Phoenix vs. Live - Phoenix Freeshard

Why is this such a sensitive issue to talk about in game? I just don't get it. How can anything ever improve/evolve if you never talk about it?
Earlier I had got my first solo kill on an armsman, so i bragged over /advice something like:

/advice Finally got my first kill on my fully buffed, temped armsman, and it was with against a SB, who missed PA, I survived with 1 hp left **flex**

Just over that one sarcastic joke, I immediately got this;

<advice> Alb Player: Seems pretty weak to me!
Alb Player sends you: "Maybe you just can't play"

You send Alb Player: "All you've got to do is look on youtube, and try and find a single instance of that happening to an armsman, here on phoenix, that's what roughly 99.9 percent of the fights consist of vs assassins on any tank, or hybrid"

Alb Player sends you: "Any tank can kill any assassin as long as you have slam, and they don't have purge."

You send Alb Player: "Lol, @ the irony in that statement"

Alb Player sends you: "Get back to live!"

.... Wow! Talk about defensive. The white knight brigade nearly burned me at the stake over a halfhearted joke over /advice.

On the other hand, can someone logically explain to me why the only option of DAOC out there is so customized? You'd think the last bastion of DAOC would try to be more true to the patch emulation, but if you go on youtube even really old videos, RvR simply wasn't like this. Whether in a group, or solo context. Everyone, and i do mean EVERYONE keeps trying to tell me my memory is flawed, but when you played something for 15 years, and a recent emulation of the very patch era this server is trying to emulate (Uthgard 1.0/2.0) you know your memory couldn't possibly be THAT faulty. I was looking at some lengthy videos of Uthgard's pvp, and you simply didn't "explode"

I witnessed alot of fights in my time in live DAOC and I don't recall a single instance of a pa/cd/ss chain killing a studded wearer before the stun wore off, nevermind a plate wearer. Most of the time even a caster would still have like 20 percent health after pa/cd/ss.

As you can see another player had a similar experience at the 4:08 mark, and it worked when he purged, but he had like 1 hp left:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45boGsmbsAU

On a final note, i'd like an honest answer if the TTK is going to be fixed on this server, or is this going to be a fixture? Currently the only "tanks" worth playing, are the ones who have stealth spec available.

Tue 30 Apr 2019 4:26 PM by Amp_Phetamine

I'm becoming concerned with your obsession with 2002 era DAoC Tanks and ancient YouTube videos of shield users blocking...

P.S. You need more offensive capabilities. That should help you win fights with >1 hit point.

Tue 30 Apr 2019 4:28 PM by Animosity

TLDR:

Another whining about stealthers thread.

Tue 30 Apr 2019 4:35 PM by Yokahu

TTK can easily be fixed or improved with the removal of buff charges.

Tue 30 Apr 2019 4:56 PM by kratoxin

Stealthers have been here a very long time, nothing will change.. the domination is real, winter is coming!

Tue 30 Apr 2019 5:14 PM by Ashenspire

Defense tanks were trash then and are trash now. This isn't Phoenix vs Live, you've just got a hard on for a trash spec that's always been trash.

Tue 30 Apr 2019 5:52 PM by Jimmy0000

Ashenspire wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 5:14 PM
Defense tanks were trash then and are trash now. This isn't Phoenix vs Live, you've just got a hard on for a trash spec that's always been trash.

Oh, you again with your willful ignorance polluting my threads in a totally unprovoked manner. Who are you trying to convince, yourself or me? I would say yourself, since you are currently in close your eyes, cover your ears and go LALALALA mode every time i present evidence that defense was superior on live than it is on this server, if you specced for it. Assassins used to constantly whine about not being able to solo def tanks at various patch eras. Feel free to peruse the IGN boards from 2002-2010's (also as stated, all you have to do is go on youtube and look up solo warrior, shieldmaster, shield merc, snarf savage, and shield champ videos to see how effective defense could be, then my eyewitness testimony of playing defense specs, and playing against them for years on live). Lol... never the less, i wasn't getting trashed on a defense spec this time, it was offense. Quit replying to my threads with your ignorance and go elsewhere, please.

Tue 30 Apr 2019 5:56 PM by Tarticus74

Was it the fight with me where you did slam I did not have purge up... You got out 2 hander and started smashing away. I evaded and landed LA stun and you killed me with 1hp but my poison killed you one tick after.

