Make Keeps Matter More - Phoenix Freeshard

Keep War
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One thing that DAOC has always lacked was a way for realms to actually win. Trading keeps and relics is nice and all, but what if there was a system that allowed one realm to claim victory over the other? It could be based on the realm who holds Darkness Falls the longest over a period of time. So lets say the realm that holds DF for the longest amount of time over the course of 2-3 months is the winner. These are some ideas.

Increased Rewards for Keep Lords and Darkness Falls

Keep Commanders drop chests that include Claws, bounty points, feathers, tinderboxes, and one rare low drop % item. These chests are the ones the Caravans carry to the keeps. Higher level keeps drop more chests.

Capturing a keep gives more RP and feathers to participants. Scale the RP reward based on the keep level. Higher keep level the higher the RP reward. The RP can be in the keep chests. Right now the feather amount is very low for taking a keep.

Unique rewards only attainable in Darkness Falls. Special Reskin merchant for seals.

Earn Keep Points for controlling Darkness Falls.

Once one realm amasses a certain amount of Keep points they are the Keep War winner.

Think of it like a keep vault that is filled as you hold enemy keeps

There could be an underdog bonus for capturing and holding keeps if one realm is super far behind in terms of total keep points.

Winning the Keep War grants the winning realm unique cosmetics, dyes, a special realmwide event, an rp bonus, and a commemoration statue in their Capital City.

Keep fights are part of the greater Keep War.

1 week break after a realm is declared the victor.

The incentives have to be high. DAOC is about Realm v Realm and keep taking should be at the forefront.

Keep fights should be what bring players to the Frontiers.

Realmwide Announcements for keeps under attack and captured. This way players know where to find the action.

I think it is important that there is a winning realm in the Keep War. It can create realm pride and unite players on a realm to fight for everyone.

Mon 29 Oct 2018 12:34 AM by Vack

Can't have re-settable systems in a persistent rvr game. I'm afraid that still will not get people out of emain, 5% is not enough of a bonus in RP.

Mon 29 Oct 2018 12:44 AM by defiasbandit

Vack wrote: ↑
Mon 29 Oct 2018 12:34 AM
Can't have re-settable systems in a persistent rvr game. I'm afraid that still will not get people out of emain, 5% is not enough of a bonus in RP.

Yeah I am all for making the bonus as high as it needs to be in order to incentivize keeps. The bonus could be 10%. If you owned 5 enemy keeps you could earn a 50% rp bonus. That is a lot.

It doesn't have to be a reset system. I like there being a greater purpose/effort to all the fighting though. You can award realms gradually if they reach a certain keep point total. There can be tiers of rewards and unlocks with a running tally. I prefer just have it be a competition with one winner, but I understand some don't.

Mon 29 Oct 2018 7:49 PM by defiasbandit

Since you would need to own all your frontier keeps to activate the RP bonus, alot of the fights in Odins, Emain, and Hadrians would be at the border keeps.

No matter how many keeps in Albion or Hibernia the realm of Midgard owns, if Midgard loses control of the Odin's gate keep, then their RP bonus is disabled.

This mechanic can lead to action in all the border zones.

The 20% bonus for fight at or near keeps is also a nice defenders bonus too.

Mon 29 Oct 2018 7:54 PM by Cadebrennus

I like the chests idea. It reminds me of the chests in NF which usually had some decent goodies. Tying caravans to chests is an excellent idea. The higher level the keep then the more loot is deposited in the chest.

Mon 29 Oct 2018 7:57 PM by defiasbandit

Cadebrennus wrote: ↑
Mon 29 Oct 2018 7:54 PM
I like the chests idea. It reminds me of the chests in NF which usually had some decent goodies. Tying caravans to chests is an excellent idea. The higher level the keep then the more loot is deposited in the chest.

Exactly Cadebrennus. So if you capture a level 10 keep it will have tons of chest dropoffs from caravans. I would consider putting RP bonuses in those chests as well, so you get more rp based on the keep level.

Mon 29 Oct 2018 10:45 PM by Cadebrennus

defiasbandit wrote: ↑
Mon 29 Oct 2018 7:57 PM
Cadebrennus wrote: ↑
Mon 29 Oct 2018 7:54 PM
I like the chests idea. It reminds me of the chests in NF which usually had some decent goodies. Tying caravans to chests is an excellent idea. The higher level the keep then the more loot is deposited in the chest.

Exactly Cadebrennus. So if you capture a level 10 keep it will have tons of chest dropoffs from caravans. I would consider putting RP bonuses in those chests as well, so you get more rp based on the keep level.

