Might as well give all casters unlimited quick casts and remove immunity timers. Bow damage is great now, no need for the unlimited cc.
Time to tone down scouts
Started 6 Jul 2020
by
Killkannon
in
Suggestions
Mon 6 Jul 2020 1:29 PM
by
Siouxsie
Killkannon wrote: ↑Mon 6 Jul 2020 1:38 AMMight as well give all casters unlimited quick casts and remove immunity timers. Bow damage is great now, no need for the unlimited cc.
Agreed. They do great damage. They don't need the lvl 45 shield style any more.
Please remove this style from the server. Thanks!
Mon 6 Jul 2020 2:17 PM
by
Cadebrennus
Then give Archers PD or take it away from Casters.
Tue 7 Jul 2020 1:31 AM
by
Killkannon
Not sure this is even comparable. Melee get AOM if you choose to spec it. There are tough caster classes in all realms. Scouts having a immunity free anytime root and stun pretty much negate all points you put in purge and then if you choose to run, you may get away, but bow damage is really good so maybe not. I am just asking to either remove it or give an immunity to it after its used once. They can still disengage or use it to kite and shoot like they do now but once is fair imo.
Tue 7 Jul 2020 5:58 AM
by
Cadebrennus
Killkannon wrote: ↑Tue 7 Jul 2020 1:31 AM
Not sure this is even comparable. Melee get AOM if you choose to spec it. There are tough caster classes in all realms. Scouts having a immunity free anytime root and stun pretty much negate all points you put in purge and then if you choose to run, you may get away, but bow damage is really good so maybe not. I am just asking to either remove it or give an immunity to it after its used once. They can still disengage or use it to kite and shoot like they do now but once is fair imo.
Bow damage isn't really good. It's "just okay", which is why most Archers stop at 27 or 35 Archery.
Tue 7 Jul 2020 6:02 AM
by
Noashakra
Killkannon wrote: ↑Tue 7 Jul 2020 1:31 AM
Not sure this is even comparable. Melee get AOM if you choose to spec it. There are tough caster classes in all realms. Scouts having a immunity free anytime root and stun pretty much negate all points you put in purge and then if you choose to run, you may get away, but bow damage is really good so maybe not. I am just asking to either remove it or give an immunity to it after its used once. They can still disengage or use it to kite and shoot like they do now but once is fair imo.
Because tanks are made to be tanky, and casters are in tissue and it makes 0 sense to make them take less melee damage than a tank.
Tue 7 Jul 2020 4:17 PM
by
joshisanonymous
Noashakra wrote: ↑Tue 7 Jul 2020 6:02 AMNot sure this is even comparable. Melee get AOM if you choose to spec it. There are tough caster classes in all realms. Scouts having a immunity free anytime root and stun pretty much negate all points you put in purge and then if you choose to run, you may get away, but bow damage is really good so maybe not. I am just asking to either remove it or give an immunity to it after its used once. They can still disengage or use it to kite and shoot like they do now but once is fair imo.
Because tanks are made to be tanky, and casters are in tissue and it makes 0 sense to make them take less melee damage than a tank.
[/quote]
If you need it to make sense in terms of immersion in a fantasy world, just imagine that they cast a spell that increases their hardiness.
Also, I'm confused about what some of y'all think PD really does and how common it is. Since we're talking about scouts and essentially solo/smallman fights, the only caster class that makes much sense to get it before a very high RR is BD, because with their access to insta interrupts (which were just slightly nerfed), they can arguably afford to forego cast speed RAs. Every other caster that takes PD even to 5 is foregoing a good amount of damage and/or cast speed to get a whopping 5% extra melee resists (because PD provides secondary resists, not primary) that will allow them to live maybe one extra offhand swing longer if they don't get heals seeing as it's equivalent to roughly an extra 80 HP when fully buffed.
Tue 7 Jul 2020 6:20 PM
by
easytoremember
Changes a lot when you factor in buffs & healsjoshisanonymous wrote: ↑Tue 7 Jul 2020 4:17 PMAlso, I'm confused about what some of y'all think PD really does and how common it is. Since we're talking about scouts and essentially solo/smallman fights, the only caster class that makes much sense to get it before a very high RR is BD, because with their access to insta interrupts (which were just slightly nerfed), they can arguably afford to forego cast speed RAs. Every other caster that takes PD even to 5 is foregoing a good amount of damage and/or cast speed to get a whopping 5% extra melee resists (because PD provides secondary resists, not primary) that will allow them to live maybe one extra offhand swing longer if they don't get heals seeing as it's equivalent to roughly an extra 80 HP when fully buffed.
