Gold per kill needs to be increased

Or at least for solo kills. Spending 10p each week to keep up with charges seems insane?
Or charges should cost less.

Sat 16 Mar 2019 8:12 AM by Luluko

yeah should be doubled its not that much an issue if u play fg and dont really need charges but if you solo you rely too much on those charges

Sat 16 Mar 2019 9:02 AM by msitruk

I m agree

Sat 16 Mar 2019 10:21 AM by Ceen

Dont play 10 h a day and you wont need to spend 10 p a week

Sat 16 Mar 2019 2:21 PM by Kohi

Sorry, but there is an aspect of Daoc which includes gathering items, gold, materials, feathers etc. which also belongs to the game.
Why should rvr-only be rewarded with more gold ? Afaik, we don't get rps while lvling, farming, crafting, do we ?
You can't have the butter and the money from butter, u have to make choices. I don't enjoy sitting for hours at the forge while seeing my pals/guildmates growing their realm rank, but i think that very soon i'll be finish with that, being able to craft my gear, having all my rogs, and finally jump for more than an hour or two in rvr.
I get it, you guys want to focus just on it and it's fully ok, but if there is no need anymore for pve, what will come next ? Food for thoughts.

Sat 16 Mar 2019 6:06 PM by

Uthred

We dont have any plans on changing Gold per kill. Actually (my personal opinion) it should be lowered a bit. But also no plans on that atm.

Sat 16 Mar 2019 6:46 PM by Steelhead23rus

Actually that was something i wanted to ask too. Lowering it will just show that you guys want to keep the server in current state(Dark age of Casters) and you dont need any melee to go solo. So, then, why dont you just delete melee classes instead of trolliing them with all these things that was made to kill them ?

Please leave people the choice of what to play and how to play it, even with current changes people still choose melee and go solo(cause they are not needed in groups) and they still need charges which is not cheap. Increasing the gold for kill amounts will allow people to do rvr instead of pve(if they dont want to). I dont want to pve but i must if i want to go rvr. That will be the only right decision if you want to save melees in this game and on this server.

Sat 16 Mar 2019 6:52 PM by florin

Steelhead23rus wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 6:46 PM
Actually that was something i wanted to ask too. Lowering it will just show that you guys want to keep the server in current state(Dark age of Casters) and you dont need any melee to go solo. So, then, why dont you just delete melee classes instead of trolliing them with all these things that was made to kill them ?

Please leave people the choice of what to play and how to play it, even with current changes people still choose melee and go solo(cause they are not needed in groups) and they still need charges which is not cheap. Increasing the gold for kill amounts will allow people to do rvr instead of pve(if they dont want to). I dont want to pve but i must if i want to go rvr. That will be the only right decision if you want to save melees in this game and on this server.

Like you I’m burning 800g to plat a day on charges so I echo your opinion

Sat 16 Mar 2019 7:00 PM by defiasbandit

Add level 50 kill collection tasks in the frontiers for gold reward.

1 tasks = 250 gold reward. Limit number you can do per day.

Collect 10 Frost Stallion hooves etc..

Sat 16 Mar 2019 7:19 PM by Luluko

Kohi wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 2:21 PM
Sorry, but there is an aspect of Daoc which includes gathering items, gold, materials, feathers etc. which also belongs to the game.
Why should rvr-only be rewarded with more gold ? Afaik, we don't get rps while lvling, farming, crafting, do we ?
You can't have the butter and the money from butter, u have to make choices. I don't enjoy sitting for hours at the forge while seeing my pals/guildmates growing their realm rank, but i think that very soon i'll be finish with that, being able to craft my gear, having all my rogs, and finally jump for more than an hour or two in rvr.
I get it, you guys want to focus just on it and it's fully ok, but if there is no need anymore for pve, what will come next ? Food for thoughts.

the logic having to pve to be able to rvr is flawed, when you are also rewarded more xp in the frontier because its more dangerous, if you follow that logic this should also apply to gold. Also there are games where you can completly loot people and take their gold, here you lose nothing except time and buff charges if you die. Its not that much to ask that you can sustain your rvr playtime by just playing rvr you also dont ask the military of your country to starve and work for minimal wages and risk their lives aswell and a military rank wont feed you its own without a wage. Despite that some people use charges quite excessive, especially stealthers and those rely a lot on buffs.

Sat 16 Mar 2019 7:22 PM by Citian

^ bounty hunting system instead. Nothing intricate, simply more gold for killing players that have actively (would need defining) existed in a zone without dying for x amount of time instead of a flat rate. Two fold benefit: when people ask for help they may be ignored less (virtually 100% now) and more money without any pve.

Plus ego bs associated w/ being worth relative high amount etc. Screenshot brag potential + standing rivalries. you get it

Sat 16 Mar 2019 7:45 PM by rubaduck

Luluko wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 8:12 AM
yeah should be doubled its not that much an issue if u play fg and dont really need charges but if you solo you rely too much on those charges

Every group charge. At least in hibernia if they're running nature druid which more and more groups are running now. Not that it is as high maintenance as solo, but it still costs 5-600 gold every other day to maintain it.

Sat 16 Mar 2019 11:53 PM by Luluko

rubaduck wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 7:45 PM
Luluko wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 8:12 AM
yeah should be doubled its not that much an issue if u play fg and dont really need charges but if you solo you rely too much on those charges

Every group charge. At least in hibernia if they're running nature druid which more and more groups are running now. Not that it is as high maintenance as solo, but it still costs 5-600 gold every other day to maintain it.

I doubt that every grp will do that, not every grp is out for all the min maxing and arent most hib grps running 2 druids anyway? should leave at least yellow speccs for most in grp if 1 druid is nurture specc , if some in grp choose they need cap buffs for dex break points sure they can do that but with all the zerging going on I doubt it matters that much. I personally would not waste 10g for a dex/qui charge every run just for the 10% that I get 1 more nuke/mezz of which could be a deciding factor in any grp scenarios, there is just too much zerging going on for that. In 1vs1 or 1vsX fights you feel the difference tho if you have blue pot buffs or red charges.

Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:02 AM by rubaduck

Luluko wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 11:53 PM
rubaduck wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 7:45 PM
Luluko wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 8:12 AM
yeah should be doubled its not that much an issue if u play fg and dont really need charges but if you solo you rely too much on those charges

Every group charge. At least in hibernia if they're running nature druid which more and more groups are running now. Not that it is as high maintenance as solo, but it still costs 5-600 gold every other day to maintain it.

I doubt that every grp will do that, not every grp is out for all the min maxing and arent most hib grps running 2 druids anyway? should leave at least yellow speccs for most in grp, if some choose they need cap buffs to dex break points sure they can do that but with all the zerging going on I doubt it matters that much. Timer camping is way more important.

It depends on the groups really. Every member of our group has all the charges to top off and I know we're not alone.

Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:06 AM by Luluko

rubaduck wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:02 AM
Luluko wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 11:53 PM
rubaduck wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 7:45 PM
Every group charge. At least in hibernia if they're running nature druid which more and more groups are running now. Not that it is as high maintenance as solo, but it still costs 5-600 gold every other day to maintain it.

I doubt that every grp will do that, not every grp is out for all the min maxing and arent most hib grps running 2 druids anyway? should leave at least yellow speccs for most in grp, if some choose they need cap buffs to dex break points sure they can do that but with all the zerging going on I doubt it matters that much. Timer camping is way more important.

It depends on the groups really. Every member of our group has all the charges to top off and I know we're not alone.

sure its good to have if the buffer is dead or got no time but I wouldnt run charges all the time, maybe there are some which do that but those shouldnt really ask that they need more gold from rvr then, you have the option to use a nurture druid, while as a stealther for example you cant bring your buffer to fights.

Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:08 AM by florin

Citian wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 7:22 PM
^ bounty hunting system instead. Nothing intricate, simply more gold for killing players that have actively (would need defining) existed in a zone without dying for x amount of time instead of a flat rate. Two fold benefit: when people ask for help they may be ignored less (virtually 100% now) and more money without any pve.

Plus ego bs associated w/ being worth relative high amount etc. Screenshot brag potential + standing rivalries. you get it

I would love a bounty hunter system - please
Yes

Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:18 AM by phixion

I asked for the ability for Alchemists to recharge, to lessen the cost... it was denied.

Apparently, charges are a luxury. Not sure how many of the staff have seriously played a solo class, but they are not a luxury. The minute they were put in the game they were a requirement, if you want to compete.

