Do something about the PVE tower/keep sieges

We need to do something about the PvE thats going on all the time around tower and keep sieges...

Its nearly impossible just to run small groups and fight, due to everyone is joining the BGs, and doing mindless farming of keeps.

Its more fun to actually do really PvE than it is to run in RvR BG groups.

And it seems like the server is getting more and more of zerging towers, by each day thats going.

And the BG leaders are taking towers instead of engaging each other. They really seem to avoid each other.

Thats not what i will call RvR, but just plain simple and really borring PvE.

I do hope that you will do some anti tower humping against the BGs, and bring real RvR/PvP back.

Sun 28 Jun 2020 7:12 PM by ExcretusMaximus

The reward for taking towers is ridiculous, especially when they're not even defended.

500 RP for a tower that takes 2 minutes to take is just too much.

Towers should be worth less and keeps worth more.

IMO.

Sun 28 Jun 2020 7:49 PM by easytoremember

Well people are too scared of dying; one BG v BG fight and the losing side has half its numbers disband immediately
On the opposite end people get too eager to die when there is something to be gained death (see task suicides from 2019)

Sun 28 Jun 2020 9:54 PM by dbeattie71

Selluz wrote: ↑
Sun 28 Jun 2020 6:20 PM
We need to do something about the PvE thats going on all the time around tower and keep sieges...

Its nearly impossible just to run small groups and fight, due to everyone is joining the BGs, and doing mindless farming of keeps.

Its more fun to actually do really PvE than it is to run in RvR BG groups.

And it seems like the server is getting more and more of zerging towers, by each day thats going.

And the BG leaders are taking towers instead of engaging each other. They really seem to avoid each other.

Thats not what i will call RvR, but just plain simple and really borring PvE.

I do hope that you will do some anti tower humping against the BGs, and bring real RvR/PvP back.

OP must not play the same game. Whew today was fun, fights all over the place.

Mon 29 Jun 2020 12:01 AM by Gildar

Selluz wrote: ↑
Sun 28 Jun 2020 6:20 PM
We need to do something about the PvE thats going on all the time around tower and keep sieges...

Its nearly impossible just to run small groups and fight, due to everyone is joining the BGs, and doing mindless farming of keeps.

Its more fun to actually do really PvE than it is to run in RvR BG groups.

And it seems like the server is getting more and more of zerging towers, by each day thats going.

And the BG leaders are taking towers instead of engaging each other. They really seem to avoid each other.

Thats not what i will call RvR, but just plain simple and really borring PvE.

I do hope that you will do some anti tower humping against the BGs, and bring real RvR/PvP back.

Why all have to enjoy your playstyle ???

Run small is really boring ... run 20 mins to kill some soloers near flags or add other fights -.-
This is your real rvr ???

8v8 is completely different but, you know, finding place in 8mens grp is nearly impossible if u dont know some of them, maybe also in RL ... so casuals have to give up after they spend 1 hour standing in relic town shouting desperately LFG ...

RvR is realm v realm not 3 v1 or 3v3 ... the Real rvr is exactly zerg v zerg.

U wanna play 3v3 or 5v5 ? Wrong game.

Uninstall and start download Guild Wars.

Peace and Love .

Mon 29 Jun 2020 4:41 AM by Forlornhope

Gildar wrote: ↑
Mon 29 Jun 2020 12:01 AM
Selluz wrote: ↑
Sun 28 Jun 2020 6:20 PM
We need to do something about the PvE thats going on all the time around tower and keep sieges...

Its nearly impossible just to run small groups and fight, due to everyone is joining the BGs, and doing mindless farming of keeps.

Its more fun to actually do really PvE than it is to run in RvR BG groups.

And it seems like the server is getting more and more of zerging towers, by each day thats going.

And the BG leaders are taking towers instead of engaging each other. They really seem to avoid each other.

Thats not what i will call RvR, but just plain simple and really borring PvE.

I do hope that you will do some anti tower humping against the BGs, and bring real RvR/PvP back.

Why all have to enjoy your playstyle ???

Run small is really boring ... run 20 mins to kill some soloers near flags or add other fights -.-
This is your real rvr ???

8v8 is completely different but, you know, finding place in 8mens grp is nearly impossible if u dont know some of them, maybe also in RL ... so casuals have to give up after they spend 1 hour standing in relic town shouting desperately LFG ...

RvR is realm v realm not 3 v1 or 3v3 ... the Real rvr is exactly zerg v zerg.

U wanna play 3v3 or 5v5 ? Wrong game.

Uninstall and start download Guild Wars.

Peace and Love .

