Explain please, I don't get it

>Leaving your portal keep:
>
>After you got killed and release back to your portal keep, you wont be able to leave the portal keep area for 180 secs after release. You will always get ported back to the >healer in the portal keep. This has no effect if you are in your homelands. Example: In emain only mids & albs cant leave the portal keep for 180 secs. Hibs will always be >able to leave Druim Ligen directly after release. You can use the porter to port back to your homeland.

What is this good for?

Thu 31 Jan 2019 5:43 PM by relvinian

as i look at it there is some sort of benefit to it for the away team.

Thu 31 Jan 2019 5:56 PM by Topenga

Imho it just supports the team that is already strong in numbers...and waiting in the porter keep for 3mins is annoying as hell!

Thu 31 Jan 2019 5:59 PM by Freudinio

Not a great change.

Thu 31 Jan 2019 6:45 PM by Reko

if im in a 8 man mid in hib and we have to release hibs got time to enmass and camp my 8 man at my portal keep... wheres the logic in that... not only that... if you solo wheres the logic in that?

why not just remove the healers curing rez sick and be done with it?

Thu 31 Jan 2019 6:50 PM by defiasbandit

Reko wrote: ↑
Thu 31 Jan 2019 6:45 PM
if im in a 8 man mid in hib and we have to release hibs got time to enmass and camp my 8 man at my portal keep... wheres the logic in that... not only that... if you solo wheres the logic in that?

It makes no sense. It makes the issues with RvR on this server even worse.

Thu 31 Jan 2019 6:58 PM by faliv

Topenga wrote: ↑
Thu 31 Jan 2019 5:38 PM
>Leaving your portal keep:
>
>After you got killed and release back to your portal keep, you wont be able to leave the portal keep area for 180 secs after release. You will always get ported back to the >healer in the portal keep. This has no effect if you are in your homelands. Example: In emain only mids & albs cant leave the portal keep for 180 secs. Hibs will always be >able to leave Druim Ligen directly after release. You can use the porter to port back to your homeland.

What is this good for?

Find it pretty reasonable. Imagin you try to reraid Beno. You wipe the midzerg at the crossroad after a hard fight, rezz up, run to Beno and while you arrive the midzerg inc again. With full mana etc.. 3mins look fair to me. Otherwise you could just yolo in everytime because you will be there again nearly instant at full life and mana, while the hometeam had to run through 3 zones again.

Thu 31 Jan 2019 7:01 PM by caridry

Just put in the teleporter pad like old times /shrug then we will see who really complains. Id support it.

Thu 31 Jan 2019 7:10 PM by Zwei

This change is beyond ridiculous unnecessary. Neither ingame (Mid side) nor in the forum was a call for something like that. Why bind the people for 3 min for doing nothing? Fix the stupid shrooms before implanting changes no one called for.

Dont get me wrong, i really love the server so far. Nice work from all included persons, but this change is not a step, its a LEAP into the wrong direction.

Please remove it.

Thu 31 Jan 2019 7:49 PM by Expfighter

this change hurts albs the most since the most rvr'ed area in the game is apk---> amg in emain.

Why not just remove the healer or remove res sick all together?

Love the server but this is the worst change you have ever made, 2nd is the 1 min rebuff out of rvr BS!

Thu 31 Jan 2019 7:58 PM by phixion

Silly change, if you want to implement this then just port people back to border keep and re-add the necklace porting system.

Thu 31 Jan 2019 8:04 PM by faliv

phixion wrote: ↑
Thu 31 Jan 2019 7:58 PM
Silly change, if you want to implement this then just port people back to border keep and re-add the necklace porting system.

And that would be better because of...?

Honestly, normal precedure after a wipe:

1. release
2. heal sick x8
3. first afk, because of dog/kid/wife
4. rebuff
5. second afk because of someone smoking

3mins easily gone and noone was even peeing

Thu 31 Jan 2019 8:25 PM by phixion

faliv wrote: ↑
Thu 31 Jan 2019 8:04 PM
phixion wrote: ↑
Thu 31 Jan 2019 7:58 PM
Silly change, if you want to implement this then just port people back to border keep and re-add the necklace porting system.