Notes to make I missed PA totally I did not have purge up and didn't have any red charge buffs up if I had of landed PA and CD and had purge up I'm guessing you would have been dead very soon as coming out of stun

Good fight though

Tue 30 Apr 2019 5:58 PM by moe_Jiller

Just picking up 1 of your points:

There is an emulator that is going for a very strict patch level in a no-matter-what kind of way.

Did you ever hear about that Uthgard 2? It failed horribly for that exact reason. At some points they even took maps and CC indicators in grp windows out of the game on purpose because you know, thats what a strict patch-level policy does, it recreates something with all of its flaws. There has not been an ideal world for every DAoC player so far, but Phoenix (and also Uthgard 1 for some time) at least tried/is trying to do so.

Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:02 PM by Jimmy0000

Amp_Phetamine wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 4:26 PM
I'm becoming concerned with your obsession with 2002 era DAoC Tanks and ancient YouTube videos of shield users blocking...

P.S. You need more offensive capabilities. That should help you win fights with >1 hit point.

It's not ancient videos, Mr. Clone of Ashenspire. There's all kinds of videos on youtube debunking the ''OfFeNcE wUZ dA OnLy VaLId sPEc FoR Uh tAnK" nonsense you keep projecting onto DAOC.

My armsman is offense specced, btw, lol. The white knights attack on the forum the same way they do in the game. Did comparing the TTK on here to HnK episodes offend you or what? Once again, it was a joke. I swear i think you and ash are some kind of shills or something. Why is it always you two who grace my responses/threads?

Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:10 PM by Amp_Phetamine

Jimmy0000 wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:02 PM
Amp_Phetamine wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 4:26 PM
I'm becoming concerned with your obsession with 2002 era DAoC Tanks and ancient YouTube videos of shield users blocking...

P.S. You need more offensive capabilities. That should help you win fights with >1 hit point.

It's not ancient videos, Mr. Clone of Ashenspire. There's all kinds of videos on youtube debunking the ''OfFeNcE wUZ dA OnLy VaLId sPEc FoR Uh tAnK" nonsense you keep projecting onto DAOC.

My armsman is offense specced, btw, lol. The white knights attack on the forum the same way they do in the game. Did comparing the TTK on here to HnK episodes offend you or what? Once again, it was a joke. I swear i think you and ash are some kind of shills or something. Why is it always you two who grace my responses/threads?

Because you continually post the same thing? Ashenspire and I don't even know each other but what we obviously can agree on is your inability to accept that defensive tanks in DAoC are not a thing..

I would semi believe your claim that this thread was a joke, if it wasn't like the fifth time you've reiterated the same thing about shield tanks in 2002/2003 and YouTube videos of shield tanks, etc.

You can obviously template and spec for pure defense (I did it on my Armsman on Live for a while - 50 crush, 42 shield, 39 parry, MoBlock 5, MoParry 6) but it's more of a joke than a legit play style.

There are MMORPG's in which high defensive tanks are a thing, DAoC is not one of them.

Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:12 PM by Jimmy0000

moe_Jiller wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 5:58 PM
Just picking up 1 of your points:

There is an emulator that is going for a very strict patch level in a no-matter-what kind of way.

Did you ever hear about that Uthgard 2? It failed horribly for that exact reason. At some points they even took maps and CC indicators in grp windows out of the game on purpose because you know, thats what a strict patch-level policy does, it recreates something with all of its flaws. There has not been an ideal world for every DAoC player so far, but Phoenix (and also Uthgard 1 for some time) at least tried/is trying to do so.

*sigh* everyone always rebuts with this same kind of strawman every single time. Why would anyone want a strict 1.65? That's never been what i've been about. What i am about, is <combat and class mechanics> that are like 1.65. Or if not 1.65 then at least *SOME* kind of patch era in daoc that existed around that time period, with QOL changes added on that have 0 to do with actual class design, or combat mechanics (i.e. faster leveling, easier templating, etc.) instead we have a server that seems like it's 90 percent customized to the point to where you might as well just consider it DAOC in name only. I have talked to *tons* of players in the game that have noticed these things, the only people who don't notice these things, or notice them, but try to pretend they don't exist is people who play stealthers, because they have a vested interest in keeping phoenix a server where the role of tanks/hybrids is to walk around like ducks in a shooting gallery for the personal pleasure of them, and the TOA casters, to whom TOA somehow isn't necessary for them to perform as if they DO have TOA artis/caps in their template.

Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:14 PM by Amp_Phetamine

Jimmy0000 wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:12 PM
moe_Jiller wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 5:58 PM
Just picking up 1 of your points:

There is an emulator that is going for a very strict patch level in a no-matter-what kind of way.

