CM undercutting 101

Started 28 May 2019
by merfp27
in Crafting
Hey folks, so I’m not here to tell anyone how to play the game. People are obviously free to list items at any price they want.
However, in every game that has some type of auction or player based market, I see the same thing. Players constantly undercutting others by large amounts and driving down prices unnecessarily.

For those that don’t know, you only need to list an item a 1-5 gold cheaper than the items that are already listed. More often than not, 1g will suffice. When I shop the market, the first thing I do is sort the prices from low to high and the one(s) that are cheapest get bought. I’m assuming this is how 99% of the playerbase does it as well. You’ll have a few who purposely won’t buy an item listed for 1g cheaper because of “morals”, but they are few.
Still, if you’re worried about missing out on a potential sale because of this, then a 5g difference is enough.

There is absolutely no reason at all to list something at 50 and 100 gold differences, especially if you are putting multiple items up. They are NOT going to sell faster. Doing this only hurts the market and profits, including your own.
What happens more often than not, is that people will buy some, then someone else comes along and lists their items for cheaper, then someone else does the same and then someone else comes along and undercuts by another large amount. Now you have an item that was easily selling at 695-700 the day or even hours before, being sold at 550 and less. And only gets worse as more people hit LGM or farm the same items.

TLDR;
There’s no need to undercut the price of the same item(s) by anything more than 1-5g. You’re only hurting your and others profits and driving down prices unnecessarily.
Wed 29 May 2019 12:02 AM by florin
Huh what part
Of a free
Market economy do
You hate comrade?
Wed 29 May 2019 12:18 AM by merfp27
florin wrote:
Wed 29 May 2019 12:02 AM
Huh what part
Of a free
Market economy do
You hate comrade?

Lol hey man, I’m just trying to help us all earn more fake gold.
Wed 29 May 2019 1:40 AM by florin
merfp27 wrote:
Wed 29 May 2019 12:18 AM
florin wrote:
Wed 29 May 2019 12:02 AM
Huh what part
Of a free
Market economy do
You hate comrade?

Lol hey man, I’m just trying to help us all earn more fake gold.

I sometimes dump cheap foreign Arcanium into the market but it’s no good quality - those swords and armor will be brittle and break at the first parry .
Wed 29 May 2019 3:42 AM by merfp27
florin wrote:
Wed 29 May 2019 1:40 AM
merfp27 wrote:
Wed 29 May 2019 12:18 AM
florin wrote:
Wed 29 May 2019 12:02 AM
Huh what part
Of a free
Market economy do
You hate comrade?

Lol hey man, I’m just trying to help us all earn more fake gold.

I sometimes dump cheap foreign Arcanium into the market but it’s no good quality - those swords and armor will be brittle and break at the first parry .

The fermented ginger I use in my combined forces pots isn’t organic and sometimes I just use allspice.
Wed 29 May 2019 4:39 AM by Gorgoroth
That is how economy works and should work, and its good rhat ppl undercut, hence making stuff more available for the realm, hence enriching all, instead of some few.

Good.
Wed 29 May 2019 4:46 AM by Mura
I've pretty much come to the conclusion that the market is pretty much FUBAR here. It's a supply and demand situation where crafting is so easy to level and cash is so easy to come by that there is a ton of supply and very little demand.

I've had quite a few people come to me for quotes on gear, and when I quote them based on 5-6 attempts they tell me they'll just buy it off the market because it's listed at vendor costs there because people are trying to unload pages of 99% from making MPs.

I just vendored an entire page of 99% duskwood bows because I literally could not give them away because nobody wants a crafted bow because the raid bows are so easy to get.

People are just going to keep driving the prices down to try and make a sale, but the market on many items is pretty minimal.
Wed 29 May 2019 8:09 AM by Lev
merfp27 wrote:
Tue 28 May 2019 11:40 PM
TLDR;
There’s no need to undercut the price of the same item(s) by anything more than 1-5g. You’re only hurting your and others profits and driving down prices unnecessarily.

just btw.
i never ever buy someones wares if he's one of the 1g undercutters. if you undercut, do it right.
if there's loads of 500g items and someone thought 499g would be more appealing, i always buy for 500g.
Wed 29 May 2019 8:23 AM by dstrmberg
You are free to start a mafia price fixing cartel if you want!

A legit business model is to harass other players until they agree to your terms. In real life this is called a Union!

