I've heard some people say that they nerfed 30% of their damage, is that true?
I just got mine to 50, should I reroll?
I just got mine to 50, should I reroll?
Are Berserkers weak?
Started 18 Feb 2019
by
DinoTriz
in
Midgard
Mon 18 Feb 2019 12:55 PM
by
Luluko
just looked over the styles, la 50 is 3 style combo so its pretty shitty, they dont have site stun here and also no access to shield like merc/bm, so they can only really utilize the hammer snares and their hamster mode. Svg with site stun 2style chain and 4sec backstun looks way better for pvp, even tho the selfbuffs are pretty short here but if there are also thrust claws here I think you could chew through alb chain pretty effectively on a svg which would also be a plus point. Warrior is also pretty nice but the burst damage shouldnt be that great especially at low rr.
You can try out a few runs in pvp and see how you do before you reroll I have run with a few in grp and they still get things dead tho.
You can try out a few runs in pvp and see how you do before you reroll I have run with a few in grp and they still get things dead tho.
Mon 18 Feb 2019 1:05 PM
by
Calconious
I've heard from multiple people that both Zerk and SB left axe dmg is a little lacking, but have also read multiple posts from the Phoenix staff that says it's scaling how it's supposed to. Who knows.
Like Luluko said above... the styles are not very great in comparison to the other realms counterparts. No shield for slam, no side stun either.
If you enjoy playing the Berserker, I'd say stick with it since you already made it to 50. Good play may offset a small lack of dmg.
Like Luluko said above... the styles are not very great in comparison to the other realms counterparts. No shield for slam, no side stun either.
If you enjoy playing the Berserker, I'd say stick with it since you already made it to 50. Good play may offset a small lack of dmg.
Tue 19 Feb 2019 12:22 PM
by
tsteken
More dps than savage, less lucky frontload.
No stun/shield. so lacking in utility. this isnt a real problem for mid as they often run warrior or than anyway (hibs will ignore hero for bm cause of shield)
Easier to manage cause you just dps and/or snare.
Prevent flight (30% passive snare)
Vendomode is the funniest skill in the game!! 100% crits is no joke. can go 2hand for sick crits.
Savage is probably the better overall character on paper, but its not such a big difference that I suggest you reroll tbh.
No stun/shield. so lacking in utility. this isnt a real problem for mid as they often run warrior or than anyway (hibs will ignore hero for bm cause of shield)
Easier to manage cause you just dps and/or snare.
Prevent flight (30% passive snare)
Vendomode is the funniest skill in the game!! 100% crits is no joke. can go 2hand for sick crits.
Savage is probably the better overall character on paper, but its not such a big difference that I suggest you reroll tbh.
Tue 19 Feb 2019 12:42 PM
by
Jaegaer
Zerker is probably the most reliable melee high damage dealer in the game. It is also the easiest to play well class in Midgard and works well even when not fully temp'ed.
The only problem is the Savage. A fully temp'ed Savage, that is well protected by his Healers, will throw out an insane amount of frontload damage ever so often and frontload is where the game is.
The only problem is the Savage. A fully temp'ed Savage, that is well protected by his Healers, will throw out an insane amount of frontload damage ever so often and frontload is where the game is.
Tue 19 Feb 2019 1:03 PM
by
Hector
No. Our zerker pounds everybody. People just repeat what they hear in discord/forums instead of testing and seeing damage logs for themselves.
Tue 19 Feb 2019 3:35 PM
by
chryso
This is the kind of thinking you see. Because savage may put out 1% more dps that means zerker is bad.
Tue 19 Feb 2019 5:32 PM
by
kmark101
Depends on playstyle and group I would say. My 50 zerker is ok in coordinated assist trains, especially with quick hits where I don't need to watch positionals, just smash. Also, it's important to note that vendo form crit is different from normal crit: it's 1-100% crit, not the higher value of normal crits... so with bad luck you can do really low amount of crits.
Where I found my zerker is lacking:
- soloing is better on any other class
- burst damage, my warrior is simply better with a bigass 2hander after a slam
- zerker spec RR (reflex attack) is very weak and useless imho
- any zerg fights you are the first one focused... (can offset this a little bit with wearing a small shield just for cosmetics and /switch in battle)
- in vendo form you are paper
Where I found my zerker is shining:
- pve
- coordinated group strike/assist train
- smallman fights (like 4v4)
- last man standing and popping vendo... glorious win
- at higher RR it will be better, but it's true for many others
Where I found my zerker is lacking:
- soloing is better on any other class
- burst damage, my warrior is simply better with a bigass 2hander after a slam
- zerker spec RR (reflex attack) is very weak and useless imho
- any zerg fights you are the first one focused... (can offset this a little bit with wearing a small shield just for cosmetics and /switch in battle)
- in vendo form you are paper
Where I found my zerker is shining:
- pve
- coordinated group strike/assist train
- smallman fights (like 4v4)
- last man standing and popping vendo... glorious win
- at higher RR it will be better, but it's true for many others
Wed 20 Feb 2019 2:24 PM
by
DinoTriz
I temporarily shelved my Berserker. I use him as a Salvage bot since he's maxed skill.
I made a Savage. He's 30 now.
