Ambron wrote: ↑Sun 15 Mar 2020 2:37 PMSounds like u want the new archery style which i am no fan of.
And as far as i know the bow dmg is kinda broken on this server (in a low dmg way) so this should be fixed first.
I believe that all archers would be happy about a disease on pen. shot but what is ur reason for it? Why would it improve the gameplay? Why would it balance anything?
Your argument is: I want disease on pen. shot so i am more powerful and kill more easily.
So its another subjective request on this Forum.
#pleasemakemyclassstronger
inoeth wrote: ↑Wed 18 Mar 2020 2:55 PMarchery is fine! dont know why ppl constantly claim it was broken...
its just archers can not rely 100% on bow and that is how they originally were designed, that what many ppl need to learn.
jk123 wrote: ↑Thu 19 Mar 2020 12:30 AMinoeth wrote: ↑Wed 18 Mar 2020 2:55 PMarchery is fine! dont know why ppl constantly claim it was broken...
its just archers can not rely 100% on bow and that is how they originally were designed, that what many ppl need to learn.
Archery is fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine!
Maybe not everyone shares your vision of a weak archery?
Just shut up, idiot.
I only stop by these days to see, how this server goes down with this kind of vision.....Have Fun - lol.
inoeth wrote: ↑Wed 18 Mar 2020 2:55 PMarchery is fine! dont know why ppl constantly claim it was broken...
its just archers can not rely 100% on bow and that is how they originally were designed, that what many ppl need to learn.
Horus wrote: ↑Thu 19 Mar 2020 1:36 PMinoeth wrote: ↑Wed 18 Mar 2020 2:55 PMarchery is fine! dont know why ppl constantly claim it was broken...
its just archers can not rely 100% on bow and that is how they originally were designed, that what many ppl need to learn.
Just for the sake of discussion...
Is archery pretty much the same here as it was on Classic? Yes, I believe so. There have been some arguments of different formulas being used back in the 1.65 era but I don't know if that has been proven or not.
The problem is everything around Archery has changed because of custom rules here on Phoenix that has really weakened bow effectiveness. It is like giving someone an axe to break through a wooden wall. That works fine. Then you build a stone wall in front of them and say go ahead and break through. When they can't and ask for a different tool you say "there is nothing wrong with that axe, it is the same it has always been".
Siouxsie wrote: ↑Thu 19 Mar 2020 2:31 PMHorus wrote: ↑Thu 19 Mar 2020 1:36 PMinoeth wrote: ↑Wed 18 Mar 2020 2:55 PMarchery is fine! dont know why ppl constantly claim it was broken...
its just archers can not rely 100% on bow and that is how they originally were designed, that what many ppl need to learn.
Just for the sake of discussion...
Is archery pretty much the same here as it was on Classic? Yes, I believe so. There have been some arguments of different formulas being used back in the 1.65 era but I don't know if that has been proven or not.
The problem is everything around Archery has changed because of custom rules here on Phoenix that has really weakened bow effectiveness. It is like giving someone an axe to break through a wooden wall. That works fine. Then you build a stone wall in front of them and say go ahead and break through. When they can't and ask for a different tool you say "there is nothing wrong with that axe, it is the same it has always been".
Remove spec AF from combined forces buff
Remove hitpoint buff
Then archery damage will be back to what it should be.
It's because of those 2 things that archery damage is so low.
Siouxsie wrote: ↑Thu 19 Mar 2020 2:31 PMHorus wrote: ↑Thu 19 Mar 2020 1:36 PMinoeth wrote: ↑Wed 18 Mar 2020 2:55 PMarchery is fine! dont know why ppl constantly claim it was broken...
its just archers can not rely 100% on bow and that is how they originally were designed, that what many ppl need to learn.
Just for the sake of discussion...
Is archery pretty much the same here as it was on Classic? Yes, I believe so. There have been some arguments of different formulas being used back in the 1.65 era but I don't know if that has been proven or not.
