Any chance for a Win Condition on Phoenix?

So one Realm can actually be declared victor?

In DAOC the servers just go on and on without a winning realm. I am not asking for resetting levels or realm ranks, but is there any system that can exist so one realm wins after set amount of time? Like one month or 6 months.. Otherwise its just an endless and pointless struggle between the realms.

Give out realmwide rewards to a winning realm.

I think it is something DAOC has always needed.

Relic War

Holding an enemy relic awards your realm either 10% feather and bounty points or 10% xp and gold bonuses. Instead of 10% Magic and 10% Melee Damage. Additionally you earn Relic Points for holding enemy relics.

Once one realm amasses a certain total amount of Relic points they are the Relic War winner.

Think of it like a relic vault that keeps filling up as you hold enemy relics.

There could be an underdog bonus for capturing and holding relics if one realm is super far behind in terms of total relic points.

Winning the Realm War grants the winning realm unique cosmetics, dyes (white dye), a special realmwide event, an rp bonus, and a commemoration statue in their Capital City.

1 week break after a realm is declared the victor.

I think it is important that there is a winning realm in the Relic War. It can create realm pride and unite players on a realm to fight for everyone.

Mon 15 Oct 2018 8:23 AM by Bethoc

Agreed. The current tasks could be continuously tallied up into a viewable composite score that yields feathers or other tangible bonuses. Perhaps every month.

For each of the four weeks in that month, hold a special event whereby a realm can boost its score considerably - this would allow an underdog realm to topple the current score leader, avoiding a sense of hopelessness if their enemy is already far ahead. Something like a 20% score boost per event, meaning there's a major incentive to log in at least on that one day each week, organize a battlegroup, and fight for your realm. Potential for huge fights. The event could simply be a variation on one of the existing tasks, or something more unique if the developers are open to experimenting. I would change the event timing every week, to avoid excluding people who are consistently unavailable on specific days.

The 'final battle' or end of month event should be even more important, maybe a doubled 40% score boost. Also, if the winner of the final battle isn't the overall score leader, make the two realms duke it out in an overtime tiebreaker to determine the ultimate victor. If the third realm wins instead, they deny any victory at all that month, which would inspire much hatred towards them and encourage realm pride.

Likewise for relics, a realm shouldn't be declared the victor if they don't even have control over their own set, meaning a denial of victory could be accomplished with a successful relic raid. Realms would have to secure their own relics regardless of score if they want to win.

Mon 15 Oct 2018 5:41 PM by defiasbandit

Bethoc wrote: ↑
Mon 15 Oct 2018 8:23 AM
Agreed. The current tasks could be continuously tallied up into a viewable composite score that yields feathers or other tangible bonuses. Perhaps every month.

For each of the four weeks in that month, hold a special event whereby a realm can boost its score considerably - this would allow an underdog realm to topple the current score leader, avoiding a sense of hopelessness if their enemy is already far ahead. Something like a 20% score boost per event, meaning there's a major incentive to log in at least on that one day each week, organize a battlegroup, and fight for your realm. Potential for huge fights. The event could simply be a variation on one of the existing tasks, or something more unique if the developers are open to experimenting. I would change the event timing every week, to avoid excluding people who are consistently unavailable on specific days.

The 'final battle' or end of month event should be even more important, maybe a doubled 40% score boost. Also, if the winner of the final battle isn't the overall score leader, make the two realms duke it out in an overtime tiebreaker to determine the ultimate victor. If the third realm wins instead, they deny any victory at all that month, which would inspire much hatred towards them and encourage realm pride.

Likewise for relics, a realm shouldn't be declared the victor if they don't even have control over their own set, meaning a denial of victory could be accomplished with a successful relic raid. Realms would have to secure their own relics regardless of score if they want to win.

That would be way cool. Seems reasonable to implement as well.

Mon 15 Oct 2018 6:30 PM by kmark101

Pretty cool idea, I love it.

Maybe it would work like gradually increased points for realms holding relics, ie. at the beginning of an era less points, but as we approach the end more points. This would incentivize early and late "era" activity as well, while an end of an era would be a huge bloodbath on every front.

Realm rewards could be like special skins or gold/plats.

You guys were looking for a reason of relics, this could be one

Mon 15 Oct 2018 7:20 PM by rubaduck

Playing around the "hold the relic" as in capture the point type of gameplay will most def be a very good incentive to play. It will give the zergers a reason to do head on collisions other then running around mindlessly slaughtering everything in task areas as the main pvp focus would be to protect relic keep / realm keeps with relics. Holding a relic accumulates points,

Instead of giving people hard rewards, like skins, and such for the "winning realm" after a period of time, make a realmwide reward. Increased amount of feather drop, increased gold drop (by a lot, not 5% but maybe 15-20% or in that ballpark), increase XP bonuses as a passive for a period of time. This gives incentive to claim keeps and defend them too. The guild who manages to accumulate most points on a realm is given hard rewards, like reskins for example.

