Something needs to be done asap about the zerg/task.

I don't see how anyone finds this current state of the action fun, this is just Call of Duty now without the killstreaks to wipe the zone.

Tue 26 Feb 2019 12:40 AM by defiasbandit

Raunzinator, the Border Keep zones need more objectives. Defending realm should not be able to teleport, but rather there should be tons of objectives in their border keep zones. Change teleporting to keeps instead of flags in the center zone. Increase the rewards for turnins. Provide more stats and information on what each objective is worth, hoe much each player or realm is contributing, and how each realm is doing.

There needs to be a lot more objectives in the Realm tasks, especially in the Border Keep zones (Gorge, Collory, Savuage, Snowdonia, Uppland, Yggdra).

Right now if you port into Breifine, you should be able to do objectives in Mount Collory or Cruachan Gorge. There really isn't much of a reason to roam the border keep zones. If players are going to be teleporting past them into Breifine, then there should be objectives and reasons for them to return and roam those zones. It might be better for Breifine to be the de facto Zerg task zone. Gorge and Collory can have a wider range of objectives that lead players all over these zones. These zones have lots of objectives in the corners of the maps and up on the hills, because they aren't as visible to the zerg. The more spots the better really.

Scaling Objectives:

There could be specific objectives that capture faster the fewer players nearby. That way zergs might bypass certain objectives, because they know that it would take too long to efficiently cap them. This would let smaller groups roam and fight over these objectives. These objectives would be tucked away on hillsides and in corners aways from the main roads. There could be certain objectives that can only be capped by a full group or less, so 8 mans can seek these out and fight over them. A king of the hill type objective for 8mans.

Unpredictable Objectives:

Spawn chests in random areas of the zones, especially the border keep zones. Having players taking more routes and running in different directions in the border keep zones would allow for more small man RvR. Place these chests away from the main roads and tucked away on hills and in treelines. It would encourage players to roam to more remote parts of these zones. If the task says chest spawn in Northeast Mount Collory, then it might interest solo or small mans to roam there and find it. The location isn't exact so players will have to do some exploring. Having players roam and wander around is a good thing. The location of all objectives should not be exactly known. Having a player wandering up a hillside and coming across one of these chests would be an exciting moment.

Here is a map of Forest Sauvage with New Objectives:

https://imgur.com/a/FWRqcmd

Tue 26 Feb 2019 5:46 AM by Tree

I agree with Raunz. Although we have great quantity in RvR, the quality is just bad. Most of us in this game are wired to get the highest reward first, thats why we put up with the current task system, because it awards by far the most RP consistently. But it certainly isnt a fun way to experience DAoC RvR, unless you love to run around in a zerg all the time.

We need incentives and a better task system that rewards fgs, smallmen and solo play in a meaningful and fun way.

Tue 26 Feb 2019 5:49 AM by Raunz

Tasks should get x amount of solo kills, 8vs8 etc zerging should lose you rps instead of giving. This server is so far to the wrong direction of what I enjoy about the game that it feels like live now and that is not daoc to me.

Tue 26 Feb 2019 5:53 AM by defiasbandit

Teleporting to Keeps instead of Flags:

Invading realms will teleport to the 4 center keeps instead of the flags. The invading realms can now battle over the center zone keeps at the start of the task to secure teleports. This is more in the spirit of Dark Age of Camelot.

Invader Teleporting Only:

Allow only the invading realms to teleport to keeps. The defending realms will need to run from their border keeps. This will create more action in the Border Keep zones, and the action will flow from the portal zones towards the border keep zones instead of vice versa. It will spread the action into two more zones than just the center zone.

Objectives in Border Keep Zones:

Improve Current Objectives:

Realmwide Task Reward:

The winner of each realm task will gain control of Darkness Falls. With increased rewards in Darkness Falls, this will add a bit of competitiveness to the Realm Tasks. Darkness Falls now might change hands more easily. Farm in in Darkness Falls or try to win the next realm task to keep control?

RvR Scoreboard:

Tue 26 Feb 2019 6:01 AM by Zenit

Stop that instant Flag teleporting stuff. This not DAOC anymore. You cant predict where enemies come from. Camping the Borderkeeps has no point anymore for smallmen oder solos. Bring it back how it was normally. Port to porterkeeps (Emain, HW, OG) as attacker....start off as Defender in CG/MC, Svasud/Yggdra, Sauvage/Snow. This instant action is increasing the zergfest even more.

In EU Prime we have a peak of 3k players.