Did you ever hear about that Uthgard 2? It failed horribly for that exact reason. At some points they even took maps and CC indicators in grp windows out of the game on purpose because you know, thats what a strict patch-level policy does, it recreates something with all of its flaws. There has not been an ideal world for every DAoC player so far, but Phoenix (and also Uthgard 1 for some time) at least tried/is trying to do so.

*sigh* everyone always rebuts with this same kind of strawman every single time. Why would anyone want a strict 1.65? That's never been what i've been about. What i am about, is <combat and class mechanics> that are like 1.65. Or if not 1.65 then at least *SOME* kind of patch era in daoc that existed around that time period, with QOL changes added on that have 0 to do with actual class design, or combat mechanics (i.e. faster leveling, easier templating, etc.) instead we have a server that seems like it's 90 percent customized to the point to where you might as well just consider it DAOC in name only. I have talked to *tons* of players in the game that have noticed these things, the only people who don't notice these things, or notice them, but try to pretend they don't exist is people who play stealthers, because they have a vested interest in keeping phoenix a server where the role of tanks/hybrids is to walk around like ducks in a shooting gallery for the personal pleasure of them, and the TOA casters, to whom TOA somehow isn't necessary for them to perform as if they DO have TOA artis/caps in their template.

What exactly is your point though? That shield tanks should be invulnerable in melee combat? Because that's literally all I've been able to pull out of your posts. I'm not attacking you, I just think you're beating a dead horse for no reason.

Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:18 PM by Jimmy0000

Amp_Phetamine wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:10 PM
Jimmy0000 wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:02 PM
Amp_Phetamine wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 4:26 PM
I'm becoming concerned with your obsession with 2002 era DAoC Tanks and ancient YouTube videos of shield users blocking...

P.S. You need more offensive capabilities. That should help you win fights with >1 hit point.

It's not ancient videos, Mr. Clone of Ashenspire. There's all kinds of videos on youtube debunking the ''OfFeNcE wUZ dA OnLy VaLId sPEc FoR Uh tAnK" nonsense you keep projecting onto DAOC.

My armsman is offense specced, btw, lol. The white knights attack on the forum the same way they do in the game. Did comparing the TTK on here to HnK episodes offend you or what? Once again, it was a joke. I swear i think you and ash are some kind of shills or something. Why is it always you two who grace my responses/threads?

Because you continually post the same thing? Ashenspire and I don't even know each other but what we obviously can agree on is your inability to accept that defensive tanks in DAoC are not a thing..

I would semi believe your claim that this thread was a joke, if it wasn't like the fifth time you've reiterated the same thing about shield tanks in 2002/2003 and YouTube videos of shield tanks, etc.

You can obviously template and spec for pure defense (I did it on my Armsman on Live for a while - 50 crush, 42 shield, 39 parry, MoBlock 5, MoParry 6) but it's more of a joke than a legit play style.

There are MMORPG's in which high defensive tanks are a thing, DAoC is not one of them.

So your fabricated DAOC experience on a defense specced armsman on live somehow trumps youtube evidence, and stealth whiners on IGN boards as well as DEF tanks that have talked of experiences of killing multiple stealthers simultaneously? It's extremely easy to go on google and type in stuff about daoc to where you can see all the ''if you want to beat stealthers, stop speccing offense, moron'' type threads. I used to also kill multiple assassins simultaneously on my warrior back in the day, lol. On this server, if an assassin had purge, they could kill multiple WARRIORS simultaneously, lmao.

Also can we please stop talking about defense? This thread is about the classes, weapon tables, and weaponskill, and being TTK all over the place, not defense specs in and of themselves.

Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:23 PM by Jimmy0000

Animosity wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 4:28 PM
TLDR:

Another whining about stealthers thread.

TLDR:

Another white knight trying to discredit an OP who brings up good points.

This isn't just about stealthers, it's about the TTK on here in general, it's all over the place, and it's glaringly obvious to people who aren't noobs when it comes to DAOC

Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:24 PM by Amp_Phetamine

Jimmy0000 wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:18 PM
Amp_Phetamine wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:10 PM
Jimmy0000 wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:02 PM
It's not ancient videos, Mr. Clone of Ashenspire. There's all kinds of videos on youtube debunking the ''OfFeNcE wUZ dA OnLy VaLId sPEc FoR Uh tAnK" nonsense you keep projecting onto DAOC.

My armsman is offense specced, btw, lol. The white knights attack on the forum the same way they do in the game. Did comparing the TTK on here to HnK episodes offend you or what? Once again, it was a joke. I swear i think you and ash are some kind of shills or something. Why is it always you two who grace my responses/threads?

