I think this potion is OP, it makes keep take too fast, and its unfair is some people don't use it.
I suggest to remove this potion (double siege damage).
I suggest to remove this potion (double siege damage).
Remove Savagery Pots
Started 28 Jul 2020
by
Centenario
in
Suggestions
Tue 28 Jul 2020 1:42 PM
by
ExcretusMaximus
Centenario wrote: ↑Tue 28 Jul 2020 1:36 PMI think this potion is OP, it makes keep take too fast, and its unfair is some people don't use it.
I suggest to remove this potion (double siege damage).
Never explain, never complain, never pander.
Tue 28 Jul 2020 2:57 PM
by
Centenario
Tue 28 Jul 2020 4:29 PM
by
Siouxsie
Remove it from Alb and Hib. They are already overpopulated as it is.
Tue 28 Jul 2020 4:42 PM
by
Lollie
It's unfair because some people don't use it? Am I reading that right?
Wed 29 Jul 2020 12:27 AM
by
Centenario
1) keep doors go down too quickly
2) 150g per pot is expensive
3) its almost mandatory to use
4) it feels like energy in mobile games (artificially created barriers to progression) or gold sink
I'd rather you boost dps of rams or increase dps of catapults against doors, than force this goldsink.
If people are against using goldsinks (paytowin) then they cannot compete.
It's like saying to people:
- You can get a tax cut if you head to your tax office every end of the week.
- It's fair it applies to everybody
- Yet its proportional to your income so its more worth it if you have more income
- If you don't want tax cuts because you think that tax shouldn't exist, too bad we won't remove it
2) 150g per pot is expensive
3) its almost mandatory to use
4) it feels like energy in mobile games (artificially created barriers to progression) or gold sink
I'd rather you boost dps of rams or increase dps of catapults against doors, than force this goldsink.
If people are against using goldsinks (paytowin) then they cannot compete.
It's like saying to people:
- You can get a tax cut if you head to your tax office every end of the week.
- It's fair it applies to everybody
- Yet its proportional to your income so its more worth it if you have more income
- If you don't want tax cuts because you think that tax shouldn't exist, too bad we won't remove it
Wed 29 Jul 2020 4:38 AM
by
ExcretusMaximus
My name deals with a medical condition I suffer from called hyperhydrosis.
I find it humorous.
And at least I'm not a hypocrite.
Wed 29 Jul 2020 6:52 AM
by
Sepplord
Centenario wrote: ↑Wed 29 Jul 2020 12:27 AM4) it feels like energy in mobile games (artificially created barriers to progression) or gold sink
I'd rather you boost dps of rams or increase dps of catapults against doors, than force this goldsink.
If people are against using goldsinks (paytowin) then they cannot compete.
Neither are the pots a goldsink, nor are goldsinks pay2win since you can't buy gold with RL money.
Just throwing in big words doesn't help the credibility of your arguments
Wed 29 Jul 2020 8:00 AM
by
Gildar
Goldsink ???
You know you can but with claws ???
You know you can but with claws ???
Wed 29 Jul 2020 8:40 AM
by
Centenario
Sepplord wrote: ↑Wed 29 Jul 2020 6:52 AMNeither are the pots a goldsink, nor are goldsinks pay2win since you can't buy gold with RL money.
goldsink means that you attempt to remove currency into the game, if we imply that phoenix claw and gold are currencies then it is a goldsink item.
pay2win doesnt only mean buying thing with RL money, spending time farming is pay2win, if we imply that time is money a player spending more time farming (claw/gold=currencies) to get access to 100% uptime on savagery pot is a pay2win.
Wed 29 Jul 2020 9:57 AM
by
gotwqqd
Pay2win is not in game farmingCentenario wrote: ↑Wed 29 Jul 2020 8:40 AMSepplord wrote: ↑Wed 29 Jul 2020 6:52 AMNeither are the pots a goldsink, nor are goldsinks pay2win since you can't buy gold with RL money.
goldsink means that you attempt to remove currency into the game, if we imply that phoenix claw and gold are currencies then it is a goldsink item.
pay2win doesnt only mean buying thing with RL money, spending time farming is pay2win, if we imply that time is money a player spending more time farming (claw/gold=currencies) to get access to 100% uptime on savagery pot is a pay2win.
