Warrior, Berserker, Savage & Skald... Undecided on my Mid 8v8 Character.

Hi guys, I'm a Veteran DAoC Player... I played for years on Uthgard so I know pretty much all the Mechanics of this Game, but I noticed that here on Phoenix they changed a lot of things (Class Balance, Skills, Melee Styles & Ecc).

So I don't know the current Midgard situation like which Classes are Grouped or which Classes are good (Since Phoenix got a lot of Changes).

I always played a Berserker on Midgard, but I would like to choose it as my last resort, not because I don't like it, but because since I played it for Years I would like to change.

I'm intrigued by Warrior since they can spec 50Weapon having the highest Weapon Skill/Weapon Damage of the Game (Since they are the only class with the Highest Damage Table of 23) and still having Slam... From what I heard the Damage of a Warrior in 2H is not much far off the one of a Berserker thanks to the highest Damage Table/Weapon Damage... So I'm attracted by that.

The Skald would be an easy choice, since I think it will always be needed in group, also is one of the Classes with the highest Outplay Potential, since you can kite to death pretty much every Class in the Game (Minstrels Aside).

Savages seems cool, but don't know, always had mixed feeling about that class...

So even if I mentioned Savages and Berserker, I would prefer picking a Skald and a Warior (Unless there are some unknown reason where picking a Berserker or Savages is "mandatory"

Which is the current situation of these Classes?

Sat 25 Jan 2020 6:23 PM by Quik

One thing to consider about Warrior...

In RvR and general PvE a Thane will be better in most cases simply because he will have the same Slam, and yes the weapon dmg is not as good, his spells more then make up for it. The staff REALLY buffed Thanes spell dmg here and it is awesome.

Now in raids the warrior will shine because of the shield size he can use and will out protect a Thane in the main group, but in sub groups I would still take a Thane.

I loved warriors on live and hated thanes, here it is the opposite. The warrior just doesn't bring as much to the table as a thane total dmg wise, but if you are strictly talking weapon dmg then yes, the warrior is nice, but total dmg the thane is above and beyond in RvR.

Sat 25 Jan 2020 7:16 PM by Forlornhope

Quik wrote: ↑
Sat 25 Jan 2020 6:23 PM
One thing to consider about Warrior...

In RvR and general PvE a Thane will be better in most cases simply because he will have the same Slam, and yes the weapon dmg is not as good, his spells more then make up for it. The staff REALLY buffed Thanes spell dmg here and it is awesome.

Now in raids the warrior will shine because of the shield size he can use and will out protect a Thane in the main group, but in sub groups I would still take a Thane.

I loved warriors on live and hated thanes, here it is the opposite. The warrior just doesn't bring as much to the table as a thane total dmg wise, but if you are strictly talking weapon dmg then yes, the warrior is nice, but total dmg the thane is above and beyond in RvR.

The issue with thane is they don't have stoicism. In the role thanes/warriors fill damage is a non issue, but getting locked down by say a root would be. This would either cause the thane to blow purge, which is better off being used on a slam, or sit there and cast once or twice before the enemy just strolls out of range. On a warrior the root would be almost fading as soon as it's applied if he has det9 (which he should).

Sat 25 Jan 2020 8:16 PM by Quik

Yep but Thane here has high enough spell dmg that if they are rooted they can nuke from a distance and can rupt effectively even if he isn't slamming, and as soon as people react to his casting he is right back in melee which he is still good at.

Sun 26 Jan 2020 3:06 AM by Forlornhope

Quik wrote: ↑
Sat 25 Jan 2020 8:16 PM
Yep but Thane here has high enough spell dmg that if they are rooted they can nuke from a distance and can rupt effectively even if he isn't slamming, and as soon as people react to his casting he is right back in melee which he is still good at.

They're just easily counterable, literally all it takes is for someone to walk out of range while you can't move. Any smart player will do this, and if they don't then they're not going to be smart enough to root you in the first place making it a moot point.

Sun 26 Jan 2020 1:27 PM by Harvest

Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Sun 26 Jan 2020 3:06 AM
Quik wrote: ↑
Sat 25 Jan 2020 8:16 PM
Yep but Thane here has high enough spell dmg that if they are rooted they can nuke from a distance and can rupt effectively even if he isn't slamming, and as soon as people react to his casting he is right back in melee which he is still good at.

They're just easily counterable, literally all it takes is for someone to walk out of range while you can't move. Any smart player will do this, and if they don't then they're not going to be smart enough to root you in the first place making it a moot point.