The problem is everything around Archery has changed because of custom rules here on Phoenix that has really weakened bow effectiveness. It is like giving someone an axe to break through a wooden wall. That works fine. Then you build a stone wall in front of them and say go ahead and break through. When they can't and ask for a different tool you say "there is nothing wrong with that axe, it is the same it has always been".
Remove spec AF from combined forces buff
Remove hitpoint buff
Then archery damage will be back to what it should be.
It's because of those 2 things that archery damage is so low.
jk123 wrote: ↑Thu 19 Mar 2020 12:30 AMinoeth wrote: ↑Wed 18 Mar 2020 2:55 PMarchery is fine! dont know why ppl constantly claim it was broken...
its just archers can not rely 100% on bow and that is how they originally were designed, that what many ppl need to learn.
Archery is fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine! Archery is Fine!
Maybe not everyone shares your vision of a weak archery?
Just shut up, idiot.
I only stop by these days to see, how this server goes down with this kind of vision.....Have Fun - lol.
2100 unruptable is a bit insaneHorus wrote: ↑Thu 19 Mar 2020 4:28 PMMy suggestion is at 45 archery spec make Rapid Fire II uninterruptible like any other melee attack.
Nojil wrote: ↑Thu 19 Mar 2020 5:14 PMI can agree 100% the fact that going higher then 35 archery is a waist of points seems broken to me, also the fact that almost every archer is going melee. There's an obvious flaw here and something is obviously broken. If i go 50 bow i should be wrecking people with said bow not barely doing any damage. It makes absolutely no sense that archer bows are pointless.
Siouxsie wrote: ↑Sat 21 Mar 2020 9:44 AMIt's clear Phoenix staff do not want to address glaring imbalances in the game. Archery not fixed, assassins are overpowered still, necros and minstrel pets still have not been addressed. There was even a 50 page Bard AOE Amnesia thread.. still never was addressed.
But SMs apparently needed a nerf, and vanity pets were important.
Siouxsie wrote: ↑Sat 21 Mar 2020 9:44 AMIt's clear Phoenix staff do not want to address glaring imbalances in the game. Archery not fixed, assassins are overpowered still, necros and minstrel pets still have not been addressed. There was even a 50 page Bard AOE Amnesia thread.. still never was addressed.
But SMs apparently needed a nerf, and vanity pets were important.
This archery(classic) is nothing like live(horrendous)sylvynyr wrote: ↑Sat 21 Mar 2020 3:57 PMSiouxsie wrote: ↑Sat 21 Mar 2020 9:44 AMIt's clear Phoenix staff do not want to address glaring imbalances in the game. Archery not fixed, assassins are overpowered still, necros and minstrel pets still have not been addressed. There was even a 50 page Bard AOE Amnesia thread.. still never was addressed.
But SMs apparently needed a nerf, and vanity pets were important.
Not quite convinced Archery is broken per se, but it feels quite lackluster on a server with HP boost, no buffbots, and everyone running around with SpecAF. Assassins will say the same about PA, but at least Archery is otherwise still using the same mechanics as Live as far as I can tell; PA formula is way different here.
Necro pets feel broken somehow, but not sure why. One theory is that they are not being considered as blue con level ~45 for damage calculations, but rather level 50. Not sure how this worked on Live or what the real deal is.
Minstrel pets were addressed somewhat in a recent fix that addressed the "charmed flag" only being set when the charm was lost/released IIRC.
How is Bard AOE Amnesia even a question? It's been in the game unchanged AFAIK for 20 years.
SM intercept rate was fixed and its still really powerful. The pet was essentially acting like an almost full second health bar for the SM with its own bladeturn at that.
sylvynyr wrote: ↑Sat 21 Mar 2020 3:57 PMSiouxsie wrote: ↑Sat 21 Mar 2020 9:44 AMIt's clear Phoenix staff do not want to address glaring imbalances in the game. Archery not fixed, assassins are overpowered still, necros and minstrel pets still have not been addressed. There was even a 50 page Bard AOE Amnesia thread.. still never was addressed.
But SMs apparently needed a nerf, and vanity pets were important.