Why dont you have two tasks in 2 realms at a time? I.e. give randomly a task to raid a certain keep with like 5k reward RPs and 2k feathers or smth. This will attract raiders and defenders and brings a 2nd zone to life. While the majority will still crowd the actual maintask zone.

By far you did so good. Dont go in the wrong direction now. Dont make it too custom.

Tue 26 Feb 2019 6:35 AM by jelzinga_EU

Tree wrote: ↑
Tue 26 Feb 2019 5:46 AM
I agree with Raunz. Although we have great quantity in RvR, the quality is just bad. Most of us in this game are wired to get the highest reward first, thats why we put up with the current task system, because it awards by far the most RP consistently. But it certainly isnt a fun way to experience DAoC RvR, unless you love to run around in a zerg all the time.

We need incentives and a better task system that rewards fgs, smallmen and solo play in a meaningful and fun way.

While I'm no 8vs8 anymore- I did play that in the past back when EU servers where a thing. The problem is not the tasks, it is the players: If there truly are a lot of people interested in 8vs8 you can take it up to Discord/IRC/whatnot and arrange roaming fights in Odins/HW/EMain/Jamtland/Breifine when that realm is not the task. There will not be a zerg there and you can have clean fights in any way of shape.

However, and this is important: It is not something that will work easy. It will become pretty obvious that there will be a group (C) who's can't beat A and B. So rather than feed A and B they go back to the task-area to feed on the zerg and get their share of RP's. Now it becomes B can't beat A and thus B goes back to the task area and you're back to how it is now.

Part of this is really down to human nature, most of the people in 8vs8 want to WIN. Some might say because they want good fights, but give them good fights they consistently loose and you won't see them around for a long time. They want to win and if they lost they want something to show for it (Task RP's, killing at least a few of the people who outnumbered them etc etc) and a reason outside their own short-comings why they lost (got AJ'ed, got zerged, archer added, enemy resisted that crucial game-turning CC, etc).

One possible solutions is to just fire up all 3 tasks simultaneously; this might gravitate to people being more spread out, naturally finding the zone and fights they like. EMain will probably be very zergy, Odins might be better suited for small-man and HW for FGvsFG.Essentially this would be the same as no tasks at all tho, so who knows...

Tue 26 Feb 2019 1:49 PM by Oranius

Mr Raunz and his "clique" neeed 8v8 now they are 8L thx the zerg dude

Tue 26 Feb 2019 2:39 PM by Jodocus_Quak

The task system is good if you have a low populated server, because it gears ppl to one specific area. But since the server population is saturated, there is no need to make ppl do that. Either remove the task system completely (you may leave a port to one frontier keep per zone open for reduced walking time) or make tasks available for all three frontier zones at once to balance out the population.

And yes, remove the xp from tasks, since it takes ppl away from actually lvling from 40-50. You can simply die the last lvls in a 15 mins turn to get xp and rp for afking.

Edit: And since some ppl dont have the time to commit to an 8 men grp, you can help small man RvR by giving more rp to 2-4 men grps. This gears players to go out in smaller grps and dont make them wait for the perfect 8 men setup.

Tue 26 Feb 2019 3:59 PM by Tree

jelzinga_EU wrote: ↑
Tue 26 Feb 2019 6:35 AM
Tree wrote: ↑
Tue 26 Feb 2019 5:46 AM
I agree with Raunz. Although we have great quantity in RvR, the quality is just bad. Most of us in this game are wired to get the highest reward first, thats why we put up with the current task system, because it awards by far the most RP consistently. But it certainly isnt a fun way to experience DAoC RvR, unless you love to run around in a zerg all the time.

We need incentives and a better task system that rewards fgs, smallmen and solo play in a meaningful and fun way.

While I'm no 8vs8 anymore- I did play that in the past back when EU servers where a thing. The problem is not the tasks, it is the players: If there truly are a lot of people interested in 8vs8 you can take it up to Discord/IRC/whatnot and arrange roaming fights in Odins/HW/EMain/Jamtland/Breifine when that realm is not the task. There will not be a zerg there and you can have clean fights in any way of shape.

Im not really interested in the 8vs8 meta and it also wasnt my point actually. The current task environment overproportionally incentivises zerg RvR, which I perceive to be bad for the server. If we have a task system to make RvR more accessible the way it works should be that it gives rewards for all kinds of play including, but not specifically, zerg, 8man, smallman and solo.
Of course you can have all these things if you talk to people outside the game or to go to very specific spots. But there is no incentive to play this way and the result you can see in the kind of RvR we have right now.

