Future Class Balancing - Phoenix Freeshard

Was just curious if there has been any recent talk of taking a look at classes for balance purposes? I know it wasn't a huge priority immediately post launch, but now that we are approaching the year mark, I thought I would ask.

The dead horse that is Warden getting 1.8x points, and shield spec

BD insta Lifetap

SM pet intercept rate

Wizard in general

Just a few that come to mind. I am sure others can add on to this in the comments until just about the end of time also. Thanks!

Thu 5 Dec 2019 3:25 AM by Azrael

Good you opened that thread, devs and especially users almost forgot to talk about specific class balancing.

The dead horse that is Warden getting 1.8x points, and shield spec
-> good point, so hib caster can finally get rid of this useless peelslot, so one spot more for another caster dps. +1 for that

BD insta Lifetap
-> yes, cooldown is ridiculous high on it. should be lowered to 1 or 2 seconds.

SM pet intercept rate
-> yes, rate is ridiculous low on it, should be higher think about 85-95%

Wizard in general
-> yes, should get more utilites or at least higher gtae damage or we could nerf it so we get rid of this gtae problem on towers.

Could also talk about this anytimer snare on arms (stole this idea from another thread), instant amnesia range, base line stun and some other things i forgot and i am too lazy to open the ask the team, suggestion or qq in general tab. Perhaps nerf/buff hunters/scouts (depending on who created that thread) Tell me if we reached the end of time plz. Should really avoid this forum.

edit: most important point is to do class balancing around 1vs1

Thu 5 Dec 2019 4:26 AM by The Skies Asunder

Azrael wrote: ↑
Thu 5 Dec 2019 3:25 AM
Good you opened that thread, devs and especially users almost forgot to talk about specific class balancing.

The dead horse that is Warden getting 1.8x points, and shield spec
-> good point, so hib caster can finally get rid of this useless peelslot, so one spot more for another caster dps. +1 for that

BD insta Lifetap
-> yes, cooldown is ridiculous high on it. should be lowered to 1 or 2 seconds.

SM pet intercept rate
-> yes, rate is ridiculous low on it, should be higher think about 85-95%

Wizard in general
-> yes, should get more utilites or at least higher gtae damage or we could nerf it so we get rid of this gtae problem on towers.

Could also talk about this anytimer snare on arms (stole this idea from another thread), instant amnesia range, base line stun and some other things i forgot and i am too lazy to open the ask the team, suggestion or qq in general tab. Perhaps nerf/buff hunters/scouts (depending on who created that thread) Tell me if we reached the end of time plz. Should really avoid this forum.

edit: most important point is to do class balancing around 1vs1

Insightful, well thought out, and incredibly helpful. Thank you.

Thu 5 Dec 2019 9:25 AM by canzian

Up

Thu 5 Dec 2019 1:51 PM by inoeth

first of all necro needs massive nerfs

Thu 5 Dec 2019 2:33 PM by Horus

Things will never be perfect. When you have PvE vs. 1 on 1 vs. 8 on 8 vs BG on BG..

I thought things were "pretty good" until this latest HP buff. If that was aimed at the Caster debuff meta it has caused a detrimental effect rippling through everything else.

If debuff/assist train DPS was a concern, debuff amounts or duration should have been adjusted. Not just a sweeping HP increase. It vicariously nerfs every class that can have their DPS output stopped via interrupts. Not sure why that even came about. I never saw one post complaining about it.

But just to play along in the spirit of the thread....
The formula for bow damage should be re-addressed and tweaked. Given it is interruptible, has no style effects that can be specced, and has been nerfed based on the HP/armor vulnerability change, it is time to adjust it to increase the DPS based on composite spec.

This is a need for all 3 realms' archers so technically it would be a more balanced change other than just tweaking one specific class in one specific realm.

Thu 5 Dec 2019 2:56 PM by Azrael

Horus wrote: ↑
Thu 5 Dec 2019 2:33 PM
I thought things were "pretty good" until this latest HP buff. If that was aimed at the Caster debuff meta it has caused a detrimental effect rippling through everything else.

It vicariously nerfs every class that can have their DPS output stopped via interrupts. Not sure why that even came about. I never saw one post complaining about it.

As far as I remember they stated several times they do not want to do some flat nerf on this debuff, not sure if they revealed their real intention behind this hp buff but afaik this caster/debuff train was a problem but not the main reason. (if someone can clarify this point i will welcome that)
Not sure if it was a post but i read/heard some of complaint because of it. From my experience it is "almost" the same, if the enemy assist times it perfectly you only see that debuff and die instantly afterwards but it has to be perfect now and no rupt at all on enemy casters which is good imo. Beside that I hear savages complains about this hp buff too because the can't 1shot luris anymore

Thu 5 Dec 2019 3:24 PM by Azrael

The Skies Asunder wrote: ↑
Thu 5 Dec 2019 4:26 AM
Insightful, well thought out, and incredibly helpful. Thank you.

You are welcome! I love to give serious response to threads/posts which are clearly fresh and new and show both sides (advantages and disadvantages/and/or/objective) of a specific (suggested) change/topic/thing. Not like other threads where you can clearly see no efforts were made by OP to check for the same/similar topics or pretending they did not know other threads with same topic exists. Yes, why should somebody assume there are already threads about rare abilities out you do not often see in rvr or rarely complained in advice.