So I support this, any way in which we can lessen PvE farming for gold just to be able to RvR is good with me. Most of us already farm the Epic Dungeon multiple times per week to support our pots. Lets not make this a chore.

Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:23 AM by rubaduck

Luluko wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:06 AM
rubaduck wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:02 AM
Luluko wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 11:53 PM
I doubt that every grp will do that, not every grp is out for all the min maxing and arent most hib grps running 2 druids anyway? should leave at least yellow speccs for most in grp, if some choose they need cap buffs to dex break points sure they can do that but with all the zerging going on I doubt it matters that much. Timer camping is way more important.

It depends on the groups really. Every member of our group has all the charges to top off and I know we're not alone.
sure its good to have if the buffer is dead or got no time but I wouldnt run charges all the time, maybe there are some which do that but those shouldnt really ask that they need more gold from rvr then, you have the option to use a nurture druid, while as a stealther for example you cant bring your buffer to fights.

Well, if you want to get the most out of your druids, you should run one 40 or 39 nurt spec, 34 reg and 12 nature and one 40 reg 36 nature. You get the heals, the cure NS and provide a lot of more utility to the group. We are running this as often as we can as it gives us a much stronger synergy in the group. Again we are not alone here, a LOT of groups runs this but it requires the group to bring charges to make the buffs go up in up and it's not hard to maintain this with a good group. Every caster runs acuity charges, it's 75 acuity which is even superior to purple spec acuity from a druid/shaman/cleric which is base 52. Not running acu charge in group is straight up foolish since even with MotA 9 they won't reach the same value as the charge. Purple D/Q is the same value as the charge on a cleric, 73 on a druid and 70 on a shaman but requires 50, 48 and 47 spec in the buff spec which is far too much for the class to be viable in RvR. With MotA 9 and yellow dex/quick you'll get a value of 82 on a druid, which means a dex/quick charge of 75 is better in nearly every scenario. The same thing goes for str/con. This is of course min/maxing, and while I agree that min/maxers only represents a small portion of the player base it still counts for something.

We run charges because it is ergonomically for us, and I know of several groups that run the same. Charges isn't exclusive to solo stealthers or non grouped players and are also wildly used in groups.

Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:43 AM by Luluko

rubaduck wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:23 AM
Luluko wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:06 AM
rubaduck wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:02 AM
It depends on the groups really. Every member of our group has all the charges to top off and I know we're not alone.
sure its good to have if the buffer is dead or got no time but I wouldnt run charges all the time, maybe there are some which do that but those shouldnt really ask that they need more gold from rvr then, you have the option to use a nurture druid, while as a stealther for example you cant bring your buffer to fights.

Well, if you want to get the most out of your druids, you should run one 40 or 39 nurt spec, 34 reg and 12 nature and one 40 reg 36 nature. You get the heals, the cure NS and provide a lot of more utility to the group. We are running this as often as we can as it gives us a much stronger synergy in the group. Again we are not alone here, a LOT of groups runs this but it requires the group to bring charges to make the buffs go up in up and it's not hard to maintain this with a good group. Every caster runs acuity charges, it's 75 acuity which is even superior to purple spec acuity from a druid/shaman/cleric which is base 52. Not running acu charge in group is straight up foolish since even with MotA 9 they won't reach the same value as the charge. Purple D/Q is the same value as the charge on a cleric, 73 on a druid and 70 on a shaman but requires 50, 48 and 47 spec in the buff spec which is far too much for the class to be viable in RvR. With MotA 9 and yellow dex/quick you'll get a value of 82 on a druid, which means a dex/quick charge of 75 is better in nearly every scenario. The same thing goes for str/con. This is of course min/maxing, and while I agree that min/maxers only represents a small portion of the player base it still counts for something.

We run charges because it is ergonomically for us, and I know of several groups that run the same. Charges isn't exclusive to solo stealthers or non grouped players and are also wildly used in groups.

one charge per run isnt that much of an issue yes but lets say you solo or duo, my skald has the following charge items, specc af, str/con buff, damage add,str/con debuff, dot charge... and then you could also run haste charges with 17%...

that would make it 2 charges just to keep up buffs assassins which need dex/qui would even have 3 charges then, + add to that damage add charge or any other charge which you use situational... you would be at least at 30g if you use just one situational charge and 2 buff charges at least every 10mins and you get like 10g for a solo kill and 5g from task completed

just not really worth it except when its not that zergy and you can also find something to kill and arent just running 6mins from HW to Snowdownia or something like that.

Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:52 AM by rubaduck

Luluko wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:43 AM
rubaduck wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:23 AM
Luluko wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 12:06 AM
sure its good to have if the buffer is dead or got no time but I wouldnt run charges all the time, maybe there are some which do that but those shouldnt really ask that they need more gold from rvr then, you have the option to use a nurture druid, while as a stealther for example you cant bring your buffer to fights.

Well, if you want to get the most out of your druids, you should run one 40 or 39 nurt spec, 34 reg and 12 nature and one 40 reg 36 nature. You get the heals, the cure NS and provide a lot of more utility to the group. We are running this as often as we can as it gives us a much stronger synergy in the group. Again we are not alone here, a LOT of groups runs this but it requires the group to bring charges to make the buffs go up in up and it's not hard to maintain this with a good group. Every caster runs acuity charges, it's 75 acuity which is even superior to purple spec acuity from a druid/shaman/cleric which is base 52. Not running acu charge in group is straight up foolish since even with MotA 9 they won't reach the same value as the charge. Purple D/Q is the same value as the charge on a cleric, 73 on a druid and 70 on a shaman but requires 50, 48 and 47 spec in the buff spec which is far too much for the class to be viable in RvR. With MotA 9 and yellow dex/quick you'll get a value of 82 on a druid, which means a dex/quick charge of 75 is better in nearly every scenario. The same thing goes for str/con. This is of course min/maxing, and while I agree that min/maxers only represents a small portion of the player base it still counts for something.

We run charges because it is ergonomically for us, and I know of several groups that run the same. Charges isn't exclusive to solo stealthers or non grouped players and are also wildly used in groups.
one charge per run isnt that much of an issue yes but lets say you solo or duo, my skald has the following charge items, specc af, str/con buff, damage add,str/con debuff, dot charge... and then you could also run haste charges with 17%...

that would make it 2 charges just to keep up buffs assassins which need dex/qui would even have 3 charges then, + add to that damage add charge or any other charge which you use situational... you would be at least at 30g if you use just one situational charge and 2 buff charges at least every 10mins and you get like 10g for a solo kill and 5g from task completed

just not really worth it except when its not that zergy and you can also find something to kill and arent just running 6mins from HW to Snowdownia or something like that.

I agree that it is less charges, but to make my point clear if a group with charges runs for 30 minutes, they spend 3 charges per run. In an hour that's 6 which means you need to make 60 gold an hour to maintain one charge item. If you're running two, spec af and another stat that means 120 gold per run. This isn't unfeasible, as a group can survive longer then a solo but that doesn't mean we don't have a cost to maintain. If it's zergy I won't break even. If we're avoiding task zones and get good runs I break even or even more.

Sun 17 Mar 2019 3:15 AM by Kohi

Luluko wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 7:19 PM
Kohi wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 2:21 PM
Sorry, but there is an aspect of Daoc which includes gathering items, gold, materials, feathers etc. which also belongs to the game.
Why should rvr-only be rewarded with more gold ? Afaik, we don't get rps while lvling, farming, crafting, do we ?
You can't have the butter and the money from butter, u have to make choices. I don't enjoy sitting for hours at the forge while seeing my pals/guildmates growing their realm rank, but i think that very soon i'll be finish with that, being able to craft my gear, having all my rogs, and finally jump for more than an hour or two in rvr.
I get it, you guys want to focus just on it and it's fully ok, but if there is no need anymore for pve, what will come next ? Food for thoughts.
the logic having to pve to be able to rvr is flawed, when you are also rewarded more xp in the frontier because its more dangerous, if you follow that logic this should also apply to gold. Also there are games where you can completly loot people and take their gold, here you lose nothing except time and buff charges if you die. Its not that much to ask that you can sustain your rvr playtime by just playing rvr you also dont ask the military of your country to starve and work for minimal wages and risk their lives aswell and a military rank wont feed you its own without a wage. Despite that some people use charges quite excessive, especially stealthers and those rely a lot on buffs.

