Get people out of the epic dungeons!

Started 20 Feb 2019
by armath
in Suggestions
Feathers!

Every day in EU primetime, we see one or the other realm being underpopulated due to epic dungeon raids. This results in massive zergs taking keeps unopposed.

The combination of the individual player need for feather, and the lack of prize for defending/holding a keep, makes for a bad combination in primetime action.

To maintain the origins of the games RvR focus, I think it would be wise to look at a revamp of how the keep claims, attacking and defending them works.

Instead of having 400 people going to Tuscarian Glacier at primetime for feathers, why not give them reason to try go for a relic, or a chain of keeps, with the success giving them massive amounts of feathers compared to today. Atleast a 1.000 for lets say a keep, or perhaps 8.000 for a relic take. Its not over the top, or out of order, and a Tuscarian Glacier raid would still be more bountyful, if feathers and rogs is what you really need.

On the other hand, to make sure that the individual realm has reason to defend keeps/relics - which they hardly do today, and the keep-game meta is very loose/zergy without any real groups who specifically build for defense - since its worthless, changes are surely needed. As soon as you get the task credit, the defending part is done, and if there aint a task on the defense, and its a massive zerg, there is hardly ever a defense at all.

Why not allow defenders to also gain X amount of feathers for successfully defending vs. X amount of enemies over X amount of time with bonuses depending on where the siege defend ends ( Lower amount for chasing off enemies of the outer doors, higher reward for ending them at the lord room with both doors down. )

Other benefits of claiming the keep could also come in play, but I think we need some way to get people out of the epic dungeons, but still let people actively chase feathers in RvR siege scenario.

The relic raids ive seen on here, has been the saddest relic raids ive witnessed in daoc history, due to absolutely zero defense every single time.
Thu 21 Feb 2019 2:40 AM by Armsmancer
This is an interesting idea, the only issue I see not addressed is if this is implemented many would be pulled from the raids that offer credit, limiting the folks that actually want to spend the feathers, so if you could address the credit-in-order-to-buy-item issue this would be hard to argue against.
Thu 21 Feb 2019 3:30 AM by Zansobar
You can make 10k to 15k feathers on a dungeon run that takes 1.5 to 2.5 hours. Unless you can make more than that rate in RvR I don't think it will move the needle as people are playing the game to progress their characters, not necessarily to just trade keeps/relics with other realms.
Thu 21 Feb 2019 3:45 AM by jg777
I think making Relics worth more would incentivize defense automatically. While the intention to limit Relic value to reduce chances of realm imbalance is thoughtful, the value of Relics needing to be high is necessary to balance the RvR meta. If Relics matter, players will prioritize PvE raid to RvR accordingly. Yes, add some additional feathers while at it too if you want, but increasing/restoring the Relic values is going to help much more effectively in keep defenses becoming a priority in my view.
Thu 21 Feb 2019 4:28 AM by Cadebrennus
Keep offense and defense offering feathers would definitely have more fun action than running the same damn raid over and over again.
Thu 21 Feb 2019 7:16 AM by Sepplord
Zansobar wrote:
Thu 21 Feb 2019 3:30 AM
You can make 10k to 15k feathers on a dungeon run that takes 1.5 to 2.5 hours. Unless you can make more than that rate in RvR I don't think it will move the needle as people are playing the game to progress their characters, not necessarily to just trade keeps/relics with other realms.

heavily disagree, if i knew i get 500-1k feathers for an hour of RvR regularly (not in the rare case that a huge zerg raids 7keeps in an hour) then i would know that i will never have any feather problems and not bother with PvE raids at all. No one knows how long the current situation of easy-400people-raids that give over 10k/hr feathers will stay, so people are attending more raids to build a cushion.

In RvR you use approximately 1-2feathers per minute, assuming multiple different buffpotions being used constantly (endreg, combinedforces, haste, sharkskin, etc...) everything above that is already a gain if you start giving feathers out too easy in RvR.

Gold bottleneck is still there....but gold is not the reason people run raids, because the individual goldgain there is zero
Thu 21 Feb 2019 2:23 PM by chryso
I see a lot of words but all I hear is, "Make people play the way I want them to."
Thu 21 Feb 2019 2:38 PM by Sepplord
chryso wrote:
Thu 21 Feb 2019 2:23 PM
I see a lot of words but all I hear is, "Make people play the way I want them to."

