Question regarding keep RvR - Phoenix Freeshard

Like many others, I played classic DAOC for the RvR -- the PvE experience was nothing special, IMHO. As a Void Eldritch, my favorite aspect of RvR was keep defense AND keep sieges. In the early days, attacking a keep meant a guaranteed siege battle because once that realm or guild got notification they would log into their alts that were inside and the fun would begin. My only experience after classic DAOC has been a few months on Uthgaard 2.0 where the patch level automatically moved anyone camped inside a keep the moment the doors took damage making 'keep battles' a PvE experience of killing guards/lord.

How does it work here? I tried asking if anyone was familiar with Phoenix's ruleset over on Uthgard's OFF TOPIC forums where I was still registered and had my thread deleted, and then another locked. At least one of the developers there is EXTREMELY petty and very sensitive about this shard.

Wed 20 Mar 2019 6:12 PM by antiflagdan

Keeps and Relics are for the most part, ignored. I know this pains you to hear as a void eld, since keep defense is one of the most fun times to be a bolt caster. It's mostly just open field at the moment. Any keep takes are just killing a few guards and no resistance from the opposing realm because why bother? This shard does not promote daoc style pvp. It promotes button mashing until you die, then come right back out. rinse, repeat. CoD style, baby! It's still fun - it's just not daoc the way we knew it.

Wed 20 Mar 2019 7:47 PM by tylerforeal

The button smashing the guy below is talking about is probably related to zerg. There are many other ways to rvr that aren't braindead faceroll keyboard style like he probably plays- there's a lot of room for skill/organization here as you can 8v8/8v16/8v24 etc anytime you want or do small man stuff 3-4 people.

Keep takes are currently underemphasized. The devs here are heavily invested in the project and make sound updates- i'd expect keeps/relics to be revamped a bit at some point.

Thu 21 Mar 2019 6:04 AM by labova

At the moment keep sieges are not really a part of the RvR on Phoenix. The chief blame for this lies, in my opinion, with the poor design of the OF keeps. There isn't really much the devs can do with this at the moment.

If this is the major enjoyment for you in RvR, you will be disappointed here.

Thu 21 Mar 2019 4:19 PM by antiflagdan

The guy above is not telling it like it is. He is making assumptions because he is trying to downplay my credibility. Any random pre 50 grey who suicide bombs regularly through the frontier can tell you what is going on with pvp. The current state of pvp realistically is-

1. auto running into enemies to die to get task credit, release and afk at portal keep until task completes. rinse, repeat. Also, teleporting to a flag and afking waiting to die for credit.

2. playing a meta class that will get you into a group of 8 (heard this is less of an issue on mid), then roam around between mile gates trying to pick off small man/solos and avoid the zerg

3. stealthies picking off the auto runners that are alt tabbed watching youtube

4. ganking low levels at xp camps (lots of skalds)

5. small mans capturing flags, then getting steamrolled by an 8man

6. mindless zerging with people half afk at mile gate areas

7. fgrps that want a fair fight, but won't find one very often, especially without being assjammed by greys being pests, and getting zerged

the zerg v zerg fights are still pretty fun and i'm sure some of the 8v8 purists get their awesome fights in occasionally, but those are exceptions, not the rule. You said you like siege style fighting. You won't really get that at the moment. I think the devs have heard the cries of many on here and are working on it. Can only expect so much from a small freeshard. They're doing their best. I don't want to dissuade you because I think the game is super fun still and you'll still get your nostalgia kicks. I will reiterate - the RvR is still fun, but it's just different. Hopefully will change soon so you can bolt people from the top of keeps like I know you want to

Thu 21 Mar 2019 7:48 PM by cloudbased

The term '8v8 purist' is extremely offputting to me. I played live from launch until just shortly after ToA when I quit an never came back. In all of that time, on my server, '8v8' WASN'T A THING. There were 8 man 'gank squads' that would roll around Darkness Falls but these idea of 8v8 didn't exist and is not reflective classic DAOC RvR circa 2001-2003. I speculate that this was born of NECESSITY as terrible expansion and game direction caused populations to plummet, before any potential server mergers occurred. If people aren't mis-remembering then their server was very different from the two I played on. Certainly, on no planet would anyone ever ignore enemies because they were engaged in an '8v8' - you would be considered a traitor to your realm -- and it wasn't even a term thrown around.

Thank you for your honest and detailed reply, antiflagdan, it is appreciated. I will keep an eye on Phoenix even if it doesn't sound like it is for me, right now. It is nice to hear that the devs are open to suggestions and looking to make things better- a stark contrast to the pettiness and censorship of Uthgard. This coming from someone who loves classic DAOC and hated ToA+, too.

Thu 21 Mar 2019 8:31 PM by Aervine

cloudbased wrote: ↑
Thu 21 Mar 2019 7:48 PM
The term '8v8 purist' is extremely offputting to me. I played live from launch until just shortly after ToA when I quit an never came back. In all of that time, on my server, '8v8' WASN'T A THING. There were 8 man 'gank squads' that would roll around Darkness Falls but these idea of 8v8 didn't exist and is not reflective classic DAOC RvR circa 2001-2003. I speculate that this was born of NECESSITY as terrible expansion and game direction caused populations to plummet, before any potential server mergers occurred. If people aren't mis-remembering then their server was very different from the two I played on. Certainly, on no planet would anyone ever ignore enemies because they were engaged in an '8v8' - you would be considered a traitor to your realm -- and it wasn't even a term thrown around.

Thank you for your honest and detailed reply, antiflagdan, it is appreciated. I will keep an eye on Phoenix even if it doesn't sound like it is for me, right now. It is nice to hear that the devs are open to suggestions and looking to make things better- a stark contrast to the pettiness and censorship of Uthgard. This coming from someone who loves classic DAOC and hated ToA+, too.

I have the same feelings as you towards the 8v8 elitist culture but I suggest trying it out for yourself! I've had a ton of fun each night I log into Phoenix.

Thu 21 Mar 2019 8:34 PM by PingGuy

The only way to know if you like Phoenix is to try it. Form your own impressions.

Fri 22 Mar 2019 3:15 AM by jg777

You won’t have long siege battles presently on Phoenix, but you will have long zerg fights often. It may be different but you won’t know if you’d like it until you’ve tried it. I anticipate as others do that the Phoenix staff will be tweaking settings/server rules to encourage siege warfare and relic raids more. No ETA yet however.

Fri 22 Mar 2019 5:40 AM by UnknownAssailant

I applaud the Phoenix team for their effort here. I really really want to like this server; however, I am just not finding it fun to play, so I must bid the server farewell. Kudos to those of you having fun here but it is just not for me.

Fri 22 Mar 2019 5:42 AM by defiasbandit

UnknownAssailant wrote: ↑
Fri 22 Mar 2019 5:40 AM
I applaud the Phoenix team for their effort here. I really really want to like this server; however, I am just not finding it fun to play, so I must bid the server farewell. Kudos to those of you having fun here but it is just not for me.

What are you not enjoying?