Stealther & Instants casters - Phoenix Freeshard

Its surprising that, stealther and some classes (Instants casters) are allowed to be so powerful, and even more that the game are been rebuild/ and are about to be re-launched and still, they allow the stealthers and some classes at the same place / if not even better.
(I know - what's coming - Is a group player game

)

Sat 10 Nov 2018 12:14 AM by relvinian

I made an inf with 50 dw and 50 thrust. I don't have any special abilities, purge or none of that just master of pain, toughness, aug stats.

I literally have 2 buttons, the front dw style and the 9 second evade stun.

Those are the only 2 buttons you need,

My pain necro was nerfed into oblivion,. Not sure exactly what happened but dmg seems much lower and or enemies are just way tougher.

You run along and see a caster and boom boom boom. Dead. You hit tanks with dots and they ignore them.

Out dps by stealthers.

Sat 10 Nov 2018 6:18 AM by Robbinhood/Albsrule

so powerful? everyone takes damage differently all depending on what toon you're hitting or getting hit by. i dont always do alot of damage on my Scout or Inf. but when i do its because i dont have purge or vanish. i can be two hitted by a tank like i was today. every class can have Death blows or deal alot of dmg. people are always complaining about toons they've never played.

Sat 10 Nov 2018 8:59 AM by Rexoo

relvinian wrote: ↑
Sat 10 Nov 2018 12:14 AM
I made an inf with 50 dw and 50 thrust. I don't have any special abilities, purge or none of that just master of pain, toughness, aug stats.

I literally have 2 buttons, the front dw style and the 9 second evade stun.

Those are the only 2 buttons you need,

My pain necro was nerfed into oblivion,. Not sure exactly what happened but dmg seems much lower and or enemies are just way tougher.

You run along and see a caster and boom boom boom. Dead. You hit tanks with dots and they ignore them.

Out dps by stealthers.

About pets, yea something happened to the Cabalist as well, the pet have a hard time hitting anything

Sat 10 Nov 2018 9:07 AM by Rexoo

Robbinhood/Albsrule wrote: ↑
Sat 10 Nov 2018 6:18 AM
so powerful? everyone takes damage differently all depending on what toon you're hitting or getting hit by. i dont always do alot of damage on my Scout or Inf. but when i do its because i dont have purge or vanish. i can be two hitted by a tank like i was today. every class can have Death blows or deal alot of dmg. people are always complaining about toons they've never played.

I am playing texting more or less all classes, in all kind of setup - both powerful, and by nurfing myself - Under this testing phase.

But I have as well since the game first was released, played as main focus: Paladin, Cabalist, WIzard, Reaver, Heretic/ Thane, Hunter, SB, BD, Valkyrien / Vampire, warden, enchanter. So yeah I, will say I have played some of the classes

Mon 12 Nov 2018 2:18 AM by Thinal

If an assassin gets a full PA chan on you, and neither party has active RAs up, all else equal, the stealther should win. I don't see why this is such a hard concept to grasp. This is not only what assassins do, this is ONLY what assassins do. There shoudn't be any class that's somehow naturally immune to this. (I in no way intend to imply that this should be a GUARANTEE... I'm saying that unless player skills, gear, build, RA level, etc are especially lopsided, surviving a PA should be rare and a story to tell your grandkids about.)

If actives are up, failed a PA or part of the chain, did a BSII instead of a PA, etc then (still assuming equal skills) it's fair for some classes to be more likely to survive and some classes to die from the encounter. It's also fair that MOST classes survive the encounter, as the assassin failed in his primary calling. Those that are more likely to die are expected to have strengths elsewhere so that being vulnerable against assassins is a reasonable price to pay.

Archers are a different lot, as theoretically they can do more than just hide 'n' kill, but there are a number of other factors that discourage those other playstyles (melee damage table, available RAs, player perception, etc.) so that's another post. Minstrels fit all of the criteria of the OP and I frankly don't know what they "should" be, but it seems they especially strong against classes they have trouble avoiding and can trivially avoid classes that might give them trouble. But I'm not eager to invoke a nerf bat without a better understanding of what their role should be as opposed to what it has become.

