R5 abilities - ToA inspiration

Premise : I am convinced we need speedwarps in the game. Right now, it is far too easy for tankers to just sos in and completely destroy caster groups.

Also, the lack of Speedwarps makes zerg management almost impossible. You can counter one SoS with a SoS, but then you are left extremely vulnerable for any other adding group. SoS on a tanker requires absolutely no coordination, just scream sos inc, people disengage, sos in, collect RPs.

What I think is that R5 abilities, instead of giving unique abilities to every class that can be a pain to balance, should be ToA abilities available to class archetypes

Support : Group cure disease
Caster : Speedwarp
Light tank : Banespike (toned down version)
Heavy tank : zone of unmana
Stealthers : I don't know, I don't play stealthers
Hybrids : warguard?

Thoughts?

Mon 11 Mar 2019 2:18 PM by Sepplord

wouldn't a tankgrp SOSing on inc simply get counter-SOSed and is then in a heavy disadvantage?

What does the tankgrp do, when they SOS on inc, and the enemy then uses their SOS infight?

Mon 11 Mar 2019 2:31 PM by opossum12

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Mon 11 Mar 2019 2:18 PM
wouldn't a tankgrp SOSing on inc simply get counter-SOSed and is then in a heavy disadvantage?

What does the tankgrp do, when they SOS on inc, and the enemy then uses their SOS infight?

Whoever sos's first is, like you said, at a disadvange (usually), I am more referring to the additional groups that jump in with sos when you are already engaged with other groups. It's very frustrating as a caster group because you are extremely vulnerable at that time.

With a SW you can coordinate and position yourself correctly when you see adds inc so they have to go through the SW (that cancels sos). Tanks would have to think and kill the SW before sos'ing.

Mon 11 Mar 2019 2:54 PM by Ardri

With how zergy it is atm, i actually think it would be a good idea to add JUST speedwarp and see how people like it. Something to combat the zerg is good.

When there's a zerg of 40vs less numbers, there is no strategy, there is no outplaying the zerg, they just run forward and you eventually die or sos away.

Mon 11 Mar 2019 3:00 PM by MiNDmaZing

Speedwrap would also counter all amnesia spamming bards

Mon 11 Mar 2019 3:03 PM by Luluko

no speed warps or grp cure disease or my shaman/skald abilities are rendered almost useless then sos it would just be another out of jail ability if you cant even use it offensively anymore. I rather accept a general disease immunity which should be like 30seconds if you got hit with 2min disease it shouldnt last too long. Overall I think all those rr5 suggestions are unbalanced hybrids with warguard wtf? how are you supposed to kill a vw/champ/thane/friar/ with that up + add to that st/ip3 and a thane/champ can easiely wipe the floor with 3 bad stealthers or vs 2-3 lighttanks if it was the same absorb like on live. You just have to accept that you die from time to time if you rvr in hightraffic zones or just run 2-3 minstrels and run a less optimal setup but you can always escape even if they have to specc sos2+. You cant just give out free abilities to counter active ra's like sos where people spend ra points on thats just unfair and rr5 would be a free ability since you get to rr5 relativ fast here.

Mon 11 Mar 2019 4:25 PM by opossum12

Luluko wrote: ↑
Mon 11 Mar 2019 3:03 PM
no speed warps or grp cure disease or my shaman/skald abilities are rendered almost useless then sos it would just be another out of jail ability if you cant even use it offensively anymore. I rather accept a general disease immunity which should be like 30seconds if you got hit with 2min disease it shouldnt last too long. Overall I think all those rr5 suggestions are unbalanced hybrids with warguard wtf? how are you supposed to kill a vw/champ/thane/friar/ with that up + add to that st/ip3 and a thane/champ can easiely wipe the floor with 3 bad stealthers or vs 2-3 lighttanks if it was the same absorb like on live. You just have to accept that you die from time to time if you rvr in hightraffic zones or just run 2-3 minstrels and run a less optimal setup but you can always escape even if they have to specc sos2+. You cant just give out free abilities to counter active ra's like sos where people spend ra points on thats just unfair and rr5 would be a free ability since you get to rr5 relativ fast here.

you point out good points, I don’t think warguard should have full value. What you mention is true and probably the ML2 pet fear would be better suited for hybrids.

I never said free R5, you assumed that part. I would make them 10 RA points to get.

Btw I don’t mind dying in a rvr zone, I’m just troubled that people can run as mongos and jam everything with sos and have 99% win rate with very little you can do.

By the way, speedwarp has a counter, you kill it by smacking it 3 times. It would just mean groups running mongo tankers would have to think.

By the way speedwsrp also has a cooldown, so it wouldn’t be up 100% of the time.

I agree group cure disease would affect shamans the most, but doesn’t make your disease entirely useless, it still rupts.

Mon 11 Mar 2019 6:25 PM by Expfighter

simple answer to all of your points!

NOOOOOOOOOOOO, if you want that go play live!

Mon 11 Mar 2019 8:30 PM by opossum12

Expfighter wrote: ↑
Mon 11 Mar 2019 6:25 PM
simple answer to all of your points!

NOOOOOOOOOOOO, if you want that go play live!

Stfu and go play uthgard?

