Assassin balance? - Phoenix Freeshard

How balanced are the three assassins here? Are similar RRs generally evenly matched?

Thu 26 Nov 2020 8:03 PM by Taniquetil

They're all about the same, each has a diff playstyle. SB probably mechanically easiest.
1v1, everything else equal, whichever is played better.

Thrust Inf struggles vs SB early ranks (until around RR8, then it's hard but doable ish)
Slash inf kinda balanced throughout, probs tough vs NS at the start.
SB struggles vs NS early ranks
NS will always struggle vs thrust inf

Honestly, order of strength at low rank NS>INF>SB
Order of power at RR11 - SB>INF>NS

Although watch me get flamed now for saying that.

Thu 26 Nov 2020 8:07 PM by Noashakra

For me at low rank low rank INF>NS>SB
Agree with the high rank order.
But it's really close anyway.

Sat 28 Nov 2020 9:45 PM by darkstar00

I can't speak much for high RR but infs probably have it easiest throughout every realm rank IMO and are really competitive against the other sins every step of the way.

Shadowblade starts out slow then gets better / stronger with each realm rank. Starts to really shine rr5/6+

NS is good but 50 LA/DW from the other sins gives them more than 1 viable spec line vs NS which basically needs to stay CS.

But at the end of the day when all are high rank the differences are marginal. So pick which realm / race suites you best and it will all work out. RNG is always a huge factor in fights anyways so not 1 fight is the same.

Sat 28 Nov 2020 10:39 PM by protege

I believe SBs are the most versatile assassin. LA does particularly well against tanks and hybrids, imho. Less DPS on evade chains, but the ability to burst DPS after a forced purge is a1.

NS/Inf do very well vs. other assassins... perhaps better than SBs at lower rank.

Fri 11 Dec 2020 10:03 AM by SlowMo

Wait? there are low rank sneaks on this server? :-)
I just run into at least 9+ sneaks^^

Fri 11 Dec 2020 1:31 PM by Kevan89

SlowMo wrote: ↑
Fri 11 Dec 2020 10:03 AM
Wait? there are low rank sneaks on this server? :-)
I just run into at least 9+ sneaks^^

Yea, there are, me and my dudes for example we pass most of the time on the ground, maybe the reason cause you dont see us

Fri 11 Dec 2020 11:37 PM by Astaa

What I do find funny is sins whining about moose/IP with their 100 tick viper damage.

You have to remember, that if I finish a fight on 10, 20, 30% HP i'm stood there like a dick (likely diseased) where as you can just fuck off and stealth/hide, wait for a fresh fight, you dont even need to wait for the fight to finish, if it goes bad you can just vanish and reset, I can't. As a Visi, the moment I kill you I am waiting for the next guy to have a pop.

I'm not that bothered, when soloing, I play for the 1v1, whatever happens after I kill (or die, obvs) you doesn't really matter, as a visi I know that once I have won a fight that is that, if I can't get back to a keep or tower then I am generally free RPS. If that means using active RAs then that is that. I will gladly no longer spec IP (I have IP2) if you, not you, but assassins in general, it's cheap, lets be honest here, I wish I could spend points on a straight up damage increase, no longer use viper (5!)

That is the way of a solo visi and always has been and that's fine, it will be much more manageable as I gain RR, currently most are sank into passives, at RR6 that doesn't give a lot of wiggle room for purge/IP.

It's not all about who is best at straight up 1v1 its everything else a visi has to deal with, pre, during and post fight.

I'm sorry but getting high RR or lone enforcer or whatever is nothing on an assassin (on any server) and that's not some sort of big dick challenge, it just is what it is, 90% of your RPs will be against people out of their depth, not set up or ready for a fight.

And like I say, I don't consider equal or thereabouts assassins as over powered in a straight up fight but you have infinitely more options in getting to that RR, All I can do is have the odd good fight and spend 90% of the time getting zerged by bottom feeders or just take the shortcut and zerg a few RRs, even then I am likely to get 1 fight per release because trash are absolutely everywhere, but I can't hide from them. I spent the best part of a decade as a solo hero, I really don't have the energy on this server. I solo but I have no ambition of getting anywhere.

