@Midgard Leadership - Phoenix Freeshard

If you've ever seen the inside of a slaughterhouse, that's what a Midgard BG looks like. Simple, efficient execution, served up RP rich. Hib takes Bled and Nott keep/towers in off hours and leaves everything else. Despite having only a single relic, Midgard BG get directed at these objectives. Once the flame is lit and numbers are known, Hib ports in and AJ's. Midgard BG then rally's and does the same thing, again!?! This is due to sycophantic, capitulating BG leaders who would rather do something safe versus do something innovative and defend their decision. Vanity is a four letter word and people should get their self-esteem elsewhere. Hib leadership fails to innovate because why would they, Midgard is trained and ready to farm, slaughterhouse style.

Once a keep/tower is owned, no matter what realm it's in, it belongs to that realm. Stubborn pride to control your realm is egoism. No amount of RP bonus is going to make people feel good about that.

Wed 19 Aug 2020 8:05 PM by DinoTriz

I knew there was a rational reason why I kept rage quitting last night like a big baby.

In all seriousness, it feels like a lost cause...

Thu 20 Aug 2020 7:45 AM by Sepplord

it's easy to point fingers at what's wrong, while implying superior knowledge

Much more helpful would be to point at the alternatives what should be done instead

Thu 20 Aug 2020 9:17 AM by gotwqqd

Didn’t they just close two threads about this because they go nowhere?

Thu 20 Aug 2020 9:44 AM by Valaraukar

gotwqqd wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 9:17 AM
Didn’t they just close two threads about this because they go nowhere?

They went nowhere because some funny hibs succesfully distracted the topics trolling everyone, and getting hurt when people argued back

. Probably this post will have the same fate...

Anyway, trying to keep it positive: Yeah Mid lacks leadership, that's for sure, but the cause is not that we are all bad people ranting each other, but because it is not easy to set up an efficient BG when you have less population (fact) and less performing classes in zerg fights (another fact). And when the BG is not efficient, and never been efficient for days, and you already know this even before joining, there is an high probability that it won't go anywhere, and people will leave or stay afk and not follow leader.
The evidence is that the most famous BG leader of this server has come to Mid, succesfully taken 1 relic against no defense, succesfully taken 1 keep (ONE keep), and left Mid after 3 days. So why there should be a leadership issue if even the best leader of the server was beaten by the hardships of leading a BG in Mid?
I just believe that the causes are others, and the lack of leadership is just a symptom of them.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:10 AM by swap89

Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 9:44 AM
gotwqqd wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 9:17 AM
Didn’t they just close two threads about this because they go nowhere?

They went nowhere because some funny hibs succesfully distracted the topics trolling everyone, and getting hurt when people argued back . Probably this post will have the same fate...

Anyway, trying to keep it positive: Yeah Mid lacks leadership, that's for sure, but the cause is not that we are all bad people ranting each other, but because it is not easy to set up an efficient BG when you have less population (fact) and less performing classes in zerg fights (another fact). And when the BG is not efficient, and never been efficient for days, and you already know this even before joining, there is an high probability that it won't go anywhere, and people will leave or stay afk and not follow leader.
The evidence is that the most famous BG leader of this server has come to Mid, succesfully taken 1 relic against no defense, succesfully taken 1 keep (ONE keep), and left Mid after 3 days. So why there should be a leadership issue if even the best leader of the server was beaten by the hardships of leading a BG in Mid?
I just believe that the causes are others, and the lack of leadership is just a symptom of them.

relic taken with bg hib up. You know if you adopt the right strategy you can manage to take a keep and make sure that the defenses are minimal at least at the beginning.
the keeps taken are many more. I don't know how long midgard didn't have the blue border and two keep a hib with open teleports.
You used to cry about classes. You have cast, gt, pbaoe etc ect but you all like to use the single-button zerk.
in the 4 days at midgard I have never seen a gtaoe use. Maybe only 1 runemaster but I don't remember the name.
I have never seen the walls supprese. People sleeping in front of the walls under fire from enemy rangers and casters.
You have 3 climber classes and on the walls there are never if not 2-3 heroes who die after a short while.
Moreover I remind you if you forgot, that the lord of the aailinne was reset to 25%, and after 2 hours the lord of the scathaig was reset to 5% ... the relics taken if people learned to play could be 2-3.
In the sentence that I have highlighted you speak as if that were easy ....... I wonder, if so ... why do you NEVER do it?

BYE BYE

smap

Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:27 AM by Valaraukar

swap89 wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:10 AM
....
In the sentence that I have highlighted you speak as if that were easy ....... I wonder, if so ... why do you NEVER do it?

BYE BYE

smap

Maybe because when we try to do it we have to face your BG with 100ppl, and when you and Pilz were on Mid of course that was not possibile, unless you have the gift of ubiquity?

Regarding classes.. again and again: sure that Mid has Pbaoe and Gtaoe like other realms, BUT (and this is the point that you don't want to understand at all) the caster toons of mids SUCKS compared to Hibs (especially) and Albs, and that's why NO ONE WANTS TO PLAY THEM.

Then you talk about climbers: to have climbers suppressing walls you need a lot of HEALS. You know which class can heal on Mid? ONLY ONE AND WITH ONLY ONE SPEC: Mending/Aug Healer. Try to play one of it in a BG and tell me how much fun you'll have. Then try to play a Pac Healer in BG and see that there is even a lot less fun!

Now please Smap, at least you: don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to diminish your work or Pilz. I really appreciate good BG leaders, seen many in my Daoc carreer and I've always thought that it is the hardest part of the game. But you make it too easy, trust me. There are issues rooted so deep in this situation and if they are not addressed correctly they will cause great pain to this server. And a simple bonus to the underdog realm IS NOT GOING TO SOLVE THEM.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:34 AM by Lokkjim

swap89 wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:10 AM
relic taken with bg hib up. You know if you adopt the right strategy you can manage to take a keep and make sure that the defenses are minimal at least at the beginning.
the keeps taken are many more. I don't know how long midgard didn't have the blue border and two keep a hib with open teleports.
You used to cry about classes. You have cast, gt, pbaoe etc ect but you all like to use the single-button zerk.
in the 4 days at midgard I have never seen a gtaoe use. Maybe only 1 runemaster but I don't remember the name.
I have never seen the walls supprese. People sleeping in front of the walls under fire from enemy rangers and casters.
You have 3 climber classes and on the walls there are never if not 2-3 heroes who die after a short while.
Moreover I remind you if you forgot, that the lord of the aailinne was reset to 25%, and after 2 hours the lord of the scathaig was reset to 5% ... the relics taken if people learned to play could be 2-3.
In the sentence that I have highlighted you speak as if that were easy ....... I wonder, if so ... why do you NEVER do it?

BYE BYE

smap

To be fair, there is a point where there is too much AoE to take a keep. AoE damage needs to be limited in keep battles or something. Even if the attacking zerg has more AoE, they don't have the space that a keep affords the defenders. I'm not saying we should make it easy for attackers to take a keep, but we should make it about more than just an AoE battle.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:37 AM by swap89

Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:27 AM
swap89 wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:10 AM
....
In the sentence that I have highlighted you speak as if that were easy ....... I wonder, if so ... why do you NEVER do it?

BYE BYE

smap

Maybe because when we try to do it we have to face your BG with 100ppl, and when you and Pilz were on Mid of course that was not possibile, unless you have the gift of ubiquity?

Regarding classes.. again and again: sure that Mid has Pbaoe and Gtaoe like other realms, BUT (and this is the point that you don't want to understand at all) the caster toons of mids SUCKS compared to Hibs (especially) and Albs, and that's why NO ONE WANTS TO PLAY THEM.

Then you talk about climbers: to have climbers suppressing walls you need a lot of HEALS. You know which class can heal on Mid? ONLY ONE AND WITH ONLY ONE SPEC: Mending/Aug Healer. Try to play one of it in a BG and tell me how much fun you'll have. Then try to play a Pac Healer in BG and see that there is even a lot less fun!

Now please Smap, at least you: don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to diminish your work or Pilz. I really appreciate good BG leaders, seen many in my Daoc carreer and I've always thought that it is the hardest part of the game. But you make it too easy, trust me. There are issues rooted so deep in this situation and if they are not addressed correctly they will cause great pain to this server. And a simple bonus to the underdog realm IS NOT GOING TO SOLVE THEM.

the daoc classes have been the same for 20 years.
On the live I was playing midgard and the bg mid was very strong.
so what's the problem? ...

Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:40 AM by swap89

Lokkjim wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:34 AM
swap89 wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:10 AM
relic taken with bg hib up. You know if you adopt the right strategy you can manage to take a keep and make sure that the defenses are minimal at least at the beginning.
the keeps taken are many more. I don't know how long midgard didn't have the blue border and two keep a hib with open teleports.
You used to cry about classes. You have cast, gt, pbaoe etc ect but you all like to use the single-button zerk.
in the 4 days at midgard I have never seen a gtaoe use. Maybe only 1 runemaster but I don't remember the name.
I have never seen the walls supprese. People sleeping in front of the walls under fire from enemy rangers and casters.
You have 3 climber classes and on the walls there are never if not 2-3 heroes who die after a short while.
Moreover I remind you if you forgot, that the lord of the aailinne was reset to 25%, and after 2 hours the lord of the scathaig was reset to 5% ... the relics taken if people learned to play could be 2-3.
In the sentence that I have highlighted you speak as if that were easy ....... I wonder, if so ... why do you NEVER do it?