Tue 7 Jul 2020 6:22 PM
by
Forlornhope
Oh man, scouts can finally kill something in a 1v1 better nerf 'em!
Tue 7 Jul 2020 9:57 PM
by
pollojack
I think scouts are amazing in groups, still haven't had issues with one in a 1v1.
I admit a SB or Infil would def have issues with limited range options.
I admit a SB or Infil would def have issues with limited range options.
Tue 7 Jul 2020 10:27 PM
by
Gildar
Killkannon wrote: ↑Tue 7 Jul 2020 1:31 AM
Not sure this is even comparable. Melee get AOM if you choose to spec it. There are tough caster classes in all realms. Scouts having a immunity free anytime root and stun pretty much negate all points you put in purge and then if you choose to run, you may get away, but bow damage is really good so maybe not. I am just asking to either remove it or give an immunity to it after its used once. They can still disengage or use it to kite and shoot like they do now but once is fair imo.
Absolutely right !!!
Tue 7 Jul 2020 10:35 PM
by
Gildar
Cadebrennus wrote: ↑Tue 7 Jul 2020 5:58 AMKillkannon wrote: ↑Tue 7 Jul 2020 1:31 AMCadebrennus wrote: ↑Mon 6 Jul 2020 2:17 PM...
Bow damage isn't really good. It's "just okay", which is why most Archers stop at 27 or 35 Archery.
Bow damage is really good now ... And all 7 rangers in my guild are specced 50 bow ... And they hit damn hard ... i tested in duel whit my RR7Lx caster with PD 3 ...
In siege fights i die too many times by scouts ... And my druids (all over RR5Lx) have hard times to keep me alive ... so sorry Cadebrennus ... what you tell is not true at all
Bow damage is still too high ... And make no sense scouts have also permasnare lol
Wed 8 Jul 2020 12:19 AM
by
gotwqqd
Gildar wrote: ↑Tue 7 Jul 2020 10:35 PMCadebrennus wrote: ↑Tue 7 Jul 2020 5:58 AMIn general those 7 rangers only excel because they are assisting .... bow damage also is boosted well for rangers with PF. Scouts have issuesKillkannon wrote: ↑Tue 7 Jul 2020 1:31 AMCadebrennus wrote: ↑Mon 6 Jul 2020 2:17 PM...
Bow damage isn't really good. It's "just okay", which is why most Archers stop at 27 or 35 Archery.
Bow damage is really good now ... And all 7 rangers in my guild are specced 50 bow ... And they hit damn hard ... i tested in duel whit my RR7Lx caster with PD 3 ...
In siege fights i die too many times by scouts ... And my druids (all over RR5Lx) have hard times to keep me alive ... so sorry Cadebrennus ... what you tell is not true at all
Bow damage is still too high ... And make no sense scouts have also permasnare lol
Wed 8 Jul 2020 2:14 AM
by
Nephamael
Scout 1v1 is abyssmal, can just beg for the other guy not to run or he can't kill anything 1v1.
Scout needs selfbuffs and roostyle removed, noone needs to kite for days if he cant kill anything while doing so ^^
Scout needs selfbuffs and roostyle removed, noone needs to kite for days if he cant kill anything while doing so ^^
Wed 8 Jul 2020 5:56 PM
by
gromet12
Nephamael wrote: ↑Wed 8 Jul 2020 2:14 AMScout 1v1 is abyssmal, can just beg for the other guy not to run or he can't kill anything 1v1.
Scout needs selfbuffs and roostyle removed, noone needs to kite for days if he cant kill anything while doing so ^^
You kite for 15secs so you get another critical shot
Wed 8 Jul 2020 6:23 PM
by
Nephamael
You kite for 15secs so you get another critical shot
You can kite for 5+ minutes np vs most enemies, but your enemy can just run away at any time he chooses if he doesn't wanna be kited anymore and the fight is over, noone dies.
Wed 8 Jul 2020 10:22 PM
by
Gildar
Nephamael wrote: ↑Wed 8 Jul 2020 6:23 PMYou kite for 15secs so you get another critical shot
You can kite for 5+ minutes np vs most enemies, but your enemy can just run away at any time he chooses if he doesn't wanna be kited anymore and the fight is over, noone dies.
Not if perma-snared ...
