats the only after 1.70 patchstuff VW got on phoenix... i was a little shocked when my VW got intercept and protect...
 - Valewalkers now have access to Intercept at level 19.

 - Valewalkers now have access to Protect 2 at level 23.
W h y
 - Valewalkers now have access to Protect 3 at level 32.

 - The Valewalker ability, Immolation, now has its own separate listing in the spells window, under Arboreal Path. Due to this, Valewalkers will now see two Arboreal Path listings: one listing Immolation and the other listing Baseline spells.









Short version: Please check unique VW mechanic and eventually implent if possible, kk thx
Give VW either the anytime style twochain (Arboreal Shield + Conflag) to deal more pressure against enemy tankgrps
OR adjust diseaseproc of VW on higher tiers so hibgrps have some solid alternative chance of getting disease on their targets without depending on an eld everytime :I

Sorry for engrish, hope you have a look.

The short answer is that they cherry-picked what patch level they wanted to run at (OF/NF independent) to favour certain classes and group setups over others, then cherry-picked what RAs are available to favour certain classes and group setups over others, then cherry-picked certain class skills to favour certain classes and group setups over others, cherry-picked what pot buffs are available to favour certain classes and group setups over others, then finally cherry-picked which items are available in which realms in order to favour certain classes and group setups over others.

This, in a nutshell, is Phoenix. Any Questions?
Wed 25 Mar 2020 8:51 AM by Failwalker
Ah found 2 older threads about the same topic, going into the same direction as me. Not a single dev or gm answered on any of it?
Have to believe some of the mainpeople of this server really have had some bad VW-trauma ( /Wave to ronk the skald)

https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=7210
https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=10150
Wed 25 Mar 2020 9:29 AM by inoeth
Failwalker wrote: ↑
Mon 23 Mar 2020 9:44 AM
As example Thanes in old RA setting were unplayable due to lack of Det and their really broken unique RA (old RA setting pre 1.70) aka Static field.
Cant compare with what they get/have here tbh. Det and a working RA static field.

On phoenix however they added some really useful spells to thane, as you can see originally added on live back in patch 1.82
https://camelotherald.fandom.com/wiki/Patch_Notes:_Version_1.82
A new spell has been added: Energy Debuff Weapon Proc - Self only Buff - Target resistance is lowered. Damage done is of the spell's given damage type. The spells are as follows at the levels specified: 17 Dissipating Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 3% Energy debuff.
23 Routing Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 6% Energy debuff.
36 Sundering Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 9% Energy debuff.
47 Banishing Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 12% Energy debuff.

Why this 1.82 change is "legit" but other 1.78 or 1.83 changes are not? Why do you think VW is in a good shape? What makes you say so? Because he hits like a truck IF he lands his styles? Because he can lifetab you when he got rooted? Or because once every 5-6 hits you get diseased.


Another thing i noticed. Some of the unique stuff of pre 1.70-1.72ish daoc got added into the server while that one unique thing of VW got removed. Critical chance on his proc-styles... especially blizzard blade pbaoe proc. https://web.archive.org/web/20030429020258/http://alain.hetzel.free.fr/daoc/SI/Enorme%20baffe%20du%20faucheur.jpg


And one of the other VW-tester of alpha /beta told me critchance got removed due to being overpowered on reaver levi-proc.
Is that true?
What made you thing reaver procs could crit, aswell ? Reavers unique talent backthen was the ability to rupt with all of their 3 types of pbaoe...
(AoE Attack Debuff Chant, AoE Absorption Debuff Chant or AoE Direct Damage Chant)
And maybe someone can confirm, all reavers auras are rupting on phoenix and yet i hardly see any people playing them ? Levi mustbe too OP.

the thane debuff is really only usefull in 1on1 and still is not game changing. single dd dmg is still low, you cant really kill anyone with it, only good for rupt or killing pets. static is really nice but also not game chaning at least in grp rvr. its still hard for thanes to get a decent rvr grp if you dont want to zerg.

VW atm is really really powerfull, those side styles hit very hard, so he does in 1on1 with slash debuff style and i dont see why VW should be buffed. VW got baod and ichor and also are wanted in grps.

i really cant see any major flaw.

#pleasebuffmyclass
Wed 25 Mar 2020 9:39 AM by gotwqqd
inoeth wrote: ↑
Wed 25 Mar 2020 9:29 AM
Failwalker wrote: ↑
Mon 23 Mar 2020 9:44 AM
As example Thanes in old RA setting were unplayable due to lack of Det and their really broken unique RA (old RA setting pre 1.70) aka Static field.
Cant compare with what they get/have here tbh. Det and a working RA static field.