BYE BYE

smap

To be fair, there is a point where there is too much AoE to take a keep. AoE damage needs to be limited in keep battles or something. Even if the attacking zerg has more AoE, they don't have the space that a keep affords the defenders. I'm not saying we should make it easy for attackers to take a keep, but we should make it about more than just an AoE battle.

What the fuck did I just read?
we have to limit the aoe because you are not able to find a remedy? ... and why play only the fucking monotasto zerk?
I can not stop laughing

Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:44 AM by swap89

Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:27 AM
swap89 wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:10 AM
....
In the sentence that I have highlighted you speak as if that were easy ....... I wonder, if so ... why do you NEVER do it?

BYE BYE

smap

Maybe because when we try to do it we have to face your BG with 100ppl, and when you and Pilz were on Mid of course that was not possibile, unless you have the gift of ubiquity?

Regarding classes.. again and again: sure that Mid has Pbaoe and Gtaoe like other realms, BUT (and this is the point that you don't want to understand at all) the caster toons of mids SUCKS compared to Hibs (especially) and Albs, and that's why NO ONE WANTS TO PLAY THEM.

Then you talk about climbers: to have climbers suppressing walls you need a lot of HEALS. You know which class can heal on Mid? ONLY ONE AND WITH ONLY ONE SPEC: Mending/Aug Healer. Try to play one of it in a BG and tell me how much fun you'll have. Then try to play a Pac Healer in BG and see that there is even a lot less fun!

Now please Smap, at least you: don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to diminish your work or Pilz. I really appreciate good BG leaders, seen many in my Daoc carreer and I've always thought that it is the hardest part of the game. But you make it too easy, trust me. There are issues rooted so deep in this situation and if they are not addressed correctly they will cause great pain to this server. And a simple bonus to the underdog realm IS NOT GOING TO SOLVE THEM.

i play eld void...rm rc is the same i think...bolt,gt,aoe damage,debuff...i dont understand why u dont play it.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:51 AM by Lokkjim

swap89 wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:40 AM
What the fuck did I just read?
we have to limit the aoe because you are not able to find a remedy? ... and why play only the fucking monotasto zerk?
I can not stop laughing

Let's assume you are right and that I only play in a one-trick type of zerg. I never said we HAD to limit the AoE, that's why I put "or something." Now, how about you stop assuming that my post was only directed at hibs or gms or whatever you think and see that I was saying a workaround for the AoE needs to be found, whether that's by albs/hibs/mids or gms or whatever. I'm not posting because I expect people to follow my words to the letter, I'm trying to contribute to a topic I have interest in. Thank you.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 11:36 AM by Valaraukar

swap89 wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:44 AM
...
i play eld void...rm rc is the same i think...bolt,gt,aoe damage,debuff...i dont understand why u dont play it.

The same but for the baseline single stun that lets your AoE train focus on one target because you stun it and keep it as target and cast on it. To do the same a RM must be in assist with a Healer and I can assure you that healers have many other things to do in a zerg fight rather than stunning ppl on the walls, and if they ever have time to stun them they will not able to do it anyway BECAUSE THEY GET INTERRUPTED BY ENEMY AOEs if they get in range for the stun, lacking quickcast, you know.

As I've already said before... healer CCs are awesome, AoE stun is awesome, but healers get interrupted by everything, also by the grey cat pets, and usually in a keep fight they are burning their mana to keep everyone alive, while your casters have 2 things to do: stun - aoe. Change target, stun - aoe. And so on.

Is it clear enough now?

Thu 20 Aug 2020 11:43 AM by Forlornhope

The pach can always stay at 2k range and amnesia casters who come into los. There's always a counter to everything, that would also keep them out of gtaoe range. But really, it generally comes down to numbers a lot more often than not. Or superior coordination, which is why polemo's BGs do as well and more often better than Pilz's. They have 60+ people in discord actually communicating with each other.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 12:06 PM by Valaraukar

Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 11:43 AM
The pach can always stay at 2k range and amnesia casters who come into los. There's always a counter to everything, that would also keep them out of gtaoe range. But really, it generally comes down to numbers a lot more often than not. Or superior coordination, which is why polemo's BGs do as well and more often better than Pilz's. They have 60+ people in discord actually communicating with each other.

Also the mending/aug healer can stay at 2.3k range and use Amnesia aoe, it's a baseline pacification spell.. BUT: if you spam it to interrupt casters you burn your mana and you won't heal, and for sure won't stun or mezz anyone from that range. If you have climbers on wall you cannot do it because they will be too far to heal and die in 5 seconds, so you have to stay BELOW the walls, out of LOS hoping that no one placed a GTAOE or catapult on your position and heal as a madman.

You see, 1 class in Mid must do alone what in other realms can be done by many ppl. Heal, interrupt, cc. One class, the most difficult to play and so one of the least played, especially in a zerg where you really have NO FUN at all as a Pac Healer, and just a bit more as a Mend Healer since you just spam Spreadheal and hope your mana will be enough to keep everyone alive.

That's why a bunch of hib casters in a keep can defend it forever against an entire Mid BG, unless we use a catapult for each which becomes a totally different game, not Daoc, maybe a Total War one. And if I want to have fun firing a catapult believe me I'll play on Total War, not on Daoc.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 12:51 PM by Wakefield

As an augh I can back this one up.

That's why you see a LOT of groups in the zerg with 1 healer, sometimes not even a shaman as they are dull to play for a LOT of people.

I like mine a lot, but after you run in a bg group with only one healer and no secondary, it gets boring fast and I just log a pve toon or boot up the PS4.

That's mids problem and has been since day 1 on this server. Not enough healers but 10000 bds, zerks and the like.

You cannot force anyone to play support, but as a player who's main is augh, it's frustrating but understandable.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 1:04 PM by DinoTriz

Wakefield wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 12:51 PM
As an augh I can back this one up.

That's why you see a LOT of groups in the zerg with 1 healer, sometimes not even a shaman as they are dull to play for a LOT of people.

I like mine a lot, but after you run in a bg group with only one healer and no secondary, it gets boring fast and I just log a pve toon or boot up the PS4.

That's mids problem and has been since day 1 on this server. Not enough healers but 10000 bds, zerks and the like.

You cannot force anyone to play support, but as a player who's main is augh, it's frustrating but understandable.

I've noticed this too. Another strange thing, Shamans are usually always near the top in /serverinfo, but seem to be rare in RVR or at least BGs.

The Healer is a weird class and isn't exactly welcoming to new players. You're responsible for healing, buffing, AND crowd control?? And no offensive abilities to help me level solo (if needed).

Granted, you could definitely argue the same about the other healers in Alb and Hib, but to me at least, the Healer just seems like a pain.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 1:44 PM by Wakefield

DinoTriz wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 1:04 PM
Wakefield wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 12:51 PM
As an augh I can back this one up.

That's why you see a LOT of groups in the zerg with 1 healer, sometimes not even a shaman as they are dull to play for a LOT of people.

I like mine a lot, but after you run in a bg group with only one healer and no secondary, it gets boring fast and I just log a pve toon or boot up the PS4.

That's mids problem and has been since day 1 on this server. Not enough healers but 10000 bds, zerks and the like.

You cannot force anyone to play support, but as a player who's main is augh, it's frustrating but understandable.

I've noticed this too. Another strange thing, Shamans are usually always near the top in /serverinfo, but seem to be rare in RVR or at least BGs.

The Healer is a weird class and isn't exactly welcoming to new players. You're responsible for healing, buffing, AND crowd control?? And no offensive abilities to help me level solo (if needed).

Granted, you could definitely argue the same about the other healers in Alb and Hib, but to me at least, the Healer just seems like a pain.

Cave sham are everywhere for farming tons. I have 2 cave and aug/mend, ( gonna roll a third so I can respect my main alt back to rvr spec and use the third alt for DS.)

I have 2 healers(pac and augh) with a tri spec in the works. So literally most of my char slots over 3 pages are support so I can switch when the group needs it.

Just a shame noone wants to play them. I'm frustrated to the point I refuse to play as a solo healer

Thu 20 Aug 2020 2:07 PM by Noashakra

Did you play druid in Zerg? How is it more fun than the healer? And cleric, they have even less tools.. How is this even an argument?

It's the same for every Zerg. Lack of bards and druids in the bg all the time.

The healer is actually the funniest of the 3 to play btw.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 2:12 PM by Wakefield

No, no they are not.

Augh is the worst. I know, my main on uth was a cleric and one of my mains on one of the classic server was a druid.

I still say aug healer is the dullest

Thu 20 Aug 2020 2:15 PM by Spiegal

swap89 wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:10 AM
i play eld void...rm rc is the same i think...bolt,gt,aoe damage,debuff...i don't understand why u dont play it.

That's not the same at all, it's the Enchanter that provide the needed heat debuff, not Eld.
In the meantime, Eld can spec in light and mana spec which is way more appealing.