No it isn't a flawed logic, only the basics of this game. As for regarding the exp bonus in frontiers, it's there also because of/for the people who want to rvr = to draw 'preys' in the rvr zones, so here it's either your logic which is flawed i guess. ;-)
Now, more seriously, i'm not against balancing in some way the charge costs, my worry is either about seeing pve zones becoming empty if you can get everything in rvr. I already see a decrease of raids in my time zone : TG DR, used to participate nearly everyday, now i don't even see 1 per week which i can join and i'm not the only one who noticed it. Same goes for grp building (pve) : u often have to work without shaman/sm/healer because despite having dozen of them in lvl range in social (ally), they're all in rvr (50s as non 50s). Gold, loots, feathers should remain best rewarded if pve, with the exception of pve in rvr zones dungeons as it is right now.

Sun 17 Mar 2019 3:52 AM by AngelRose

so..basically, the devs just want groups and zergs playing....and if solo/smallman players want to play they have to pve to just have blue pots and charges.

Sun 17 Mar 2019 5:54 AM by easytoremember

Strongly opposed to messing with the gold drop amounts
If the costs behind recharge outpace gold earnings (from RvR) as severely as OP insinuates, then adjust the recharge cost itself

Sun 17 Mar 2019 10:58 AM by Luluko

Kohi wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 3:15 AM
Luluko wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 7:19 PM
Kohi wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 2:21 PM
Sorry, but there is an aspect of Daoc which includes gathering items, gold, materials, feathers etc. which also belongs to the game.
Why should rvr-only be rewarded with more gold ? Afaik, we don't get rps while lvling, farming, crafting, do we ?
You can't have the butter and the money from butter, u have to make choices. I don't enjoy sitting for hours at the forge while seeing my pals/guildmates growing their realm rank, but i think that very soon i'll be finish with that, being able to craft my gear, having all my rogs, and finally jump for more than an hour or two in rvr.
I get it, you guys want to focus just on it and it's fully ok, but if there is no need anymore for pve, what will come next ? Food for thoughts.
the logic having to pve to be able to rvr is flawed, when you are also rewarded more xp in the frontier because its more dangerous, if you follow that logic this should also apply to gold. Also there are games where you can completly loot people and take their gold, here you lose nothing except time and buff charges if you die. Its not that much to ask that you can sustain your rvr playtime by just playing rvr you also dont ask the military of your country to starve and work for minimal wages and risk their lives aswell and a military rank wont feed you its own without a wage. Despite that some people use charges quite excessive, especially stealthers and those rely a lot on buffs.

No it isn't a flawed logic, only the basics of this game. As for regarding the exp bonus in frontiers, it's there also because of/for the people who want to rvr = to draw 'preys' in the rvr zones, so here it's either your logic which is flawed i guess. ;-)
Now, more seriously, i'm not against balancing in some way the charge costs, my worry is either about seeing pve zones becoming empty if you can get everything in rvr. I already see a decrease of raids in my time zone : TG DR, used to participate nearly everyday, now i don't even see 1 per week which i can join and i'm not the only one who noticed it. Same goes for grp building (pve) : u often have to work without shaman/sm/healer because despite having dozen of them in lvl range in social (ally), they're all in rvr (50s as non 50s). Gold, loots, feathers should remain best rewarded if pve, with the exception of pve in rvr zones dungeons as it is right now.

Gold, loot, feahters is best rewarded through pve you can do a tg run and pretty much sell 10k feathers for 2p+ on average but this is getting old I was on like 25 tg already... and you have a feather cap of 1k per day in rvr so its not even close to pve.

And to that logic no its exactly the same if you want competive players which also solo/duo in the frontier zones then the buff charges should be sustainable through rvr alone because the idea is also to drawn in players into the frontier zones. If you force them to regulary pve they maybe burn out and play something. Thats what happens on live aswell too many pve campaigns and certain items costing over 200platin and everyone wants to be competive and not miss out on charges and then maybe they die because he couldnt afford it. Also I wouldnt mind just lowering the recharging costs to half instead of doubling the gold rewards.

Sun 17 Mar 2019 1:36 PM by Kohi

Luluko wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 10:58 AM
Kohi wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 3:15 AM
Luluko wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 7:19 PM
the logic having to pve to be able to rvr is flawed, when you are also rewarded more xp in the frontier because its more dangerous, if you follow that logic this should also apply to gold. Also there are games where you can completly loot people and take their gold, here you lose nothing except time and buff charges if you die. Its not that much to ask that you can sustain your rvr playtime by just playing rvr you also dont ask the military of your country to starve and work for minimal wages and risk their lives aswell and a military rank wont feed you its own without a wage. Despite that some people use charges quite excessive, especially stealthers and those rely a lot on buffs.

No it isn't a flawed logic, only the basics of this game. As for regarding the exp bonus in frontiers, it's there also because of/for the people who want to rvr = to draw 'preys' in the rvr zones, so here it's either your logic which is flawed i guess. ;-)
Now, more seriously, i'm not against balancing in some way the charge costs, my worry is either about seeing pve zones becoming empty if you can get everything in rvr. I already see a decrease of raids in my time zone : TG DR, used to participate nearly everyday, now i don't even see 1 per week which i can join and i'm not the only one who noticed it. Same goes for grp building (pve) : u often have to work without shaman/sm/healer because despite having dozen of them in lvl range in social (ally), they're all in rvr (50s as non 50s). Gold, loots, feathers should remain best rewarded if pve, with the exception of pve in rvr zones dungeons as it is right now.
Gold, loot, feahters is best rewarded through pve you can do a tg run and pretty much sell 10k feathers for 2p+ on average but this is getting old I was on like 25 tg already... and you have a feather cap of 1k per day in rvr so its not even close to pve.

And to that logic no its exactly the same if you want competive players which also solo/duo in the frontier zones then the buff charges should be sustainable through rvr alone because the idea is also to drawn in players into the frontier zones. If you force them to regulary pve they maybe burn out and play something. Thats what happens on live aswell too many pve campaigns and certain items costing over 200platin and everyone wants to be competive and not miss out on charges and then maybe they die because he couldnt afford it. Also I wouldnt mind just lowering the recharging costs to half instead of doubling the gold rewards.

First thing first, i repeat again Luluko : i'm not against -for my part- finding some way to reduce the costs with charges refill. =)
Hhhmm... I don't know if it's a good idea or not, didn't think about consequences, but i'll throw it as it is : + and - to make it possible to recharge for bounty points ? Like for reskins etc, some npc parked in the capital or even better in pks ? good idea, bad idea ? tbh idk...

This being said, back to TG & co : sure, it's worth doing raids as it brings 12k feathers + a chance on a rog. Prob is, there is not much raids anymore these last weeks. Since 2 weeks, i observe that there is sometimes a raid at 5AM (my time) and when somebody try to make one, it's a pain because we were not enough (last we did, we were lesser than 100 iirc, and the one before we wiped because only 60+ ). At those both raids, from memory i think we had around 600+ people online for the realm, but mostly... rvr... I didn't have the problem back in February (guess there was still enough people lvling their main then?) and could join every morning a raid.

Now, for your explanation, it can also be turn the other way : you said forcing people to pve 'could' burn them out, while i know hundreds of guys which stopped playing on Uthgard because fed up of being ganked on the way to keeps to gather materials. What do u think will happen to newcomers being alone for lvling, gearing up ? What about people who want to change the realm for a fresh start ? Those wishing to lvl a new toon ? Will they not be 'forced' to give up or 'burned out' because unable to gear up for rvr/to compete with the hard nuts out there ? See, different point of view, different issue... /shrug

But this is anyway not even the topic, Phoenix did and still does a lot for both worlds, pve as rvr, and i don't think that spending a few hours per week bashing some mobs would 'burn out' anybody. The comparison to live is imho exagerate (200p items etc). The staff did take measures to balance economy, and i'm pretty sure they're still monitoring whats going on in pve as rvr. Like i said above, my fight is not against rvr or charges, it's about preserving a realm alive, out of the fz.

