Stealth Nerf to Glimmer Griever Drops?

on Hib, one of our prime farming spots is Sheeroe Hils, and notably on the Grievers due to their metal armor drops. Apparently with the latest buff pot patch, the drop rate or drop table has been altered significantly. Was this intentional?

Fri 10 May 2019 4:17 PM by

Uthred

It is not a stealth nerf or a ninja nerf. Grievers were just wrong. They had drops on them which they shouldnt have dropped at all. Those drops got removed.

"– Monsters from level 6 to 55 won’t drop regular items." --> http://playphoenix.wiki/miscellaneous-changes/

Glimmer Grievers are level 48, 49, 50, 51, 52 and had their regular (salvageloot) on them. That got fixed. They will only drop ROGs now.

Fri 10 May 2019 4:32 PM by Dominus

will Malmo Axehands who are still dropping classic chain also be adjusted?

Fri 10 May 2019 4:43 PM by

Uthred

We are atm checking "salvageloot"-mobs and if we find any other mobs that dont have the correct loot on it, we will fix that. Feel free to open a bug report if you know of any mobs that have the wrong loot on them. And not only in the other realms, but also in your own.

Fri 10 May 2019 5:09 PM by Tree

Well you do realize that this is a bad idea, because the hibernian economy is already completely destroyed and there are people probably sitting on hundreds of platin by now. And that is just plain unfair to new(er) players, because there is not a single activity in this game that even comes close to this plat/hour.

Fri 10 May 2019 5:35 PM by Halma

There will be some funny moments at the Azurs now.
And with funny I mean akward. Until they also get fixed (,they are orange so I guess they aren't above 55 as well).
But there are alternatives. They may not give 8p/hour but 4-5p, so it's not that bad.
But as mentioned, it's bad for everyone who did not have the chance to farm there until now.

It would have been worth mentioning in the patch notes.

Fri 10 May 2019 6:39 PM by chryso

Tree wrote: ↑
Fri 10 May 2019 5:09 PM
Well you do realize that this is a bad idea, because the hibernian economy is already completely destroyed and there are people probably sitting on hundreds of platin by now. And that is just plain unfair to new(er) players, because there is not a single activity in this game that even comes close to this plat/hour.

Are you suggesting that because Hib has been getting too much free money that they should be allowed to continue getting more free money and that it is unfair to stop Hib from getting more free money?

Fri 10 May 2019 6:40 PM by Sektor

How can you allow this?

The inflation on hib is so ridiculous already it makes it IMPOSSIBLE for those of us who just came here to catch up.

How can you do this?

Fri 10 May 2019 6:41 PM by Rookie

yet more hib nerfs as if hib not losing enough players already. Guess I picked the wrong time to reroll hib, bac kto alb like 90% of population then. Nice way to ruin the hib economy for players who just switched to hib, how do we now compete with people who have 100's of plats and can keep prices inflated

Fri 10 May 2019 7:11 PM by Prometheus

Uthred wrote: ↑
Fri 10 May 2019 4:17 PM
It is not a stealth nerf or a ninja nerf. Grievers were just wrong. They had drops on them which they shouldnt have dropped at all. Those drops got removed.

"– Monsters from level 6 to 55 won’t drop regular items." --> http://playphoenix.wiki/miscellaneous-changes/

Glimmer Grievers are level 48, 49, 50, 51, 52 and had their regular (salvageloot) on them. That got fixed. They will only drop ROGs now.

Wow, this is a pretty huge change, I had thought it was intended for mobs in Sheeroe Hills to have their own loot so you could actually make money with salvage.

Fri 10 May 2019 7:21 PM by Dominus

friend on Mid says he's farming Axehands right now and classic metal armor is dropping nicely for him (still).

Fri 10 May 2019 7:36 PM by Sektor

Dominus wrote: nd on Mid says he's farming Axehands right now and classic metal armor is dropping nicely for him (still).

working as intended.

Fri 10 May 2019 7:53 PM by

Uthred

Fixed it. Pls open a bug report. That would help a lot more than browsing the forum.

Fri 10 May 2019 10:24 PM by Tree

I understand you consider it a fix, but you dont fix things that now turn out to be major economic exploits four months after the server launched. Would have been much better to just pretend this was working as intended all along, just like everyone who farmed them probably assumed.

Taking it away now is just bad for every latecomer.

Same goes for every similar spawn in other realms.