When you look at the mage in Mid, it's just not that appealing vs what others can offer in Daoc. Kinda like a tasteless classes.
We don't have charm classes, our pets are nerfed, spec lines that isn't appealing. Vikings are just way more appealing, which is not the best as it stand on this server.

But yes we do need more support, that is a problem. You can't force people to play classes that they don't want to, it's just that simple.

Can we stop with the Missing lead and toxic realm BS post, people are great in Mid and so are leaders, we just get farm for keep wars and get tired of that.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 2:17 PM by Sepplord

Wakefield wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 2:12 PM
No, no they are not.

Augh is the worst. I know, my main on uth was a cleric and one of my mains on one of the classic server was a druid.

I still say aug healer is the dullest

why though?
I have a hard time understanding why AugH would be duller (more dull?) than a cleric?

The argument that healers can't stun as nice as hibcasters because they are occupied healing and need to stay out of LOS makes sense.
The argument that ALB/HIB-healers are more intresting to play in Zergfights doesn't

Thu 20 Aug 2020 2:20 PM by Wakefield

Clerics get smite. Was fun being a ma on uth in a caster group keep defence, holding off a mid groups

When the smite was going off, people knew the target was stunned.

Good times.

But that was OF, nf is different kettle of fish I guess.

I miss my cleric

Thu 20 Aug 2020 2:50 PM by thirian24

Here is a thought, stop beating on doors, take an 8man grp, roam around and participate in open field rvr.

Then you dont have to worry about why such and such class/realm is at a disadvantage in keep zerg door battles.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 2:53 PM by Wakefield

That's the whole point of these forums.

Hibs like to zerg up, mid doesnt.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 3:55 PM by Stoertebecker

thirian24 wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 2:50 PM
Here is a thought, stop beating on doors, take an 8man grp, roam around and participate in open field rvr.

Then you dont have to worry about why such and such class/realm is at a disadvantage in keep zerg door battles.

Concept of DAoC is large scale battles, not only 8v8 arena style.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 4:19 PM by joshisanonymous

Zod7120 wrote: ↑
Wed 19 Aug 2020 6:28 PM
If you've ever seen the inside of a slaughterhouse, that's what a Midgard BG looks like. Simple, efficient execution, served up RP rich. Hib takes Bled and Nott keep/towers in off hours and leaves everything else. Despite having only a single relic, Midgard BG get directed at these objectives. Once the flame is lit and numbers are known, Hib ports in and AJ's. Midgard BG then rally's and does the same thing, again!?! This is due to sycophantic, capitulating BG leaders who would rather do something safe versus do something innovative and defend their decision. Vanity is a four letter word and people should get their self-esteem elsewhere. Hib leadership fails to innovate because why would they, Midgard is trained and ready to farm, slaughterhouse style.

Once a keep/tower is owned, no matter what realm it's in, it belongs to that realm. Stubborn pride to control your realm is egoism. No amount of RP bonus is going to make people feel good about that.

Back on topic... This leaves me wondering what you think would be different about going for some other target? If Mid attacked anything in Hibland, Hib would still get a count, then port and AJ. What you're describing has nothing to do with which Hib controlled keeps/towers Mid attacks. If Mid just ignored Hib and didn't try to retake their realm, it would end up entirely green in short order. Alternatively, Mid could attack Alb, but for what gain? Just to piss them off and end up with both realms attacking Mid?

There are very few profitable strategies in the current situation. Hib has numbers, relic bonuses, and more consistent leadership.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 4:33 PM by Forlornhope

Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 12:06 PM
Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 11:43 AM
The pach can always stay at 2k range and amnesia casters who come into los. There's always a counter to everything, that would also keep them out of gtaoe range. But really, it generally comes down to numbers a lot more often than not. Or superior coordination, which is why polemo's BGs do as well and more often better than Pilz's. They have 60+ people in discord actually communicating with each other.

Also the mending/aug healer can stay at 2.3k range and use Amnesia aoe, it's a baseline pacification spell.. BUT: if you spam it to interrupt casters you burn your mana and you won't heal, and for sure won't stun or mezz anyone from that range. If you have climbers on wall you cannot do it because they will be too far to heal and die in 5 seconds, so you have to stay BELOW the walls, out of LOS hoping that no one placed a GTAOE or catapult on your position and heal as a madman.

You see, 1 class in Mid must do alone what in other realms can be done by many ppl. Heal, interrupt, cc. One class, the most difficult to play and so one of the least played, especially in a zerg where you really have NO FUN at all as a Pac Healer, and just a bit more as a Mend Healer since you just spam Spreadheal and hope your mana will be enough to keep everyone alive.

That's why a bunch of hib casters in a keep can defend it forever against an entire Mid BG, unless we use a catapult for each which becomes a totally different game, not Daoc, maybe a Total War one. And if I want to have fun firing a catapult believe me I'll play on Total War, not on Daoc.

Yep, I am aware of how the healer classes work. I've got one of each on this server at 50 and have played them all at length. That's why I said the pach healer should rupt specifically, leaving the augh free to heal. And before you say most groups don't run with both, they have one or the other, there are more than likely four or five groups who DO have both. This is obviously a tactic for one of those groups who actually have a group set up. If your mend healers are just sitting there spamming spreadheal and not using proper rotations of MCL/power pot/legion chunk, that's not a class balance issue so don't make it one. That's more of a player not knowing what they're doing. If your climbers are staying up there trying to harass well dug in groups with good heals, then they're not doing that right either. I've been defending on either my cleric or druid during NA prime last year when there was the 80 man mid zerg running nightly, if they're led right and have even halfway decent coordination not only can mid take keeps, they can excel at it. I've also been in mid zergs on my augh and have seen them be very successful. You mention that there's a good counter to the hib casters defending keeps in catapults, but don't want to use them because it "becomes a totally different game".. well again that's why you're failing, and also an issue with leadership and the players in the bg not a class balance issue these threads always evolve into. You have the tools but you just refuse to use them or change your tactics.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 7:53 PM by ExcretusMaximus

Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 3:55 PM
Concept of DAoC is large scale battles, not only 8v8 arena style.

People keep saying that, yet the devs have stated multiple times that they balance around group fights, not solo or zerg.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 8:14 PM by Freedomcall

thirian24 wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 2:50 PM
Here is a thought, stop beating on doors, take an 8man grp, roam around and participate in open field rvr.

Then you dont have to worry about why such and such class/realm is at a disadvantage in keep zerg door battles.

Your comment is true until 1 realm monopolizes 6 relics and benefit 10% melee + 10% spell bonuses alone.

This is the reason why 8man/smallman/solo aspects can't be totally separated from "zerg door battles" in this game.

I don't think specific realm is seriously disadvantageous on current zerg fights though...

Thu 20 Aug 2020 8:57 PM by Adwaenyth

About Midgard lacking Healers in Zerg RvR I can only say that healing classes will inherently be lacking ANYWHERE in the game.

It's a simple calculation: To be effective as a healing team you need at least 2 main healers and 1 other support. That doesn't matter if it's 2 Healers, 2 Clerics or 2 Druids. Mids will need a shaman, Hibs will need a bard for the other sups, Albs are somewhat a little different in that a friar isn't mandatory.

A group consists of 8 players.

If 2 of these 8 need to main healers, at least 25% of the realm population would need to be main healers. However, Mid has 12 classes, Hib has 13 and Alb has 14.

Now tell me which realm has 25% population of main healers (or if you count the at least necessary 3rd support slot - 37.5% supporters) online in total.

Atm there are:

53 Clerics / 446 Albs (11.9%)
41 Druids / 398 Hibs (10.3%)
47 Healers / 371 Mids (12.7%)

The total amount of primary healers is almost equally "bad" (acutally they are some of the most played classes because they are so dearly needed) among the realms for any kind of RvR situation. So it's not that there is a special lack of Healers in Midgard, the lack is global due to having up to 14 different classes but needing at least 2 of the same in any 8 man group. All are equally uninteresting to play in Zerg RvR usually.

Thu 20 Aug 2020 10:26 PM by Stoertebecker

ExcretusMaximus wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 7:53 PM
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 3:55 PM
Concept of DAoC is large scale battles, not only 8v8 arena style.

People keep saying that, yet the devs have stated multiple times that they balance around group fights, not solo or zerg.

Maybe here on Phoenix.

There are some streams from CU around where exactly this *problemtic* was on the table.
And someone who should know how they`re going to balance things said * We`re following the same way like it was done in DAoC.
Realm>Group>Solo
It will be possible to solo, Groups/Warbands are a important aspect, but the focus is on Big Battles, realmwise.
Thats the concept, what players do with it is another thing.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 5:54 AM by Noashakra

Smite is crap and is you are the only healer you can't do it either.
Same it's worst for druid (and even worst again for a druid buff) what can he do?

If the cleric can smite how are you not able to interrupt? You complained about QC, but the cleric doesn't have one either. It makes no sense

You speak about problems that are the same for all the realms to justify your bg problems.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 6:04 AM by Spiegal

Adwaenyth wrote: ↑
Thu 20 Aug 2020 8:57 PM
About Midgard lacking Healers in Zerg RvR I can only say that healing classes will inherently be lacking ANYWHERE in the game.