Sun 17 Mar 2019 5:59 PM by Luluko

Kohi wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 1:36 PM
Luluko wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 10:58 AM
Kohi wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 3:15 AM
No it isn't a flawed logic, only the basics of this game. As for regarding the exp bonus in frontiers, it's there also because of/for the people who want to rvr = to draw 'preys' in the rvr zones, so here it's either your logic which is flawed i guess. ;-)
Now, more seriously, i'm not against balancing in some way the charge costs, my worry is either about seeing pve zones becoming empty if you can get everything in rvr. I already see a decrease of raids in my time zone : TG DR, used to participate nearly everyday, now i don't even see 1 per week which i can join and i'm not the only one who noticed it. Same goes for grp building (pve) : u often have to work without shaman/sm/healer because despite having dozen of them in lvl range in social (ally), they're all in rvr (50s as non 50s). Gold, loots, feathers should remain best rewarded if pve, with the exception of pve in rvr zones dungeons as it is right now.
Gold, loot, feahters is best rewarded through pve you can do a tg run and pretty much sell 10k feathers for 2p+ on average but this is getting old I was on like 25 tg already... and you have a feather cap of 1k per day in rvr so its not even close to pve.

And to that logic no its exactly the same if you want competive players which also solo/duo in the frontier zones then the buff charges should be sustainable through rvr alone because the idea is also to drawn in players into the frontier zones. If you force them to regulary pve they maybe burn out and play something. Thats what happens on live aswell too many pve campaigns and certain items costing over 200platin and everyone wants to be competive and not miss out on charges and then maybe they die because he couldnt afford it. Also I wouldnt mind just lowering the recharging costs to half instead of doubling the gold rewards.

First thing first, i repeat again Luluko : i'm not against -for my part- finding some way to reduce the costs with charges refill. =)
Hhhmm... I don't know if it's a good idea or not, didn't think about consequences, but i'll throw it as it is : + and - to make it possible to recharge for bounty points ? Like for reskins etc, some npc parked in the capital or even better in pks ? good idea, bad idea ? tbh idk...

This being said, back to TG & co : sure, it's worth doing raids as it brings 12k feathers + a chance on a rog. Prob is, there is not much raids anymore these last weeks. Since 2 weeks, i observe that there is sometimes a raid at 5AM (my time) and when somebody try to make one, it's a pain because we were not enough (last we did, we were lesser than 100 iirc, and the one before we wiped because only 60+ ). At those both raids, from memory i think we had around 600+ people online for the realm, but mostly... rvr... I didn't have the problem back in February (guess there was still enough people lvling their main then?) and could join every morning a raid.

Now, for your explanation, it can also be turn the other way : you said forcing people to pve 'could' burn them out, while i know hundreds of guys which stopped playing on Uthgard because fed up of being ganked on the way to keeps to gather materials. What do u think will happen to newcomers being alone for lvling, gearing up ? What about people who want to change the realm for a fresh start ? Those wishing to lvl a new toon ? Will they not be 'forced' to give up or 'burned out' because unable to gear up for rvr/to compete with the hard nuts out there ? See, different point of view, different issue... /shrug

But this is anyway not even the topic, Phoenix did and still does a lot for both worlds, pve as rvr, and i don't think that spending a few hours per week bashing some mobs would 'burn out' anybody. The comparison to live is imho exagerate (200p items etc). The staff did take measures to balance economy, and i'm pretty sure they're still monitoring whats going on in pve as rvr. Like i said above, my fight is not against rvr or charges, it's about preserving a realm alive, out of the fz.

the difference is you level up once and to 50 you can get realitiv fast here thanks to xp items/tasks, you get like 5-7bubs just from xp items rest is from realm tasks or some kill tasks or you just farm more xp items for the next few levels while doing killtasks. You can do that in the frontier risk getting killed you can better the odds of not getting ganked if you pve at a certain time and when its not a realmtask zone and if its not in a high traffic zone, but if you dont mind dieing once in a while you still get the realm partizipation if you got killed so its a win=win for greys here, if they arent too stubborn and come to the same spot again and again.

A lvl 50 only has the choice to find easier fights where people dont use buff charges, that would be greens/blue xpers in the frontier. Without having to spend lots of money on charges and even then you sometimes need some if a few lvl 50 show up to play white knight or another realm has the same idea. You dont really have an option despite grping up and it can take time to find a grp especially on certain classes. I mean if everyone would just play a caster with speed and would zerg and only run blue pots sure you would still make rps but then you are just a victim for assassins if you are alone then and as a tank/ none speed class you are pretty useless in zerg fights if solo.

Sun 17 Mar 2019 6:15 PM by Kohi

Luluko wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 5:59 PM
...
the difference is you level up once and to 50 you can get realitiv fast here thanks to xp items/tasks, you get like 5-7bubs just from xp items rest is from realm tasks or some kill tasks or you just farm more xp items for the next few levels while doing killtasks. You can do that in the frontier risk getting killed you can better the odds of not getting ganked if you pve at a certain time and when its not a realmtask zone and if its not in a high traffic zone, but if you dont mind dieing once in a while you still get the realm partizipation if you got killed so its a win=win for greys here, if they arent too stubborn and come to the same spot again and again.

A lvl 50 only has the choice to find easier fights where people dont use buff charges, that would be greens/blue xpers in the frontier. Without having to spend lots of money on charges and even then you sometimes need some if a few lvl 50 show up to play white knight or another realm has the same idea. You dont really have an option despite grping up and it can take time to find a grp especially on certain classes.

Correct, i did alternate mainland/rvr zone for lvling my toons (don't have any lvler toon anymore), and for sure use eggs, exp items, % bonus when they came. I was ganked more than once, 99% of time by sneaks or pet classes. But this is again not the topic, is it ?
I don't deny that pots/charges are more than handy and if solo or non supp class in small/grp, a must-have thing. I just don't agree with an increase of gold in rvr. A bounty points or/and a decrease of recharge/craft cost might be a way out, idk. Like i said, even if you're solo and have a decent farm class, even without any buffs, u can still manage to farm few plats quickly. Anyway, time to sleep ;-) Have fun, Luluko =)

Sun 17 Mar 2019 7:56 PM by waffel

My god, how often are you people dying that you’re burning so much gold a day? And how many charges are you running??? And how often are you dying without getting any kills or tagging anyone?

Sun 17 Mar 2019 8:45 PM by AngelRose

waffel wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 7:56 PM
My god, how often are you people dying that you’re burning so much gold a day? And how many charges are you running??? And how often are you dying without getting any kills or tagging anyone?

They are on 10 minute timers. Even if you don die, you go through them quickly. They are expensive. Not everyone runs in fg with buffs. And those who still want to play smally/solo are at a sever disadvantage already with the blue buffs. We also have to spend much more time farming, just to have crappy buffs and charges.

Mon 18 Mar 2019 5:38 AM by rubaduck

AngelRose wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 3:52 AM
so..basically, the devs just want groups and zergs playing....and if solo/smallman players want to play they have to pve to just have blue pots and charges.

No you dont have to pve to maintain it, and to avoid the zerg you can always go to the non-task zones as people are still playing 8v8, smallman and solo there. You still get task credit for RvRing in those zones and will probably net you more gold then the zerg zone.

Mon 18 Mar 2019 7:11 AM by AngelRose

rubaduck wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 5:38 AM
AngelRose wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 3:52 AM
so..basically, the devs just want groups and zergs playing....and if solo/smallman players want to play they have to pve to just have blue pots and charges.

No you dont have to pve to maintain it, and to avoid the zerg you can always go to the non-task zones as people are still playing 8v8, smallman and solo there. You still get task credit for RvRing in those zones and will probably net you more gold then the zerg zone.

How much gold an hour do you make? Do you solo or duo?

Mon 18 Mar 2019 9:26 AM by rubaduck

AngelRose wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 7:11 AM
rubaduck wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 5:38 AM
AngelRose wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 3:52 AM
so..basically, the devs just want groups and zergs playing....and if solo/smallman players want to play they have to pve to just have blue pots and charges.

No you dont have to pve to maintain it, and to avoid the zerg you can always go to the non-task zones as people are still playing 8v8, smallman and solo there. You still get task credit for RvRing in those zones and will probably net you more gold then the zerg zone.

How much gold an hour do you make? Do you solo or duo?

I do not solo or duo as it doesn't appeal to me, but I do smallman and 8 man and I've made everything between 400 to 800 gold per session of 2-4 hours. It is by far enough to maintain my runs.

Now to follow up on my own questioning on the matter, where do you solo/duo?

Mon 18 Mar 2019 9:56 AM by Durgrim

Stop whining.
For midgard side: invest 55min ONCE a week into a TG run, this nets you at least 10k feathers worth min. 2 plat at the moment.
For other realms: invest XXmin ONCE a week into Epic Dungeon run, this nets you at least 10k feathers worth how many plat at the moment?
Stop whining.