It’s a term strictly to define someone with deep wallets in the real world buying items or abilities and getting benefits from them
Wed 29 Jul 2020 11:00 AM
by
Noashakra
Using money IG to buy an item IG is not pay to win.
P2W is when you invest real money to gain an advantage over other players.
P2W is when you invest real money to gain an advantage over other players.
Wed 29 Jul 2020 1:33 PM
by
Shamissa
This is one of those threads with no sense at all.
We need to use the pots here...this is not daoc live not yet.
It takes too long to siege a door down even with a pot already.
What are you smoking kid?
God damn find something useful to talk about it instead of no sense crap.
We need to use the pots here...this is not daoc live not yet.
It takes too long to siege a door down even with a pot already.
What are you smoking kid?
God damn find something useful to talk about it instead of no sense crap.
Wed 29 Jul 2020 2:37 PM
by
LolaEbola
I’d just like to add here, that claws are not a gold sink because no gold is leaving the game, just being passed from one player to another. Gold sinks are a mechanic used to combat inflation in a game’s economy, a good example would be the 200 plat horse armor or 100 plat mansions.
Wed 29 Jul 2020 4:06 PM
by
Centenario
Whatever the terms you wanna use, if you tried to understand you would.
Savagery pots need to be removed and all siege weapon receive the 100% damage bonus from savagery buff, case closed.
Savagery pots need to be removed and all siege weapon receive the 100% damage bonus from savagery buff, case closed.
Wed 29 Jul 2020 5:10 PM
by
LolaEbola
I do understand what you’re saying, and I actually don’t see any great reason to have savagery in game. Overall, I agree with you. I’d like keep fights to be longer and harder.
I just want people to understand what a gold sink actually is and why it’s useful.
I just want people to understand what a gold sink actually is and why it’s useful.
Thu 30 Jul 2020 7:08 AM
by
Sepplord
Centenario wrote: Savagery pots need to be removed and all siege weapon receive the 100% damage bonus from savagery buff, case closed.
So what will it be.....what is your argument?
You started with the buff being too strong and keep taking being too fast, NOW it seems you are just butthurt that there is a cost associated with the potion and want to have it removed and the buff given for free
Your argumentations are inconsistent AND misuse known definitions just because you believe it sounds flashy.
How many people are there per keepraid on average? I bet 50 is a quite low number, which would already result in 50claws being put into the economy. Enough to buy more pots than needed for the keepraid.
Thu 30 Jul 2020 7:46 AM
by
Centenario
My argument was that it is not healthy to have pay to win (IG) savagery pots. I think they should be removed.
I think the keeptakes are too fast, so maybe 100% bonus is not needed, I could see only a 50% bonus instead if savagery pots were to be removed.
I think the keeptakes are too fast, so maybe 100% bonus is not needed, I could see only a 50% bonus instead if savagery pots were to be removed.
Thu 30 Jul 2020 8:14 AM
by
Sepplord
doubling down on misusing flashy words is still only doing one thing:
taking away from your credibility (or well....in your case, keeping it at zero)
taking away from your credibility (or well....in your case, keeping it at zero)
Thu 30 Jul 2020 10:30 AM
by
Centenario
I have zero need for petty arrogance or "credibility" on this forum.
I don't misuse flashy word, you just have minimal understanding of those concepts.
It's like saying that volunteering or being a housewife isnt a job or work, because you don't have a salary.
Pay to win doesnt only involve physical money, time has a value, maybe 1 hour of my time is worth $20.
If I can afford to waste my time farming, when another cannot, then I have actually had an edge over the other person due to real life circumstances.