True, it's similar in loads of "suggestions/discussion". Especially obvious in the taskchange/taskremovement threads.


A: QQ There is only Zerg

B: Go somewhere else then.

A: I can't, noone is there

B: if all you "A's" went there there would be people (and infact, there ARE already many people in off-task zones)

A: zergzergzerg easy-RP farm, QQ this sucks so much. No one likes this. Game needs to change



/mindboggling
Thu 21 Feb 2019 2:59 PM by chryso
Sepplord wrote:
Thu 21 Feb 2019 2:38 PM
A: zergzergzerg easy-RP farm, QQ this sucks so much. No one likes this. Game needs to change


Yes, this one is my favorite.
It reminds me of the old Yogi Berra quote, "Nobody Goes There Anymore, It’s Too Crowded."
Fri 22 Feb 2019 9:18 AM by dudis
I despise running TG, but I do it because i know that sometime soon, Cercei is going to stop the daily runs and its going to be a pain to get gear for any new char i create :S
Fri 22 Feb 2019 9:43 AM by Durgrim
dudis wrote:
Fri 22 Feb 2019 9:18 AM
I despise running TG, but I do it because i know that sometime soon, Cercei is going to stop the daily runs and its going to be a pain to get gear for any new char i create :S

don't create new chars then just kidding. You are right. But maybe until then you came across some nice RoGs in order to weaponless temp your new char with crafted stuff only.
Fri 22 Feb 2019 10:31 AM by jhaerik
All of the above x1000.

Seriously the server feels so GD dead 5 hours out of the day. At least Mid side.

TG is literally ran 5 hours a day(From BG open to end of loot distribution) MON-FRI during both EU AND NA prime times.
At some points over HALF of the online mid population is inside that boring ass TG raid.

Why can't we RvR for a reasonable amount of feathers? Why can't We buy feathers with BP's?
Seriously, it's 2019... how many people still play Daoc for it's *cough* "glorious PvE content."
To me it just feels like Live. Go do your dragon campaign, and your otherworld campaign, then farm aurulite.

Typical templates require 50-90k feathers. You are going to be hard pressed to find anyone on Mid that actually enjoys running TG 5-8 times per character.
You'd also be hard pressed to find anyone that wouldn't like to be able to RvR for a reasonable amount of feather. Nothing like having to skip an RvR night to go afk stick someone in TG to farm feathers for more potions.....

Hell if nothing else why can't we make a compatible amount of feathers doing ANYTHING else other than repeating the same boring SI raid over...

and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over.

^Did you bother reading that? I bet not. Well we don't wanna bother running TG 50+ times. I actually put more effort into copy pasting that than it takes to make 11.6k feathers in a TG raid. If you want to force us to PvE... at least make it interesting PvE. IE give us one group content that can compete with afk sticking someone in TG and getting chewed out by some raid leader on a power trip 24/7. Cause frankly I couldn't care less who followers their directions. It's 400+ people killing 4 group content. Lets just get the crap over with so I can go back to killing peoples.

If nothing else, if we gotta PvE... give us weekly tasks to complete that take a couple hours and give 10k feathers.
Mon 25 Feb 2019 7:25 AM by Cadebrennus
jhaerik wrote:
Fri 22 Feb 2019 10:31 AM
All of the above x1000.

Seriously the server feels so GD dead 5 hours out of the day. At least Mid side.

TG is literally ran 5 hours a day(From BG open to end of loot distribution) MON-FRI during both EU AND NA prime times.
At some points over HALF of the online mid population is inside that boring ass TG raid.

Why can't we RvR for a reasonable amount of feathers? Why can't We buy feathers with BP's?
Seriously, it's 2019... how many people still play Daoc for it's *cough* "glorious PvE content."
To me it just feels like Live. Go do your dragon campaign, and your otherworld campaign, then farm aurulite.

Typical templates require 50-90k feathers. You are going to be hard pressed to find anyone on Mid that actually enjoys running TG 5-8 times per character.
You'd also be hard pressed to find anyone that wouldn't like to be able to RvR for a reasonable amount of feather. Nothing like having to skip an RvR night to go afk stick someone in TG to farm feathers for more potions.....