Not quite convinced Archery is broken per se, but it feels quite lackluster on a server with HP boost, no buffbots, and everyone running around with SpecAF. Assassins will say the same about PA, but at least Archery is otherwise still using the same mechanics as Live as far as I can tell; PA formula is way different here.
Necro pets feel broken somehow, but not sure why. One theory is that they are not being considered as blue con level ~45 for damage calculations, but rather level 50. Not sure how this worked on Live or what the real deal is.
Minstrel pets were addressed somewhat in a recent fix that addressed the "charmed flag" only being set when the charm was lost/released IIRC.
How is Bard AOE Amnesia even a question? It's been in the game unchanged AFAIK for 20 years.
SM intercept rate was fixed and its still really powerful. The pet was essentially acting like an almost full second health bar for the SM with its own bladeturn at that.
Horus wrote: ↑Thu 19 Mar 2020 4:28 PMSiouxsie wrote: ↑Thu 19 Mar 2020 2:31 PMHorus wrote: ↑Thu 19 Mar 2020 1:36 PMJust for the sake of discussion...
Is archery pretty much the same here as it was on Classic? Yes, I believe so. There have been some arguments of different formulas being used back in the 1.65 era but I don't know if that has been proven or not.
The problem is everything around Archery has changed because of custom rules here on Phoenix that has really weakened bow effectiveness. It is like giving someone an axe to break through a wooden wall. That works fine. Then you build a stone wall in front of them and say go ahead and break through. When they can't and ask for a different tool you say "there is nothing wrong with that axe, it is the same it has always been".
Remove spec AF from combined forces buff
Remove hitpoint buff
Then archery damage will be back to what it should be.
It's because of those 2 things that archery damage is so low.
I agree...some other things custom here working against the traditional 1.65 era archery formula...
-Universal perma sprint
-Ranged interrupt from armor dmg procs
-Instant self heals that are standard for all toons (pots and legion)
-Lowering of dmg type vs armor bonus
Add all these together and archery really takes a hit.
My suggestion is at 45 archery spec make Rapid Fire II uninterruptible like any other melee attack.
Horus wrote: ↑Thu 19 Mar 2020 1:36 PMinoeth wrote: ↑Wed 18 Mar 2020 2:55 PMarchery is fine! dont know why ppl constantly claim it was broken...
its just archers can not rely 100% on bow and that is how they originally were designed, that what many ppl need to learn.
Just for the sake of discussion...
Is archery pretty much the same here as it was on Classic? Yes, I believe so. There have been some arguments of different formulas being used back in the 1.65 era but I don't know if that has been proven or not.
The problem is everything around Archery has changed because of custom rules here on Phoenix that has really weakened bow effectiveness. It is like giving someone an axe to break through a wooden wall. That works fine. Then you build a stone wall in front of them and say go ahead and break through. When they can't and ask for a different tool you say "there is nothing wrong with that axe, it is the same it has always been".
Freedomcall wrote: ↑Mon 23 Mar 2020 3:48 AMTruth be told,
buff archery dmg = best way to buff stealth zerg and adders
jwalker wrote: ↑Mon 23 Mar 2020 11:03 AMHorus wrote: ↑Thu 19 Mar 2020 4:28 PMSiouxsie wrote: ↑Thu 19 Mar 2020 2:31 PMRemove spec AF from combined forces buff
Remove hitpoint buff
Then archery damage will be back to what it should be.
It's because of those 2 things that archery damage is so low.
I agree...some other things custom here working against the traditional 1.65 era archery formula...
-Universal perma sprint
-Ranged interrupt from armor dmg procs
-Instant self heals that are standard for all toons (pots and legion)
-Lowering of dmg type vs armor bonus
Add all these together and archery really takes a hit.
My suggestion is at 45 archery spec make Rapid Fire II uninterruptible like any other melee attack.
One more thing - Arrows used to fly really slow, which means now you can interrupt better with bows but on live you actually shot already the second arrow before the first one was hitting. This is not possible anymore and it makes killing someone before they use last attacker and run away or rupt even harder.