Non-transferable Realm Point Tokens!

Tue 30 Oct 2018 12:38 AM by defiasbandit

There is great incentive for both attackers and defenders.

Attackers can earn RP, win loot from the caravan chests that drop off Commanders, as well help control more keeps for their realm to ensure the 10% RP Bonus per enemy keep held.

Defenders get a nice 50% RP bonus for killing players near keeps they are defending. The defenders are also helping their realm control their keeps for the realmwide % RP bonus.

Tue 30 Oct 2018 6:43 AM by aso

Man pls go live and stick the brainless hero zerg...

Tue 30 Oct 2018 8:54 AM by Sei

I d tend to agree that making keep more attractive is a good idea, the only thing we should be careful with is that it is not giving too much bonus to the dominating realm, because for sure there will be one.

Tue 30 Oct 2018 1:17 PM by Ombrix

aso wrote: ↑
Tue 30 Oct 2018 6:43 AM
Man pls go live and stick the brainless hero zerg...

😂

Tue 30 Oct 2018 5:19 PM by defiasbandit

The Keep War might just be the key to all of this.

The bonuses can always be refined or changed, but DAOC is desigined around 8 man groups fighting over keeps.

Serverwide alerts indicating what keep is under attack is what will bring players to Frontier Zones, as well as give players multiple options of where to fight.

Offering big instant rewards that drop off Keep Commanders such as Claws, feathers, bounty points, tinderboxes, and realm points is what we need to incentivize RvR everywhere.

Making the rewards scale based on the Keep level
More caravans that reach a keep, the more chests that drop off Commanders.

Think of the Defender's Bonus. Receiving 50% bonus RP per kill for fighting at keeps or in zones where keeps are under attack.

Make the RP gain high for fighting over keeps.

Every Keep take in the frontiers contributes to the Keep War. It can encourage players to travel to all frontiers to fight in. You do not need a zerg to take keeps. 8mans and even small mans can take over keeps and earn the chest rewards for themselves.

Players will want their realm to succeed in the Keep War in order to benefit from the realmwide bonuses.

The purpose of the Keep War is to create constant action everywhere while adhering to RvR based objectives. Keep War is everywhere, not just one Zerg fighting at one keep all the time.

Log on and invite a few friends. Go attack a level 7 keep. Fight the enemy realm defending the keep, kill the commander and receive chests, add another keep take to the realm map.

Having everyone running around a single zone killing eachother and respawning is not healthy for this server. Many players are not interested in such RvR, and we can see how shallow it has become during i50.

Add stats to track on the herald possibly as well.

The game is about RvR, not just RP farming.

Tue 30 Oct 2018 5:36 PM by defiasbandit

The Keep Commanders should have a very low % chance to drop a special item. Higher level keeps aka more caravans that have reached the keep should increase the drop %.

The Caravans should also be carrying this special rare item.

The special item could be a cosmetic piece like the ToA Epic Weapons that were removed.

Tue 30 Oct 2018 11:27 PM by Cadebrennus

Definitely boost RPs in a large radius around keeps and penalize RPs in areas that we want to move RvR away from

Wed 31 Oct 2018 1:24 AM by defiasbandit

A consideration is to allow realms to port to their border keeps if they own all their frontier keeps. Not primarily for the reason of porting to fight in Emain, Odins, or Hadrian's.. rather to be able to more reasonably defend Border Keeps.

Wed 31 Oct 2018 1:30 AM by Cramit845

defiasbandit wrote: ↑
Wed 31 Oct 2018 1:24 AM
A consideration is to allow realms to port to their border keeps if they own all their frontier keeps. Not primarily for the reason of porting to fight in Emain, Odins, or Hadrian's.. rather to be able to more reasonably defend Border Keeps.

This is actually not a bad idea, although I think they would have to limit it to the teleporter only working while the keep is not under attack. That or at least after the first set of doors is down. That way you can't have instant zergs appear behind the walls and just roll the attacking force. Would make keeps pointless to attack over populated realms that way.

Wed 31 Oct 2018 3:51 AM by defiasbandit

I think a concern with Keep RvR has always been the guards. It is better to make guards pretty weak. Players don't really like guards determining the outcomes of fights. Perhaps guards can do low damage, but have high hp pools so you have to spend time killing them. Otherwise guards can just wipe players/groups and that is not great for PvP.

Mon 11 Feb 2019 6:47 AM by defiasbandit

Taking keeps seems a bit like a treadmill, having a point system might give players more reason to do so. It can be like a competition and gives owning Darkness Falls more importance.