It's a simple calculation: To be effective as a healing team you need at least 2 main healers and 1 other support. That doesn't matter if it's 2 Healers, 2 Clerics or 2 Druids. Mids will need a shaman, Hibs will need a bard for the other sups, Albs are somewhat a little different in that a friar isn't mandatory.

A group consists of 8 players.

If 2 of these 8 need to main healers, at least 25% of the realm population would need to be main healers. However, Mid has 12 classes, Hib has 13 and Alb has 14.

Now tell me which realm has 25% population of main healers (or if you count the at least necessary 3rd support slot - 37.5% supporters) online in total.

Atm there are:
53 Clerics / 446 Albs (11.9%)
41 Druids / 398 Hibs (10.3%)
47 Healers / 371 Mids (12.7%)

The total amount of primary healers is almost equally "bad" (actually they are some of the most played classes because they are so dearly needed) among the realms for any kind of RvR situation. So it's not that there is a special lack of Healers in Midgard, the lack is global due to having up to 14 different classes but needing at least 2 of the same in any 8 man group. All are equally uninteresting to play in Zerg RvR usually.

Although your original approach was ok, your reasoning do not quite reflect the reality of a zerg.
In a zerg situation, some group will have the perfect setup but some others will need to fill with what they can. Now here's the big difference for Hyb:
They got 4 classes that can do healing : Bard, druid, Mentalist, warden. I'm not saying those classes replace druids, but a heal is a heal.
So they are more flexible for the group composition than mid.

But you are right for the lack of appeal for healers in general to play in zerg.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 6:12 AM by Noashakra

This is actually a good point. Warden has decent heals. Can't say the same for bard that is oom in 5 casts and the mentalist with his 200 heal.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 7:19 AM by Sepplord

Noashakra wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 5:54 AM
Smite is crap and is you are the only healer you can't do it either.
Same it's worst for druid (and even worst again for a druid buff) what can he do?

If the cleric can smite how are you not able to interrupt? You complained about QC, but the cleric doesn't have one either. It makes no sense

You speak about problems that are the same for all the realms to justify your bg problems.

i believe you are mixing up arguments now, smite was brought up as reason to my question why healer is less intresting to play.
It makes sense, because when there is downtime and your side is winning the fight you can stunnuke people, which is fun. While as healer you basically do nothing or chase people autoattacking when your realm is dominating the fight

Fri 21 Aug 2020 7:39 AM by Astaa

I love defending keeps against midgard as a ranger, virtually no ranged attackers and no GTAOE to worry about, shooting fish in a barrel. Defending vs alb is a pain.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 8:28 AM by Valaraukar

Noashakra wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 5:54 AM
Smite is crap and is you are the only healer you can't do it either.
Same it's worst for druid (and even worst again for a druid buff) what can he do?

If the cleric can smite how are you not able to interrupt? You complained about QC, but the cleric doesn't have one either. It makes no sense

You speak about problems that are the same for all the realms to justify your bg problems.

And here we are again.... mixing up arguments and trolling people to distract from the topic.

What is that you don't you understand about: "Mid have only ONE class with CC and Interrupt, and it's the Healer that, of course, must HEAL and DOES NOT HAVE QC to interrupt or mezz/stun enemies on a wall, where you cannot take a position because you can only stay at range down and hope to get someone on the wall and not get interrupted"?. See now the difference with Sorcerer mezz (QC and range) or all Hibs casters with stun (QC)?
Of course you see it but you don't care at all, and you randomly change subject because the only goal for you is to post here trolling people and try to have the topic closed as the other two, so your fantastic and full of great people and BG leaders realm can keep all the relics forever. I really don't know why I'm wasting my time talking with you again....

Fri 21 Aug 2020 9:05 AM by Vkejai

Worth noting the realm with the least amount of PvE raids per week has a better chance of getting a good BG size. Always seems to be PvE raids happening in MId and Alb .

Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:02 AM by Valaraukar

Vkejai wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 9:05 AM
Worth noting the realm with the least amount of PvE raids per week has a better chance of getting a good BG size. Always seems to be PvE raids happening in MId and Alb .

Totally agree, this is a big part of the whole issue, and is well exploited by Hib who take relics when there are such raids. I do not mean to criticize it, it's just a fact and of course the most natural way to do it, no defense, just go to the keep and bye bye.
Another part of the issue is that an usual raid on Mid (with 60-80ppl in it) lasts 2 hrs while in other realms with the same amount of ppl lasts 1 hr... BUT it's ok, we do not have a class unbalance here you know

Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:02 AM by Forlornhope

Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 8:28 AM
Noashakra wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 5:54 AM
Smite is crap and is you are the only healer you can't do it either.
Same it's worst for druid (and even worst again for a druid buff) what can he do?

If the cleric can smite how are you not able to interrupt? You complained about QC, but the cleric doesn't have one either. It makes no sense

You speak about problems that are the same for all the realms to justify your bg problems.

And here we are again.... mixing up arguments and trolling people to distract from the topic.

What is that you don't you understand about: "Mid have only ONE class with CC and Interrupt, and it's the Healer that, of course, must HEAL and DOES NOT HAVE QC to interrupt or mezz/stun enemies on a wall, where you cannot take a position because you can only stay at range down and hope to get someone on the wall and not get interrupted"?. See now the difference with Sorcerer mezz (QC and range) or all Hibs casters with stun (QC)?
Of course you see it but you don't care at all, and you randomly change subject because the only goal for you is to post here trolling people and try to have the topic closed as the other two, so your fantastic and full of great people and BG leaders realm can keep all the relics forever. I really don't know why I'm wasting my time talking with you again....

Dude a shaman's job is literally to interrupt, there are plenty of other classes that are regularly in a mid bg that can and should be interrupting if you do not have both an aug healer and a pac healer in your group. Every shaman should have moc, and be able to purge a stun if they quick cast it. Or here's another thought, have the healer stand out of cast range with catapults. They can still heal while using one and have the added benefit of being able to toss an amnesia out there as well. You're severely limiting yourself and what you can do in a bg and it's really obvious as to why you're not successful.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:19 AM by Valaraukar

Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:02 AM
Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 8:28 AM
Noashakra wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 5:54 AM
Smite is crap and is you are the only healer you can't do it either.
Same it's worst for druid (and even worst again for a druid buff) what can he do?

If the cleric can smite how are you not able to interrupt? You complained about QC, but the cleric doesn't have one either. It makes no sense

You speak about problems that are the same for all the realms to justify your bg problems.

And here we are again.... mixing up arguments and trolling people to distract from the topic.

What is that you don't you understand about: "Mid have only ONE class with CC and Interrupt, and it's the Healer that, of course, must HEAL and DOES NOT HAVE QC to interrupt or mezz/stun enemies on a wall, where you cannot take a position because you can only stay at range down and hope to get someone on the wall and not get interrupted"?. See now the difference with Sorcerer mezz (QC and range) or all Hibs casters with stun (QC)?
Of course you see it but you don't care at all, and you randomly change subject because the only goal for you is to post here trolling people and try to have the topic closed as the other two, so your fantastic and full of great people and BG leaders realm can keep all the relics forever. I really don't know why I'm wasting my time talking with you again....
Dude a shaman's job is literally to interrupt, there are plenty of other classes that are regularly in a mid bg that can and should be interrupting if you do not have both an aug healer and a pac healer in your group.

Another class with no QC interrupting casters with CC and Quickcast... you know, if a shaman stays in range below the walls to cast aoe dots will last, maybe, for 1 cast then die miserably stunned debuffed and focused. And RIP to the other groupmates buffs, and then wait for sickness if you don't PR him, and so on. Another interrupter in mid please? The Bonedancer? Yeah it was the BEST one, for sure, and then they nerfed the Lifetap recast to SIX seconds, Six seconds mean 3 cast from a decently templated lurikeen. Another interrupter? Thanes: yeah great ones indeed, with lots of HPs, determination, and a 3.5 secs aoe cast that can be interrupted by anyone at anytime since it is so slow to cast, and trust me I have a Frostalf thane with aug dex and mota and it's still hard to cast hammers, imagine what a Troll thane could do (yes there are also troll thanes running with bg).

I'm not saying that is impossibile, mind it, I'm just saying (and have always been saying so) that for Mid is more difficult, since it's a melee realm, to counter casters like Hibs and Albs in big zerg fight, especially in keeps, in this server. This is what I call class unbalance, not saying that Mid is the poor baby bullied by great Hibs and Albs, but that something should be done to get zerg fights more even between the 3 realms, and the last months clearly show that Hibs has a huge advantage in them, apart from the leadership issue, which is a part of the problem but not the root cause of this situation.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:23 AM by Forlornhope

Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:19 AM
Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:02 AM
Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 8:28 AM
Noashakra wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 5:54 AM
Smite is crap and is you are the only healer you can't do it either.
Same it's worst for druid (and even worst again for a druid buff) what can he do?

If the cleric can smite how are you not able to interrupt? You complained about QC, but the cleric doesn't have one either. It makes no sense

You speak about problems that are the same for all the realms to justify your bg problems.

And here we are again.... mixing up arguments and trolling people to distract from the topic.