Sat 11 May 2019 12:09 AM by Quik

Tree wrote: ↑
Fri 10 May 2019 10:24 PM
I understand you consider it a fix, but you dont fix things that now turn out to be major economic exploits four months after the server launched. Would have been much better to just pretend this was working as intended all along, just like everyone who farmed them probably assumed.

Taking it away now is just bad for every latecomer.

Same goes for every similar spawn in other realms.

I understand your point of view, but isn't this the same as a character being OP from some bug and the dev's fixing it so the character is now where it should be power wise? New players won't be able to abuse the OP character but it still needs to be fixed.

Just because people are late doesn't mean something doesn't need patched.

Sat 11 May 2019 12:34 AM by Sektor

Quik wrote:
Tree wrote: ↑
Fri 10 May 2019 10:24 PM
I understand you consider it a fix, but you dont fix things that now turn out to be major economic exploits four months after the server launched. Would have been much better to just pretend this was working as intended all along, just like everyone who farmed them probably assumed.

Taking it away now is just bad for every latecomer.

Same goes for every similar spawn in other realms.

I understand your point of view, but isn't this the same as a character being OP from some bug and the dev's fixing it so the character is now where it should be power wise? New players won't be able to abuse the OP character but it still needs to be fixed.

Just because people are late doesn't mean something doesn't need patched.

Not the same at all. This is an ACCOUNT WIDE nerf for anyone new to Hibernia. The inflation is so that it makes it nearly impossible for new players to compete with purchasing rogs/feather gear. Do you not see this?

Sat 11 May 2019 12:47 AM by Dominus

Since your'e dead set on increasing pve farm times for all, the Azure Banishers in SH are still drop Shimmering Sheeroe chain, albeit at a fraction of Grievers. Also, the continue to drop a flowery jewel. Definitely not a rog.

Hammer that death nail good!

Sat 11 May 2019 12:52 AM by dbeattie71

Dominus wrote: ↑
Sat 11 May 2019 12:47 AM
Since your'e dead set on increasing pve farm times for all, the Azure Banishers in SH are still drop Shimmering Sheeroe chain, albeit at a fraction of Grievers. Also, the continue to drop a flowery jewel. Definitely not a rog.

Hammer that death nail good!

But Azures are my friends 😂

Sat 11 May 2019 1:14 AM by Leandrys

Please nerf, sorry meant fix ofc, even more Hibernia, let our population drop to half other realm's ones, will improve a lot our situation.

Sat 11 May 2019 3:47 AM by ExcretusMaximus

chryso wrote: ↑
Fri 10 May 2019 6:39 PM
Are you suggesting that because Hib has been getting too much free money that they should be allowed to continue getting more free money and that it is unfair to stop Hib from getting more free money?

I think his point is more along the lines of them allowing the bug to persist for months, and not addressing it, but choosing to do so now when the economy is so out of whack that it is unfixable. So now it's a case of the rich being able to afford anything, and the poor being unable to catch up and afford the items they need. Prices will not deflate without a way to remove the stockpiled wealth, so the unwealthy (or just starting out) players suffer over a poor decision to wait until this late date to fix the drop table.

Sat 11 May 2019 8:19 AM by Boomslang

I have heard from a friend on Hib that the Banisher mobs are still getting Shimmering Drops which is completely not fair to the other realms. If this is the case, Azure banishers should also be adjusted just as Axehands, and Grievers have had their loot tables "fixed". This friend let me know through Discord, that in about an hour he was still able to farm about 4-5plat at Azure banishers today after the patch/fix went in.

Sat 11 May 2019 9:30 AM by Hejjin

ExcretusMaximus wrote: ↑
Sat 11 May 2019 3:47 AM
chryso wrote: ↑
Fri 10 May 2019 6:39 PM
Are you suggesting that because Hib has been getting too much free money that they should be allowed to continue getting more free money and that it is unfair to stop Hib from getting more free money?

I think his point is more along the lines of them allowing the bug to persist for months, and not addressing it, but choosing to do so now when the economy is so out of whack that it is unfixable. So now it's a case of the rich being able to afford anything, and the poor being unable to catch up and afford the items they need. Prices will not deflate without a way to remove the stockpiled wealth, so the unwealthy (or just starting out) players suffer over a poor decision to wait until this late date to fix the drop table.

Emphasis added. Stating that they allowed the bug to persist for months implies that they were aware of the bug. Were these mobs dropping this loot in the beta? If so did anyone report it, or did people turn a blind eye to it hoping that they would be able exploit it after the game went live to get very rich?