Tue 26 Feb 2019 4:04 PM by chryso

Waaaaah waaaaaah waaaah, nobody is playing the way i want them to.
Dude, go somewhere else. Nobody is making you go to the task realm. Just get all of your little 8v8 buddies and go to a different realm.

Holy crap there are a lot of whiners here.

Tue 26 Feb 2019 8:05 PM by keen

Phoenix has created the best enviorment for both worlds. The ones that want to zerg go to the task zone, the ones that want to 8v8 could have the cleanest 8v8 fights ever seen in the other two zones. They are just not willing/capable of doing it. This is sad.

Wed 27 Feb 2019 8:16 AM by Sepplord

because they want to farm noob-grps, but the noob-grps join the zerg
having a twenty minute fight vs another really good 8man is fun too...once in a while, but it doesn't give much RP

If they would at least admit it....but they can't since they would immediatly lose their position in the discussion

Wed 27 Feb 2019 8:37 AM by Keeto

chryso wrote: ↑
Tue 26 Feb 2019 4:04 PM
Waaaaah waaaaaah waaaah, nobody is playing the way i want them to.
Dude, go somewhere else. Nobody is making you go to the task realm. Just get all of your little 8v8 buddies and go to a different realm.

Holy crap there are a lot of whiners here.

Lol why are the casual zerg players always so aggressive?

Wed 27 Feb 2019 11:44 AM by chewchew

keen wrote: ↑
Tue 26 Feb 2019 8:05 PM
Phoenix has created the best enviorment for both worlds. The ones that want to zerg go to the task zone, the ones that want to 8v8 could have the cleanest 8v8 fights ever seen in the other two zones.

But what about the ones who say they 8v8 but in reality love the ez zerg and pug rps????? Pretty [edit - Language] environment for them tbh!

Wed 27 Feb 2019 12:07 PM by jg777

Having multiple active zones in different parts of the Frontiers makes sense and the player population can handle it. Increasing rewards for keep defense and captures, along with Relics will help spread the action and give incentives to do so. We don’t need everyone in one spot when there are hundreds doing it all the time. Right now everyone is in the same zone because you are indirectly penalized if you aren’t. This can easily be adjusted to improve all forms of RvR gameplay.

Wed 27 Feb 2019 12:51 PM by vadox

Suspend task system completely for a month. Promote individualism through roaming, 8 men fights, keep taking, duo, trio, solo. Make players think and create their own action instead of server dictating how to play this game. Each day becoming less and less enjoyable. Free Rps are fun, some zerg fights are fun but there is nothing else going on because optimal way right now is to follow other realmates or be eaten by a bigger fish. I bet more people start pveing now and hoping that RvR mechanics will change while they leveling other toons.

Wed 27 Feb 2019 12:56 PM by Muse

The casuals like the System, it keeps the Server alive, who cares if your 8man is leaving the Server.
A Server doesnt last Long with hardcore 8v8 Players. But a Server where People actually form zergs and there is aciton, that keeps a Server alive.

Wed 27 Feb 2019 1:08 PM by jg777

Muse wrote: ↑
Wed 27 Feb 2019 12:56 PM
The casuals like the System, it keeps the Server alive, who cares if your 8man is leaving the Server.
A Server doesnt last Long with hardcore 8v8 Players. But a Server where People actually form zergs and there is aciton, that keeps a Server alive.

On principle yes. However this doesn’t mean we can’t spread the Zerg action out a bit and give more options for players to acquire task rewards. A Zerg doesn’t have to be hundreds of players all in one zone- it can be 100 in zone X, 60 zone Y, 150 zone Z, ect. The most fun I had was keep takes and defenses, particularly relic raids/defenses. I’d like that aspect given fair credit and meaning. After all, that used to be the main RvR objective years ago and what the endgame mechanic was built around. Bring it back!

Wed 27 Feb 2019 1:12 PM by chryso

Keeto wrote: ↑
Wed 27 Feb 2019 8:37 AM
chryso wrote: ↑
Tue 26 Feb 2019 4:04 PM
Waaaaah waaaaaah waaaah, nobody is playing the way i want them to.
Dude, go somewhere else. Nobody is making you go to the task realm. Just get all of your little 8v8 buddies and go to a different realm.

Holy crap there are a lot of whiners here.

Lol why are the casual zerg players always so aggressive?

Why are all the 8v8ers so whiny?

Wed 27 Feb 2019 1:22 PM by Hector

I find it hilarious that Raunz complains of zerging yet Los Boyos is always conveniently tucked inside the hib zerg in the task zone, since launch.