Best regards,
A communist hater
Wed 29 May 2019 10:58 AM by Sepplord
in the housing housenumber is the biggest determining factor, not price

low number = frontpage = sales

sorting by price only sorts the current page (unless something changed recently)



And lower prices are good for the buyers, so for more people. It's a reoccuring complaint in any MMO but i never understood the mentality of going as far to publicly complain about it, because it basically boils down to: "QQ someone else sells his stuff cheaper than i do...i wish i was the only person selling this stuff, then i could take whatever prices i feel like"


When quoting someone on 99% you have multiple options, but if you offer him just the 99% item without anything else, then...yeah, your price has to compete with people offloading their leftovers from MP-crafting. You on the otherhand are trying to quote 5-6tries (which is afaik average for 99ers) and would pocket MPs that happen during crafting. Did you mention that they would get MPs that happen? Did you offer billing based on tries?
You offer a single option, the one that has high competition and then wonder that you can't make a sale...That's not how business works
Wed 29 May 2019 1:29 PM by dbeattie71
Lev wrote:
Wed 29 May 2019 8:09 AM
merfp27 wrote:
Tue 28 May 2019 11:40 PM
TLDR;
There’s no need to undercut the price of the same item(s) by anything more than 1-5g. You’re only hurting your and others profits and driving down prices unnecessarily.

just btw.
i never ever buy someones wares if he's one of the 1g undercutters. if you undercut, do it right.
if there's loads of 500g items and someone thought 499g would be more appealing, i always buy for 500g.

But it is.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_pricing

I never buy stuff from a CM if I can’t enter their house to port though.
Wed 29 May 2019 4:18 PM by merfp27
Sepplord wrote:
Wed 29 May 2019 10:58 AM
in the housing housenumber is the biggest determining factor, not price

low number = frontpage = sales

sorting by price only sorts the current page (unless something changed recently)



And lower prices are good for the buyers, so for more people. It's a reoccuring complaint in any MMO but i never understood the mentality of going as far to publicly complain about it, because it basically boils down to: "QQ someone else sells his stuff cheaper than i do...i wish i was the only person selling this stuff, then i could take whatever prices i feel like"

Do people only buy off the first page? I always sort the first page, find the lowest price, and then check the other pages. If there’s a ton of pages, I’ll take the lowest price I found after check several, make a filter and starting browsing again.

This wasn’t a complaint. I’m not against a free market economy and I’m not genuinely upset from losing out on potential fake money. That would be like getting mad when paper trading.
This is just a strategy that a lot of people are generally unaware of. Just like how some people don’t realize that if you see an item absurdly lower than the average price, you can often just buy it and resell it for a profit.
Wed 29 May 2019 5:45 PM by CronU
Well, this is something i noted as well.
In Midgard, and i can just talk about the midgard alchemy market here, it is that far that some people are selling
Strong Draught of Power, Strong Draught of Endurance and Improved Draught of Invigoration below their craftingprice. (if you count in the feathers, for the current local price of 1.2p/5k Feathers)

I made myself a list, including all the Featherprices.
And if an Improved Draught of Invigoration get crafted for a price of 64g, and someone is selling it for 60g. He is just simply losing money, and so does everyone else who try to compete with those prices.
ofc now you can say, buy all those barrels and sell them yourself, but if the same crafter is making new ones and selling them for 60g again, 2h later... then well, he or she just simply want to lose money i guess.

Same for Strong Draught of Power, current craftingcosts: 87g , selled for 88g. wow ... you make a earning of 1g, at least if you start counting the feathers in.
Wed 29 May 2019 5:57 PM by Mura
That's likely just people skilling off them and trying to sell above vendor cost to recoup some of their material price, and they have no problems undercutting somebody selling at profitable prices.
Wed 29 May 2019 7:53 PM by Sixin2082
I craft at cost for guildies, but I won't take orders for mp anything because it's usually cheaper on the cm than what I'll craft it for.

I do make some money on alchemy regularly. I find that the severe undercutters usually sell out fast enough that if I just leave my products up they will go eventually.
Wed 29 May 2019 9:06 PM by Pops999
While you might feel they are selling below cost including feathers, given no central clearing house for said feathers other than broadcasting in trade. Selling for a discount to move your feathers through the merchant is a viable path.
Thu 30 May 2019 11:33 AM by CronU
Pops999 wrote:
Wed 29 May 2019 9:06 PM
While you might feel they are selling below cost including feathers, given no central clearing house for said feathers other than broadcasting in trade. Selling for a discount to move your feathers through the merchant is a viable path.

I guess, you are currently playing alb?
As i mentioned my perspective is from mid side, and there i cant understand the massive undercutting, cause in 2-3 weeks midgard will run low on alchemist feathers.
There is close to no TG raids, DS with randoms is close to impossible. This just works in albion.

This is why i cant understand that people not including prices for feathers.
Thu 30 May 2019 5:22 PM by Druth
I create batches of MP stuff, whatever 99's that I get will be sold at low price, and undercutting market by 50-100g.
Why not 1g? Because I check prices once, and don't want to return and check prices every day.

So either the other sellers have to wait till mine are sold, or undercutting me, which they rarely do.

I make plenty of plats doing crafting, even though I only charge 80-100g for SC'ing (somehow I enjoy being the one to complete a persons template...).


I have all crafts, but fletcher, and even my alch part gets work now and then. But alch is a horrible way to make plats, because so many have their own.
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