If player 1 in DAoC has spent 100 hours in RvR and is 10L when player 2 has spent 50 hours in RvR and is 9L9. (all else equal, class, playstyle)
Don't you think that the first player has paid time to win RR? That's pay to win.
I don't misuse flashy word, you just have minimal understanding of those concepts.
It's like saying that volunteering or being a housewife isnt a job or work, because you don't have a salary.
Pay to win doesnt only involve physical money, time has a value, maybe 1 hour of my time is worth $20.
If I can afford to waste my time farming, when another cannot, then I have actually had an edge over the other person due to real life circumstances.
If player 1 in DAoC has spent 100 hours in RvR and is 10L when player 2 has spent 50 hours in RvR and is 9L9. (all else equal, class, playstyle)
Don't you think that the first player has paid time to win RR? That's pay to win.
Thu 30 Jul 2020 1:04 PM
by
gotwqqd
noCentenario wrote: ↑Thu 30 Jul 2020 10:30 AMI have zero need for petty arrogance or "credibility" on this forum.
I don't misuse flashy word, you just have minimal understanding of those concepts.
It's like saying that volunteering or being a housewife isnt a job or work, because you don't have a salary.
Pay to win doesnt only involve physical money, time has a value, maybe 1 hour of my time is worth $20.
If I can afford to waste my time farming, when another cannot, then I have actually had an edge over the other person due to real life circumstances.
If player 1 in DAoC has spent 100 hours in RvR and is 10L when player 2 has spent 50 hours in RvR and is 9L9. (all else equal, class, playstyle)
Don't you think that the first player has paid time to win RR? That's pay to win.
Nice try though
Thu 30 Jul 2020 1:35 PM
by
Sepplord
Unless you use this forum as a personal notepad (which you don't because you are actively reacting to people) then you are here to make your opinion heard, which to be succesful requires credibility.
But, really, lets take a look at your definition of pay2win. If that is the definition, then it becomes a complete meaningless phrase. Everything takes time. There is not a single game (or anything at all) that doesn't take time. Even in Chess, you have to take the time to lift your finger and move a figure on the board. Unless you "pay that time" you can't even play at all, and never win.
In a perfectly balanced, no progression shooter, you have to "pay the time" to move the crosshair onto your enemy, otherwise you just won't win.
So...the best case for you, is that you are using meaningless words without any informational content.
I am quite convinced that isn't the case and you are just full of shit, going "hurrdurr they think i'm a moron, but i am just trolling"
Thu 30 Jul 2020 2:16 PM
by
Centenario
Lets close this issue of the terms please.
You have been insulting me so I am not going to spend the time anymore to explain it to you and teach you.
I will follow that forum moto.
Not gonna explain that time has value, etc...
Not gonna complain about your behavior.
Not gonna pander to your negative behavior.
Back on topic:
I think Savagery pots need to be removed for simple reasons:
- Artificial barrier to dps to spend currency (phoenix claw)
- If people are not using it they have a disadvantage, making them mandatory
Please give reasons why it shouldnt be removed (for example):
- If we follow this reasoning, then we should remove buff pots as well
- I like to spend my claws on Savagery pots
- I get an edge over players who don't use it that's why its there
- What else would I spend my claws on
- Its a source of revenue for people farming only in RvR
You have been insulting me so I am not going to spend the time anymore to explain it to you and teach you.
I will follow that forum moto.
Not gonna explain that time has value, etc...
Not gonna complain about your behavior.
Not gonna pander to your negative behavior.
Back on topic:
I think Savagery pots need to be removed for simple reasons:
- Artificial barrier to dps to spend currency (phoenix claw)
- If people are not using it they have a disadvantage, making them mandatory
Please give reasons why it shouldnt be removed (for example):
- If we follow this reasoning, then we should remove buff pots as well
- I like to spend my claws on Savagery pots
- I get an edge over players who don't use it that's why its there
- What else would I spend my claws on
- Its a source of revenue for people farming only in RvR
Thu 30 Jul 2020 3:01 PM
by
Lollie
Thing is, same can be said about any sort of in game currency, feathers, gold, claws or what ever. There will always be those how have more because they have invested the time into getting them.