Because you continually post the same thing? Ashenspire and I don't even know each other but what we obviously can agree on is your inability to accept that defensive tanks in DAoC are not a thing..

I would semi believe your claim that this thread was a joke, if it wasn't like the fifth time you've reiterated the same thing about shield tanks in 2002/2003 and YouTube videos of shield tanks, etc.

You can obviously template and spec for pure defense (I did it on my Armsman on Live for a while - 50 crush, 42 shield, 39 parry, MoBlock 5, MoParry 6) but it's more of a joke than a legit play style.

There are MMORPG's in which high defensive tanks are a thing, DAoC is not one of them.

So your fabricated DAOC experience on a defense specced armsman on live somehow trumps youtube evidence, and stealth whiners on IGN boards as well as DEF tanks that have talked of experiences of killing multiple stealthers simultaneously? It's extremely easy to go on google and type in stuff about daoc to where you can see all the ''if you want to beat stealthers, stop speccing offense, moron'' type threads. I used to also kill multiple assassins simultaneously on my warrior back in the day, lol. On this server, if an assassin had purge, they could kill multiple WARRIORS simultaneously, lmao.

No. I have over 5 years specifically on the Armsman class, that I played until rank 12 in solo, duo, trio, small man, 8 man and zerg. Do you have a rr12 armsman? I've played every single spec, every combination of weapons, trust me when I tell you, I intentionally tried to create a "turtle" pure defense armsman. It does not work.

Yes, I was able to kill classes doing so, but due to block/parry caps, frontal requirements on block/parry, lack of collision detection, client-server lag, pure defense is not a thing on DAoC.

If you want to try and "school" me with your decades old memories bring something better to the table please. I have years of heavy tank game play and experience.

An assassin can not, could not, and would not kill "multiple warriors" with purge. Bro, you're seriously mental and losing any credibility you may have had.

I've killed multiple assassins on my Mercenary as well - You seem to be the variable in what is going wrong.

Edit: Finally, Jimmy reveals himself to be a Troll - Close this thread please

Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:26 PM by Jimmy0000

Tarticus74 wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 5:56 PM
Was it the fight with me where you did slam I did not have purge up... You got out 2 hander and started smashing away. I evaded and landed LA stun and you killed me with 1hp but my poison killed you one tick after.

Notes to make I missed PA totally I did not have purge up and didn't have any red charge buffs up if I had of landed PA and CD and had purge up I'm guessing you would have been dead very soon as coming out of stun

Good fight though

Nah, man. thanks for the neato fight story, but that wasn't me; my arms doesn't have slam (on live, it wasn't necessary to actually put up a fight against sbs, or any other 'sin)

Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:36 PM by lourock

Uth2 was custom as f 1.65 with no SI or SI items was garbage from the get go. Nightmare to balance and the custom qol changes they added made it even worse.

I was always of the opinion that heavy tanks should almost never die to a lone stealther but we all know that was never the case.

Freeshards are great fun but people need to stop comparing them to live or wanting them to be what live was 19 years ago it will never happen again. Like Biggie once said. “Things done changed”

Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:46 PM by Jimmy0000

Amp_Phetamine wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:24 PM
Jimmy0000 wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:18 PM
Amp_Phetamine wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 6:10 PM
Because you continually post the same thing? Ashenspire and I don't even know each other but what we obviously can agree on is your inability to accept that defensive tanks in DAoC are not a thing..

I would semi believe your claim that this thread was a joke, if it wasn't like the fifth time you've reiterated the same thing about shield tanks in 2002/2003 and YouTube videos of shield tanks, etc.

You can obviously template and spec for pure defense (I did it on my Armsman on Live for a while - 50 crush, 42 shield, 39 parry, MoBlock 5, MoParry 6) but it's more of a joke than a legit play style.

There are MMORPG's in which high defensive tanks are a thing, DAoC is not one of them.

So your fabricated DAOC experience on a defense specced armsman on live somehow trumps youtube evidence, and stealth whiners on IGN boards as well as DEF tanks that have talked of experiences of killing multiple stealthers simultaneously? It's extremely easy to go on google and type in stuff about daoc to where you can see all the ''if you want to beat stealthers, stop speccing offense, moron'' type threads. I used to also kill multiple assassins simultaneously on my warrior back in the day, lol. On this server, if an assassin had purge, they could kill multiple WARRIORS simultaneously, lmao.