Again, the answer is a solo zone, without the dumb /bowtowns. Frankly I would go as far as banning casters from it too, I want fighting, not mashing 2 or 3 buttons.

Sat 12 Dec 2020 12:06 AM by Stoertebecker

Astaa wrote: ↑
Fri 11 Dec 2020 11:37 PM
What I do find funny is sins whining about moose/IP with their 100 tick viper damage.

Get AoM?

Sat 12 Dec 2020 12:14 AM by Astaa

Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Sat 12 Dec 2020 12:06 AM
Astaa wrote: ↑
Fri 11 Dec 2020 11:37 PM
What I do find funny is sins whining about moose/IP with their 100 tick viper damage.

Get AoM?

Yes mate, at RR6, right on it (and I am well aware how AoM works

) 100 damage less 26% = 74, less AOM 9 (34 points) 20% (it's not cumulative) = 59 damage, opposed to 74 (but even with capped resists its still 102, less capped AoM ~80 damage) Points well spent, I'm sure you will agree.

Or I could just get and use IP2 (or higher as I gain RR)...

Sat 12 Dec 2020 12:20 AM by Noashakra

Also assassins play with weapons with dot procs, LT procs, etc and AoM also works on that (especially SB who can triple dot with a good axe).
AoM 5+ is a must have for everyone that play solo, combined with MoParry and MoBlock. As a solo tank, you want to play defensive vs sins.

And I don't know where people cry about hero/MA/Warrior.
The only BS I hate on my side is reflex attack and DT.

Sat 12 Dec 2020 12:27 AM by Stoertebecker

Astaa wrote: ↑
Sat 12 Dec 2020 12:14 AM
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Sat 12 Dec 2020 12:06 AM
Astaa wrote: ↑
Fri 11 Dec 2020 11:37 PM
What I do find funny is sins whining about moose/IP with their 100 tick viper damage.

Get AoM?

Yes mate, at RR6, right on it (and I am well aware how AoM works ) 100 damage less 26% = 74, less AOM 9 (34 points) 20% (it's not cumulative) = 59 damage, opposed to 74 (but even with capped resists its still 102, less capped AoM ~80 damage) Points well spent, I'm sure you will agree.

Or I could just get and use IP2 (or higher as I gain RR)...

If you think AoM isn`t worth the points go for something else, It`s not only useful against sins.

Yep, at least AoM 5 is a fair trade.

Sat 12 Dec 2020 12:37 AM by Astaa

Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Sat 12 Dec 2020 12:27 AM
Astaa wrote: ↑
Sat 12 Dec 2020 12:14 AM
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Sat 12 Dec 2020 12:06 AM
Astaa wrote: ↑
Fri 11 Dec 2020 11:37 PM
What I do find funny is sins whining about moose/IP with their 100 tick viper damage.

Get AoM?

Yes mate, at RR6, right on it (and I am well aware how AoM works ) 100 damage less 26% = 74, less AOM 9 (34 points) 20% (it's not cumulative) = 59 damage, opposed to 74 (but even with capped resists its still 102, less capped AoM ~80 damage) Points well spent, I'm sure you will agree.

Or I could just get and use IP2 (or higher as I gain RR)...

If you think AoM isn`t worth the points go for something else, It`s not only useful against sins.

Yep, at least AoM 5 is a fair trade.

AoM is absolutely fine if you can spare the points, but I can't

so those 34 points are by far and away much better spent on things like IP that are useful in all fights. I play to win, not fuck about.

34 points = AoM 9 And honestly, nothing like useful for points spent.

30 points = 80% heal

I have IP2 (35% heal) I could use those 10 points on AoM instead and gain 10% resist (10% of whatever is left after 26% SC) SO I could get hit for 90 damage instead of 102 every single tick...reapplied on purge...but why?!