For example, you have a starting pool of 0, every realm accumulates a number of points over time (like 1 per relic they control per minute), with 3 relics that is increased by 10%, 4 by 25%, 5 by 50% and 6 by 100%. This goes on over a time period of a week. If every realm owns two relics each, the realm task will rotate around just like it would like now. With 3-4 relics there is a 50% chance that the realm tasks will be set to the FZ controlling the relics. With 5-6 relics the tasks has a 100% chance to spawn in the realm with the most or all relics. For each completed realm task, the realm who completed the realm tasks gets a point, regardless if they own a relic or not.

Mon 15 Oct 2018 7:25 PM by poisonclover

when you add a win condition you encourage people to switch to the benefiting/winning server. just saying.

Mon 15 Oct 2018 8:21 PM by defiasbandit

poisonclover wrote: ↑
Mon 15 Oct 2018 7:25 PM
when you add a win condition you encourage people to switch to the benefiting/winning server. just saying.

Idea is to have underpopulation bonuses. Ways to help the losing realm so they still have a chance.

How about the losing realm gets invaded for the day?

Wed 17 Oct 2018 3:14 AM by rubaduck

defiasbandit wrote: ↑
Mon 15 Oct 2018 8:21 PM
How about the losing realm gets invaded for the day?

Why do you keep bringing up this, I really don't understand why you'd want that.

Wed 17 Oct 2018 8:40 AM by Sepplord

there are two very dangerous effects win conditions and rewards have:

a) there comes a point, where one/two sides simply give up, since they cannot catch up anymore (or believe they won't catch up). There are workarounds to make that timeframe as small as possible, but it will always be there and keep a portion of the playerbase from playing.

b) this one is far more problematic: switching to the winning side is something that already happens when realms have relics or simply dominate consistently. Adding additional weekly boni further benefits the winning side. The winning side gets stronger even faster and "wins more" next season. They already get more rewards for winning individual fights.
Passive boni to XP/GOLD/etc... also add onto this, not only is one side winning a lot, it is now also more easy to get started in that realm. Leaving behind your old chars hurts far less if you can jump into the new realm and level faster, get back gold faster, etc...

Winning SHOULD Give huge rewards....that's what logic dictates for us. Otherwise, why even bother? But in situations where people can easily switch the side their are fighting on realm-wide rewards are a bad idea imo.

Wed 17 Oct 2018 9:35 AM by Kampfar

Something like Points for kill enemy could be implemented . Could call them realmpoints. Oh wait ...

Wed 17 Oct 2018 12:49 PM by poisonclover

defiasbandit wrote: ↑
Mon 15 Oct 2018 8:21 PM
poisonclover wrote: ↑
Mon 15 Oct 2018 7:25 PM
when you add a win condition you encourage people to switch to the benefiting/winning server. just saying.

Idea is to have underpopulation bonuses. Ways to help the losing realm so they still have a chance.

How about the losing realm gets invaded for the day?
[/quote

Im just pointing out that generally speaking from experience especially in this game, once a realm holds all relics, they usually don't lose them. maybe 1 or 2 here and there but they get them back pretty fast. people will sooner switch to the winning realm then stay in an underpopulated one and struggle. so the underpopulated one has to be worth it.

Wed 17 Oct 2018 1:45 PM by Sepplord

I agree, that effect was already very obvious on live, when "switching" realms was a much bigger hassle.
Imo Relics always were too strong anyways and not really had a place in a game about balanced RvR but that's a completely different topic.

Winning in DAoC itself is a great reward and almost everything you do to win already gives realmpoints/boni/DF access/relics/etc...

there is no need for another reward for the strongest side

Wed 17 Oct 2018 5:04 PM by kmark101

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Wed 17 Oct 2018 8:40 AM
there are two very dangerous effects win conditions and rewards have:

a) there comes a point, where one/two sides simply give up, since they cannot catch up anymore (or believe they won't catch up). There are workarounds to make that timeframe as small as possible, but it will always be there and keep a portion of the playerbase from playing.

b) this one is far more problematic: switching to the winning side is something that already happens when realms have relics or simply dominate consistently. Adding additional weekly boni further benefits the winning side. The winning side gets stronger even faster and "wins more" next season. They already get more rewards for winning individual fights.
Passive boni to XP/GOLD/etc... also add onto this, not only is one side winning a lot, it is now also more easy to get started in that realm. Leaving behind your old chars hurts far less if you can jump into the new realm and level faster, get back gold faster, etc...

Winning SHOULD Give huge rewards....that's what logic dictates for us. Otherwise, why even bother? But in situations where people can easily switch the side their are fighting on realm-wide rewards are a bad idea imo.