No. I have over 5 years specifically on the Armsman class, that I played until rank 12 in solo, duo, trio, small man, 8 man and zerg. Do you have a rr12 armsman? I've played every single spec, every combination of weapons, trust me when I tell you, I intentionally tried to create a "turtle" pure defense armsman. It does not work.

Yes, I was able to kill classes doing so, but due to block/parry caps, frontal requirements on block/parry, lack of collision detection, client-server lag, pure defense is not a thing on DAoC.

If you want to try and "school" me with your decades old memories bring something better to the table please. I have years of heavy tank game play and experience.

An assassin can not, could not, and would not kill "multiple warriors" with purge. Bro, you're seriously mental and losing any credibility you may have had.

I've killed multiple assassins on my Mercenary as well - You seem to be the variable in what is going wrong.

Edit: Finally, Jimmy reveals himself to be a Troll - Close this thread please

Even if what you said was true, this is still your anecdotal experience though. I played warrior(s), armsmen, etc off and on for about 15 years. Not sure why it didn't work for you, but if you're a euro player perhaps lag was more of a thing, i do notice that lag on phoenix myself from time to time, more than on live, i think that's because i'm not in the EU.

"I've killed multiple assassins on my Mercenary as well - You seem to be the variable in what is going wrong."

Lol with the buffs dual wield has on this server that never existed on live, i still have a hard time believing that.

Here's the thing, Amp; you're just one person. I don't know if you played primarily in an era where defense was at it's crappiest or what, but there's tons of evidence that defense worked, even if it didn't somehow work for you. All the tanks I have talked to on here are shocked at just how crappy defense is, and how superior it was on live when it came to getting jumped by stealthers. Again the youtube videos and forum posts on IGN speak for themselves. Even savages only have a pissy 18 percent chance to evade arrows defense is so crippled on this server. Granted, in the really really late era, like 2010-2015 defense started to suck more than it did, but it was still a million times better than on here (again peruse youtube videos for proof)

Here's a tank talking about the situation that was going down on live, and it's eerily similar to what this server is like. from an old live thread in 2010; He can no longer kill multiple stealthers with a defense spec, only one at a time, because of all the cheesy procs they started putting in the game:
https://www.ign.com/boards/threads/game-is-too-easy-for-casters-and-stealthers-at-50-and-too-hard-for-melees.250247468/

A bit before that era here's another example in 2007 on how defense is the way to go against stealthers:
"What class is anti-stealther?"
https://www.ign.com/boards/threads/what-class-is-anti-stealther.250236848/
"Any Shield Tank"

Defense being good on tanks on live for various situations is such common knowledge, it figures on a private server with a largely noobish population that people would be saying things like "defense was always trash" (on live)

Now, with that said, please stop hijacking my threads by talking about defense specs. I didn't mention anything about a defense spec ONE SOLITARY TIME in my OP. (my freaking armsman is *offense specced* for crying out loud.)

Tue 30 Apr 2019 7:47 PM by Jimmy0000

Yokahu wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Apr 2019 4:35 PM
TTK can easily be fixed or improved with the removal of buff charges.

I tell you one thing Yokahu, if they aren't going to put yellow buff merchants in the server, and i had a choice between no buffs *at all* outside groups, vs using these weird, random, inconsistant, rich man/poor man, halfassed combination of Uthgard style charge/pot juggling, i'd just rather have no buffs whatsoever outside groups, then you could nerf group buffs down to 50 percent. That's basically what made the BG's so much more balanced than level 50 on live. Another thing, as a newish player, it makes me not able to save up any money without farming, because every cent i make in rvr is going to have to go to potions. I just blew 750 gold in one session for practically no reason besides buff pots. I could have used that money to put toward buying feathers, or something.

Wed 1 May 2019 12:15 AM by Effaermon

+I regret reading this thread1

Wed 1 May 2019 4:33 AM by Ashenspire

Effaermon wrote: ↑
Wed 1 May 2019 12:15 AM
+I regret reading this thread1

Don't worry. He'll make another one tomorrow talking about a time in daoc that never existed and crying about mechanics he doesn't understand.

Wed 1 May 2019 9:11 AM by Cadebrennus

The only classes that are crippled by defense mechanics are Archers

Thu 2 May 2019 6:21 AM by Sepplord

For only being a joke, OP is surely arguing quite a bit...

When you have to argue or explain a joke, it wasn't a good joke. Cut your losses and move on....

Or was the joke excuse and claiming it to be about advice-chat toxicity just a defense?