Further, the real old mechanic was played in a time were buffbots and spec af, even templates were more or less not the norm. Once BB and sc was intruduced archery was already considered weak. With TOA Archery got a bit more relevant again with very high dex stat, ToA archery speed and damage but especially 10% range. Further, braggards bow would add a substantial damage on rapid fire shots. All these are missing here, together with the above mentioned changes (like low attack stats vs. high hp/af from targets) archery is just lacking.
I'm however striktly against high level abilities in bow as the current skill trees do not realistically allow all archers to go higher bow without gimping themself in melee (hunter has 1 less skill so that would be the exception). I would introduce abilites around 32-37 with some minor boni (another 5-6% to the current bonus) if you spec higher, to open real hybrid specs but still give a reasonable bonus to higher archery.
Isavyr wrote: ↑Mon 23 Mar 2020 3:40 PMUntil people find a way to make suggestions to archers without improving the stealth zerg situation, I'm a solid no to archery changes. Stealthers are nothing but bottom feeders that attempt asymmetrical warfare. While this mirrors real-life, it isn't positive in a game, which tries to have balanced fun gameplay for the enjoyment of all. Stealth in itself was so poorly designed that in combination with strong openers created an undesirable playstyle. It isn't positive in a game.
Let stealthers suck until the stealther community is willing to embrace a different niche than ganking.
Isavyr wrote: ↑Mon 23 Mar 2020 3:40 PMUntil people find a way to make suggestions to archers without improving the stealth zerg situation, I'm a solid no to archery changes. Stealthers are nothing but bottom feeders that attempt asymmetrical warfare. While this mirrors real-life, it isn't positive in a game, which tries to have balanced fun gameplay for the enjoyment of all. Stealth in itself was so poorly designed that in combination with strong openers created an undesirable playstyle. It isn't positive in a game.
Let stealthers suck until the stealther community is willing to embrace a different niche than ganking.
Lollie wrote: ↑Mon 23 Mar 2020 4:07 PMIsavyr wrote: ↑Mon 23 Mar 2020 3:40 PMUntil people find a way to make suggestions to archers without improving the stealth zerg situation, I'm a solid no to archery changes. Stealthers are nothing but bottom feeders that attempt asymmetrical warfare. While this mirrors real-life, it isn't positive in a game, which tries to have balanced fun gameplay for the enjoyment of all. Stealth in itself was so poorly designed that in combination with strong openers created an undesirable playstyle. It isn't positive in a game.
Let stealthers suck until the stealther community is willing to embrace a different niche than ganking.
The problem is if stealters feel that they suck or thier class is under performing then they will just group up more to compensate which just compounds the problems.
Lollie wrote: ↑Mon 23 Mar 2020 4:07 PMThe problem is if stealters feel that they suck or thier class is under performing then they will just group up more to compensate which just compounds the problems.
Parole wrote: ↑Wed 25 Mar 2020 7:46 PMAll these guys whining about a group of stealthers. 8 people in a group doesn't constitute a zerg. Never has. If you are going to penalize stealthers for grouping and killing solos and small man then you should penalize 8 man visi groups that do the same thing. Maybe drop their ability to have speed or heals for 30 seconds. Gank is a gank - you don't get to be ok with it one way and not the other.
On Phoenix it seems ok for l33t 8 mans to gank every soloer or small man across the realms but when a group of stealthers does it everyone calls for nerfs and custom changes and flames people on forums. Buncha whiners.
Everyone already has access to stealther pots "lucidity potions". And you still complain (these shouldn't even exist imo - this gives a distinct advantage vs stealthers and is in no way reciprocated for stealther vs. visi fights). If you are worried about your 8 man being killed by stealthers, you shouldn't be. If you are tired of dying to a group of sneaks... make some friends and use your invite button. IT WAS MEANT TO BE USED.
Nothing broken about stealthers grouping. Move along.
- Oh yeah and Bow DMG sucks. BAD. TERRIBAD. I can do more dmg with melee during a slam than w/ a crit shot + follow up shot. At least on Uthgard you could crit shot multiple times if your target wasn't running.
/flameon
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