I disagree with both.

a) can be controlled with the gradually progressive result points as the age matures: at the beginning of an age, there are less victory condition points and the age comes to an end, the points increase gradually... this means that even if your realm was losing, you can still "catch up" with a good finish, while there is also incentive to be active at the beginning period as well (hence we have 3 realms here)

b) the whole idea is exactly have the opposite effect what you are describing: as an age comes to an end, there is a new age where every realm starts a fresh! so there is a chance to get revenge and people would not stick to the winning side, but their favorite realm

Wed 17 Oct 2018 5:11 PM by defiasbandit

I wrote this rather rambling idea earlier. I have shortened it.

Relic War

Holding an enemy relic awards your realm either 10% feather and bounty points or 10% xp and gold bonuses. Instead of 10% Magic and 10% Melee Damage.

The first realm to capture 25 enemy relics wins the Realm War.

There could be an underdog bonus for capturing relics if one realm is super far behind in terms of total captures. Give bonus captures + % bonuses to an underdog.

Winning the Realm War grants the winning realm unique cosmetics, dyes (white dye), a special realmwide event, and a commemoration statue in their Capital City.

I think it is important that there is a winning realm in the Relic War. It can create realm pride and unite players on a realm to fight for everyone.

Thu 18 Oct 2018 5:23 AM by Sepplord

kmark101 wrote: ↑
Wed 17 Oct 2018 5:04 PM
a) can be controlled with the gradually progressive result points as the age matures: at the beginning of an age, there are less victory condition points and the age comes to an end, the points increase gradually... this means that even if your realm was losing, you can still "catch up" with a good finish, while there is also incentive to be active at the beginning period as well (hence we have 3 realms here)

b) the whole idea is exactly have the opposite effect what you are describing: as an age comes to an end, there is a new age where every realm starts a fresh! so there is a chance to get revenge and people would not stick to the winning side, but their favorite realm

Your arguments make sense theoretically, but i don't believe that it actually happens that way.

a) is debateable, yes. Catch-ups can help to decrease the impact of the problem, or to make it only appear in bigger imbalances. But balancing that perfectly to allow catch ups until the last hour of a "season" is not realistic imo and also unfair... Why would one realm dominating for 90% of the time suddenly get beaten in the last few days?
You claim that there is also an incnetive to be active at start, but i don't see how that works while ALSO having huge catch up mechanics.

b) that's simply not what happens. There is no fresh start. The scoreboard is clear but the stronger side is still stronger, and now they got season rewards on top. It's not like a round based shooter, where teams get rebalanced between the seasons.
Some people will try again and again and again. One side dominating ONCE, wouldn't have much of an impact. Some guilds might even move to the underdog for more enemies to fight. But the casual zerg mass will migrate towards the dominant side. That already happens without extra season rewards. Why do you beieve additional winning rewards would decrease winning team joining?

Thu 18 Oct 2018 1:40 PM by poisonclover

Relics should benefit the realm and imo should be mostly PVE.

my ideas:

10% increased drop rate on Epic Mobs ( maybe more drops if held)
2.5% Defense bonus ( block,parry,evade)
15% increased XP/RP Gain
10% less Experience lost per death
2.0% End/power cost reduction
20% Increased Spawn rate on Epic Mobs.
2% increase on RoG quality drops. ( would of been a 94% will drop at 96%)
5% Decrease on RA Timers.

Underpopulated realms should be addressed immediately, by whatever means required imo. even if its /level 10 anything that will encourage people to play or stick around cant hurt in the long run.

just some ideas and I know some of them just aren't possible, but just throwing some ideas around. I honestly don't think Relics should make a realm do More damage or cast faster or anything of the such as that changes things drastically across the board.

Thu 18 Oct 2018 4:24 PM by defiasbandit

poisonclover wrote: ↑
Thu 18 Oct 2018 1:40 PM
Relics should benefit the realm and imo should be mostly PVE.

my ideas:

10% increased drop rate on Epic Mobs ( maybe more drops if held)
2.5% Defense bonus ( block,parry,evade)
15% increased XP/RP Gain
10% less Experience lost per death
2.0% End/power cost reduction
20% Increased Spawn rate on Epic Mobs.
2% increase on RoG quality drops. ( would of been a 94% will drop at 96%)
5% Decrease on RA Timers.

Underpopulated realms should be addressed immediately, by whatever means required imo. even if its /level 10 anything that will encourage people to play or stick around cant hurt in the long run.

just some ideas and I know some of them just aren't possible, but just throwing some ideas around. I honestly don't think Relics should make a realm do More damage or cast faster or anything of the such as that changes things drastically across the board.

Well there can always be some builtin underpopulation bonuses. We already have an underpopulation RP bonus it is quite nice.