Sat 11 May 2019 1:29 PM by Prometheus

Hejjin wrote: ↑
Sat 11 May 2019 9:30 AM
Emphasis added. Stating that they allowed the bug to persist for months implies that they were aware of the bug. Were these mobs dropping this loot in the beta? If so did anyone report it, or did people turn a blind eye to it hoping that they would be able exploit it after the game went live to get very rich?

I truly believe everyone assumed it was intended for that particular zone since mobs everywhere else didn't have loot tables, it was always talked about in advice in Hibernia that Sheeroe Hills was the place to farm, I don't play any other realm so I thought alb/mid had their own equivalent zone for farming as well.

Sat 11 May 2019 1:38 PM by dbeattie71

Boomslang wrote: ↑
Sat 11 May 2019 8:19 AM
I have heard from a friend on Hib that the Banisher mobs are still getting Shimmering Drops which is completely not fair to the other realms. If this is the case, Azure banishers should also be adjusted just as Axehands, and Grievers have had their loot tables "fixed". This friend let me know through Discord, that in about an hour he was still able to farm about 4-5plat at Azure banishers today after the patch/fix went in.

Banishers max level is 57 so if they’re greater than 55, it’s normal.

Sat 11 May 2019 1:41 PM by Hejjin

Prometheus wrote: ↑
Sat 11 May 2019 1:29 PM
Hejjin wrote: ↑
Sat 11 May 2019 9:30 AM
Emphasis added. Stating that they allowed the bug to persist for months implies that they were aware of the bug. Were these mobs dropping this loot in the beta? If so did anyone report it, or did people turn a blind eye to it hoping that they would be able exploit it after the game went live to get very rich?

I truly believe everyone assumed it was intended for that particular zone since mobs everywhere else didn't have loot tables, it was always talked about in advice in Hibernia that Sheeroe Hills was the place to farm, I don't play any other realm so I thought alb/mid had their own equivalent zone for farming as well.

I did not take part in the Beta, so when I was on Midgard for the first week after launch I thought those chain and weapon drops in Malmohus at the Drakulv camp by the lake were intended loot. I did not have salvage on that char, so I did not realise that they salvaged for more than normal ROG's. Likewise in Albion with mobs in Lyn Barfog and various Giants in Dartmoor close to the lair. So yes I believe some of the people that farmed those areas did not realise the loot tables were wrong.

Sat 11 May 2019 2:21 PM by

Uthred

As I wrote before, we are going to rework it for all realms. This was done today. --> https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=40&p=62918#p62918

The droprate was to high and it got reduced. After an internal discussion we changed the min. level from lvl 55+ to lvl 50+. All mobs lvl 50+ (in average) will drop salvageloot. This will be updated on the wiki very shortly.

Sat 11 May 2019 2:27 PM by Sektor

Uthred wrote: As I wrote before, we are going to rework it for all realms. This was done today. --> https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=40&p=62918#p62918

The droprate was to high and it got reduced. After an internal discussion we changed the min. level from lvl 55+ to lvl 50+. All mobs lvl 50+ (in average) will drop salvageloot. This will be updated on the wiki very shortly.

wonderful thank you for listening. This is the fair response.

Sat 11 May 2019 3:35 PM by Dominus

Uthred wrote: ↑
Sat 11 May 2019 2:21 PM
As I wrote before, we are going to rework it for all realms. This was done today. --> https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=40&p=62918#p62918

The droprate was to high and it got reduced. After an internal discussion we changed the min. level from lvl 55+ to lvl 50+. All mobs lvl 50+ (in average) will drop salvageloot. This will be updated on the wiki very shortly.

Uthred, can you tweak the drop rates a bit higher? Tested grievers for a few hours and the drop rate is underwhelming. Obviously this would apply to all three realms.

Sat 11 May 2019 8:57 PM by Rookie

Farmed azure banishes for 2 hours only got 265 arc bars. Now people have to spend longer in pve to get plats for template, time which could be spent in RvR

Sun 12 May 2019 2:01 AM by Painn

Wait a minute, let me get this straight.....

The dev priority was to nerf sheeroe hills. Done.
Hibs point out spots in other realms that were not "fixed". Mobs get fixed.
Mids whine more. "Internal discussion" takes place and the "fixes" are reevaluated.

Interesting.