And that would be better because of...?

Honestly, normal precedure after a wipe:

1. release
2. heal sick x8
3. first afk, because of dog/kid/wife
4. rebuff
5. second afk because of someone smoking

3mins easily gone and noone was even peeing

Because it looks silly being ported back, most people don't even realise what's going on when it happens.

And that may be the usual experience in groups, however if you are solo you tend to want to get out ASAP, especially if you're a stealther and have to stealth a long way to get any action.

Thu 31 Jan 2019 9:46 PM by BaldEagle

Don't know why everyone is surprised about the zerging. That is why they are implementing this rule.

If only this server was NF instead of OF, so many problems would have been solved. That is why Live daoc when to NF and a reason (although no one wants to admit it) why Uthgard died.

Insta port to action = Zergin (logic hard).

Switch to NF and we are all in the clear.

Thu 31 Jan 2019 9:49 PM by tylerryan307

So being hit with today has also caused a lot of confusion for me in game. I also would really like to hear from those that decided to make this change and why it was put into the game? There could have been lots of other ways to fix the problem that may have been listed as to why it was implemented.
I mean right now the game is not being played to how it was designed since everyone is playing the task game. So if the people here at Phoenix want something done in RvR then I would look at that first. Why not make it so people are able to pick which task they want to achieve? Why not make each side on a different task instead of everyone all on the same task? Why not add a teleport for each home realm in their own land? Why not make the low population realm a lower respawn timer so they can get back out quicker?
Like I said nobody is going after keeps or relics unless its on the weekends because everyone is just waiting for the task to go through and move to the next realm. All that is happening with this release counter is giving people a reason to run into a zone die, go eat or watch TV, and wait for zone switch since people get credit for playing a minute of the game and move on. Go to next realm and repeat, make realm rank 5 in a week for just a couple of minutes of play time that week.

Thu 31 Jan 2019 10:26 PM by Freudinio

BaldEagle wrote: ↑
Thu 31 Jan 2019 9:46 PM
Don't know why everyone is surprised about the zerging. That is why they are implementing this rule.

But the zerging is servermade. EVERYONE goes to the designated task area. There is little to no solo/smallman/8v8 to be found anywhere, as all other zones are dead. Sure I can go kill xp'ers to bait people out, but where is the fun in that?

This change hurts those of us that solo/smallman more than others I feel, because we tend to get killed a lot more (since everyone is out for points).

This change feels like a kneejerk panic reaction.

Thu 31 Jan 2019 10:31 PM by BaldEagle

Freudinio wrote: ↑
Thu 31 Jan 2019 10:26 PM
BaldEagle wrote: ↑
Thu 31 Jan 2019 9:46 PM
Don't know why everyone is surprised about the zerging. That is why they are implementing this rule.

But the zerging is servermade. EVERYONE goes to the designated task area. There is little to no solo/smallman/8v8 to be found anywhere, as all other zones are dead. Sure I can go kill xp'ers to bait people out, but where is the fun in that?

This change hurts those of us that solo/smallman more than others I feel, because we tend to get killed a lot more (since everyone is out for points).

This change feels like a kneejerk panic reaction.

Agree. The change is a joke, but it's to combat zerging which will always be a problem on OF because you port straight to action.

Thu 31 Jan 2019 10:32 PM by opossum12

Pretty sure the 180 sec isn’t about zerging but more about the relic take couple weeks ago where mids died 15 times to hibs but the just kept releasing to mpk then running back to throw their bodies at the hibs to slow down progression. Only reason why mids took the relic that day.

This 180sec rules makes that if you die, you die. It’s not just a port back to mpk/apk

Thu 31 Jan 2019 10:52 PM by BaldEagle

opossum12 wrote: ↑
Thu 31 Jan 2019 10:32 PM
Pretty sure the 180 sec isn’t about zerging but more about the relic take couple weeks ago where mids died 15 times to hibs but the just kept releasing to mpk then running back to throw their bodies at the hibs to slow down progression. Only reason why mids took the relic that day.