Mon 12 Nov 2018 9:32 AM by Druth

Thinal wrote: ↑
Mon 12 Nov 2018 2:18 AM
If an assassin gets a full PA chan on you, and neither party has active RAs up, all else equal, the stealther should win. I don't see why this is such a hard concept to grasp. This is not only what assassins do, this is ONLY what assassins do. There shoudn't be any class that's somehow naturally immune to this. (I in no way intend to imply that this should be a GUARANTEE... I'm saying that unless player skills, gear, build, RA level, etc are especially lopsided, surviving a PA should be rare and a story to tell your grandkids about.)

I agree, no clue why people complain about being destroyed by assassins when they land PA/CD and they have purge down.
But when the assassin fails his opening he should have a very hard time winning.
And poison cycling means their dps will still be very high, which makes them still win fights where they should be at a clear disadvantage.

Mon 12 Nov 2018 3:24 PM by Dominus

well, with 5 min purge, dragonfang was effectively nerfed, along with scout slam. Big hit for Alb sneaks moreso than the other two realms. I'm sure testing isn't complete on the RA's, effectiveness and durations so we'll see.

Problem is, we have a date for live and there are "radical" changes being done just weeks before launch... Launch maybe be Beta 2.

Mon 12 Nov 2018 3:44 PM by Thinal

Dominus wrote: ↑
Mon 12 Nov 2018 3:24 PM
Problem is, we have a date for live and there are "radical" changes being done just weeks before launch... Launch maybe be Beta 2.

So far, I'm trusting the party line that it was always expected that i50 would have big changes to balance. It's the primary reason i50 has happened. I expect it's a big part of why this iteration of Cathal Valley happened, so Hibbies could actually be part of the equation.

I'm expecting tweaks after release, but the NNF RA change cause me to change race on my ranger. That's fat and happy for i50, but I would hope no changes after release are major enough that a single stroke could make rerolling the most feasible option.

Mon 12 Nov 2018 3:47 PM by Ganaka

Dominus wrote: ↑
Mon 12 Nov 2018 3:24 PM
well, with 5 min purge, dragonfang was effectively nerfed, along with scout slam. Big hit for Alb sneaks moreso than the other two realms. I'm sure testing isn't complete on the RA's, effectiveness and durations so we'll see.

Problem is, we have a date for live and there are "radical" changes being done just weeks before launch... Launch maybe be Beta 2.

That is a lot of Realm Points to spend just to counter skills that don't require Realm Points to purchase.

I would prefer alternative adjustments than implementing "mandatory" Realm Ability purchases.

Sat 29 Dec 2018 9:54 PM by Salviati

So have any of these changes been reverted? Has slam been restored for scouts? Are they going to take away free MoS for assassins? Did they fix defense pen and absorb (so assassins aren't one shotting full templated warriors with PA, like original origins)?

I had hopes for this server, but the more I read the more ridiculous it appears to be.

The devs seem to have no idea what they're doing.

Sat 29 Dec 2018 10:57 PM by Citian

Assassins have been relatively nerfed on this rendition: no evade follow-up styles, e.g. off-evade stun + 3-4 hamstrings into a combo; no dodger RA; 25% defense penetration from dual wield rather than 50%; no avoid pain; poisons/debuffs/diseases cannot crit 99%.

PA chain is incapable of one shotting a full temp main tank. Not to say that it should... but if it were a worry, it shouldnt be. Have fun

Wed 9 Jan 2019 12:14 PM by aenne

oje oje oje....this is sooo crap.....

Wed 9 Jan 2019 4:07 PM by Isavyr

Salviati wrote: ↑
Sat 29 Dec 2018 9:54 PM
So have any of these changes been reverted? Has slam been restored for scouts? Are they going to take away free MoS for assassins? Did they fix defense pen and absorb (so assassins aren't one shotting full templated warriors with PA, like original origins)?

I had hopes for this server, but the more I read the more ridiculous it appears to be.

The devs seem to have no idea what they're doing.

Slam was never changed for scouts. MOS is provided in stealth spec. Assassins don't 1-shot tanks with PA.