Technically any sort of combat against an enemy realm should be considered RvR, regardless of numbers. I really don't understand how people just kind of ignore the fact that this game literally gives you almost unlimited options of play styles, but somehow think their play style is the only one that is correct. It can be said for both side of this argument, the zerg v zerg people and the small man/solos/8mans. You're all pretty much hypocrites.

Mon 29 Jun 2020 7:16 AM by Helwyr

My experience running with the Hib BG on this server just doesn't match with what the OP is saying, often see some huge battles, sometimes with all 3 Realms BGs on the same field of battle. Are empty towers also frequently taken? Of course, but not just for RPs or because everyone wants to PvE, but because NFs requires that if your playing the actual RvR game of trying to hold and gain territory and capture relics. But to say fights vs other players are avoided by Realm BGs just isn't true.

Mon 29 Jun 2020 9:56 AM by Gildar

Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Mon 29 Jun 2020 4:41 AM
....

Technically any sort of combat against an enemy realm should be considered RvR, regardless of numbers. I really don't understand how people just kind of ignore the fact that this game literally gives you almost unlimited options of play styles, but somehow think their play style is the only one that is correct. It can be said for both side of this argument, the zerg v zerg people and the small man/solos/8mans. You're all pretty much hypocrites.

Maybe I wasn't clear, so I try to explain my thoughts better.

I never said that zerg v zerg is the only way to play ... and I never said that the other playstyles are not feasible and in fact I have not asked (as the author of the post) to change the server rules to favor a certain type of playstyle.

I just pointed out that, imho, small is boring and that (imho again) zerg v zerg is whatI consider the real RvR.

Anyway, I play in the BG Hib and often there are fights, small and large, and often the BG leader besieged towers / keeps only to wake up the enemy realm and provoke a reaction, with the consequent fights.

@Helwyr: what BG leader u follow ? Pilz ? just to know

Mon 29 Jun 2020 2:58 PM by ExcretusMaximus

Helwyr wrote: ↑
Mon 29 Jun 2020 7:16 AM
My experience running with the Hib BG on this server just doesn't match with what the OP is saying, often see some huge battles, sometimes with all 3 Realms BGs on the same field of battle. Are empty towers also frequently taken? Of course, but not just for RPs or because everyone wants to PvE, but because NFs requires that if your playing the actual RvR game of trying to hold and gain territory and capture relics. But to say fights vs other players are avoided by Realm BGs just isn't true.

Come to Mid and run for a month, you'll see exactly what he's talking about.

Mon 29 Jun 2020 3:01 PM by Sepplord

ExcretusMaximus wrote: ↑
Mon 29 Jun 2020 2:58 PM
Helwyr wrote: ↑
Mon 29 Jun 2020 7:16 AM
My experience running with the Hib BG on this server just doesn't match with what the OP is saying, often see some huge battles, sometimes with all 3 Realms BGs on the same field of battle. Are empty towers also frequently taken? Of course, but not just for RPs or because everyone wants to PvE, but because NFs requires that if your playing the actual RvR game of trying to hold and gain territory and capture relics. But to say fights vs other players are avoided by Realm BGs just isn't true.

Come to Mid and run for a month, you'll see exactly what he's talking about.

Sounds like it's a leader/follower problem then...
Maybe Pilzpower is an institution on Hib and can afford to wipe without 50% of the people leaving and the other 50% starting a flamewar in battlechat. While other leaders in Midgard can't...

Just an assumption though, correct me if i am wrong

Mon 29 Jun 2020 3:16 PM by ExcretusMaximus

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Mon 29 Jun 2020 3:01 PM
Sounds like it's a leader/follower problem then...
Maybe Pilzpower is an institution on Hib and can afford to wipe without 50% of the people leaving and the other 50% starting a flamewar in battlechat. While other leaders in Midgard can't...

Just an assumption though, correct me if i am wrong

I very rarely run with the zerg (I have no attention span and get bored) but from reading the BG chat, you're not wrong. Our leaders are fine, Ffej, Oaden, and Johny all do a great job leading, but the typical Mid player's morale seems to break easily. They don't lose 50% of the BG when they wipe, but they do lose a pretty good portion of it. So they've learned to avoid BG vs BG unless it's a relic situation or a defense.

Just my observations, but like I said, I rarely join them so I could be wrong.

Mon 29 Jun 2020 3:55 PM by joshisanonymous

Honestly having trouble understanding exactly what the complaint is here. First they say it's impossible to run a smallman, but the reason given is because BGs spend too much time attacking keeps, which is weird since there's nothing about a BG attacking a keep that stops you from running a smallman. Then they say that BGs should be attacking other BGs directly more because attacking keeps is boring, but that implies that the OP would join the BG if the BG was attacking other BGs, yet that's a much different playstyle than smallman. Then there's some random stuff about towers thrown in there.