Thu 2 May 2019 12:31 PM by Jimmy0000

Ashenspire wrote: ↑
Wed 1 May 2019 4:33 AM
Effaermon wrote: ↑
Wed 1 May 2019 12:15 AM
+I regret reading this thread1

Don't worry. He'll make another one tomorrow talking about a time in daoc that never existed and crying about mechanics he doesn't understand.

Have you, or have you not looked up solo warrior, shieldmaster, shield champ, snarf savage, melee scout videos on youtube for proof of how effective defense could be? If not, you're just being willfully ignorant, and shouldn't be posting here anymore until you do. Time that never existed, yeah right. The only time that never existed on live, is Phoenix's combat mechanics. You can tell they crippled certain things. I was in DF yesterday, with 94 percent block rate vs purple diamond level mobs for crissakes.... i go out to pvp, and my block rate is suddenly 25 percent against dual wielders. Gaps that extreme between pve, and pvp mechanics were never in daoc, and had to be put here on purpose, just like the staff on Warhammer Return of Reckoning did. they hated tanks on that server, (one of the admins, torque, constantly died to chosen on live, back in the day so instead of picking the targets his stealther was supposed to attack, his stealther ego couldn't handle it, and just made tanks weak as sh*t on his server, so witch hunters could kill them more easily), so just like here, he made them op as sh*t) and literally made Chosen/KOTBS like 50 percent less effective than they were on warhammer live. How do i know this? I went on another server after it was made that reverted every custom change, and they literally performed 50 percent better. That's just like here.
Out of all the knowledgeable/experienced players that have existed in daoc, why is the player base to these private servers so universally noobish? Why are people arguing such obviously wrong points to me? There's proof everywhere that what i'm saying is accurate. Granted, Phoenix's community is probably the best i've seen, but the knowledge level is not what you would expect from DAOC vets, to say the least. Many pvpers must have been stunted on here in terms of knowledge and experience due to only being zerglings, or 8v8lings. I see daoc veterans in name only constantly giving out cringy, eye-rolling assvice over the /advice chat, i take it they must be players like amp, and ash, lol.

Thu 2 May 2019 2:14 PM by Ashenspire

Cut up montages on YouTube aren't proof of anything.

You are the only person here who thinks super defensive was a good or effective play style.

But sure, everyone else is wrong, every one else misremembers. You're not the one with a chip on their shoulder.

Fri 3 May 2019 2:50 AM by hellcon

Jimmy0000 wrote: ↑
Thu 2 May 2019 12:31 PM
.... i go out to pvp, and my block rate is suddenly 25 percent against dual wielders.

I think there is a 35% hardcap against dw. baf

Fri 3 May 2019 11:52 AM by Jimmy0000

hellcon wrote: ↑
Fri 3 May 2019 2:50 AM
Jimmy0000 wrote: ↑
Thu 2 May 2019 12:31 PM
.... i go out to pvp, and my block rate is suddenly 25 percent against dual wielders.

I think there is a 35% hardcap against dw. baf

There's a 35 percent hardcap on shield against dual wielders? That's the most biased, arbitrary thing I have ever read on a private server, Let me guess weaponskill is calculated AFTER the 35 percent cap, so the cap goes all the way down to 25 percent... if that's true. that's worse than back in the day when you had -50 percent penalty toward dual wield, at least then shield block had no cap, so, you could still get things like 60 percent + block rate against dual wield. Lets just take shield spec away completely from all tanks. Lets give them all castable 1500 DDs, and a shout like the DovahKiin that can stun in a AOE cone in front of themselves up to 600 range. Lets give all tanks speed 6, and increase skald damage song to 150 points. while we're at it, lets bring back ''assassinate'' to the game, but give it to all stealthers, on a 5 second timer, lets also put stealthing in combat in the game, and take out vanish, and just but a 2 second timer on stealth. Lets give sorcs chainmail, runemasters platemail, and lets give them MCL at the highest level for free. These are all things dark age of Phoenixalot needs. Don't forget to give minstrels mend spec to compensate!

Fri 3 May 2019 11:54 AM by Sepplord

Jimmy0000 wrote: ↑
Fri 3 May 2019 11:52 AM
hellcon wrote: ↑
Fri 3 May 2019 2:50 AM
Jimmy0000 wrote: ↑
Thu 2 May 2019 12:31 PM
.... i go out to pvp, and my block rate is suddenly 25 percent against dual wielders.