Sun 12 May 2019 2:15 AM by Leandrys

Something is starting to turn really wrong in this server, at first it was all about QoL, now it's all adding the max nerfs possible to that QoL.

I don't get it. the moment people were able to get all secondaries at 1100 for 150 gold, you could guess economy was going to be broken, so why trying to fix it ?

Why do you even care about plats, devs ? What's the point ? People who want to farm plats for crafting or buying bigger houses should have them easily, leave them in their own personnal spot.

Instead make people win much more feathers in RvR and buy credits with them for nammed, problem solved, no more boring raids, even better, get rid of feathers and replace them with BP, increase BP's gains in RvR or make high end items low priced, another easy fix, there are tons of ways to make huge stack of plats almost useless, inflation will not gently turn into deflation this easily, you're just killing new players who will never catch up high RR players now anyway.

At this rate of population's loss, Phoenix could be left in less than one year with a few albs high RR FGs, one big bad mid bus of 80 players and 10 hibs, including 8 NS, 1 2L3 luri ranger and one lvl 11 warden LFG xp at parths, stop focusing on clueless things.

Sun 12 May 2019 2:47 AM by Haruspex

Uthred wrote: ↑
Sat 11 May 2019 2:21 PM
As I wrote before, we are going to rework it for all realms. This was done today. --> https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=40&p=62918#p62918

The droprate was to high and it got reduced. After an internal discussion we changed the min. level from lvl 55+ to lvl 50+. All mobs lvl 50+ (in average) will drop salvageloot. This will be updated on the wiki very shortly.

But it's not like that though.

People are killing oj, red and purple mobs in Malmohus on Mid and nothing but rog is dropping. There's no 'salvage loot' dropping, that being the regular items that salvage for more than the 3 bars that rog does.

Sun 12 May 2019 6:56 AM by

Uthred

If you think a mob doesnt drop salvageloot, feel free to open a bug report and we will look into it. But if those mobs were dropping salvageloot before the change, they will still do it, just with a lower droprate. Only this got changed, nothing else.

Sun 12 May 2019 7:35 AM by Rookie

Drop rate is way to low . Spent 2 hours killing azure banishers with an animist today must of been around 700 mobs and had a total of 3 salvageable loot that wasn't a rog. 20 arcanite bars in 2 hours?

I really don't get why you have made this change

Sun 12 May 2019 10:39 AM by merfp27

Uthred wrote: ↑
Sun 12 May 2019 6:56 AM
If you think a mob doesnt drop salvageloot, feel free to open a bug report and we will look into it. But if those mobs were dropping salvageloot before the change, they will still do it, just with a lower droprate. Only this got changed, nothing else.

Would you be willing to share what the droprates were previously and what they are now? Were they same amongst each realm before the change? Did the mobs that were fixed have similar loot tables amongst each realm?

I get that you have to equalize the droprates amongst the realms, but if you just changed the droprates and didn’t add to the loot tables, then there’s still an imbalance and this could be why people aren’t getting anything from axehands, since they only ever dropped weapons.

Sun 12 May 2019 12:35 PM by Haruspex

Uthred wrote: ↑
Sun 12 May 2019 6:56 AM
If you think a mob doesnt drop salvageloot, feel free to open a bug report and we will look into it. But if those mobs were dropping salvageloot before the change, they will still do it, just with a lower droprate. Only this got changed, nothing else.

Is it possible that the Rog droprate is interfering with the Salvageloot dropping?

Hypothetical example: The game decides a Salvageloot item should drop from the kill, but rog drops instead, overwriting the salvageloot.

Or would the game simply drop a rog AND a Salvageloot?

Sun 12 May 2019 6:26 PM by Prometheus

Rookie wrote: ↑
Sun 12 May 2019 7:35 AM
Drop rate is way to low . Spent 2 hours killing azure banishers with an animist today must of been around 700 mobs and had a total of 3 salvageable loot that wasn't a rog. 20 arcanite bars in 2 hours?

I really don't get why you have made this change

I get that the salvage drop rates were too high, a flat % for the salvage to drop may have looked good on paper but when it's so rare that people aren't sure if it actually drops loot you know that it's too low, this is salvage we are talking about not epic gear that is dropping, I don't expect salvage every pull but atleast something every 10 15 minutes I think would be fair without over-inflating the economy.

Sun 12 May 2019 7:11 PM by leb

sorry you said glimmers griever were fix, but on the same spot there are glimmers striker oj and red for a level 50 and the drop rate is ridiculous....