Mon 11 Feb 2019 7:47 AM by Ceen

There are keep tasks already and I'm not sure if you noticed but the population is actually increasing and on an all time high.

So maybe step back with all your "suggestions" and enjoy the game like everyone else. Actually the tasks support open field fights which are much more entertaining than simple keep raids.

Mon 11 Feb 2019 7:20 PM by defiasbandit

Ceen wrote: ↑
Mon 11 Feb 2019 7:47 AM
There are keep tasks already and I'm not sure if you noticed but the population is actually increasing and on an all time high.

So maybe step back with all your "suggestions" and enjoy the game like everyone else. Actually the tasks support open field fights which are much more entertaining than simple keep raids.

I never said get rid of tasks. They are a good thing. Players would actually be more encouraged to do the keep tasks. The whole point is to create a grander purpose and goal towards owning keeps. Otherwise, what is the point? Darkness Falls does not provide anything special. Trading keeps back and forth endlessly seems irrelevant.

Create a point system where realms gain points for controlling DF. DF should have some unique rewards also.

What does DF even offer? You can get way better XP elsewhere, and TG, Sidi, Galla raids give so much more feathers.

Mon 11 Feb 2019 8:54 PM by Cadebrennus

I don't know if taking keeps gives BPs, but if it was a significant amount of BPs it could matter more. Allowing BPs to be used at the Feather Merchants would be another impetus to RvR, allowing people to buy items with their RvR time rather than their PvE time.

Mon 11 Feb 2019 9:01 PM by defiasbandit

The idea here is to make it a realm competition. The only competition on the server is individual RR. Why not have a competition that is realmwide?

Tue 12 Feb 2019 4:21 AM by Frieza

maybe we should look at making keeps a bigger part of rvr?

i.e. keep ownership = high dps/ heals/ etc.

I think i speak for the minority when i say, i love keep attack and defense, and im sure most people will disagree, but i think if you take keeps as a more important role overall, itll increase the activity and the surprise factor of rvr. I think everyone can say theyve done the 8man game roaming for the past 15+ years whereas keeps have always been that weird step child off to the side.

Again, im probably in the minority here, but i like that going into the mix.

Tue 12 Feb 2019 8:41 PM by defiasbandit

Frieza wrote: ↑
Tue 12 Feb 2019 4:21 AM
maybe we should look at making keeps a bigger part of rvr?

i.e. keep ownership = high dps/ heals/ etc.

I think i speak for the minority when i say, i love keep attack and defense, and im sure most people will disagree, but i think if you take keeps as a more important role overall, itll increase the activity and the surprise factor of rvr. I think everyone can say theyve done the 8man game roaming for the past 15+ years whereas keeps have always been that weird step child off to the side.

Again, im probably in the minority here, but i like that going into the mix.

We need something that is more challenging and fulfilling for the zerg community. Zerging realm tasks gets repetitive, especially when the free rp dissipates. Having a competitive system between the realms would give RvR more purpose, and offer another form of progression beyond realm ranks. We all know how much ranking up slows down after RR5.

Casuals will love this. Think Zerg War. Albion, Midgard, Hibernia last realm standing.

Thu 14 Feb 2019 2:34 AM by Frieza

why not give a high amount of feathers for taking relics i.e. returning them to your relic keep? Make it as many as a raid even?

Thu 14 Feb 2019 5:05 PM by Durrty

This is a boss idea.

I like everything about it. Just splendid, Defias.

Someone get that dog a bone.

And my 2 cents is that its a thing that isn't always running as it would cause it to be slightly frustrating constantly fighting over keeps, but I suppose that would also depend on the population.

Tue 19 Feb 2019 8:09 PM by defiasbandit

Durrty wrote: ↑
Thu 14 Feb 2019 5:05 PM
This is a boss idea.

I like everything about it. Just splendid, Defias.

Someone get that dog a bone.

And my 2 cents is that its a thing that isn't always running as it would cause it to be slightly frustrating constantly fighting over keeps, but I suppose that would also depend on the population.

Well there would be an underdog mechanic. You would earn points if you were behind. The point is to sort of make it a close race between the 3 realms until the end. The final week could offer bonus points as well, so even if your realm is last you can still win. Sort of eases the pressure of worrying about falling behind all the time.

Fri 22 Mar 2019 10:43 PM by defiasbandit

You shouldnt lose RP % for losing your keeps. The 5 or 10% bonuses are fine.