Have you played this server or do you just troll the forums?

Wed 9 Jan 2019 9:33 PM by Salviati

Isavyr wrote: ↑
Wed 9 Jan 2019 4:07 PM
Salviati wrote: ↑
Sat 29 Dec 2018 9:54 PM
So have any of these changes been reverted? Has slam been restored for scouts? Are they going to take away free MoS for assassins? Did they fix defense pen and absorb (so assassins aren't one shotting full templated warriors with PA, like original origins)?

I had hopes for this server, but the more I read the more ridiculous it appears to be.

The devs seem to have no idea what they're doing.

Slam was never changed for scouts. MOS is provided in stealth spec. Assassins don't 1-shot tanks with PA.

Have you played this server or do you just troll the forums?

No I don't play on this server, that's why I'm asking questions. Well, that and nobody plays on it because it isn't live and before that it was just a beta test. Or original origins I routinely got PA'd for 9-1200 on my fully temped warrior (even with a full 50% crit it should never have been about 500 and 500 was a low normal PA). Nobody knew how to fix that properly. Or the devs all played stealthers and had no interest to. I was wondering if they had the gumption to fix that, yet. I mean, did you ever notice how many terrible assassins were thriving on both Uthgard and Origins? Te servers catered to them and this one seems to go one step above.

I still say they should remove free mastery of stealth.

And someone on the forum made the statement that scouts had slam reduced to 5 seconds.

But TIL asking questions and sharing true experiences = trolling. The idiocracy is here.

Thu 10 Jan 2019 2:51 AM by Turtle006

I played an Inf for a lot of Beta and i50. I never got close to 1 shotting a tank. I got my ass handed to me by a LOT of tanks. (and other classes also)
Stealthers seem to be in a pretty good place, Scouts are probably a bit weak.

Thu 10 Jan 2019 3:26 AM by Isavyr

Salviati wrote: ↑
Wed 9 Jan 2019 9:33 PM
But TIL asking questions and sharing true experiences = trolling. The idiocracy is here.

You said:

"I had hopes for this server, but the more I read the more ridiculous it appears to be.

The devs seem to have no idea what they're doing. "

You misread other's comments, leading you to make comments that the devs don't know what they're doing, when it's actually you. Instead of politely asking questions, you put down the server, which you haven't even bothered to play, and then other users. You're quite good at mental gymnastics.

Thu 10 Jan 2019 10:04 PM by Patron

Salviati wrote: ↑
Sat 29 Dec 2018 9:54 PM
So have any of these changes been reverted? Has slam been restored for scouts? Are they going to take away free MoS for assassins? Did they fix defense pen and absorb (so assassins aren't one shotting full templated warriors with PA, like original origins)?

I had hopes for this server, but the more I read the more ridiculous it appears to be.

The devs seem to have no idea what they're doing.

Mon 21 Jan 2019 10:24 PM by randomeclipse

Rexoo wrote: ↑
Fri 9 Nov 2018 11:35 PM
Its surprising that, stealther and some classes (Instants casters) are allowed to be so powerful, and even more that the game are been rebuild/ and are about to be re-launched and still, they allow the stealthers and some classes at the same place / if not even better.
(I know - what's coming - Is a group player game )

You should roll one.

Tue 22 Jan 2019 7:02 AM by Joc

Dominus wrote: ↑
Mon 12 Nov 2018 3:24 PM
well, with 5 min purge, dragonfang was effectively nerfed, along with scout slam. Big hit for Alb sneaks moreso than the other two realms. I'm sure testing isn't complete on the RA's, effectiveness and durations so we'll see.

Problem is, we have a date for live and there are "radical" changes being done just weeks before launch... Launch maybe be Beta 2.

30 min purge and slam/DF were NEVER balanced though. People need to recognize the power of a 50 DW inf and stop bitching about Ra's and an overpowered I win button when they get it nerfed (indirectly through ras) and they still have an amazingly good spec/class at their disposal. I have an idea, let's go back to 1.61 when SBs where like zerkers with crazy high double frost damage and 3 rounding infs/ns and you can have your 30 minute purge back.

New Ra's are a bigger benefit for the community.