Sun 12 May 2019 7:26 PM by dbeattie71

Rookie wrote: ↑
Sun 12 May 2019 7:35 AM
Drop rate is way to low . Spent 2 hours killing azure banishers with an animist today must of been around 700 mobs and had a total of 3 salvageable loot that wasn't a rog. 20 arcanite bars in 2 hours?

I really don't get why you have made this change

Yikes, I was around 178 bars for about 45mins.

Sun 12 May 2019 8:10 PM by Warpfield

Some mobs have been wrong, but it seems the changes went out to all salvageable loot. There is now no way for new players to even make money, let alone make a crafter.

Sun 12 May 2019 9:04 PM by dbeattie71

Warpfield wrote: ↑
Sun 12 May 2019 8:10 PM
Some mobs have been wrong, but it seems the changes went out to all salvageable loot. There is now no way for new players to even make money, let alone make a crafter.

Is this a joke?

Mon 13 May 2019 2:16 AM by Mord

Uthred wrote: ↑
Sun 12 May 2019 6:56 AM
If you think a mob doesnt drop salvageloot, feel free to open a bug report and we will look into it. But if those mobs were dropping salvageloot before the change, they will still do it, just with a lower droprate. Only this got changed, nothing else.

You mean like reporting how galladoria doesnt drop stacks or respec stones like Alb and Mid do.
Someone originally posted this over three months ago and it was just closed, with no fix.
I have again reported this over 2 months ago and you changed it to "world" but no fix still.

The economy is now settled around this salvage income. The prices are now set. Hib will be dead before this works its self out to a new level.

Mon 13 May 2019 2:41 AM by dbeattie71

Mord wrote: ↑
Mon 13 May 2019 2:16 AM
Uthred wrote: ↑
Sun 12 May 2019 6:56 AM
If you think a mob doesnt drop salvageloot, feel free to open a bug report and we will look into it. But if those mobs were dropping salvageloot before the change, they will still do it, just with a lower droprate. Only this got changed, nothing else.

You mean like reporting how galladoria doesnt drop stacks or respec stones like Alb and Mid do.
Someone originally posted this over three months ago and it was just closed, with no fix.
I have again reported this over 2 months ago and you changed it to "world" but no fix still.

The economy is now settled around this salvage income. The prices are now set. Hib will be dead before this works its self out to a new level.

Mid and Alb SI dungeons drop respec stones? :O :O ;O wtf

Mon 13 May 2019 3:09 AM by Mord

dbeattie71 wrote: ↑
Mon 13 May 2019 2:41 AM
Mord wrote: ↑
Mon 13 May 2019 2:16 AM
Uthred wrote: ↑
Sun 12 May 2019 6:56 AM
If you think a mob doesnt drop salvageloot, feel free to open a bug report and we will look into it. But if those mobs were dropping salvageloot before the change, they will still do it, just with a lower droprate. Only this got changed, nothing else.

You mean like reporting how galladoria doesnt drop stacks or respec stones like Alb and Mid do.
Someone originally posted this over three months ago and it was just closed, with no fix.
I have again reported this over 2 months ago and you changed it to "world" but no fix still.

The economy is now settled around this salvage income. The prices are now set. Hib will be dead before this works its self out to a new level.

Mid and Alb SI dungeons drop respec stones? :O :O ;O wtf

Yep stacks of single line respecs every kill. I started on alb and then played mid, before coming to hib. I was very surprised about not getting more than 1 stone some times.

Mon 13 May 2019 6:56 AM by Sepplord

Mord wrote: ↑
Mon 13 May 2019 3:09 AM
dbeattie71 wrote: ↑
Mon 13 May 2019 2:41 AM
Mord wrote: ↑
Mon 13 May 2019 2:16 AM
You mean like reporting how galladoria doesnt drop stacks or respec stones like Alb and Mid do.
Someone originally posted this over three months ago and it was just closed, with no fix.
I have again reported this over 2 months ago and you changed it to "world" but no fix still.

The economy is now settled around this salvage income. The prices are now set. Hib will be dead before this works its self out to a new level.

Mid and Alb SI dungeons drop respec stones? :O :O ;O wtf

Yep stacks of single line respecs every kill. I started on alb and then played mid, before coming to hib. I was very surprised about not getting more than 1 stone some times.

stacks? Afaik every boss drops one line respec in TG
(That ofcourse should also happen in Galla, which apparently doesn't)