I think there is a 35% hardcap against dw. baf

There's a 35 percent hardcap on shield against dual wielders? That's the most biased, arbitrary thing I have ever read on a private server, Let me guess weaponskill is calculated AFTER the 35 percent cap, so the cap goes all the way down to 25 percent... if that's true. that's worse than back in the day when you had -50 percent penalty toward dual wield, at least then shield block had no cap, so, you could still get things like 60 percent + block rate against dual wield. Lets just take shield spec away completely from all tanks. Lets give them all castable 1500 DDs, and a shout like the DovahKiin that can stun in a AOE cone in front of themselves up to 600 range. Lets give all tanks speed 6, and increase skald damage song to 150 points. while we're at it, lets bring back ''assassinate'' to the game, but give it to all stealthers, on a 5 second timer, lets also put stealthing in combat in the game, and take out vanish, and just but a 2 second timer on stealth. Lets give sorcs chainmail, runemasters platemail, and lets give them MCL at the highest level for free. These are all things dark age of Phoenixalot needs. Don't forget to give minstrels mend spec to compensate!

really?

you hear someone "thinking" that there is a 35%hardcap against DW....not only do you then take that for granted, despite the commenter not being sure....you go even further and interpret the just heard thing in the worst possible way and then rant about that

Fri 3 May 2019 12:06 PM by gnefner

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Fri 3 May 2019 11:54 AM
Jimmy0000 wrote: ↑
Fri 3 May 2019 11:52 AM
hellcon wrote: ↑
Fri 3 May 2019 2:50 AM
I think there is a 35% hardcap against dw. baf

There's a 35 percent hardcap on shield against dual wielders? That's the most biased, arbitrary thing I have ever read on a private server, Let me guess weaponskill is calculated AFTER the 35 percent cap, so the cap goes all the way down to 25 percent... if that's true. that's worse than back in the day when you had -50 percent penalty toward dual wield, at least then shield block had no cap, so, you could still get things like 60 percent + block rate against dual wield. Lets just take shield spec away completely from all tanks. Lets give them all castable 1500 DDs, and a shout like the DovahKiin that can stun in a AOE cone in front of themselves up to 600 range. Lets give all tanks speed 6, and increase skald damage song to 150 points. while we're at it, lets bring back ''assassinate'' to the game, but give it to all stealthers, on a 5 second timer, lets also put stealthing in combat in the game, and take out vanish, and just but a 2 second timer on stealth. Lets give sorcs chainmail, runemasters platemail, and lets give them MCL at the highest level for free. These are all things dark age of Phoenixalot needs. Don't forget to give minstrels mend spec to compensate!

really?

you hear someone "thinking" that there is a 35%hardcap against DW....not only do you then take that for granted, despite the commenter not being sure....you go even further and interpret the just heard thing in the worst possible way and then rant about that

This "debate" is humorous.. I'm unsure as to why you, Sepp, is still entertaining this dude

Fri 3 May 2019 12:14 PM by Jimmy0000

Ashenspire wrote: ↑
Thu 2 May 2019 2:14 PM
Cut up montages on YouTube aren't proof of anything.

You are the only person here who thinks super defensive was a good or effective play style.

But sure, everyone else is wrong, every one else misremembers. You're not the one with a chip on their shoulder.

Your Logical Fallacy Is:
--------------------------------
Irrelevant conclusion, also known as ignoratio elenchi (Latin for 'ignoring refutation'

or missing the point, is the informal fallacy of presenting an argument that may or may not be logically valid and sound, but (whose conclusion) fails to address the issue in question.
---------------------------------
Your Logical Fallacy Is:
Moving the Goalposts
(also known as: gravity game, raising the bar, argument by demanding impossible perfection [form of])

Description: Demanding from an opponent that he or she address more and more points after the initial counter-argument has been satisfied refusing to concede or accept the opponent’s argument.
---------------------------------
Your Logical Fallacy Is:
Argumentum ad populum
In argumentation theory, an argumentum ad populum (Latin for "argument to the people"

is a fallacious argument that concludes that a proposition must be true because many or most people believe it, often concisely encapsulated as: "If many believe so, it is so."
----------------------------------
Ash the burden of proof is on you, not me. It's not about misremembering, it's about objective evidence, consensus on the forums of the live servers, and memories of DAOC vets. It's common knowledge that defense was the stealth-pwn spec. Just because it's not like that on a lame, biased private server with a staff that hates tanks , doesn't mean anything. Hell, level up a 50 warrior on Uthgard, and fight the 1, or 2 stealthers on there and see the outcome. If you have anything near the mid level moblock/moparry you will kill them while retaining about 50-75 percent health. On dark age of phoenixalot, they will kill YOU while retaining about 50-75 percent health. Did you look at the multiple forum posts I linked? You and amp are not "everyone".