What is that you don't you understand about: "Mid have only ONE class with CC and Interrupt, and it's the Healer that, of course, must HEAL and DOES NOT HAVE QC to interrupt or mezz/stun enemies on a wall, where you cannot take a position because you can only stay at range down and hope to get someone on the wall and not get interrupted"?. See now the difference with Sorcerer mezz (QC and range) or all Hibs casters with stun (QC)?
Of course you see it but you don't care at all, and you randomly change subject because the only goal for you is to post here trolling people and try to have the topic closed as the other two, so your fantastic and full of great people and BG leaders realm can keep all the relics forever. I really don't know why I'm wasting my time talking with you again....
Dude a shaman's job is literally to interrupt, there are plenty of other classes that are regularly in a mid bg that can and should be interrupting if you do not have both an aug healer and a pac healer in your group.

Another class with no QC interrupting casters with CC and Quickcast... you know, if a shaman stays in range below the walls to cast aoe dots will last, maybe, for 1 cast then die miserably stunned debuffed and focused. And RIP to the other groupmates buffs, and then wait for sickness if you don't PR him, and so on. Another interrupter in mid please? The Bonedancer? Yeah it was the BEST one, for sure, and then they nerfed the Lifetap recast to SIX seconds, Six seconds mean 3 cast from a decently templated lurikeen. Another interrupter? Thanes: yeah great ones indeed, with lots of HPs, determination, and a 3.5 secs aoe cast that can be interrupted by anyone at anytime since it is so slow to cast, and trust me I have a Frostalf thane with aug dex and moa and it's still hard to cast hammers, imagine what a Troll thane could do (yes there are also troll thanes running with bg).

I'm not saying that is impossibile, mind it, I'm just saying (and have always been saying so) that for Mid is more difficult, since it's a melee realm, to counter casters like Hibs and Albs in big zerg fight, especially in keeps, in this server. This is what I call class unbalance, not saying that Mid is the poor baby bullied by great Hibs and Albs, but that something should be done to get zerg fights more even between the 3 realms, and the last months clearly show that Hibs has a huge advantage in them, apart from the leadership issue, which is a part of the problem but not the root cause of this situation.

Every shaman should have moc and be abe to purge a stun and they're not the only class regularly in a bg who can and should be interrupting walls. Or here's another thought, have the healer stand out of cast range with catapults. They can still heal while using one and have the added benefit of being able to toss an amnesia out there as well. But you stated in a previous post that you don't like using catapults because it feels like a different game. You're severely limiting yourself and what you can do in a bg and it's really obvious as to why you're not successful.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:27 AM by Valaraukar

Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:23 AM
Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:19 AM
Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:02 AM
Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 8:28 AM
Noashakra wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 5:54 AM
Smite is crap and is you are the only healer you can't do it either.
Same it's worst for druid (and even worst again for a druid buff) what can he do?

If the cleric can smite how are you not able to interrupt? You complained about QC, but the cleric doesn't have one either. It makes no sense

You speak about problems that are the same for all the realms to justify your bg problems.

And here we are again.... mixing up arguments and trolling people to distract from the topic.

What is that you don't you understand about: "Mid have only ONE class with CC and Interrupt, and it's the Healer that, of course, must HEAL and DOES NOT HAVE QC to interrupt or mezz/stun enemies on a wall, where you cannot take a position because you can only stay at range down and hope to get someone on the wall and not get interrupted"?. See now the difference with Sorcerer mezz (QC and range) or all Hibs casters with stun (QC)?
Of course you see it but you don't care at all, and you randomly change subject because the only goal for you is to post here trolling people and try to have the topic closed as the other two, so your fantastic and full of great people and BG leaders realm can keep all the relics forever. I really don't know why I'm wasting my time talking with you again....
Dude a shaman's job is literally to interrupt, there are plenty of other classes that are regularly in a mid bg that can and should be interrupting if you do not have both an aug healer and a pac healer in your group.

Another class with no QC interrupting casters with CC and Quickcast... you know, if a shaman stays in range below the walls to cast aoe dots will last, maybe, for 1 cast then die miserably stunned debuffed and focused. And RIP to the other groupmates buffs, and then wait for sickness if you don't PR him, and so on. Another interrupter in mid please? The Bonedancer? Yeah it was the BEST one, for sure, and then they nerfed the Lifetap recast to SIX seconds, Six seconds mean 3 cast from a decently templated lurikeen. Another interrupter? Thanes: yeah great ones indeed, with lots of HPs, determination, and a 3.5 secs aoe cast that can be interrupted by anyone at anytime since it is so slow to cast, and trust me I have a Frostalf thane with aug dex and moa and it's still hard to cast hammers, imagine what a Troll thane could do (yes there are also troll thanes running with bg).

I'm not saying that is impossibile, mind it, I'm just saying (and have always been saying so) that for Mid is more difficult, since it's a melee realm, to counter casters like Hibs and Albs in big zerg fight, especially in keeps, in this server. This is what I call class unbalance, not saying that Mid is the poor baby bullied by great Hibs and Albs, but that something should be done to get zerg fights more even between the 3 realms, and the last months clearly show that Hibs has a huge advantage in them, apart from the leadership issue, which is a part of the problem but not the root cause of this situation.

Every shaman should have moc and be abe to purge a stun and they're not the only class regularly in a bg who can and should be interrupting walls. Or here's another thought, have the healer stand out of cast range with catapults. They can still heal while using one and have the added benefit of being able to toss an amnesia out there as well. But you stated in a previous post that you don't like using catapults because it feels like a different game. You're severely limiting yourself and what you can do in a bg and it's really obvious as to why you're not successful.

Moc you can use it every 10 mins, like purge unless you are really high RR. So you can suppress wall once in 10 minutes... seems good enough

I'm not limiting me. You are limiting my (my realm) choiches saying use catapults and be happy with it. And it's the same thing that I've said before: Mid can suppress the wall using catapults (the other realms too obviously so it's not a "midgard bonus" having catas), so we should use loads of them. And I just said that IT IS BORING. Don't you agree with me, or you find it funny to wait for a GT, press aim, press fire, press aim, press fire....?

Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:30 AM by Forlornhope

Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:19 AM
Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:02 AM
Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 8:28 AM
Noashakra wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 5:54 AM
Smite is crap and is you are the only healer you can't do it either.
Same it's worst for druid (and even worst again for a druid buff) what can he do?

If the cleric can smite how are you not able to interrupt? You complained about QC, but the cleric doesn't have one either. It makes no sense

You speak about problems that are the same for all the realms to justify your bg problems.

And here we are again.... mixing up arguments and trolling people to distract from the topic.

What is that you don't you understand about: "Mid have only ONE class with CC and Interrupt, and it's the Healer that, of course, must HEAL and DOES NOT HAVE QC to interrupt or mezz/stun enemies on a wall, where you cannot take a position because you can only stay at range down and hope to get someone on the wall and not get interrupted"?. See now the difference with Sorcerer mezz (QC and range) or all Hibs casters with stun (QC)?
Of course you see it but you don't care at all, and you randomly change subject because the only goal for you is to post here trolling people and try to have the topic closed as the other two, so your fantastic and full of great people and BG leaders realm can keep all the relics forever. I really don't know why I'm wasting my time talking with you again....
Dude a shaman's job is literally to interrupt, there are plenty of other classes that are regularly in a mid bg that can and should be interrupting if you do not have both an aug healer and a pac healer in your group.

Another class with no QC interrupting casters with CC and Quickcast... you know, if a shaman stays in range below the walls to cast aoe dots will last, maybe, for 1 cast then die miserably stunned debuffed and focused. And RIP to the other groupmates buffs, and then wait for sickness if you don't PR him, and so on. Another interrupter in mid please? The Bonedancer? Yeah it was the BEST one, for sure, and then they nerfed the Lifetap recast to SIX seconds, Six seconds mean 3 cast from a decently templated lurikeen. Another interrupter? Thanes: yeah great ones indeed, with lots of HPs, determination, and a 3.5 secs aoe cast that can be interrupted by anyone at anytime since it is so slow to cast, and trust me I have a Frostalf thane with aug dex and mota and it's still hard to cast hammers, imagine what a Troll thane could do (yes there are also troll thanes running with bg).

I'm not saying that is impossibile, mind it, I'm just saying (and have always been saying so) that for Mid is more difficult, since it's a melee realm, to counter casters like Hibs and Albs in big zerg fight, especially in keeps, in this server. This is what I call class unbalance, not saying that Mid is the poor baby bullied by great Hibs and Albs, but that something should be done to get zerg fights more even between the 3 realms, and the last months clearly show that Hibs has a huge advantage in them, apart from the leadership issue, which is a part of the problem but not the root cause of this situation.

The classes are there on mid to be able to counter casters on walls, it's not imbalance if people just choose not to play them. Cool, they may have more fun playing a zerker over a runemaster or spiritmasters but that doesn't mean there's an imbalance. All of this comes back to the players, not the realm. The ones who want to play those types of classes aren't on mid because they don't get grouped. Then the people who aren't grouping them are complaining because they have nothing to counter the other realm's casters. On open field, mid is incredibly dominant, which is why the other bg leaders (mostly pilz) avoids those situations. That means you need to adjust your tactics and play more classes that do excel in the situations you find yourselves in the most.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:34 AM by Forlornhope

Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:27 AM
Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:23 AM
Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:19 AM
Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:02 AM
Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 8:28 AM
Noashakra wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 5:54 AM
Smite is crap and is you are the only healer you can't do it either.
Same it's worst for druid (and even worst again for a druid buff) what can he do?