And a caster dont have any chance ... scouts have crit + rapid fire and casters cant cast at all ... can only die ... And if try to flee... long shot and bb caster
Thu 9 Jul 2020 5:04 AM
by
Forlornhope
Gildar wrote: ↑Wed 8 Jul 2020 10:22 PMNephamael wrote: ↑Wed 8 Jul 2020 6:23 PMYou kite for 15secs so you get another critical shot
You can kite for 5+ minutes np vs most enemies, but your enemy can just run away at any time he chooses if he doesn't wanna be kited anymore and the fight is over, noone dies.
Not if perma-snared ...
And a caster dont have any chance ... scouts have crit + rapid fire and casters cant cast at all ... can only die ... And if try to flee... long shot and bb caster
all you have to do is wait for him to shoot you once, then instead of running into his melee range run the other way. No solo scout will have the dps to kill you before you get out of range, unless you're a caster. But archers of any kind are literally set up to kill casters, it's almost the point of playing the class.. But how many solo casters do you see running around that's not a bd? Who would have zero issues beating a scout in a 1v1.
Thu 9 Jul 2020 6:39 AM
by
inoeth
Forlornhope wrote: ↑Thu 9 Jul 2020 5:04 AMGildar wrote: ↑Wed 8 Jul 2020 10:22 PMNephamael wrote: ↑Wed 8 Jul 2020 6:23 PMYou kite for 15secs so you get another critical shot
You can kite for 5+ minutes np vs most enemies, but your enemy can just run away at any time he chooses if he doesn't wanna be kited anymore and the fight is over, noone dies.
Not if perma-snared ...
And a caster dont have any chance ... scouts have crit + rapid fire and casters cant cast at all ... can only die ... And if try to flee... long shot and bb caster
all you have to do is wait for him to shoot you once, then instead of running into his melee range run the other way. No solo scout will have the dps to kill you before you get out of range, unless you're a caster. But archers of any kind are literally set up to kill casters, it's almost the point of playing the class.. But how many solo casters do you see running around that's not a bd? Who would have zero issues beating a scout in a 1v1.
thats not exactly true, everything with pet will beat a scout.
so in the end it comes down to two caster classes that are beatable with scout:
runemaster
eldritch
and those only if they have no brain or wrong spec (no NS)
Fri 24 Jul 2020 8:21 PM
by
jlxscholar
I mean, BD's had their insta-LT set to 5 seconds.
That is a considerable nerf. Well-timed disease and I think any assassin or duo could take one if done right.
Sat 25 Jul 2020 1:01 AM
by
easytoremember
what's disease going to do?jlxscholar wrote: ↑Fri 24 Jul 2020 8:21 PM
I mean, BD's had their insta-LT set to 5 seconds.
That is a considerable nerf. Well-timed disease and I think any assassin or duo could take one if done right.
Sat 25 Jul 2020 8:50 AM
by
Noashakra
And they still don't need to do more than stand and drain with PD 5+jlxscholar wrote: ↑Fri 24 Jul 2020 8:21 PM
I mean, BD's had their insta-LT set to 5 seconds.
That is a considerable nerf. Well-timed disease and I think any assassin or duo could take one if done right.
it's impossible to kill a BD with PD for a melee, end of the story.
You know all the other mages except the necro need to QC root or something to win...
Sat 25 Jul 2020 11:15 AM
by
Adwaenyth
Forlornhope wrote: ↑Tue 7 Jul 2020 6:22 PMOh man, scouts can finally kill something in a 1v1 better nerf 'em!
The problem is just how they are doing it. Slam, Root and run. If you can't get snare on, it's ridicolous.
The next thing is, that they can crit shot you although you and they were engaged in melee... if it were just normal arrows, that wouldn't be much of a problem, but if you eat a crit for 900 then that's hard to compensate for anyone.
Sat 25 Jul 2020 1:07 PM
by
Cadebrennus
Adwaenyth wrote: ↑Sat 25 Jul 2020 11:15 AMForlornhope wrote: ↑Tue 7 Jul 2020 6:22 PMOh man, scouts can finally kill something in a 1v1 better nerf 'em!
The problem is just how they are doing it. Slam, Root and run. If you can't get snare on, it's ridicolous.
The next thing is, that they can crit shot you although you and they were engaged in melee... if it were just normal arrows, that wouldn't be much of a problem, but if you eat a crit for 900 then that's hard to compensate for anyone.
It's about time an Archer can kill something with... *gasp* ....Archery!
Sat 25 Jul 2020 1:24 PM
by
Forlornhope
Adwaenyth wrote: ↑Sat 25 Jul 2020 11:15 AMForlornhope wrote: ↑Tue 7 Jul 2020 6:22 PMOh man, scouts can finally kill something in a 1v1 better nerf 'em!