As for taking keeps too quickly, you need a lot of people to take a keep quickly, which means multiple rams and multiple buffs with enough players to fill the rams (you can speak to bg leaders to know how fustrating that can be) to get the maximum dps from them, with that being the case then they should be smashing the living crap out of that door. It's not mandortory to use them when taking a keep, with enough players and rams you can do it, it just helps to have it.
As for taking keeps too quickly, you need a lot of people to take a keep quickly, which means multiple rams and multiple buffs with enough players to fill the rams (you can speak to bg leaders to know how fustrating that can be) to get the maximum dps from them, with that being the case then they should be smashing the living crap out of that door. It's not mandortory to use them when taking a keep, with enough players and rams you can do it, it just helps to have it.
Fri 31 Jul 2020 7:51 AM
by
Sepplord
Centenario wrote: ↑Thu 30 Jul 2020 2:16 PMI think Savagery pots need to be removed for simple reasons:
- Artificial barrier to dps to spend currency (phoenix claw)
- If people are not using it they have a disadvantage, making them mandatory
Please give reasons why it shouldnt be removed (for example):
- If we follow this reasoning, then we should remove buff pots as well
- I like to spend my claws on Savagery pots
- I get an edge over players who don't use it that's why its there
- What else would I spend my claws on
- Its a source of revenue for people farming only in RvR
Now we talking
You already mentioned most counterarguments yourself
a few other things that also give players who spend time/ressources an advantage:
-charges
-templates
-assassin poisons
-equipment repair costs
imo, all of them are negligible and doing RvR is self sufficient. The amount of gold/feathers earned in regular RvR easily pays for combinedforces / invigoration / equipment repair / charge uses, just as claws dropped in keep-/towerraids easily pay for the savagery-pots
Fri 31 Jul 2020 12:43 PM
by
jlxscholar
Centenario wrote: ↑Tue 28 Jul 2020 1:36 PMI think this potion is OP, it makes keep take too fast, and its unfair is some people don't use it.
I suggest to remove this potion (double siege damage).
I'm in favor of removing it. Keeps are already taken WAY too quickly. It's a joke.
Sun 2 Aug 2020 5:16 AM
by
Adwaenyth
Or simply allow only one ram to attack the door at the same time? That is far more of a problem than the buff alone. 5+ rams on a gate and the door melts in seconds.
Fri 14 Aug 2020 1:47 PM
by
Centenario
I still think something needs to be improved with siege damage and phoenix claw in general.
Sat 15 Aug 2020 12:36 PM
by
joshisanonymous
Siouxsie wrote: ↑Tue 28 Jul 2020 4:29 PMRemove it from Alb and Hib. They are already overpopulated as it is.
I know this was meant to be tongue-in-cheek, but that would probably be a better way to balance realms in terms of the overall war situation than the 50% RP bonus that was added. I can't imagine people complaining that only the low pop realm has savagery buffs in the way they complain about the RP difference, it wouldn't cause huge population swings, and it would be a direct boon to helping the low pop realm control territory more easily.
Sat 15 Aug 2020 1:40 PM
by
Lokkjim
joshisanonymous wrote: ↑Sat 15 Aug 2020 12:36 PMSiouxsie wrote: ↑Tue 28 Jul 2020 4:29 PMRemove it from Alb and Hib. They are already overpopulated as it is.
I know this was meant to be tongue-in-cheek, but that would probably be a better way to balance realms in terms of the overall war situation than the 50% RP bonus that was added. I can't imagine people complaining that only the low pop realm has savagery buffs in the way they complain about the RP difference, it wouldn't cause huge population swings, and it would be a direct boon to helping the low pop realm control territory more easily.
This wouldn't work, because then the other realms would just keep the border keep to ensure you couldn't get savagery pots. Hib did it for a while with beno and bled.
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