If you want clean 8v8 fights its really simple. Put your group inside an alternative zone (non-task) and post in discord saying you are roaming in XX Realm (which is allowed). Easy. We did this on uthgard with less people, slower ports, etc., and it worked just fine.

Wed 27 Feb 2019 1:25 PM by Liah

Hector wrote: ↑
Wed 27 Feb 2019 1:22 PM
I find it hilarious that Raunz complains of zerging yet Los Boyos is always conveniently tucked inside the hib zerg in the task zone, since launch.

If you want clean 8v8 fights its really simple. Put your group inside an alternative zone (non-task) and post in discord saying you are roaming in XX Realm (which is allowed). Easy. We did this on uthgard with less people, slower ports, etc., and it worked just fine.

Thing is, noone wants to fight his group cause its a tough one to beat. most ppl give up after a few wipes. Also i can completely understand that they dont want to stand in an empty zone three hours a day.. Zerg is the only option then.

Wed 27 Feb 2019 1:26 PM by Durgrim

disagree. Nothing NEEDS to be done asap.

Wed 27 Feb 2019 1:49 PM by Sepplord

Liah wrote: ↑
Wed 27 Feb 2019 1:25 PM
Hector wrote: ↑
Wed 27 Feb 2019 1:22 PM
I find it hilarious that Raunz complains of zerging yet Los Boyos is always conveniently tucked inside the hib zerg in the task zone, since launch.

If you want clean 8v8 fights its really simple. Put your group inside an alternative zone (non-task) and post in discord saying you are roaming in XX Realm (which is allowed). Easy. We did this on uthgard with less people, slower ports, etc., and it worked just fine.

Thing is, noone wants to fight his group cause its a tough one to beat. most ppl give up after a few wipes. Also i can completely understand that they dont want to stand in an empty zone three hours a day.. Zerg is the only option then.

why would the staff of the server then change the game according to their likings though?

If noone wants to fight them 8vs8, then too bad. Take your crown as the best 8vs8 grp on the server and leave/wait until a new challenger appears.
Whining on the forums constantly, demanding MUST HAVE changes, so the game mechanics feed you more 8mangroups you can farm, 8man groups that do not want to fight you btw (see above) is just one thing, selfish. Screams entitlement to me.

Following that logic just proves how unhealthy the top-set-grps are to a gameserver. There's a reason mainstream games are getting dumbed down more and more and the competitive players complain (rightfully) louder and louder each time a new game releases. The question is, does this server want to be an 8man-playground or something for the casual mass to enjoy at the end of a hard workweek for a few hours. And so far it doesn't seem to be option A.

Wed 27 Feb 2019 1:52 PM by Liah

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Wed 27 Feb 2019 1:49 PM
Liah wrote: ↑
Wed 27 Feb 2019 1:25 PM
Hector wrote: ↑
Wed 27 Feb 2019 1:22 PM
I find it hilarious that Raunz complains of zerging yet Los Boyos is always conveniently tucked inside the hib zerg in the task zone, since launch.

If you want clean 8v8 fights its really simple. Put your group inside an alternative zone (non-task) and post in discord saying you are roaming in XX Realm (which is allowed). Easy. We did this on uthgard with less people, slower ports, etc., and it worked just fine.

Thing is, noone wants to fight his group cause its a tough one to beat. most ppl give up after a few wipes. Also i can completely understand that they dont want to stand in an empty zone three hours a day.. Zerg is the only option then.

why would the staff of the server then change the game according to their likings though?

If noone wants to fight them 8vs8, then too bad. Take your crown as the best 8vs8 grp on the server and leave/wait until a new challenger appears.
Whining on the forums constantly, demanding MUST HAVE changes, so the game mechanics feed you more 8mangroups you can farm, 8man groups that do not want to fight you btw (see above) is just one thing, selfish. Screams entitlement to me.

Yeah no, wasn't saying thati t justifys the server being rebuid completely. Just cant stand the crying about them zerging aswell. Ofc they zerg if they have nothing else to do

Wed 27 Feb 2019 1:56 PM by Sepplord

Liah wrote: ↑
Wed 27 Feb 2019 1:52 PM
Yeah no, wasn't saying thati t justifys the server being rebuid completely. Just cant stand the crying about them zerging aswell. Ofc they zerg if they have nothing else to do

i wish i had nothing else to do, besides playing a video game without having fun

Got what you meant though, and i agree, noone should blame anyone for zerging, especially in the current situation.