Seriously, what exactly is the complaint?

Mon 29 Jun 2020 4:58 PM by Selluz

First of all. I do recall when server opened in old frontier.

There was so many to fight, small mans, 8v8, wich almost allways ended up in a zerg fight. But at least it was a fight.

Due to everyone joining a BG today, and with the solo pvp zone, duo/smallmans got nothing to do.
Because if you roam a smallman, you will get wiped over with some random noob 8 man roaming where duos/smallmans are roaming, wich is away from the BGs.

And taking a keep or tower is just mindless PvE in an RvR zone....

I do miss the old action that old frontier provided, but with no random porters into RvR zones.

As i can see, it would be nice if something could be done about the massive BG tower/keep farming, and avoiding each other, or they should open up a zone for a max of 4 ppl, so duo/trios can compete against 4 man.
Its hard to find a premade 8 man to run everyday, and imo 4 people is somehow doable.

Maybe just open a solo - 4 man zone, for instant action, away from the BGs?

Mon 29 Jun 2020 5:14 PM by ExcretusMaximus

Selluz wrote: ↑
Mon 29 Jun 2020 4:58 PM
Maybe just open a solo - 4 man zone, for instant action, away from the BGs?

More zones is not the answer, less is.

You point out that funneling people away from the frontiers is the problem, and then ask them to do it more. Get rid of all these extraneous zones.

Mon 29 Jun 2020 7:38 PM by Destz

Easy solution to the crappy state of RVR zerg-mode would be to cut the realm point gain from taking towers/keeps. Yes it can be fun running around dotting, aoe'ing, TWF'ing everything for a few runs but come on.... this can't be what the majority want to do night after night?

I actually looked forward to NF but the action in OF was so much better. There was something to do for everyone.

Mon 29 Jun 2020 8:13 PM by pollojack

Y'all know people go to the BG to avoid getting run down by 8 mans when they are less than 8?

Attacking keep and tower RPs is the wrong method here.

Make 8 mans vs solos worth 10% rps, no task credit. Linear increase as it goes to 8.

Encourage people to run solo. Encourage people to run small. There are small carrots for solo and small man kills but removing the stick of getting run down will help too.

Mon 29 Jun 2020 8:21 PM by Helwyr

Reading the OP and a number of the comments, the real problem here isn't a new one, it's players that come to this game thinking it should be like a game of counter strike, with frequent fights against even numbers. Completely ignoring they are playing a Massively Multiplayer Role Playing Game built around a concept of three Realms ....not individuals, not 4 people, not 8, not groups, not guilds... REALMS... fighting each other. The problem caused by this erroneous view point is further exacerbated because pre-made 8 man groups can and do get away with ignoring what this game is all about, because they have speed 6 and the highest group number benefiting from that speed and other group abilities is 8. Sure sometimes you could have multiple speed 6 pre-made 8mans working together, but it doesn't happen that often here in Phoenix from what I've seen. But you can be sure if it does the whines from the 8 man community will be loud and unending. But to have solo, duos, and 4 man all wanting the game mechanics twisted to their desired arena style game play of a particular number fighting each other is just ridiculous. You know people have entirely lost the plot when they're calling for taking of keeps to yield no REALM points. .. yeah Realm, not PvP points, not duel points, not group vs group or guild vs guild points... they are called Realm points for a reason.

Lastly small man fights aren't prevented from occurring because of BG/Zergs or w/e you want to call them, it's 8 mans that make that hard, because of math, 8 generally is greater than 4, same for visible solo except you can now add small mans to the problem as 4 is generally greater than 1. Battle groups are generally easily avoided. If your desired gameplay requires either all other players adhering to your made up rules or the fundamentals of the game being changed, your probably playing the wrong game.

Gildar wrote: ↑
Mon 29 Jun 2020 9:56 AM
[...]
@Helwyr: what BG leader u follow ? Pilz ? just to know

It was Pilzpower the other day yes, but it's not like I follow specific leaders and not others, just whomever seems to be running the show at the time I'm playing.

Mon 29 Jun 2020 8:21 PM by dbeattie71

Destz wrote: ↑
Mon 29 Jun 2020 7:38 PM
Easy solution to the crappy state of RVR zerg-mode would be to cut the realm point gain from taking towers/keeps. Yes it can be fun running around dotting, aoe'ing, TWF'ing everything for a few runs but come on.... this can't be what the majority want to do night after night?

I actually looked forward to NF but the action in OF was so much better. There was something to do for everyone.

Hated the switch to NF but now I like it and NF is wayyyyyyyyy better. Weird how ppl have different optionions.