This 180sec rules makes that if you die, you die. It’s not just a port back to mpk/apk

If you lose the relic in the first place, you deserve to lose it.

Thu 31 Jan 2019 11:08 PM by Tsyliae

Can agree with this change, but ... 2 mins will be enough the last one is anoying as hell :/

Thu 31 Jan 2019 11:15 PM by Exercia

Remove the healers in the TK if you want to slow it down. But waiting 3 mins is just terrible. Or atleast make a visible timer.

This is a game changer and everyone in my guild is more then unpleased about it.

I have faith in the devs to find a sweetspot.

btw: Before you make those changes, try to fix the bug, that albion can not repair the relic keep doors.

Thu 31 Jan 2019 11:49 PM by Wulfen001

Exercia wrote: ↑
Thu 31 Jan 2019 11:15 PM
Remove the healers in the TK if you want to slow it down. But waiting 3 mins is just terrible. Or atleast make a visible timer.

This is a game changer and everyone in my guild is more then unpleased about it.

I have faith in the devs to find a sweetspot.

btw: Before you make those changes, try to fix the bug, that albion can not repair the relic keep doors.

100% agreed! Its just helping the strong Realm with more manpower. Solo people and small grps are just unhappy about it. Timegating is never a good thing... we want to be free.

Thu 31 Jan 2019 11:53 PM by Dimir

Hello Phoenix staff! Please consider:
1. If this is about relic attack/defense consider making it so that this 3m timer only applies if you die within a certain range of a relic keep or a keep that holds a relic. You could base it on whether the keep was under attack but sometimes that happens randomly so idk how accurate that would be.

2. If this isn't about relic keeps at all then this is about... zerging? Maybe that means there should be multiple RvR tasks going on at once to spread out the population.

As it stands this doesn't seem to hurt groups directly because they always take a few minutes to buff up, but it does indirectly hurt them by putting less people out there for them to fight. It mostly hurts small mans and solo classes that are going to have to wait to RvR and wait for their opponents to wait to RvR.

Please reconsider this change depending on what problem you are trying to fix! Thank you!

Fri 1 Feb 2019 12:05 AM by Hedien

@GM - I really don't get it.
Daoc is a game that suffer from lack of dynamism.
Why - because people take inhumane amount of time to build their group.
People get frustrated and start to do something else.

So now, you force people to stay at PK, increasing frustration.
Since you have this timer, people start to say : it's ok for me to take an afk. Which in fact increases the timer to 5-10 min.
And increase further the lack of dynamism and frustration.

Edit : and the chat timer notification is not that obvious, people don't want to try and thus wait more.

This is a big bad move for me.

Grim/Saturday.

Fri 1 Feb 2019 1:02 AM by Kaozium

Alb smallman here.

Why do you do this to me?

Most of the action is 300m from our portal keep. We die a lot. 3 Minutes is way too much.

When emain task is on we spend as much time in the keep as we do actually playing.

Fri 1 Feb 2019 2:32 AM by tylerryan307

First off this is is by no means 100% but just an idea of what could happen. Looking at the numbers after my last post. With Phoenix forcing us to stand on the sideline and if we play the sideline RvR Task game. A solo person that could complete 4 realm tasks of just running out into Emain, Odin's Gate, and Hadrian's Wall and die could make a total of 6000 rp's an hour. If that player plays for 5 hours a day that is 30,000 rp's that means in 17 days a person can reach realm rank 5L0.
So by forcing people out of playing the game, you are in fact giving people a way to make more realm points then are spent playing in the game. A person can run solo get ganked in a minute sit at the portal keep go back and watch TV with a timer and go to next realm run die get the credit. This system is forcing people out of the game and forcing people to solo since it is easier to get more realm points this way than others.
I do play in Albion and unless this gets fixed I guess I will hit 5L0 in about 14 - 15 days from now, but I will have also caught up on all my favorite TV shows I have been behind on.