Not for defending the Thane, since I'm not familiar with these new improvements that the Phoenix Staff gave to it... But that would be true even for any kind of Caster DD since they have the same exact Range on their Spells... That does not make a Caster "easily counterable" since 50% of the groups in RvR are Caster Groups (Not in Midgard in particular, I mean in general).

Math wise (Made the calculation taking in consideration the new Delve Value of the Thane DDs), you don't lose much damage and you literally have a Caster in Mail with Shield that can Back-Snare Peel, have Slam and also have Determination.

Sun 26 Jan 2020 1:38 PM by opossum12

People put way too much emphasis on stoicsm tbh. As long as you keep your purge up for roots, you can manage a thane in a group.

Tbh I'd be curious how good a thane could be in a group if played like a valk, up front using his insta DD, pbae and casted DDs to rupt more than kill, along with the 9sec stun and ST.

The big advantage of savages are theur defenses with the 360 evade. They are extremely difficult to peel because of their evade. H2H damage also comes in "spikes" which is difficult to manage by the other healers.

Zerk has a visual dmg spike (vendo) so the other group can call it and manage it.

Warrior is great overall.

What is the difference in HP between a Thane and a Warr?

Sun 26 Jan 2020 4:25 PM by inoeth

lol root on a tank in rvr ;D
in 8v8 nobody uses roots on tanks because it gives snare immunity

i myself play thane simply because i like the class but in a serious 8v8 grp warrior is much better because stoic and high weapon dmg

svg does really good dmg but lacks of snares, your targets can just run away from you

skald is really strong

zerk dmg is lower than svg dmg but you have back side snare and prevent flight

Sun 26 Jan 2020 6:09 PM by Forlornhope

Harvest wrote: ↑
Sun 26 Jan 2020 1:27 PM
Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Sun 26 Jan 2020 3:06 AM
Quik wrote: ↑
Sat 25 Jan 2020 8:16 PM
Yep but Thane here has high enough spell dmg that if they are rooted they can nuke from a distance and can rupt effectively even if he isn't slamming, and as soon as people react to his casting he is right back in melee which he is still good at.

They're just easily counterable, literally all it takes is for someone to walk out of range while you can't move. Any smart player will do this, and if they don't then they're not going to be smart enough to root you in the first place making it a moot point.

Not for defending the Thane, since I'm not familiar with these new improvements that the Phoenix Staff gave to it... But that would be true even for any kind of Caster DD since they have the same exact Range on their Spells... That does not make a Caster "easily counterable" since 50% of the groups in RvR are Caster Groups (Not in Midgard in particular, I mean in general).

Math wise (Made the calculation taking in consideration the new Delve Value of the Thane DDs), you don't lose much damage and you literally have a Caster in Mail with Shield that can Back-Snare Peel, have Slam and also have Determination.

Yeah the point is though n the role a thane would be filling (peeler) they can be easily taken out of the fight. The amount of damage that they do is a non factor in the main role that they fill in a group. Since any group is likely going to kite a mid group because of the heavy melee a thane will easily be left behind. I played thane at launch as a peeler for my guild group and it happened in almost every fight, so you either have to blow purge on the root, only to be slamed once you catch up or sit there in limbo.

Sun 26 Jan 2020 6:11 PM by SalidorMacCulloch

Solid 8 man rvr most hibs and albs will kite. i find it rare to see mids kite ^^, So all the anti CC all the better. remember 60secs vs Stoicism is 15secs. More then enough time for a kite group to set up.

Each class has a different roll as well. Thanes will have a similar roll then a warrior, for Peals and such. But if needed to switch off and Push. a warrior having 350+ more HP and more anti CC is much better.

My warrior is RR8 and my Thane is RR5.

Fri 31 Jan 2020 10:10 PM by Valis

In my opinion i'd suggest make a Warrior out of those classes you listed, will be easier to xp to 50 with the bomb grp meta and @50 you can do DS groups as tank if you want feathers for gear. In RvR a Warrior who knows how to peel and which targets to guard is much more valuable than a zerk/svg and considering the overall strong rvr skills of most on server can be very easy to be a wasted asset and focused down by debuff train if you are running in a group without godly healers. Final point i'd make is Warriors have a very interesting and fun Realm Ability path/choices with nice active RA like Dashing Defense that can win fights for your group, whereas something like a Savage basically has Det then training in MoPain so is quite one dimensional in comparison? some food for thought, whatever choice you make welcome to Phoenix! /salute