PS (my pov):
The amount of gold which currently drops (RvR & PvE) is too high. A full group @ redcaps - not even bombing - makes around 100-150g each player per hour...coin drop only! No sellloot, no salvage included yet.
Solo farm classes like Shaman can do more than 2 plat per hour; together with a pulling skald more than double the amount. I have done 6250g per hour once with a skald even without selling ROGs - only coindrop & salvage.

I'd reduce the coin drop.

Mon 18 Mar 2019 2:58 PM by dante`afk

Ceen wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 10:21 AM
Dont play 10 h a day and you wont need to spend 10 p a week

I play 1-2 hours a day, tops.

Uthred wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 6:06 PM
We dont have any plans on changing Gold per kill. Actually (my personal opinion) it should be lowered a bit. But also no plans on that atm.

Let alchemists recharge items? Less cost for recharging items overall? I play 1-2 hours per day and burn through 10p a week solo.

Mon 18 Mar 2019 3:11 PM by Sym

Kohi wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 2:21 PM
Sorry, but there is an aspect of Daoc which includes gathering items, gold, materials, feathers etc. which also belongs to the game.
Why should rvr-only be rewarded with more gold ? Afaik, we don't get rps while lvling, farming, crafting, do we ?
You can't have the butter and the money from butter, u have to make choices. I don't enjoy sitting for hours at the forge while seeing my pals/guildmates growing their realm rank, but i think that very soon i'll be finish with that, being able to craft my gear, having all my rogs, and finally jump for more than an hour or two in rvr.
I get it, you guys want to focus just on it and it's fully ok, but if there is no need anymore for pve, what will come next ? Food for thoughts.

While leveling you earn xp and gold. Which is pretty much what you need to level up, right ? Why would you get rps during your leveling sessions ? lol.
And even tho we earn a decent amount of gold while xp'ing, it's still far from what it requires to make a full temp'd char for some classes. When I reached level 50, I had barely 5PP. Pretty low, considering how expensive some crafts / procs can be.

I'm pretty much ok with the original post, the gold per kills should be highly increased since it's the only income we get once we're done with the pve side. Maybe not highly, but at least increased.
I'm temp'd since a week, or maybe less, and the Con of some of my items are already at 99%, which means it decreases pretty fast. If it keeps going like that, I might have to think about getting new armor/spellcrafted pieces after several weeks. If I've to pay high prices to recharge my items, buy pots, etc. how much gold do I've left to make another temp when it's going to be needed ?

<You have to make choices>
The end-game of DAoC is the Realm vs Realm aspect, so why should have ever bother to go to the pve side for a big and annoying farm session (gathering several plats to make a temp'd gear is far from being fast when you're alone) which might last for several days/weeks (assuming we're not all no-lifers ?). Speaking of which, my choice is already made.

Mon 18 Mar 2019 4:47 PM by Kohi

Sym wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 3:11 PM
Kohi wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 2:21 PM
Sorry, but there is an aspect of Daoc which includes gathering items, gold, materials, feathers etc. which also belongs to the game.
Why should rvr-only be rewarded with more gold ? Afaik, we don't get rps while lvling, farming, crafting, do we ?
You can't have the butter and the money from butter, u have to make choices. I don't enjoy sitting for hours at the forge while seeing my pals/guildmates growing their realm rank, but i think that very soon i'll be finish with that, being able to craft my gear, having all my rogs, and finally jump for more than an hour or two in rvr.
I get it, you guys want to focus just on it and it's fully ok, but if there is no need anymore for pve, what will come next ? Food for thoughts.

While leveling you earn xp and gold. Which is pretty much what you need to level up, right ? Why would you get rps during your leveling sessions ? lol.
And even tho we earn a decent amount of gold while xp'ing, it's still far from what it requires to make a full temp'd char for some classes. When I reached level 50, I had barely 5PP. Pretty low, considering how expensive some crafts / procs can be.

I'm pretty much ok with the original post, the gold per kills should be highly increased since it's the only income we get once we're done with the pve side. Maybe not highly, but at least increased.
I'm temp'd since a week, or maybe less, and the Con of some of my items are already at 99%, which means it decreases pretty fast. If it keeps going like that, I might have to think about getting new armor/spellcrafted pieces after several weeks. If I've to pay high prices to recharge my items, buy pots, etc. how much gold do I've left to make another temp when it's going to be needed ?

<You have to make choices>
The end-game of DAoC is the Realm vs Realm aspect, so why should have ever bother to go to the pve side for a big and annoying farm session (gathering several plats to make a temp'd gear is far from being fast when you're alone) which might last for several days/weeks (assuming we're not all no-lifers ?). Speaking of which, my choice is already made.

"Why would you get rps during your leveling sessions ? lol."
Again the same vision as before : your point of view isn't objective, as you're not considering the whole aspect which -like it or not- includes pve...
My sentence - "Afaik, we don't get rps while lvling, farming, crafting, do we ?" - was a counter to the previous pov, to express the duality of these 2 "worlds" (pve/rvr). Afaik, i never asked for rps while lvling so please don't quote me with this sentence out of its context.

"the gold per kills should be highly increased since it's the only income we get once we're done with the pve side"
Says who ? Are u forbidden to join a moderna grp ? shredders grp ? TH runs ? TG raids ? DR raids ? duo farming ? I see all day long people asking for people to join, sometimes searching for hours depending on the classes. We all have to grind for gold, rogs and feathers, thats the way it is. All people i knew on live, even hardcore rvr players, spent always a bit time farming with an alt for their mains, generally by fins or coruscating mines (i was on hib then). For me it was always part of the deal.

Now i don't deny the cost, it's real, and somehow, i already said it during beta, the degrade of items isn't like i remembered it from live : i could rep few times to 100% durability (2 times maybe ?) before finally losing 1%, while here it goes down very fast imo.

"The end-game of DAoC is the Realm vs Realm aspect"
Thats your point of view, again... I enjoy both aspects and know a lot of people here which think the same way. I like smallmen, 8-grp, taking keeps, raiding, soloing when i'm on sneak, as well as i can enjoy a challenging epic raid or making massive pulls to gather gold, feathers and rogs for 2-3h. I also like farming solo/duo some named or high mobs for a specific item while chatting or drinking my coffee. Too much people assume there is only one way to play daoc here these days, while we have all sort of folks here, making the diversity of this server so enjoyable. There is not one way, there is only "your" way, and it should be fun. Some like farming, others rvr, others like smallmen only, while other want to 8vs8...

Mon 18 Mar 2019 5:16 PM by Sym

Kohi wrote: Says who ? Are u forbidden to join a moderna grp ? shredders grp ? TH runs ? TG raids ? DR raids ? duo farming ? I see all day long people asking for people to join, sometimes searching for hours depending on the classes. We all have to grind for gold, rogs and feathers, thats the way it is. All people i knew on live, even hardcore rvr players, spent always a bit time farming with an alt for their mains, generally by fins or coruscating mines (i was on hib then). For me it was always part of the deal.

Me. I've done dozen and dozen of Sidi raids, and when every raid comes with 200+ players, it's everything but fun considering the lags. I've farmed WAY ENOUGH days to FINALLY being able to pay for my temp'd gear, why should I do that once again with my main character ? He enjoyed the PVE side of the game, then now I want to enjoy the RVR one as much as I can with him. It sounds fair to me.
Talking about personal POV, don't think of your own POVs as the spearhead of objectivity neither. If YOU enjoy both PVE and RVR sides it doesn't mean everyone has to as much as you do.
I do enjoy the PVE side as a goal to gear my character, once it's done I like to do something else.

And not everyone has the will to level up a dedicated farm toon, not everyone is playing MID to join moderna groups (which seems to be a very good way to earn gold there from what I heard), etc.

At least, if there were pretty much straight forward ways to earn gold in a solo farming session which doesn't require hours and hours to set up, I wouldn't mind to do it from time to time, but there no such things atm. Unless you've a dedicated farm class. And as an Alb player, aside of cabalist and necro, that's pretty much it.
Even the RoG system is a salvage nerf in itself. The "RoG drop-rate" as an answer to that is a bad joke since most of the farming classes are cloth users and cloth users MOSTLY get cloth RoG items. Pretty bad when it comes to salvage when everyone knows salvage grants a good income when it comes to salvage METAL items.