Hell if nothing else why can't we make a compatible amount of feathers doing ANYTHING else other than repeating the same boring SI raid over...

and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over.

^Did you bother reading that? I bet not. Well we don't wanna bother running TG 50+ times. I actually put more effort into copy pasting that than it takes to make 11.6k feathers in a TG raid. If you want to force us to PvE... at least make it interesting PvE. IE give us one group content that can compete with afk sticking someone in TG and getting chewed out by some raid leader on a power trip 24/7. Cause frankly I couldn't care less who followers their directions. It's 400+ people killing 4 group content. Lets just get the crap over with so I can go back to killing peoples.

If nothing else, if we gotta PvE... give us weekly tasks to complete that take a couple hours and give 10k feathers.

Mon 25 Feb 2019 11:13 AM by Durgrim
jhaerik wrote:
Fri 22 Feb 2019 10:31 AM
All of the above x1000.

Seriously the server feels so GD dead 5 hours out of the day. At least Mid side.

TG is literally ran 5 hours a day(From BG open to end of loot distribution) MON-FRI during both EU AND NA prime times.
At some points over HALF of the online mid population is inside that boring ass TG raid.

Why can't we RvR for a reasonable amount of feathers? Why can't We buy feathers with BP's?
Seriously, it's 2019... how many people still play Daoc for it's *cough* "glorious PvE content."
To me it just feels like Live. Go do your dragon campaign, and your otherworld campaign, then farm aurulite.

Typical templates require 50-90k feathers. You are going to be hard pressed to find anyone on Mid that actually enjoys running TG 5-8 times per character.
You'd also be hard pressed to find anyone that wouldn't like to be able to RvR for a reasonable amount of feather. Nothing like having to skip an RvR night to go afk stick someone in TG to farm feathers for more potions.....

Hell if nothing else why can't we make a compatible amount of feathers doing ANYTHING else other than repeating the same boring SI raid over...

and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over.

^Did you bother reading that? I bet not. Well we don't wanna bother running TG 50+ times. I actually put more effort into copy pasting that than it takes to make 11.6k feathers in a TG raid. If you want to force us to PvE... at least make it interesting PvE. IE give us one group content that can compete with afk sticking someone in TG and getting chewed out by some raid leader on a power trip 24/7. Cause frankly I couldn't care less who followers their directions. It's 400+ people killing 4 group content. Lets just get the crap over with so I can go back to killing peoples.

If nothing else, if we gotta PvE... give us weekly tasks to complete that take a couple hours and give 10k feathers.

TG in its current form is way too attractive for not being done. May it be gearing up main or alt, helping guild, helping alchemy or may it be simple economical reasons.
Keep on TGing!
Mon 25 Feb 2019 4:57 PM by FFpheonix
Reducing the need to run Raids multiple times was the reason for account wide credit, you nailed it the solution is to make Feathers obtainable from multiple sources... I know! Make them drop in abundance in RvR!
Mon 25 Feb 2019 5:37 PM by Kohi
If i don't agree with stopping TG runs (for me it should stay the most rewarding way to get feathers), i noted an idea which is not bad imho :

"give us weekly tasks to complete that take a couple hours and give 10k feathers"

Getting few feathers in addition of some rvr tasks could be a way, could it ? After all, taking keeps gives us a few (too less for my taste )
Another idea (this time my own ^^) : why not making guards and lords dropping high utility rogs according to their lvl ? No ? thoughts ? I didn't thought a lot about + and - for this, just threw the idea as it is. =)
Mon 25 Feb 2019 5:51 PM by Keelia
Mids bitching about TG? You have a TG raid going and still have a Zerg of 80+. Hibs don’t have a raid and can’t muster 60, mids complaining about anything is seriously laughable.
Mon 25 Feb 2019 5:54 PM by Kohi
Keelia wrote:
Mon 25 Feb 2019 5:51 PM
Mids bitching about TG? You have a TG raid going and still have a Zerg of 80+. Hibs don’t have a raid and can’t muster 60, mids complaining about anything is seriously laughable.

Aehm ? ^^
Btw, Galla is doable with that amount of people.
PS : got ganked recently from a mid, or simply a bad day ? ;-)
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