The problem is just how they are doing it. Slam, Root and run. If you can't get snare on, it's ridicolous.
The next thing is, that they can crit shot you although you and they were engaged in melee... if it were just normal arrows, that wouldn't be much of a problem, but if you eat a crit for 900 then that's hard to compensate for anyone.
You realize all you need to do to counter them is run the opposite way right? Or use a dd charge to rupt them. They're still really easily countered by basically every class that doesn't die in less than 4 shots.
Sat 25 Jul 2020 5:02 PM
by
Killkannon
Forlornhope wrote: ↑Sat 25 Jul 2020 1:24 PMAdwaenyth wrote: ↑Sat 25 Jul 2020 11:15 AMForlornhope wrote: ↑Tue 7 Jul 2020 6:22 PMOh man, scouts can finally kill something in a 1v1 better nerf 'em!
The problem is just how they are doing it. Slam, Root and run. If you can't get snare on, it's ridicolous.
The next thing is, that they can crit shot you although you and they were engaged in melee... if it were just normal arrows, that wouldn't be much of a problem, but if you eat a crit for 900 then that's hard to compensate for anyone.
You realize all you need to do to counter them is run the opposite way right? Or use a dd charge to rupt them. They're still really easily countered by basically every class that doesn't die in less than 4 shots.
I don't think anyone believes running away is a counter. Use a dd charge? Well then for the next 2 min what? Oh run away... So look you have put scouts on the same level as necros and bds. Go watch Tani's video and tell that paly he should have just ran away. Scouts get to pick their victims unlike necros and bd's. And they pick targets that are easily killed by this mechanic. It's not rocket science. There is a reason the game creators didn't give ranged damage permanent crowd control.
Sat 25 Jul 2020 5:17 PM
by
Adwaenyth
Forlornhope wrote: ↑Sat 25 Jul 2020 1:24 PMYou realize all you need to do to counter them is run the opposite way right? Or use a dd charge to rupt them. They're still really easily countered by basically every class that doesn't die in less than 4 shots.
You realize NOT fighting them is not a counter but them just winning?
Sun 26 Jul 2020 8:28 AM
by
Noashakra
This is what I am saying since ages, nobody wins, the scout only kill people that persist running after them without the tools to interupt them.
Give them more tool to have interesting fights. Like up a bit their melee dmg, or a cool style bleed unique to them, and remove the root.
Give them more tool to have interesting fights. Like up a bit their melee dmg, or a cool style bleed unique to them, and remove the root.
Sun 26 Jul 2020 9:14 AM
by
Forlornhope
Adwaenyth wrote: ↑Sat 25 Jul 2020 5:17 PMForlornhope wrote: ↑Sat 25 Jul 2020 1:24 PMYou realize all you need to do to counter them is run the opposite way right? Or use a dd charge to rupt them. They're still really easily countered by basically every class that doesn't die in less than 4 shots.
You realize NOT fighting them is not a counter but them just winning?
If you don't have the skills in your class to counter them, then running away is the only smart things to do. No one wins, but you take away their ability to kill you, it's like fighting a mins sometimes the best thing you can hope for is a draw where they blow sos and have to dip out. And guess what this is ok, some classes just can't beat some classes and that is how this game is. Why people can't understand this after 20 years baffles me. A counter doesn't necessarily mean you'll win the fight, but making their one and only strategy useless is a pretty strong tactic even if it ends in a draw.
Mon 27 Jul 2020 4:47 PM
by
Siouxsie
Solution: Remove custom level 45 scout shield snare style.
It should never have been put in the game to begin with. It was an extremely poor design choice.
It should never have been put in the game to begin with. It was an extremely poor design choice.
Thu 30 Jul 2020 5:32 PM
by
Centenario
I would like this shield style to be removed, and the scout archery damage to be increased by 20-30% 
Or other suggestions:
- Give scout access to polearms
- Give scout access to two-handed
- Give scout access to chain armor
- Give scout access to self buffs
- Remove 5.5 speed bow from ranger and give 6.0 speed to scout
- Increase damage table of scout (melee and archery)
- Allow avalonian and half ogres to become scouts
- Make Volley and Longshot Archery line abilities
Or other suggestions:
- Give scout access to polearms
- Give scout access to two-handed
- Give scout access to chain armor
- Give scout access to self buffs
- Remove 5.5 speed bow from ranger and give 6.0 speed to scout
- Increase damage table of scout (melee and archery)
- Allow avalonian and half ogres to become scouts
- Make Volley and Longshot Archery line abilities
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