Mon 18 Mar 2019 5:46 PM by Kohi

Sym wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 5:16 PM
Kohi wrote: Says who ? Are u forbidden to join a moderna grp ? shredders grp ? TH runs ? TG raids ? DR raids ? duo farming ? I see all day long people asking for people to join, sometimes searching for hours depending on the classes. We all have to grind for gold, rogs and feathers, thats the way it is. All people i knew on live, even hardcore rvr players, spent always a bit time farming with an alt for their mains, generally by fins or coruscating mines (i was on hib then). For me it was always part of the deal.

Me. I've done dozen and dozen of Sidi raids, and when every raid comes with 200+ players, it's everything but fun considering the lags. I've farmed WAY ENOUGH days to FINALLY being able to pay for my temp'd gear, why should I do that once again with my main character ? He enjoyed the PVE side of the game, then now I want to enjoy the RVR one as much as I can with him. It sounds fair to me.
Talking about personal POV, don't think of your own POVs as the spearhead of objectivity neither. If YOU enjoy both PVE and RVR sides it doesn't mean everyone has to as much as you do.
I do enjoy the PVE side as a goal to gear my character, once it's done I like to do something else.

And not everyone has the will to level up a dedicated farm toon, not everyone is playing MID to join moderna groups (which seems to be a very good way to earn gold there from what I heard), etc.

At least, if there were pretty much straight forward ways to earn gold in a solo farming session which doesn't require hours and hours to set up, I wouldn't mind to do it from time to time, but there no such things atm. Unless you've a dedicated farm class, and as Alb player, aside of cabalist and necro, that's pretty much it.
Even the RoG system is a salvage nerf in itself. The "RoG drop-rate" as an answer to that is a bad joke since most of the farming classes are cloth users and cloth users MOSTLY get cloth RoG items. Pretty bad when it comes to salvage when everyone knows salvage grants a good income when it comes to salvage METAL items.

Well. I will skip the first part of your post, as discuting further this subject isn't constructive somehow. ;-)
I like both, yes, as do a lot of my guildies and people i met while lvling, some of them even farming with me sometimes, as we too have to gather rogs, gold, feathers in order to gear up and craft the famous pots, procs etc. Now, i respect your pov as it's your right to focus on rvr, thats not the question tho.

To lvl an alt, especially one dedicated to farm, is in fact a decision to take for yourself. I could have skip it, and now being howling with the hord for more gold in rvr. (sry, just kidding ^^) But i took the decision to anticipate the problem by taking basic measures as i did back in 2002, or more recently in 2016 on Uth : lvling first my mains + farm toons in order to gather stuff for my alts (better lvling experience), crafting, etc.

Now, the "not everyone is playing Mid to join Moderna" argumentation, u can't be serious can u ?

ALB ? Necro ? i don't think it's a big deal to farm there too, is it ? Anyway, Moderna is just a classic example, u can go Malmo, DF, Hagbuis in the swamp, whatever. Hell, i even farmed fins & leprechauns in the fz, or marfach back in the days. There are enough zones with tons of mobs to farm everywhere i guess.

Regarding the classes, i didn't exclusively use my ench or menta to farm then, i was often farming with my ranger too. Those who know coruscating mines will know about weeveres spot (the long tunnel) which is perfect for ranger/void/light eld or menta, or even the golems in the pit (forgot their name in English ^^). I had few friends which had only sneak toons then, and i was even pled from my best pal down there, using ns or ranger depending on his mood. Tons of drops to salv, loot to sell and gold coins. Yeah, i get it, it takes time and it's boring. But u know the saying, where there is a will...

Mon 18 Mar 2019 5:56 PM by Sym

Kohi wrote: thats not the question tho.

That's the question, actually. If I focus on rvr I'll get much less gold as stated previously, since the gold amount we earn per kills isn't that huge. That where comes the need to level up a dedicated farming class, etc. Which sounds pretty bad or like a default choice to "enjoy" the pve side.

Mon 18 Mar 2019 6:08 PM by Kohi

Sym wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 5:56 PM
Kohi wrote: thats not the question tho.

That's the question, actually. If I focus on rvr I'll get much less gold as stated previously, since the gold amount we earn per kills isn't that huge. That where comes the need to level up a dedicated farming class, etc. Which sounds pretty bad or like a default choice to "enjoy" the pve side.

My bad, i rewrote the sentence and suppressed some parts to avoid writing a wall.

What i meant was refering to the upper text, about our different povs, my own way to see things and the guys around me opinion. It's 3AM here, so i'm kinda tired. Anyway, it's a 'hot' topic as opinions are divided as for buffbots, pots, and other things.

Tue 19 Mar 2019 3:46 AM by AngelRose

rubaduck wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 9:26 AM
AngelRose wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 7:11 AM
rubaduck wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 5:38 AM
No you dont have to pve to maintain it, and to avoid the zerg you can always go to the non-task zones as people are still playing 8v8, smallman and solo there. You still get task credit for RvRing in those zones and will probably net you more gold then the zerg zone.

How much gold an hour do you make? Do you solo or duo?

I do not solo or duo as it doesn't appeal to me, but I do smallman and 8 man and I've made everything between 400 to 800 gold per session of 2-4 hours. It is by far enough to maintain my runs.

Now to follow up on my own questioning on the matter, where do you solo/duo?

You have no idea what you are talking about, to be honest. The amount of charges do not change based on location, and non-task areas decrease gold because there are less fights. I have 2 charges that have to be hit every 10 minutes, as well as the expensive buff pot. Even without dying, just the charges alone is 120 gp an hour. We also are paying for the buff and endo pots....maybe another 50 gold an hour. Over all we spend about 200g an hour...if we dont die. My friend has 3 charges...so even more

Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:20 AM by rubaduck

AngelRose wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 3:46 AM
rubaduck wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 9:26 AM
AngelRose wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 7:11 AM
How much gold an hour do you make? Do you solo or duo?

I do not solo or duo as it doesn't appeal to me, but I do smallman and 8 man and I've made everything between 400 to 800 gold per session of 2-4 hours. It is by far enough to maintain my runs.

Now to follow up on my own questioning on the matter, where do you solo/duo?
You have no idea what you are talking about, to be honest. The amount of charges do not change based on location, and non-task areas decrease gold because there are less fights. I have 2 charges that have to be hit every 10 minutes, as well as the expensive buff pot. Even without dying, just the charges alone is 120 gp an hour. We also are paying for the buff and endo pots....maybe another 50 gold an hour. Over all we spend about 200g an hour...if we dont die. My friend has 3 charges...so even more

I also have two charges going constantly every 10 minutes 1 AF, 1 D/Q or 1 S/C, which has exactly the same cost to recharge as yours, as well as having to keep up both endo and power barrels. So I beg your f**cking pardon, what on earth makes your solo play more relevant then my argument in this case? How ironic, that in one post you managed to take your *oh snap* and turn it back on your self. How about not projecting your argument next time?

Don't run in zerg zones, ups your chance for kills, downs your chance dying randomly = makes the zone pretty relevant for upkeep.

Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:35 AM by AngelRose

rubaduck wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:20 AM
AngelRose wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 3:46 AM
rubaduck wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 9:26 AM
I do not solo or duo as it doesn't appeal to me, but I do smallman and 8 man and I've made everything between 400 to 800 gold per session of 2-4 hours. It is by far enough to maintain my runs.

Now to follow up on my own questioning on the matter, where do you solo/duo?
You have no idea what you are talking about, to be honest. The amount of charges do not change based on location, and non-task areas decrease gold because there are less fights. I have 2 charges that have to be hit every 10 minutes, as well as the expensive buff pot. Even without dying, just the charges alone is 120 gp an hour. We also are paying for the buff and endo pots....maybe another 50 gold an hour. Over all we spend about 200g an hour...if we dont die. My friend has 3 charges...so even more

I also have two charges going constantly every 10 minutes 1 AF, 1 D/Q or 1 S/C, which has exactly the same cost to recharge as yours, as well as having to keep up both endo and power barrels. So I beg your f**cking pardon, what on earth makes your solo play more relevant then my argument in this case? How ironic, that in one post you managed to take your *oh snap* and turn it back on your self. How about not projecting your argument next time?

Don't run in zerg zones, ups your chance for kills, downs your chance dying randomly = makes the zone pretty relevant for upkeep.