Mon 11 Mar 2019 9:41 PM by Luluko

opossum12 wrote: ↑
Mon 11 Mar 2019 4:25 PM
Luluko wrote: ↑
Mon 11 Mar 2019 3:03 PM
no speed warps or grp cure disease or my shaman/skald abilities are rendered almost useless then sos it would just be another out of jail ability if you cant even use it offensively anymore. I rather accept a general disease immunity which should be like 30seconds if you got hit with 2min disease it shouldnt last too long. Overall I think all those rr5 suggestions are unbalanced hybrids with warguard wtf? how are you supposed to kill a vw/champ/thane/friar/ with that up + add to that st/ip3 and a thane/champ can easiely wipe the floor with 3 bad stealthers or vs 2-3 lighttanks if it was the same absorb like on live. You just have to accept that you die from time to time if you rvr in hightraffic zones or just run 2-3 minstrels and run a less optimal setup but you can always escape even if they have to specc sos2+. You cant just give out free abilities to counter active ra's like sos where people spend ra points on thats just unfair and rr5 would be a free ability since you get to rr5 relativ fast here.

you point out good points, I don’t think warguard should have full value. What you mention is true and probably the ML2 pet fear would be better suited for hybrids.

I never said free R5, you assumed that part. I would make them 10 RA points to get.

Btw I don’t mind dying in a rvr zone, I’m just troubled that people can run as mongos and jam everything with sos and have 99% win rate with very little you can do.

By the way, speedwarp has a counter, you kill it by smacking it 3 times. It would just mean groups running mongo tankers would have to think.

By the way speedwsrp also has a cooldown, so it wouldn’t be up 100% of the time.

I agree group cure disease would affect shamans the most, but doesn’t make your disease entirely useless, it still rupts.

speedwarp is dumb then rather have ichor affect targets in sos but losing speed and hitting speed warp or kill 2-3 speed warps if its an alb caster grp is just too annoying then I prefer the ichor version at least you have to aim it and cant just drop it and it affects everyone its just too easy kite with that + sos, then people should just pick their fights better if they stop to kill a solo or duo and then get sosed down when they sit there without speed is their fault and those situation happen a lot, its not just fgs vs zergs

Mon 11 Mar 2019 11:16 PM by opossum12

Hmm, having ichor break root isn’t a bad idea actually, it would require good gameplay to land. My concern is it boils down to a RA dump fest where whoever has stuff up wins. Speedwarps have a more passive approach to them that I like, but yeah chasing an alb caster geoup that poops 5 warps in a row can be annoying.

Tue 12 Mar 2019 12:08 AM by Luluko

opossum12 wrote: ↑
Mon 11 Mar 2019 11:16 PM
Hmm, having ichor break root isn’t a bad idea actually, it would require good gameplay to land. My concern is it boils down to a RA dump fest where whoever has stuff up wins. Speedwarps have a more passive approach to them that I like, but yeah chasing an alb caster geoup that poops 5 warps in a row can be annoying.

thats the thing with active ra's like sos/ichor/purge you have them to counter other abilities, I wouldnt even need to invest 15ra points into purge on my skald if slam wouldnt last 9secs but I have to if I dont want to die to a champ/lighttank as soon as he comes into melee range

and a speedwarp can also be used to gank people minst/sorc duo or add to that a cleric aswell just farming solos and smallman you cant even sos away from them even if you purge stun if they mezz you and put a speedwarp right next to you, It would make the whole investment of my 5ra points useless while a stealthers vanish would save him after purge. It could certainly push more solo speed classes to stealthers then, even tho not many would think that far to use a speedwarp like that to catch a solo but I had that happen to me on live a few times and you die easy enough with how little hp you have without cl levels I could maybe see it happen if the cooldown was 30-60mins but not like 5-7mins like it was on live . Sometimes less is more and I really dont want those speed bumbs you already lose speed if you enter combat for 10secs thats already annoying enough when you zerg surf as a skald.

Tue 12 Mar 2019 1:06 PM by Ardri

Just put speedwarp on a 30min or 1hr cooldown and only enable 1 (per realm) per 5k or even 10k units. The code is already there with campfires. Can make the speedwarp half the radius if you want, doesn't matter. Just something to combat these mindless zergs.

Tue 12 Mar 2019 4:48 PM by opossum12

Ardri wrote: ↑
Tue 12 Mar 2019 1:06 PM
Just put speedwarp on a 30min or 1hr cooldown and only enable 1 (per realm) per 5k or even 10k units. The code is already there with campfires. Can make the speedwarp half the radius if you want, doesn't matter. Just something to combat these mindless zergs.

That’s a good idea and like you said they already have something implemented with the tinderboxes. I wouldn’t put it on a 1 hr timer, I’d keep it on a 10-15 min timer.

It’s sad how phoenix is turning into the braindead server.

Tue 12 Mar 2019 5:56 PM by Ashenspire

Lumping all hybrids together is a bad idea. Valewalkers, champions and reavers wouldn't benefit from Warguard.

Tue 12 Mar 2019 10:32 PM by Luluko

Ashenspire wrote: ↑
Tue 12 Mar 2019 5:56 PM
Lumping all hybrids together is a bad idea. Valewalkers, champions and reavers wouldn't benefit from Warguard.

wasnt that the 30abs buff for 30secs or so? how wouldnt they benefit from that? VW self absorb might not stack with it but thats the only thing I could think of.

Wed 13 Mar 2019 8:42 AM by rubaduck

MiNDmaZing wrote: ↑
Mon 11 Mar 2019 3:00 PM
Speedwrap would also counter all amnesia spamming bards

What.. the insta amnesia with 10 second cooldown spam?

But for real, I wouldn't have a problem with a speedwarp if it had a long cooldown and a range check per realm to make sure you can't put a lot of them down at he same time. It will spice up the game without troubling me with master levels.

Thu 14 Mar 2019 2:43 PM by Amp_Phetamine

NO

Nothing ToA related or further.

People need to re-familiarize themselves with the /release function.

All that crap on Live that gave extend/caster groups the ability to pull forever was horrible.

Play well, die well, no implementations of easy-mode abilities and especially no ToA BS.