Fri 1 Feb 2019 2:39 AM by daocgod

This definitely takes the cake in dumb changes

Fri 1 Feb 2019 6:43 AM by Topenga

[/quote]

Find it pretty reasonable. Imagin you try to reraid Beno. You wipe the midzerg at the crossroad after a hard fight, rezz up, run to Beno and while you arrive the midzerg inc again. With full mana etc.. 3mins look fair to me. Otherwise you could just yolo in everytime because you will be there again nearly instant at full life and mana, while the hometeam had to run through 3 zones again.
[/quote]

It's the same for all realms, once you win, once you lose...but, and I repeat myself here, this is mostly annoying and favors the team that is stronger in numbers already...just leave it as it was.

Fri 1 Feb 2019 7:27 AM by Druth

The reason for doing it was fine, the implementation could have been better.

Have a little faith in the team, they've been really good at listening so far. So tone down the doomsday spelling and be constructive.

Fri 1 Feb 2019 7:29 AM by Druth

And this is the reason for it: https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=3910

You might disagree with it being a valid reason, but they had a reason for doing it.

Fri 1 Feb 2019 7:37 AM by Khazar

Is it true that Mexico will pay for this wall?

Joke apart : a big NOP, you dev doing a great job, we having fun, we having bad time too, sometimes. We having consistant RvR and we can laugh and rage as usual, we don't need this timer, or at least... 60 seconds, not 180.

I don't want to play with my brother and having nostalgia about : "ya memby when the timer was not implent ? ah... good times of camelot."

Im sure you can find an other better way to solved the RvR problem... if there is ? one ? by the way... ?

I have about 2+ hours a day on this wonderful game, and yesterday was horrible, i have to wait for at least 30min... waiting in front of my keep while ennemy realm camping PK and farming.

All my guildies and i were salty af...

Don't do that

Fri 1 Feb 2019 8:00 AM by Hedien

Druth wrote: ↑
Fri 1 Feb 2019 7:29 AM
And this is the reason for it: https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=3910

You might disagree with it being a valid reason, but they had a reason for doing it.

The solution implemented impacts much more than this problem, in a negative way.

Fri 1 Feb 2019 8:38 AM by Topenga

Like one guild mate put it yesterday: "hardcore 8vs8 RvR groups broke up over having to wait 3 minutes for something" ;-)

Fri 1 Feb 2019 8:44 AM by Druth

Topenga wrote: ↑
Fri 1 Feb 2019 8:38 AM
Like one guild mate put it yesterday: "hardcore 8vs8 RvR groups broke up over having to wait 3 minutes for something" ;-)

See? Some good things comes from this change

Fri 1 Feb 2019 9:14 AM by Mac

The changes and the reason for the changes can be found in this thread: https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=4524
Where Uthred says,
"Leaving your portal keep:

After you got killed and release back to your portal keep, you wont be able to leave the portal keep area for 180 secs after release. You will always get ported back to the healer in the portal keep. This has no effect if you are in your homelands. Example: In emain only mids & albs cant leave the portal keep for 180 secs. Hibs will always be able to leave Druim Ligen directly after release. You can use the porter to port back to your homeland.

We did this change to remove people from running straight to the mg fights again and again and not being worth anything by the time they arrive. Especially when a relic is in transit it was very helpful for the attacking realm to be back in no time."

Fri 1 Feb 2019 9:30 AM by Terrence

I really don't appreciate this change either. I feel it's been done without any critical need and without any consultation with the player base.

As much as I love the server and the communication from the staff so far I feel we shouldn't continue implementing drastic changes without a strong need or fix a clear exploit. I was exping my minst (lvl 32) in the fz yesterday, got grey ganked by 50s and then had to wait 3 minutes to run back to my spot, beyond annoying.

Why don't we just play the server as is for a few months and leave any big changes for the time being? Performance could be improved a bit, certain bugs fixed, sure, but the server is great as is, no need to annoy players.

Fri 1 Feb 2019 9:47 AM by Druth

Terrence wrote: ↑
Fri 1 Feb 2019 9:30 AM
I really don't appreciate this change either. I feel it's been done without any critical need and without any consultation with the player base.