If the cleric can smite how are you not able to interrupt? You complained about QC, but the cleric doesn't have one either. It makes no sense

You speak about problems that are the same for all the realms to justify your bg problems.

And here we are again.... mixing up arguments and trolling people to distract from the topic.

What is that you don't you understand about: "Mid have only ONE class with CC and Interrupt, and it's the Healer that, of course, must HEAL and DOES NOT HAVE QC to interrupt or mezz/stun enemies on a wall, where you cannot take a position because you can only stay at range down and hope to get someone on the wall and not get interrupted"?. See now the difference with Sorcerer mezz (QC and range) or all Hibs casters with stun (QC)?
Of course you see it but you don't care at all, and you randomly change subject because the only goal for you is to post here trolling people and try to have the topic closed as the other two, so your fantastic and full of great people and BG leaders realm can keep all the relics forever. I really don't know why I'm wasting my time talking with you again....
Dude a shaman's job is literally to interrupt, there are plenty of other classes that are regularly in a mid bg that can and should be interrupting if you do not have both an aug healer and a pac healer in your group.

Another class with no QC interrupting casters with CC and Quickcast... you know, if a shaman stays in range below the walls to cast aoe dots will last, maybe, for 1 cast then die miserably stunned debuffed and focused. And RIP to the other groupmates buffs, and then wait for sickness if you don't PR him, and so on. Another interrupter in mid please? The Bonedancer? Yeah it was the BEST one, for sure, and then they nerfed the Lifetap recast to SIX seconds, Six seconds mean 3 cast from a decently templated lurikeen. Another interrupter? Thanes: yeah great ones indeed, with lots of HPs, determination, and a 3.5 secs aoe cast that can be interrupted by anyone at anytime since it is so slow to cast, and trust me I have a Frostalf thane with aug dex and moa and it's still hard to cast hammers, imagine what a Troll thane could do (yes there are also troll thanes running with bg).

I'm not saying that is impossibile, mind it, I'm just saying (and have always been saying so) that for Mid is more difficult, since it's a melee realm, to counter casters like Hibs and Albs in big zerg fight, especially in keeps, in this server. This is what I call class unbalance, not saying that Mid is the poor baby bullied by great Hibs and Albs, but that something should be done to get zerg fights more even between the 3 realms, and the last months clearly show that Hibs has a huge advantage in them, apart from the leadership issue, which is a part of the problem but not the root cause of this situation.

Every shaman should have moc and be abe to purge a stun and they're not the only class regularly in a bg who can and should be interrupting walls. Or here's another thought, have the healer stand out of cast range with catapults. They can still heal while using one and have the added benefit of being able to toss an amnesia out there as well. But you stated in a previous post that you don't like using catapults because it feels like a different game. You're severely limiting yourself and what you can do in a bg and it's really obvious as to why you're not successful.

Moc you can use it every 10 mins, like purge unless you are really high RR. So you can suppress wall once in 10 minutes... seems good enough
I'm not limiting me. You are limiting my (my realm) choiches saying use catapults and be happy with it. And it's the same thing that I've said before: Mid can suppress the wall using catapults (the other realms too obviously so it's not a "midgard bonus" having catas), so we should use loads of them. And I just said that IT IS BORING. Don't you agree with me, or you find it funny to wait for a GT, press aim, press fire, press aim, press fire....?

So, you admit the tools are there but refuse to use them? Then somehow still find a way to say there's imbalance? You realize how little sense that makes right? Have fun with that I guess, you'll continue to see things stay exactly the same as they are. I look forward to seeing more posts complaining about the same stuff lol.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:58 AM by Bobbahunter

To sum it up.

The Melee realm shouldn’t play melee classes because they can’t compete with the caster realm. So the Melee realm should play casters that aren’t as diverse as the casters from the caster realm?

Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:09 AM by Valaraukar

Bobbahunter wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:58 AM
To sum it up.

The Melee realm shouldn’t play melee classes because they can’t compete with the caster realm. So the Melee realm should play casters that aren’t as diverse as the casters from the caster realm?

Or maybe the melee realm should use catapults to counter the casters, and enjoy it because it's a part of the game!

Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:13 AM by Lokkjim

Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:09 AM
Or maybe the melee realm should use catapults to counter the casters, and enjoy it because it's a part of the game!

I can agree that catapults are and should be, part of the game. But I think it would be more interesting if the number of catapults in an area could be limited to a certain amount. But then that would probably hurt Mid, so I dunno. Just my two cents.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:20 AM by Forlornhope

Bobbahunter wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:58 AM
To sum it up.

The Melee realm shouldn’t play melee classes because they can’t compete with the caster realm. So the Melee realm should play casters that aren’t as diverse as the casters from the caster realm?

It's not about them not playing melees, it's about them having more variety in their setups. If a bunch of melee classes are just mindlessly running at walls with not enough support from other things like casters then of course they're not going to have an easy time trying to take a keep when the walls are lined with 100 casters. It's about logic man, there's a reason why midgard isn't just all melees and have casters on their roster. And until you actually change your tactics you're going to keep failing.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:31 AM by Forlornhope

Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:09 AM
Bobbahunter wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:58 AM
To sum it up.

The Melee realm shouldn’t play melee classes because they can’t compete with the caster realm. So the Melee realm should play casters that aren’t as diverse as the casters from the caster realm?

Or maybe the melee realm should use catapults to counter the casters, and enjoy it because it's a part of the game!

You won't run more dedicated interrupt classes, that's fine. But then you won't do the only other thing that can even give you a chance of winning in a keep fight, for basically no reason that makes any sort of sense.. Well, then you shouldn't come onto these forums and complain when you can't win. Maybe this isn't the game for you, but if you insist on not using the tools available to you then I wish you luck. You're going to need it.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:43 AM by Valaraukar

Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:31 AM
Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:09 AM
Bobbahunter wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:58 AM
To sum it up.

The Melee realm shouldn’t play melee classes because they can’t compete with the caster realm. So the Melee realm should play casters that aren’t as diverse as the casters from the caster realm?

Or maybe the melee realm should use catapults to counter the casters, and enjoy it because it's a part of the game!

You won't run more dedicated interrupt classes, that's fine. But then you won't do the only other thing that can even give you a chance of winning in a keep fight, for basically no reason that makes any sort of sense.. Well, then you shouldn't come onto these forums and complain when you can't win. Maybe this isn't the game for you, but if you insist on not using the tools available to you then I wish you luck. You're going to need it.

You didn't answer to me what would be the so needed interrupt classes on Mid, apart of healers. SMs? Interrupt what? Or they spec Pbaoe (and won't interrupt anything) or they Spec Darkness (and have only single target spells, with no BASELINE STUN like yours). RMs? yeah nice the flaming spears falling from the sky are great, then what else? Do you know that the nearsight is in the Suppression spec of the RM, the one with PBT and a ridicolous dps, especially aoe? So all RM in Mid should respec in supp just to be able to nearsight hundreds of casters who, in their turn, can focus only on killing ppl because this server is so caster friendly and Hib is a caster realm?
But really don't you all see this situation here, and keep talking about using casters in Mid?
That implies that yes, this server is caster friendly, and so the realm with the best casters (which is absolutely not MID I'd say, or do you want to contest also this?) has the upper hand, unless something will change in the next future.
And the only thing that seems to be an issue here is that Mid has no leadership.... this is just ridicolous

Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:52 AM by labra

is mid doing well against alb casters since they don't have baseline stun?

Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:55 AM by Valaraukar

labra wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:52 AM
is mid doing well against alb casters since they don't have baseline stun?

no because they have tons of pets (also pets who stun you know) so they can interrupt every support, and they also have a mezz with longer range, quickcast, and on a class who normally have 350dex

ah... and Alb has Necros

Mid casters lack of this all: they lack CC and they lack pets, the ones having pets have been repeatedly nerfed (BD and SM) over the past time

Fri 21 Aug 2020 12:21 PM by Stoertebecker

Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:55 AM
Mid casters lack of this all: they lack CC and they lack pets, the ones having pets have been repeatedly nerfed (BD and SM) over the past time

BD was already nerfed pet wise from day 1.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 12:27 PM by Valaraukar

Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 12:21 PM
Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:55 AM
Mid casters lack of this all: they lack CC and they lack pets, the ones having pets have been repeatedly nerfed (BD and SM) over the past time

BD was already nerfed pet wise from day 1.

I know this quite well... my first char on Phoenix is a BD, the second a Pac Healer

Fri 21 Aug 2020 12:32 PM by labra

I agree about long range mez .

I'm looking at charplan, I didn't play any mid casters (I barely played casters, being more melee fancy).
I see a nearsight and confusion on runemaster on bt spec (suppression) , ae mez, cure mez on spiritmasters, both having qc.
I assume those 2 classes are underplayed?

regarding insta debuff (like ae str/con), do they interrupt?

last question: when taking a tower/keep, do mid insta kill pnj on walls or use them as free ae spot?

Fri 21 Aug 2020 12:51 PM by DinoTriz

This thread has inspired me to level up my RC Runemaster.

I will save the realm!