On phoenix however they added some really useful spells to thane, as you can see originally added on live back in patch 1.82
https://camelotherald.fandom.com/wiki/Patch_Notes:_Version_1.82
A new spell has been added: Energy Debuff Weapon Proc - Self only Buff - Target resistance is lowered. Damage done is of the spell's given damage type. The spells are as follows at the levels specified: 17 Dissipating Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 3% Energy debuff.
23 Routing Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 6% Energy debuff.
36 Sundering Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 9% Energy debuff.
47 Banishing Blows 3.0 second cast time/20 minute duration, 12% Energy debuff.

Why this 1.82 change is "legit" but other 1.78 or 1.83 changes are not? Why do you think VW is in a good shape? What makes you say so? Because he hits like a truck IF he lands his styles? Because he can lifetab you when he got rooted? Or because once every 5-6 hits you get diseased.


Another thing i noticed. Some of the unique stuff of pre 1.70-1.72ish daoc got added into the server while that one unique thing of VW got removed. Critical chance on his proc-styles... especially blizzard blade pbaoe proc. https://web.archive.org/web/20030429020258/http://alain.hetzel.free.fr/daoc/SI/Enorme%20baffe%20du%20faucheur.jpg


And one of the other VW-tester of alpha /beta told me critchance got removed due to being overpowered on reaver levi-proc.
Is that true?
What made you thing reaver procs could crit, aswell ? Reavers unique talent backthen was the ability to rupt with all of their 3 types of pbaoe...
(AoE Attack Debuff Chant, AoE Absorption Debuff Chant or AoE Direct Damage Chant)
And maybe someone can confirm, all reavers auras are rupting on phoenix and yet i hardly see any people playing them ? Levi mustbe too OP.

the thane debuff is really only usefull in 1on1 and still is not game changing. single dd dmg is still low, you cant really kill anyone with it, only good for rupt or killing pets. static is really nice but also not game chaning at least in grp rvr. its still hard for thanes to get a decent rvr grp if you dont want to zerg.

VW atm is really really powerfull, those side styles hit very hard, so he does in 1on1 with slash debuff style and i dont see why VW should be buffed. VW got baod and ichor and also are wanted in grps.

i really cant see any major flaw.

#pleasebuffmyclass

I think the Thane debuff was meant to enhance their melee DD procs ....which this server does not have
Wed 25 Mar 2020 11:39 AM by inoeth
gotwqqd wrote: ↑
Wed 25 Mar 2020 9:39 AM
inoeth wrote: ↑
Wed 25 Mar 2020 9:29 AM
Failwalker wrote: ↑
Mon 23 Mar 2020 9:44 AM
As example Thanes in old RA setting were unplayable due to lack of Det and their really broken unique RA (old RA setting pre 1.70) aka Static field.
Cant compare with what they get/have here tbh. Det and a working RA static field.

On phoenix however they added some really useful spells to thane, as you can see originally added on live back in patch 1.82
https://camelotherald.fandom.com/wiki/Patch_Notes:_Version_1.82


Why this 1.82 change is "legit" but other 1.78 or 1.83 changes are not? Why do you think VW is in a good shape? What makes you say so? Because he hits like a truck IF he lands his styles? Because he can lifetab you when he got rooted? Or because once every 5-6 hits you get diseased.


Another thing i noticed. Some of the unique stuff of pre 1.70-1.72ish daoc got added into the server while that one unique thing of VW got removed. Critical chance on his proc-styles... especially blizzard blade pbaoe proc. https://web.archive.org/web/20030429020258/http://alain.hetzel.free.fr/daoc/SI/Enorme%20baffe%20du%20faucheur.jpg


And one of the other VW-tester of alpha /beta told me critchance got removed due to being overpowered on reaver levi-proc.
Is that true?
What made you thing reaver procs could crit, aswell ? Reavers unique talent backthen was the ability to rupt with all of their 3 types of pbaoe...
(AoE Attack Debuff Chant, AoE Absorption Debuff Chant or AoE Direct Damage Chant)
And maybe someone can confirm, all reavers auras are rupting on phoenix and yet i hardly see any people playing them ? Levi mustbe too OP.

the thane debuff is really only usefull in 1on1 and still is not game changing. single dd dmg is still low, you cant really kill anyone with it, only good for rupt or killing pets. static is really nice but also not game chaning at least in grp rvr. its still hard for thanes to get a decent rvr grp if you dont want to zerg.

VW atm is really really powerfull, those side styles hit very hard, so he does in 1on1 with slash debuff style and i dont see why VW should be buffed. VW got baod and ichor and also are wanted in grps.

i really cant see any major flaw.

#pleasebuffmyclass

I think the Thane debuff was meant to enhance their melee DD procs ....which this server does not have

yes and the instants but well 12% increases those 150 to about 170 wow major buff!
still a strafing VW smacks you in several seconds, no buff needed
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