Thu 5 Dec 2019 3:53 PM by Sepplord

Azrael wrote: ↑
Thu 5 Dec 2019 2:56 PM
Horus wrote: ↑
Thu 5 Dec 2019 2:33 PM
I thought things were "pretty good" until this latest HP buff. If that was aimed at the Caster debuff meta it has caused a detrimental effect rippling through everything else.

It vicariously nerfs every class that can have their DPS output stopped via interrupts. Not sure why that even came about. I never saw one post complaining about it.

As far as I remember they stated several times they do not want to do some flat nerf on this debuff, not sure if they revealed their real intention behind this hp buff but afaik this caster/debuff train was a problem but not the main reason. (if someone can clarify this point i will welcome that)
Not sure if it was a post but i read/heard some of complaint because of it. From my experience it is "almost" the same, if the enemy assist times it perfectly you only see that debuff and die instantly afterwards but it has to be perfect now and no rupt at all on enemy casters which is good imo. Beside that I hear savages complains about this hp buff too because the can't 1shot luris anymore

i agree, the HP buff has many different consequences, and i could imagine most of the being intentional. I doubt they didn't realise that buffing the HP across the board would have more influence than just changing debuff-trains. That is just one effect.

Imo when i take a fast look and list influences it doesn't seem fully unreasonable to believe they are intended. And it's a smart way to "nerf" some classes/problems without having to write patchnotes where many classes get nerfed. Because classnerfs create much more QQ.

Thu 5 Dec 2019 10:17 PM by The Skies Asunder

Azrael wrote: ↑
Thu 5 Dec 2019 3:24 PM
The Skies Asunder wrote: ↑
Thu 5 Dec 2019 4:26 AM
Insightful, well thought out, and incredibly helpful. Thank you.
You are welcome! I love to give serious response to threads/posts which are clearly fresh and new and show both sides (advantages and disadvantages/and/or/objective) of a specific (suggested) change/topic/thing. Not like other threads where you can clearly see no efforts were made by OP to check for the same/similar topics or pretending they did not know other threads with same topic exists. Yes, why should somebody assume there are already threads about rare abilities out you do not often see in rvr or rarely complained in advice.

I was honestly just curious if the devs have had any talks about these things. I don't believe the server is in a bad state or anything, and obviously it will never be perfect (though it is closer than any other server currently is), but I would still like to know what their ideas are. If they have even discussed any.

Tue 10 Dec 2019 11:28 PM by Pirhana7

Nothing will ever be completely balanced but after playing here I think the following would help.

(1) Scout : needs something to at least make them as strong as the other 2 archers. Damage table boost, or self buffs, or chain armor, just some ideas
(2) Archers having a reason to go more than 27 in bow
(3) Melee Hybrids having some kind of group buff to make them more group friendly
(4) Melee Wardens getting a boost that would only make them stronger in melee BUT NOT as a group healer spec. (maybe CS or LW ability....
(5) Reavers need a small boost
(6) ValeWalkers need a good anytime style.
(7) Berserkers need a small boost and something that defines them differently than a Savage so that a group would want 1 of each.
(8) SBs could use a small boost or utility.

Thu 19 Dec 2019 7:41 AM by aenne

moin, you should get urgent and time will finally, check the ns and ranger and / or upgrade .. or repair, bow crit max400 huh ???? There has never been anything AND with pa the same thing. short example; fight against troll scalden, crit hit --- 340 with correct arrows ?? then evaded once in close combat N I C H T, with 340 dex ----- troll vs luri ?? are you crazy????

the other sneak maybe you go similar ??

Fri 20 Dec 2019 4:33 AM by gromet12

Insta amnesia not dropping speed of the bard (make it drop the casters speed as well)
Add new archery system into the mix and give archers MOC

Fri 20 Dec 2019 8:29 AM by Siouxsie

There's already a 35 page thread on Bard amnesia here: https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=4544
Was anything done? Of course not.

Fri 20 Dec 2019 2:52 PM by gromet12

Siouxsie wrote: ↑
Fri 20 Dec 2019 8:29 AM
There's already a 35 page thread on Bard amnesia here: https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=4544
Was anything done? Of course not.

Well, reduced range on live eventually...So maybe we can get the range reduced to 1875 vs 2300 since you know its insta, and doesn't drop the speed. I think better yet is to make the bard's castable so they can use it as it is intended (by design looking at the other two realms) vs what it is used for by only (1) realm of the 3;

Fri 20 Dec 2019 6:27 PM by gotwqqd

gromet12 wrote: ↑
Fri 20 Dec 2019 2:52 PM
Siouxsie wrote: ↑
Fri 20 Dec 2019 8:29 AM
There's already a 35 page thread on Bard amnesia here: https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=4544
Was anything done? Of course not.

Well, reduced range on live eventually...So maybe we can get the range reduced to 1875 vs 2300 since you know its insta, and doesn't drop the speed. I think better yet is to make the bard's castable so they can use it as it is intended (by design looking at the other two realms) vs what it is used for by only (1) realm of the 3;

Insta should require even closer than bolt range

This is maybe the best initiating skill in the game. The other realms have no counter as this is instant and has longest spell range in game.