Fri 21 Aug 2020 1:21 PM by Valaraukar

labra wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 12:32 PM
I agree about long range mez .

I'm looking at charplan, I didn't play any mid casters (I barely played casters, being more melee fancy).
I see a nearsight and confusion on runemaster on bt spec (suppression) , ae mez, cure mez on spiritmasters, both having qc.
I assume those 2 classes are underplayed?

regarding insta debuff (like ae str/con), do they interrupt?

last question: when taking a tower/keep, do mid insta kill pnj on walls or use them as free ae spot?

sure they interrupt, but the issue remains the same: you get in range to target someone on the walls then you get stunned (because every damn hib caster has a stun) or mezzed, because of the range of the alb aoe mezz or added by hundreds or pets, and you are wiped in 3 seconds, with no healing possible. The issue here is not all about interrupt, it is mainly about CC and mid casters lack cc, but for the SM that has that crappy aoe mezz useful just to give immunity

Fri 21 Aug 2020 1:24 PM by labra

that's why I asked about pnj on walls (archers). If they are kept alive, it's a easy click to interrupt people upstairs

Fri 21 Aug 2020 1:31 PM by Forlornhope

Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:43 AM
Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:31 AM
Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:09 AM
Bobbahunter wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:58 AM
To sum it up.

The Melee realm shouldn’t play melee classes because they can’t compete with the caster realm. So the Melee realm should play casters that aren’t as diverse as the casters from the caster realm?

Or maybe the melee realm should use catapults to counter the casters, and enjoy it because it's a part of the game!

You won't run more dedicated interrupt classes, that's fine. But then you won't do the only other thing that can even give you a chance of winning in a keep fight, for basically no reason that makes any sort of sense.. Well, then you shouldn't come onto these forums and complain when you can't win. Maybe this isn't the game for you, but if you insist on not using the tools available to you then I wish you luck. You're going to need it.

You didn't answer to me what would be the so needed interrupt classes on Mid, apart of healers. SMs? Interrupt what? Or they spec Pbaoe (and won't interrupt anything) or they Spec Darkness (and have only single target spells, with no BASELINE STUN like yours). RMs? yeah nice the flaming spears falling from the sky are great, then what else? Do you know that the nearsight is in the Suppression spec of the RM, the one with PBT and a ridicolous dps, especially aoe? So all RM in Mid should respec in supp just to be able to nearsight hundreds of casters who, in their turn, can focus only on killing ppl because this server is so caster friendly and Hib is a caster realm?
But really don't you all see this situation here, and keep talking about using casters in Mid?
That implies that yes, this server is caster friendly, and so the realm with the best casters (which is absolutely not MID I'd say, or do you want to contest also this?) has the upper hand, unless something will change in the next future.
And the only thing that seems to be an issue here is that Mid has no leadership.... this is just ridicolous

Runemasters have gtaoe, one of the things you have such issues with when taking a keep. And you seem to assume that because I haven't updated my signature since the start of the server that I only play hib. I have classes on all realms, and haven't even played hib since last year on this server. In fact I spend most of my time now playing in mid. The gtaoe spell is at 19, it doesn't need to be higher to be an effective interrupt tool. Which allows them to either spec into darkness or supp for more dps or the added utility of nearsight. You consistently talk about baseline stun and them being able to quick cast it, well you know what counters that effectively? Amnesia, so again we're back to unwillingness to use the tools you're given. And runies aren't the only thing, your healers can't be base line stunned if they stay back out of cast range, you know like where they should be standing. The hibs may excel at holding a keep position, but there are way to work around it and you refuse to actually see it. The real issue here isn't even just individual leadership, it's people who consistently fail doing the same things but refuse to change. I don't even bother running with the mid bgs, all they do is constantly feed because they have no understanding of what they're capable of if they set groups up right and use better tactics other than standing at the walls around the gates or try to climb the walls with their fifty wall climbers.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 1:34 PM by Valaraukar

labra wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 1:24 PM
that's why I asked about pnj on walls (archers). If they are kept alive, it's a easy click to interrupt people upstairs

yes that's fine but sooner or later they will die, usually they cannot last longer than a few minutes of siege. While they are up I always target them to have an aoe chance with other ppl hiding behind the walls

Fri 21 Aug 2020 1:59 PM by Valaraukar

Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 1:31 PM
Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:43 AM
Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:31 AM
Valaraukar wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:09 AM
Bobbahunter wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:58 AM
To sum it up.

The Melee realm shouldn’t play melee classes because they can’t compete with the caster realm. So the Melee realm should play casters that aren’t as diverse as the casters from the caster realm?

Or maybe the melee realm should use catapults to counter the casters, and enjoy it because it's a part of the game!

You won't run more dedicated interrupt classes, that's fine. But then you won't do the only other thing that can even give you a chance of winning in a keep fight, for basically no reason that makes any sort of sense.. Well, then you shouldn't come onto these forums and complain when you can't win. Maybe this isn't the game for you, but if you insist on not using the tools available to you then I wish you luck. You're going to need it.

You didn't answer to me what would be the so needed interrupt classes on Mid, apart of healers. SMs? Interrupt what? Or they spec Pbaoe (and won't interrupt anything) or they Spec Darkness (and have only single target spells, with no BASELINE STUN like yours). RMs? yeah nice the flaming spears falling from the sky are great, then what else? Do you know that the nearsight is in the Suppression spec of the RM, the one with PBT and a ridicolous dps, especially aoe? So all RM in Mid should respec in supp just to be able to nearsight hundreds of casters who, in their turn, can focus only on killing ppl because this server is so caster friendly and Hib is a caster realm?
But really don't you all see this situation here, and keep talking about using casters in Mid?
That implies that yes, this server is caster friendly, and so the realm with the best casters (which is absolutely not MID I'd say, or do you want to contest also this?) has the upper hand, unless something will change in the next future.
And the only thing that seems to be an issue here is that Mid has no leadership.... this is just ridicolous

Runemasters have gtaoe, one of the things you have such issues with when taking a keep. And you seem to assume that because I haven't updated my signature since the start of the server that I only play hib. I have classes on all realms, and haven't even played hib since last year on this server. In fact I spend most of my time now playing in mid. The gtaoe spell is at 19, it doesn't need to be higher to be an effective interrupt tool. Which allows them to either spec into darkness or supp for more dps or the added utility of nearsight. You consistently talk about baseline stun and them being able to quick cast it, well you know what counters that effectively? Amnesia, so again we're back to unwillingness to use the tools you're given. And runies aren't the only thing, your healers can't be base line stunned if they stay back out of cast range, you know like where they should be standing. The hibs may excel at holding a keep position, but there are way to work around it and you refuse to actually see it. The real issue here isn't even just individual leadership, it's people who consistently fail doing the same things but refuse to change. I don't even bother running with the mid bgs, all they do is constantly feed because they have no understanding of what they're capable of if they set groups up right and use better tactics other than standing at the walls around the gates or try to climb the walls with their fifty wall climbers.

This is you point of view and I respect it, but from what you say it seems to me that it's like: "hibs just need to sit on the walls and press 1 key, you mids must find every way of countering them at the best of your skill and wit". Ok it's fine, but this seems to me another, longer and more poetic, way to call it "unbalance".
Yes you may win but you'll need to do all your best and beyond, while they just need to make one thing: stay behind the walls and avoid open field fights (at which both Pilz and Smap are the best). Is this not unbalance between realms? It seems so to me

Edit: and the simple fact that a zerg needs to have lots of casters means that this is a caster-based server, not a melee one, and that in casters comparison Mid will be always be the last of the 3. That's all and nothing will change my mind from it.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 2:24 PM by labra

I agree about the caster-friendly server, wether it's intentionnal or not.
To be honest I always felt DAOC as a more caster oriented game than melee (but I know I don't see "the full picture" as I mostly played melee classes.
Yes you'll get more pain going through as Midgard is more melee oriented.
But I believe there is ways to adapt, even is sometimes it will be harder.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:08 PM by Astaa

Here's an idea, stop being so wet, come and fight.

And by fight, I don't mean run 3fg on stick in task zone, or 1fg in CG hunting 35s, come and actually fight.

Bunch of fannies.

Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:22 PM by Gildar

Astaa wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 10:08 PM
Here's an idea, stop being so wet, come and fight.

And by fight, I don't mean run 3fg on stick in task zone, or 1fg in CG hunting 35s, come and actually fight.

Bunch of fannies.

Shhh dont tell so ... cant tell at mids to come fight ... or you are a toxic person ...

But someone can stay here and whining all the time about realm imbalance of classes ....

Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:11 PM by twinsonian

One thing that discourages people to bg with mid is that they don't stay together. When pilz runs his ball uses just slightly faster than hastener when moving. Mid bgs lose a lot of people/groups that do not have anything faster than hastener.

Sat 22 Aug 2020 6:14 AM by Gildar

twinsonian wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:11 PM
One thing that discourages people to bg with mid is that they don't stay together. When pilz runs his ball uses just slightly faster than hastener when moving. Mid bgs lose a lot of people/groups that do not have anything faster than hastener.

Oh ... and that are an Hib fault ?

Or depends of imbalance of classes ???