As much as I love the server and the communication from the staff so far I feel we shouldn't continue implementing drastic changes without a strong need or fix a clear exploit. I was exping my minst (lvl 32) in the fz yesterday, got grey ganked by 50s and then had to wait 3 minutes to run back to my spot, beyond annoying.

Why don't we just play the server as is for a few months and leave any big changes for the time being? Performance could be improved a bit, certain bugs fixed, sure, but the server is great as is, no need to annoy players.

Were you xp'ing in enemy frontier?

There is no timer when you run from Snowdonia or FS.

Fri 1 Feb 2019 12:10 PM by Terrence

Yes, in Emain actually, some good spirit and animal mobs near the ATK to get my tasks, plus frontier bonus. Sometimes you get ganked from fgs of course but until yesterday that never bothered me much. Mid fg kills me, I wait 3 minutes, the second I run out a ranger one-shots me... another 3 minute. That's just my own experience, but I generally don't see the need, some people just love zerging, if hibs or mids want to fight near our atk the respawn is just part of the game. Removing the ress sick healer would be a simpler solution if necessary.

Fri 1 Feb 2019 12:14 PM by Muradin

faliv wrote: ↑
Thu 31 Jan 2019 8:04 PM
phixion wrote: ↑
Thu 31 Jan 2019 7:58 PM
Silly change, if you want to implement this then just port people back to border keep and re-add the necklace porting system.

And that would be better because of...?

Honestly, normal precedure after a wipe:

1. release
2. heal sick x8
3. first afk, because of dog/kid/wife
4. rebuff
5. second afk because of someone smoking

3mins easily gone and noone was even peeing

^^^^^^^ this. Tbh I didn't even notice it after about an hr

Fri 1 Feb 2019 1:36 PM by faliv

phixion wrote: ↑
Thu 31 Jan 2019 8:25 PM
faliv wrote: ↑
Thu 31 Jan 2019 8:04 PM
phixion wrote: ↑
Thu 31 Jan 2019 7:58 PM
Silly change, if you want to implement this then just port people back to border keep and re-add the necklace porting system.

And that would be better because of...?

Honestly, normal precedure after a wipe:

1. release
2. heal sick x8
3. first afk, because of dog/kid/wife
4. rebuff
5. second afk because of someone smoking

3mins easily gone and noone was even peeing

Because it looks silly being ported back, most people don't even realise what's going on when it happens.

And that may be the usual experience in groups, however if you are solo you tend to want to get out ASAP, especially if you're a stealther and have to stealth a long way to get any action.

Ok, point. For a solo player it might suck a little bit more. But even when they would introduce Visur again, you had your downtime. And it only applies in enemy frontiers, so the way back to the next mg is not that far. And if there is no action at the mg, there is normaly no reason to run stealthed for a long while.

All in all i think it is still a fair game, but that is just my opinion of course.

Fri 1 Feb 2019 1:44 PM by faliv

Topenga wrote: ↑
Fri 1 Feb 2019 6:43 AM

Find it pretty reasonable. Imagin you try to reraid Beno. You wipe the midzerg at the crossroad after a hard fight, rezz up, run to Beno and while you arrive the midzerg inc again. With full mana etc.. 3mins look fair to me. Otherwise you could just yolo in everytime because you will be there again nearly instant at full life and mana, while the hometeam had to run through 3 zones again.
[/quote]

It's the same for all realms, once you win, once you lose...but, and I repeat myself here, this is mostly annoying and favors the team that is stronger in numbers already...just leave it as it was.
[/quote]

And i think death has to have a punishment. Otherwise i can engage everything on sight, because i will be instantly back again. So i like the idea. Could it be implementet in a better way, maybe. Make a suggestion.

Fri 1 Feb 2019 1:57 PM by Ardri

Feels a little long at 3min. Hopefully it will be reduced to 2min.

Fri 1 Feb 2019 2:53 PM by

Uthred

Locked.

Any feedback? --> https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=4590