"But sure, everyone else is wrong"
gtfo of here with that argumentum ad populum crap. I have had countless tank players talk to me about this very thing "in game"
A couple of scrub players on a forum, of a biased, arbitrary private server isn't "everyone"
as far as the sheer quantity of players talking about def specs, again feel free to peruse the IGN forums.

I also see you moved the goal posts. I mention video proof of countless youtube videos, now the videos aren't good enough because they're 'cut up'.... lmao. Turning up the willful ignorance to an all new level. Now you're simply avoiding the obvious. I can't think of a single video of a def tank, or any other soloer on youtube, who has actually ''cut-up'' any fight footage. the only ''cut up'' they do is before a fight, and after a fight (for obvious reasons... who wants to watch them walk around for 4 hours before they encounter someone?)

Fri 3 May 2019 12:24 PM by Jimmy0000

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Fri 3 May 2019 11:54 AM
Jimmy0000 wrote: ↑
Fri 3 May 2019 11:52 AM
hellcon wrote: ↑
Fri 3 May 2019 2:50 AM
I think there is a 35% hardcap against dw. baf

There's a 35 percent hardcap on shield against dual wielders? That's the most biased, arbitrary thing I have ever read on a private server, Let me guess weaponskill is calculated AFTER the 35 percent cap, so the cap goes all the way down to 25 percent... if that's true. that's worse than back in the day when you had -50 percent penalty toward dual wield, at least then shield block had no cap, so, you could still get things like 60 percent + block rate against dual wield. Lets just take shield spec away completely from all tanks. Lets give them all castable 1500 DDs, and a shout like the DovahKiin that can stun in a AOE cone in front of themselves up to 600 range. Lets give all tanks speed 6, and increase skald damage song to 150 points. while we're at it, lets bring back ''assassinate'' to the game, but give it to all stealthers, on a 5 second timer, lets also put stealthing in combat in the game, and take out vanish, and just but a 2 second timer on stealth. Lets give sorcs chainmail, runemasters platemail, and lets give them MCL at the highest level for free. These are all things dark age of Phoenixalot needs. Don't forget to give minstrels mend spec to compensate!

really?

you hear someone "thinking" that there is a 35%hardcap against DW....not only do you then take that for granted, despite the commenter not being sure....you go even further and interpret the just heard thing in the worst possible way and then rant about that

Your Logical Fallacy Is:
--------------------------------
Irrelevant conclusion, also known as ignoratio elenchi (Latin for 'ignoring refutation'

or missing the point, is the informal fallacy of presenting an argument that may or may not be logically valid and sound, but (whose conclusion) fails to address the issue in question.
---------------------------------

I think you conveniently overlooked this phrase by me:
"if that's true."

It's called thinking out loud, and quite frankly it's probably true. I"ve had my cap reduced all the way down to 25 percent on the highest RR assassins, there has to be a logical explanation, and that fits the bill. A forum is for these things.

Fri 3 May 2019 12:46 PM by Jimmy0000

Another thing people seem to keep ignoring, is this thread isn't about defense. Again, i didn't mention a single thing about defense in the OP, my enemies keep bringing it up in an attempt to divert attention away from Phoenix's TTK issues, so nobody will talk about it.

Fri 3 May 2019 1:05 PM by Ashenspire

"Armsman get beat most times by assassins. That never happened in on live."

Taking your post history into account, everyone knows exactly what you're complaining about.

You can claim any logical fallacy you want. You're wrong, but go right ahead.

You are the one claiming defense rates are broken compared to live and that something isn't working right.

You are the ONLY one claiming this, and you're constantly refuted on that point.

There are plenty of videos from this server showcasing tanks and hybrids doing just fine against stealthers but they're still not considered proof. Highlight videos on YouTube are never proof of anything. It's not on anyone but you to showcase that they don't. Using youtube videos from 15 years ago to back up your claims are irrelevant. Using youtube videos of phoenix assassins cherry picking their good fights mean nothing on the other side either.

Your understanding of the game is flawed, your understanding of the Phoenix changes is misguided, and your nostalgia for a way it never was is absurd. The TTK on phoenix is typically higher than this era of live as everyone here has access to combined forces pots whereas not everyone on live had access to buffbots. Not to mention how much easier and common it is to get your templates perfected.

I'm sorry you struggle with assassins on your tank. To quote the original guy that responded to you, get good or go back to live.

Fri 3 May 2019 1:08 PM by kratoxin

I gave up reading all these long posts ... to lazy.