You think you can compare small man/8man and solo/duo as the same. Go run solo for a few days, and get back to me - cuz at this point you just look like a dumb ass, darlin

Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:40 AM by rubaduck

AngelRose wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:35 AM
rubaduck wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:20 AM
AngelRose wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 3:46 AM
You have no idea what you are talking about, to be honest. The amount of charges do not change based on location, and non-task areas decrease gold because there are less fights. I have 2 charges that have to be hit every 10 minutes, as well as the expensive buff pot. Even without dying, just the charges alone is 120 gp an hour. We also are paying for the buff and endo pots....maybe another 50 gold an hour. Over all we spend about 200g an hour...if we dont die. My friend has 3 charges...so even more

I also have two charges going constantly every 10 minutes 1 AF, 1 D/Q or 1 S/C, which has exactly the same cost to recharge as yours, as well as having to keep up both endo and power barrels. So I beg your f**cking pardon, what on earth makes your solo play more relevant then my argument in this case? How ironic, that in one post you managed to take your *oh snap* and turn it back on your self. How about not projecting your argument next time?

Don't run in zerg zones, ups your chance for kills, downs your chance dying randomly = makes the zone pretty relevant for upkeep.

You think you can compare small man/8man and solo/duo as the same. Go run solo for a few days, and get back to me - cuz at this point you just look like a dumb ass, darlin

Again, projecting.

Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:37 AM by Sepplord

dante`afk wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 2:58 PM
Ceen wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 10:21 AM
Dont play 10 h a day and you wont need to spend 10 p a week

I play 1-2 hours a day, tops.

Uthred wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 6:06 PM
We dont have any plans on changing Gold per kill. Actually (my personal opinion) it should be lowered a bit. But also no plans on that atm.

Let alchemists recharge items? Less cost for recharging items overall? I play 1-2 hours per day and burn through 10p a week solo.

How do you burn 10plat in pots/charges in 10hours of gameplay?

charges are 1g/minute
combined forces+endu+shardskin+haste are approx 1g/minute in total

3charges +pots come out at 240g per hour

Either you are dieing every 3minutes (at which point i am unsure how you mange to rebuff all charges before dieing again) but then maybe rethink your running habits

Or am i missing some substantial gold-drain that you are using?

Tue 19 Mar 2019 7:49 AM by AngelRose

rubaduck wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:40 AM
AngelRose wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:35 AM
rubaduck wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 5:20 AM
I also have two charges going constantly every 10 minutes 1 AF, 1 D/Q or 1 S/C, which has exactly the same cost to recharge as yours, as well as having to keep up both endo and power barrels. So I beg your f**cking pardon, what on earth makes your solo play more relevant then my argument in this case? How ironic, that in one post you managed to take your *oh snap* and turn it back on your self. How about not projecting your argument next time?

Don't run in zerg zones, ups your chance for kills, downs your chance dying randomly = makes the zone pretty relevant for upkeep.

You think you can compare small man/8man and solo/duo as the same. Go run solo for a few days, and get back to me - cuz at this point you just look like a dumb ass, darlin

Again, projecting.

When will you solo for a few days? Keep us updated on how you solo for 4 hours and log off with more gold then you started, over a period of a few days. Let's see how that actually works for you...and not just paper doac from someone who has never done it.

Tue 19 Mar 2019 7:59 AM by Durgrim

back to topic:
No, disagree. No more gold per kill.
Players are spoiled with running 24/7 fully charged and buffed because this is their expectation - being fully prepared.
Fully prep is money sink and should be. Just imagine QQ about Alch prices when feathers run low on the server due to lesser TG runs....

fact is, if you wanna be fully prep in rvr you need bloody money and this should NOT come from RvR'ing. It should come from the dark side of the moon: PvE content.

Tue 19 Mar 2019 8:16 AM by Durgrim

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:37 AM
dante`afk wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 2:58 PM
Ceen wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 10:21 AM
Dont play 10 h a day and you wont need to spend 10 p a week

I play 1-2 hours a day, tops.

Uthred wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 6:06 PM
We dont have any plans on changing Gold per kill. Actually (my personal opinion) it should be lowered a bit. But also no plans on that atm.

Let alchemists recharge items? Less cost for recharging items overall? I play 1-2 hours per day and burn through 10p a week solo.

How do you burn 10plat in pots/charges in 10hours of gameplay?

charges are 1g/minute
combined forces+endu+shardskin+haste are approx 1g/minute in total

3charges +pots come out at 240g per hour

Either you are dieing every 3minutes (at which point i am unsure how you mange to rebuff all charges before dieing again) but then maybe rethink your running habits

Or am i missing some substantial gold-drain that you are using?

Once again shows me that Math classes DO PAY OFF! *drools* my math teach was right

I will need it at some point in my life....

Tue 19 Mar 2019 1:54 PM by dante`afk

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:37 AM
dante`afk wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 2:58 PM
Ceen wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 10:21 AM
Dont play 10 h a day and you wont need to spend 10 p a week

I play 1-2 hours a day, tops.

Uthred wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 6:06 PM
We dont have any plans on changing Gold per kill. Actually (my personal opinion) it should be lowered a bit. But also no plans on that atm.

Let alchemists recharge items? Less cost for recharging items overall? I play 1-2 hours per day and burn through 10p a week solo.

How do you burn 10plat in pots/charges in 10hours of gameplay?

charges are 1g/minute
combined forces+endu+shardskin+haste are approx 1g/minute in total

3charges +pots come out at 240g per hour

Either you are dieing every 3minutes (at which point i am unsure how you mange to rebuff all charges before dieing again) but then maybe rethink your running habits

Or am i missing some substantial gold-drain that you are using?

I was bad at math. 2-3 hours per day during the week. 5 hours plus on Friday. Don't play Sat/Sunday (mostly)

I'll leave the calculations for other people. My K/D ratio is positive 2:1.

5 charge items
3 barrels with 100 charges each, approx 1.5p for all together
shard and haste pots 50g together
lethargy/weariness poisons 50g together
18 weapons for repoisening

Wed 20 Mar 2019 3:09 PM by Steelhead23rus

Kohi wrote: ↑
Sun 17 Mar 2019 3:15 AM
Luluko wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 7:19 PM
Kohi wrote: ↑
Sat 16 Mar 2019 2:21 PM
Sorry, but there is an aspect of Daoc which includes gathering items, gold, materials, feathers etc. which also belongs to the game.
Why should rvr-only be rewarded with more gold ? Afaik, we don't get rps while lvling, farming, crafting, do we ?
You can't have the butter and the money from butter, u have to make choices. I don't enjoy sitting for hours at the forge while seeing my pals/guildmates growing their realm rank, but i think that very soon i'll be finish with that, being able to craft my gear, having all my rogs, and finally jump for more than an hour or two in rvr.
I get it, you guys want to focus just on it and it's fully ok, but if there is no need anymore for pve, what will come next ? Food for thoughts.
the logic having to pve to be able to rvr is flawed, when you are also rewarded more xp in the frontier because its more dangerous, if you follow that logic this should also apply to gold. Also there are games where you can completly loot people and take their gold, here you lose nothing except time and buff charges if you die. Its not that much to ask that you can sustain your rvr playtime by just playing rvr you also dont ask the military of your country to starve and work for minimal wages and risk their lives aswell and a military rank wont feed you its own without a wage. Despite that some people use charges quite excessive, especially stealthers and those rely a lot on buffs.

No it isn't a flawed logic, only the basics of this game. As for regarding the exp bonus in frontiers, it's there also because of/for the people who want to rvr = to draw 'preys' in the rvr zones, so here it's either your logic which is flawed i guess. ;-)
Now, more seriously, i'm not against balancing in some way the charge costs, my worry is either about seeing pve zones becoming empty if you can get everything in rvr. I already see a decrease of raids in my time zone : TG DR, used to participate nearly everyday, now i don't even see 1 per week which i can join and i'm not the only one who noticed it. Same goes for grp building (pve) : u often have to work without shaman/sm/healer because despite having dozen of them in lvl range in social (ally), they're all in rvr (50s as non 50s). Gold, loots, feathers should remain best rewarded if pve, with the exception of pve in rvr zones dungeons as it is right now.

Daoc is not pve game. Every discussion about pve being empty is a joke.

Wed 20 Mar 2019 3:24 PM by Durgrim

dante`afk wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 1:54 PM
Sepplord wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:37 AM
dante`afk wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Mar 2019 2:58 PM
I play 1-2 hours a day, tops.