Edit, like I say, I will gladly drop IP if sins drop viper, as it is IP vs viper is pretty equal, the only difference is mine is on a 15 min timer

and again, viper isn't OP, every solo viable class has a counter in IP.

Some random idiot suggested I avoided allowing (allowing, exact words) an assassin to apply lifebane on me, I'm still trying to work out how one would go about that.

Sat 12 Dec 2020 3:39 AM by protege

AoM5 + EM1 if you wanna negate Viper

15 points spent to negate 30 RSPs on the assassin. Amazing trade off imo

Sat 12 Dec 2020 7:17 AM by Stoertebecker

Astaa wrote: ↑
Sat 12 Dec 2020 12:37 AM
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Sat 12 Dec 2020 12:27 AM
Astaa wrote: ↑
Sat 12 Dec 2020 12:14 AM
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Sat 12 Dec 2020 12:06 AM
Astaa wrote: ↑
Fri 11 Dec 2020 11:37 PM
What I do find funny is sins whining about moose/IP with their 100 tick viper damage.

Get AoM?

Yes mate, at RR6, right on it (and I am well aware how AoM works ) 100 damage less 26% = 74, less AOM 9 (34 points) 20% (it's not cumulative) = 59 damage, opposed to 74 (but even with capped resists its still 102, less capped AoM ~80 damage) Points well spent, I'm sure you will agree.

Or I could just get and use IP2 (or higher as I gain RR)...

If you think AoM isn`t worth the points go for something else, It`s not only useful against sins.

Yep, at least AoM 5 is a fair trade.

AoM is absolutely fine if you can spare the points, but I can't so those 34 points are by far and away much better spent on things like IP that are useful in all fights. I play to win, not fuck about.

34 points = AoM 9 And honestly, nothing like useful for points spent.

30 points = 80% heal

I have IP2 (35% heal) I could use those 10 points on AoM instead and gain 10% resist (10% of whatever is left after 26% SC) SO I could get hit for 90 damage instead of 102 every single tick...reapplied on purge...but why?!

Edit, like I say, I will gladly drop IP if sins drop viper, as it is IP vs viper is pretty equal, the only difference is mine is on a 15 min timer and again, viper isn't OP, every solo viable class has a counter in IP.

Some random idiot suggested I avoided allowing (allowing, exact words) an assassin to apply lifebane on me, I'm still trying to work out how one would go about that.

Having enough points to spent them for AoM is the prerequisite, should be logical, or? It`s an addition to IP, not a replacement.
But before i stick points into archer related ra`s like FE or MoP i`d stick them into AoM. Aom5 is 12% btw.

Sat 12 Dec 2020 8:56 AM by Astaa

AOM5 is 10% and costs 10 points, that is why I compared the points spend with IP.

Sat 12 Dec 2020 9:27 AM by Stoertebecker

Astaa wrote: ↑
Sat 12 Dec 2020 8:56 AM
AOM5 is 10% and costs 10 points, that is why I compared the points spend with IP.

The values in the charplaner are not correct. Did you never checked it ingame?

Sat 12 Dec 2020 9:48 AM by Astaa

Ah right OK, no I didn't but even so the return isn't that great when I can use those points on IP which helps vs all classes. (talking at my RR, 6L1)

Sat 12 Dec 2020 10:23 AM by boridi

AoM resist values were recently boosted.

Mon 28 Dec 2020 12:27 AM by cantgetright006

The simple truth is every class is op if it's optimal situations are met! But people are judging it from the perspective of 1v1 combat. And a lot of the time in DAOC a classes optimal situation isn't linked to 1v1 combat. And that's because the game was never made to be balanced around 1v1 combat! It was made to be balanced around 1v1v1 ( that's realm vs realm vs realm warfare ) and not class vs class single combat. Those are just the facts of the case. And until people understand that every thread that is is trying to prove or disprove. Or simply just ranting, whining, crying, moaning, or bragging is just irrelevant! People can disagree with what I said and that cool. Doesn't change the facts at all.