Wed 27 Feb 2019 2:40 PM by chryso

Now this brings up an interesting question. Are these boyos really that good or are they just good at mashing the right buttons in the perfect set up?
I see plenty of complaints about how alb tank groups can't compete and how friars are a wasted spot on a group. ( I think friars are great in a group but i seem to be the only one)
My question is, can the boyos win with an alb tank group running with a friar? If they are that good, maybe they can. I don't know. But if they can it would really shut up some of the alb whining about how everything is stacked against them.
It would be like a golfer playing with a handicap.

Wed 27 Feb 2019 3:13 PM by Tree

Maybe Raunz reason to write this post or others addressing RvR issues in the past arent entirely altruistic, but that doesnt mean he is wrong. An ideal RvR task system would incentivise all kinds of gameplay somewhat equally, so that people with different interests can play RvR their way and be rewarded for it. A diverse RvR environment is for the benefit of all of us.

I think that is what most people in this thread dont get. You are so wired to bashing Raunz that you are actually defending a flawed one-dimensional RvR-system to the detriment of the entire server.

Wed 27 Feb 2019 3:31 PM by Sepplord

Tree wrote: ↑
Wed 27 Feb 2019 3:13 PM
I think that is what most people in this thread dont get. You are so wired to bashing Raunz that you are actually defending a flawed one-dimensional RvR-system to the detriment of the entire server.

There is some truth to your statements, the thing is Raunz has not acted like a reasonable discussion partner on the forum so far. Concerning me, his forum presence and how he reacts to me disagreeing with him (i haven't disagreed with all his post btw. so i am not disagreeing on principle) has killed the "name" that he built ingame of himself and just proved, that being good at a videogame and spending a lot of time in it doesn't mean anything regarding other capabilities including reason regarding gamebalance in that exact game.

Just as a reminder, the opening post of this thread was:

I don't see how anyone finds this current state of the action fun, this is just Call of Duty now without the killstreaks to wipe the zone

I don't see a single reasonable argument. I don't see any reason why this thread was created besides the des to vent/rant.

That said, you are correct and we should return back more on the topic and not go offtopic about specific groups/players. So: many are enjoying the zerging, the participation rate shows clearly. If people want to send a message they need to stop participating in actions that they do not like just to get rewards. As long as people join en masse, the tasksystem is working exactly the way it should: getting people into RvR.

The setgroups are also raking in high-RPs, so i don't think they need it easier to get rewards. They are clearly doing just fine.

Wed 27 Feb 2019 3:49 PM by chryso

Tree wrote: ↑
Wed 27 Feb 2019 3:13 PM
Maybe Raunz reason to write this post or others addressing RvR issues in the past arent entirely altruistic, but that doesnt mean he is wrong. An ideal RvR task system would incentivise all kinds of gameplay somewhat equally, so that people with different interests can play RvR their way and be rewarded for it. A diverse RvR environment is for the benefit of all of us.

I think that is what most people in this thread dont get. You are so wired to bashing Raunz that you are actually defending a flawed one-dimensional RvR-system to the detriment of the entire server.

I don't know who Raunz is other than what someone said in this thread. However, I don't think you are completely right either. People who are die hard RVR players do not need an incentive to get out there and RVR. I think the incentive is for the people who are not hard core and maybe people who really don't rvr at all. Now they see a way they can get some RPs even if they won't have the best set up. These people may decide that they like rvr. Giving them a few RPS so they may have a slightly higher chance at surviving long enough to have fun is a good thing.

Wed 27 Feb 2019 4:12 PM by Tavi

chryso wrote: ↑
Wed 27 Feb 2019 2:40 PM
Now this brings up an interesting question. Are these boyos really that good or are they just good at mashing the right buttons in the perfect set up?
I see plenty of complaints about how alb tank groups can't compete and how friars are a wasted spot on a group. ( I think friars are great in a group but i seem to be the only one)
My question is, can the boyos win with an alb tank group running with a friar? If they are that good, maybe they can. I don't know. But if they can it would really shut up some of the alb whining about how everything is stacked against them.
It would be like a golfer playing with a handicap.

it is the course of events which makes his posts unbearable.

-playing hib for the easy headstart
-playing hib caster group(which arguably is the strongest setup in the beginning of a Server)
-not complaining about the system, because they can easily farm rr lowbies
-ppl catch up in rr, then start complaining about DET, while playing caster group...

Yes the system has its flaws, devs are working on it and actively asking the community for Input. If you want to change something bring up suggestions that actually make sense for the whole community.
Raunz posts are not contributing to anything, sadly elitism in DAoC always came hand in hand with toxicity.