Let alchemists recharge items? Less cost for recharging items overall? I play 1-2 hours per day and burn through 10p a week solo.

How do you burn 10plat in pots/charges in 10hours of gameplay?

charges are 1g/minute
combined forces+endu+shardskin+haste are approx 1g/minute in total

3charges +pots come out at 240g per hour

Either you are dieing every 3minutes (at which point i am unsure how you mange to rebuff all charges before dieing again) but then maybe rethink your running habits

Or am i missing some substantial gold-drain that you are using?

I was bad at math. 2-3 hours per day during the week. 5 hours plus on Friday. Don't play Sat/Sunday (mostly)

I'll leave the calculations for other people. My K/D ratio is positive 2:1.

5 charge items
3 barrels with 100 charges each, approx 1.5p for all together
shard and haste pots 50g together
lethargy/weariness poisons 50g together
18 weapons for repoisening

Then you simply cannot run max buffed/potted as you do not want to invest into earning money.

Wed 20 Mar 2019 3:33 PM by Steelhead23rus

Durgrim wrote: ↑
Wed 20 Mar 2019 3:24 PM
dante`afk wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 1:54 PM
Sepplord wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:37 AM
How do you burn 10plat in pots/charges in 10hours of gameplay?

charges are 1g/minute
combined forces+endu+shardskin+haste are approx 1g/minute in total

3charges +pots come out at 240g per hour

Either you are dieing every 3minutes (at which point i am unsure how you mange to rebuff all charges before dieing again) but then maybe rethink your running habits

Or am i missing some substantial gold-drain that you are using?

I was bad at math. 2-3 hours per day during the week. 5 hours plus on Friday. Don't play Sat/Sunday (mostly)

I'll leave the calculations for other people. My K/D ratio is positive 2:1.

5 charge items
3 barrels with 100 charges each, approx 1.5p for all together
shard and haste pots 50g together
lethargy/weariness poisons 50g together
18 weapons for repoisening

Then you simply cannot run max buffed/potted as you do not want to invest into earning money.

Why so ? People should have the choice and they will have it anyway. Even if they will be forced to go pve and if they dont want to theyll just leave. Will be great end of the great game if pve will kill it)

Wed 20 Mar 2019 3:42 PM by Halma

This whole discussion just shows buffpots and charges need to go. More time for everyone to just do RvR with the skills the class provides.
"But muh swing cap" will sadly prevent this.

Wed 20 Mar 2019 3:47 PM by florin

Durgrim wrote: ↑
Wed 20 Mar 2019 3:24 PM
dante`afk wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 1:54 PM
Sepplord wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 6:37 AM
How do you burn 10plat in pots/charges in 10hours of gameplay?

charges are 1g/minute
combined forces+endu+shardskin+haste are approx 1g/minute in total

3charges +pots come out at 240g per hour

Either you are dieing every 3minutes (at which point i am unsure how you mange to rebuff all charges before dieing again) but then maybe rethink your running habits

Or am i missing some substantial gold-drain that you are using?

I was bad at math. 2-3 hours per day during the week. 5 hours plus on Friday. Don't play Sat/Sunday (mostly)

I'll leave the calculations for other people. My K/D ratio is positive 2:1.

5 charge items
3 barrels with 100 charges each, approx 1.5p for all together
shard and haste pots 50g together
lethargy/weariness poisons 50g together
18 weapons for repoisening

Then you simply cannot run max buffed/potted as you do not want to invest into earning money.

Just cause we have 60-70 plat or more doesn't mean we want or think its right to drop 10p a week on mostly charges especially for savant killing solos who need purp dex/qui/str/con AF haste/shard/da/ablative/golfbag full of poisons.

Charges are both too little at 10 min and too expensive at 100g - yes and we also have 2-3 of each of those charges in inventory..so we have made the pve investment.

our bags are so full that soil/snow/branches go straight to the ground

please help

Wed 20 Mar 2019 3:57 PM by Kohi

Steelhead23rus wrote: ↑
Wed 20 Mar 2019 3:09 PM
[...]
Daoc is not pve game. Every discussion about pve being empty is a joke.

Don't impose your vision to other players please.

Wed 20 Mar 2019 6:13 PM by Durgrim

Steelhead23rus wrote: ↑
Wed 20 Mar 2019 3:33 PM
Durgrim wrote: ↑
Wed 20 Mar 2019 3:24 PM
dante`afk wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Mar 2019 1:54 PM
I was bad at math. 2-3 hours per day during the week. 5 hours plus on Friday. Don't play Sat/Sunday (mostly)

I'll leave the calculations for other people. My K/D ratio is positive 2:1.

5 charge items
3 barrels with 100 charges each, approx 1.5p for all together
shard and haste pots 50g together
lethargy/weariness poisons 50g together
18 weapons for repoisening

Then you simply cannot run max buffed/potted as you do not want to invest into earning money.

Why so ? People should have the choice and they will have it anyway. Even if they will be forced to go pve and if they dont want to theyll just leave. Will be great end of the great game if pve will kill it)

because thats the way it is at the moment. As you have read, in one Staff´s opinion the gold drop from pvp should rather be decreased than increased.
Take the buffs-pots-charges not as the standard. the standard is you and your selfbuffs. Anything on top of that comes either from buffs in group or from pots-charges which cost money. money comes from PvE or Tradeskills/Trading. That´s the circle.
Again, any buffage should be seen as on top. If enemy players decide on 20% pve to run the 80% time RvR fully buffed and you are not willing to do so, live with the drawbacks. Sorry, really no offense I try to see it from another perspective.

Thu 21 Mar 2019 7:47 AM by Sepplord

Cap charges that can be used simultaniously at 2 (so one buff + 1offensive charge or 2buffs etc...)

Reduces the ridiculousness of juggling 5charges like it seems Dante is doing, and cuts the goldusage down to about 150g per hour to be "competitive" with the other hardcore chargeusers

Thu 21 Mar 2019 11:12 AM by Xunn

Increasing the gold per kill is not a solution but would be a work around to solve the buffs/chages issues.

I think pots/barrels should stay for the following reasons:
They are convenient (invenotry speaking)
They make a trade skill more userful
They are balanced: enough strong to make your character not look dumb but not strong enough to match self buffs
The game will still keep a money sink needed for economy

On the opposite, changes (ALL) should go because:
Annoying/tedious to manage
Way too expensive, to the point that they are not affordable for a part of the playerbase. It makes solo an hardcore-only or more unfair experience
Unbalanced from the self buffing classes perspective

Please consider removing the charges at all.

Tue 5 Nov 2019 8:07 AM by Razur Ur

Increase gold per kill only for solo´s.

Tue 5 Nov 2019 9:28 AM by Chaskha

How do you manage your money so that it decreases ?
I'm playing between 20h and 40h a week depending on my free time and responsibilities, I believe it's quite a huge amount of play time.
I do mostly RvR lately. My melee cost me the most but never more than 120g per evening, I don't see my account money decrease.
It rather increase with the couple SC orders I take per week.

Do a DS/HoH run a week, sell the feathers and soon enough you are rich.
Only for the new people, those price are too harsh but once you are temped? Money only goes up

Wed 6 Nov 2019 8:50 PM by gromet12

Chaskha wrote: ↑
Tue 5 Nov 2019 9:28 AM
How do you manage your money so that it decreases ?
I'm playing between 20h and 40h a week depending on my free time and responsibilities, I believe it's quite a huge amount of play time.
I do mostly RvR lately. My melee cost me the most but never more than 120g per evening, I don't see my account money decrease.
It rather increase with the couple SC orders I take per week.

Do a DS/HoH run a week, sell the feathers and soon enough you are rich.
Only for the new people, those price are too harsh but once you are temped? Money only goes up

Not everyone wants to play a toon that farms and the way they PVE is mindless designed, its run a select group and that is it. The rest of the umpteen classes are left out in the cold.

No housing available (run around of hours upon hours) to find a housing lot, nada and I see questions about in chat daily. If youre just starting out, the CURVE is massive to even make WOW classic look easy to get going (and they actually have interesting pve)

Wed 6 Nov 2019 8:57 PM by Sepplord

Exxaggerating doesnt help your point...getting started on Phoenix is MUCH less time consuming than classic wow, and while they have decent PvE (to be honest retail-pve is good, classic-pve is just time consuming without challenge) they have absolutely garbage PvP.

WoW and DAoC are just as comparable as doom and fortnite are....