Sat 22 Aug 2020 12:27 PM by twinsonian

Gildar wrote: ↑
Sat 22 Aug 2020 6:14 AM
twinsonian wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Aug 2020 11:11 PM
One thing that discourages people to bg with mid is that they don't stay together. When pilz runs his ball uses just slightly faster than hastener when moving. Mid bgs lose a lot of people/groups that do not have anything faster than hastener.

Oh ... and that are an Hib fault ?

Or depends of imbalance of classes ???

Not at all. I am pointing out that the mid bg leadership is not interested in keeping the group together. Stragglers are slowly picked off by small man/groups. Whether or not people agree doesn't matter, it discourages people from joining or staying with a mid rvr bg.

Sat 22 Aug 2020 1:01 PM by Siouxsie

twinsonian wrote: ↑
Sat 22 Aug 2020 12:27 PM
Not at all. I am pointing out that the mid bg leadership is not interested in keeping the group together. Stragglers are slowly picked off by small man/groups. Whether or not people agree doesn't matter, it discourages people from joining or staying with a mid rvr bg.

I spent an hour trying to get my 4 man group to the mid BG. Not once was any of the locations they gave when I asked were accurate.
While trying to get to the mid BG we were wiped by 2 different full groups of albs: AOE mezz, following by being picked off one by one
by the group, and they had 5 pets so it was like 13 albs. You can't do anything because most of the alb classes can instantly stun you anyway.

After that I just logged. Game isn't fun on Mid any more, and the people who play alb and hib on this server use the class imbalance to
act like complete toxic imbeciles. The community here is toxic, full of griefers, and hib and alb gaslighters, exploiters and cheaters. It's a real shame.
It's become a 2 realm game. It's no wonder most Mids don't bother with realm objectives. It's easier to go somewhere else than meet up with
zergs or overpowered groups that will wipe you.

Sat 22 Aug 2020 1:39 PM by Gildar

Not an Hib / Alb fault if your BG run skald speed and many cant ... or if your grp gave to you inaccurate locations ...

Sun 23 Aug 2020 12:07 AM by boridi

Mid BG leaders are fine. However, the mid BGs always have people arguing with the leader, trying to become a second leader and give their own sets of directions, insulting people, untemplated level 43 cave shaman telling everyone else how to play their class, etc, etc, etc. Most people playing this game are at least 30 years old.. can't believe they act this way. BG chat should be limited to intel or "lfg" messages from non-leaders. Just now, Johny was leading a BG and tried to come around behind hibs to kill them. Wasn't super successful but we didn't wipe. Shortly after, someone is in BG chat saying "why the f*** did we do that?" Cannot blame BG leaders for not wanting to put up with profanity and insults like that. I have half the realm on my /ignore list because of all the arguing and negativity. People say Pilz and Polemos can be a bit abrasive, but I get the sense that albs/hibs would not argue with either of them openly in /bc chat.

And tonight I spent 30 minutes playing my shaman in RvR before remembering that I am awful at playing support classes.... sorry to my group for having to put up with Boridot.

Sun 23 Aug 2020 1:22 AM by Wakefield

Polemo can lead rvr, he is just too toxic over /advice at those who choose to do other things, whether its epic dungeons, dragon, legion etc than join his bg.

It's a game after all, people should be able to play how they want to and not be slagged off for doing so.

Until those who choose to be abusive against those who like ALL content start paying for my internet connection, I will continue to play the classes I play the way I want to play them. Sometimes I dont want to rvr as I either do not have the time, no interest, pissed as a rat etcetc.

Does that mean I should NOT log on at all?

Sun 23 Aug 2020 6:54 AM by Stoertebecker

boridi wrote: ↑
Sun 23 Aug 2020 12:07 AM
Mid BG leaders are fine. However, the mid BGs always have people arguing with the leader, trying to become a second leader and give their own sets of directions, insulting people, untemplated level 43 cave shaman telling everyone else how to play their class, etc, etc, etc. Most people playing this game are at least 30 years old.. can't believe they act this way. BG chat should be limited to intel or "lfg" messages from non-leaders. Just now, Johny was leading a BG and tried to come around behind hibs to kill them. Wasn't super successful but we didn't wipe. Shortly after, someone is in BG chat saying "why the f*** did we do that?" Cannot blame BG leaders for not wanting to put up with profanity and insults like that. I have half the realm on my /ignore list because of all the arguing and negativity. People say Pilz and Polemos can be a bit abrasive, but I get the sense that albs/hibs would not argue with either of them openly in /bc chat.

And tonight I spent 30 minutes playing my shaman in RvR before remembering that I am awful at playing support classes.... sorry to my group for having to put up with Boridot.

Afaik there was a /battlegroup listen command. Not working here?

Sun 23 Aug 2020 3:34 PM by jlxscholar

Zod7120 wrote: ↑
Wed 19 Aug 2020 6:28 PM
If you've ever seen the inside of a slaughterhouse, that's what a Midgard BG looks like. Simple, efficient execution, served up RP rich. Hib takes Bled and Nott keep/towers in off hours and leaves everything else. Despite having only a single relic, Midgard BG get directed at these objectives. Once the flame is lit and numbers are known, Hib ports in and AJ's. Midgard BG then rally's and does the same thing, again!?! This is due to sycophantic, capitulating BG leaders who would rather do something safe versus do something innovative and defend their decision. Vanity is a four letter word and people should get their self-esteem elsewhere. Hib leadership fails to innovate because why would they, Midgard is trained and ready to farm, slaughterhouse style.

Once a keep/tower is owned, no matter what realm it's in, it belongs to that realm. Stubborn pride to control your realm is egoism. No amount of RP bonus is going to make people feel good about that.

Ok, you had the gall to come on here and make a post. If you can run a BG group better, RUN ONE!

You guys stop complaining and make one. Change it up. If you are successful people will come back, that's how leadership works.

Sun 23 Aug 2020 3:40 PM by jlxscholar

I can honestly say I have not seen a caster group or been a part of one on mid yet.

Everyone runs the same thing, 2 healers, 1 sham, 4 melees and a runemaster.

Boring.

So runemasters are certainly getting hired. Thanes, BD's, SM's, seem much rarer. At the end of the day, it is down to player choices what they have in their groups and what they consider meta/better. I think thanes, BD's, and SM's provide good things, but you won't see them asked for regularly.

Sun 23 Aug 2020 4:51 PM by Valaraukar

jlxscholar wrote: ↑
Sun 23 Aug 2020 3:40 PM
I can honestly say I have not seen a caster group or been a part of one on mid yet.

Everyone runs the same thing, 2 healers, 1 sham, 4 melees and a runemaster.

Boring.

So runemasters are certainly getting hired. Thanes, BD's, SM's, seem much rarer. At the end of the day, it is down to player choices what they have in their groups and what they consider meta/better. I think thanes, BD's, and SM's provide good things, but you won't see them asked for regularly.

Wonder why? You see them good, all the realm does not.... so where could be the truth? Maybe because these classes are just overperformed by the other realms, and the only viable setup for Mid is the melee one, even with some difficulties being without Charge.

Mon 24 Aug 2020 12:12 PM by Sabatasso79

Since every strategy more or less has been exhausted some 15 years ago, what a Raid Leader actually need is a bunch of people who are ready & willing to follow. So the problem isn't lack of leadership, it's lack of decent manpower. Put your egos aside and join the fight! Reading this thread, and this forum in general, I almost feel like I'm back building sand castles in kindergarden... there's always that one kid who can't behave and is destroying everyone's fun. Don't be that kid!

Mon 24 Aug 2020 12:59 PM by Gildar

Sabatasso79 wrote: ↑
Mon 24 Aug 2020 12:12 PM
Since every strategy more or less has been exhausted some 15 years ago, what a Raid Leader actually need is a bunch of people who are ready & willing to follow. So the problem isn't lack of leadership, it's lack of decent manpower. Put your egos aside and join the fight! Reading this thread, and this forum in general, I almost feel like I'm back building sand castles in kindergarden... there's always that one kid who can't behave and is destroying everyone's fun. Don't be that kid!

/clap

Mon 24 Aug 2020 1:42 PM by Wakefield

Sabatasso79 wrote: ↑
Mon 24 Aug 2020 12:12 PM
Since every strategy more or less has been exhausted some 15 years ago, what a Raid Leader actually need is a bunch of people who are ready & willing to follow. So the problem isn't lack of leadership, it's lack of decent manpower. Put your egos aside and join the fight! Reading this thread, and this forum in general, I almost feel like I'm back building sand castles in kindergarden... there's always that one kid who can't behave and is destroying everyone's fun. Don't be that kid!

That kid is the Hib zerg...

Mon 24 Aug 2020 2:06 PM by Noashakra

Wakefield wrote: ↑
Mon 24 Aug 2020 1:42 PM
Sabatasso79 wrote: ↑
Mon 24 Aug 2020 12:12 PM
Since every strategy more or less has been exhausted some 15 years ago, what a Raid Leader actually need is a bunch of people who are ready & willing to follow. So the problem isn't lack of leadership, it's lack of decent manpower. Put your egos aside and join the fight! Reading this thread, and this forum in general, I almost feel like I'm back building sand castles in kindergarden... there's always that one kid who can't behave and is destroying everyone's fun. Don't be that kid!

That kid is the Hib zerg...

Stop kicking the sand castle dude please