The loads of self-buffs which have to be refreshed every 15 seconds turned me away at first, but I ended up making a mouse macro which makes refreshing buffs a simple one-button press on the mouse.
Savage weapons look stupid (except the huge crescent blade ones), but really that's my only grip.
They're awesome. It feels like Savages were made as a second chance at making a Berserker.
The quad hits are cool, self buffs are sweet, and their styles are so much better than Left Axe.
Here I was initially thinking that Doublefrost was the ultimate anytime style, but man, Savages get Wild Call at level 6! Sure, you can't use it in PVE groups but still.
Their styles are also only 2 chained. Back stun, Side stun, etc. Amazing.
I made a Savage. He's 30 now.
The loads of self-buffs which have to be refreshed every 15 seconds turned me away at first, but I ended up making a mouse macro which makes refreshing buffs a simple one-button press on the mouse.
Savage weapons look stupid (except the huge crescent blade ones), but really that's my only grip.
They're awesome. It feels like Savages were made as a second chance at making a Berserker.
The quad hits are cool, self buffs are sweet, and their styles are so much better than Left Axe.
Here I was initially thinking that Doublefrost was the ultimate anytime style, but man, Savages get Wild Call at level 6! Sure, you can't use it in PVE groups but still.
Their styles are also only 2 chained. Back stun, Side stun, etc. Amazing.
Wed 27 Feb 2019 2:57 PM
by
mello
kmark101 wrote: ↑Tue 19 Feb 2019 5:32 PMDepends on playstyle and group I would say. My 50 zerker is ok in coordinated assist trains, especially with quick hits where I don't need to watch positionals, just smash. Also, it's important to note that vendo form crit is different from normal crit: it's 1-100% crit, not the higher value of normal crits... so with bad luck you can do really low amount of crits.
Where I found my zerker is lacking:
- soloing is better on any other class
- burst damage, my warrior is simply better with a bigass 2hander after a slam
- zerker spec RR (reflex attack) is very weak and useless imho
- any zerg fights you are the first one focused... (can offset this a little bit with wearing a small shield just for cosmetics and /switch in battle)
- in vendo form you are paper
Where I found my zerker is shining:
- pve
- coordinated group strike/assist train
- smallman fights (like 4v4)
- last man standing and popping vendo... glorious win
- at higher RR it will be better, but it's true for many others
thank you very much really interesting
i have some questions for you
with my zerk i maxed determination, then i want purge 2
at that point, what do you think is the best next?
ignore pain or MoP/MoA ?
thank you again
ciao
Wed 27 Feb 2019 3:06 PM
by
DinoTriz
mello wrote: ↑Wed 27 Feb 2019 2:57 PMkmark101 wrote: ↑Tue 19 Feb 2019 5:32 PMDepends on playstyle and group I would say. My 50 zerker is ok in coordinated assist trains, especially with quick hits where I don't need to watch positionals, just smash. Also, it's important to note that vendo form crit is different from normal crit: it's 1-100% crit, not the higher value of normal crits... so with bad luck you can do really low amount of crits.
Where I found my zerker is lacking:
- soloing is better on any other class
- burst damage, my warrior is simply better with a bigass 2hander after a slam
- zerker spec RR (reflex attack) is very weak and useless imho
- any zerg fights you are the first one focused... (can offset this a little bit with wearing a small shield just for cosmetics and /switch in battle)
- in vendo form you are paper
Where I found my zerker is shining:
- pve
- coordinated group strike/assist train
- smallman fights (like 4v4)
- last man standing and popping vendo... glorious win
- at higher RR it will be better, but it's true for many others
thank you very much really interesting
i have some questions for you
with my zerk i maxed determination, then i want purge 2
at that point, what do you think is the best next?
ignore pain or MoP/MoA ?
thank you again
ciao
I'm not him, but I would recommend going MoPain. Some people say it's a waste on a Zerker since they can go Vendo mode but you're not always in Vendo. Plus, you're offensive. Also MoPain helps in both Offense or Defense scenarios. Get the offense RA
Just my opinion though.
Wed 27 Feb 2019 3:11 PM
by
Ashenspire
Zerkers are higher sustained damage than savages. Savages can burst higher, but it's rare.
A zerkers and savage working together are going to be better than 2 savages or 2 berserkers.
You don't need a shield as a berserker. Shield on bm and Merc is overrated anyway.
Albion should always have a paladin on their assist train, hib has heroes with shield or annihilation, or champions or Valewalker. Light tanks with shield is more redundant than necessary.
Three style chain is fine. Not using hammer is fine. Stop thinking about the game in terms of 1v1 or comparing a class directly to another class.
A zerkers and savage working together are going to be better than 2 savages or 2 berserkers.
You don't need a shield as a berserker. Shield on bm and Merc is overrated anyway.
Albion should always have a paladin on their assist train, hib has heroes with shield or annihilation, or champions or Valewalker. Light tanks with shield is more redundant than necessary.
Three style chain is fine. Not using hammer is fine. Stop thinking about the game in terms of 1v1 or comparing a class directly to another class.
Wed 27 Feb 2019 3:42 PM
by
DinoTriz
Ashenspire wrote: ↑Wed 27 Feb 2019 3:11 PMZerkers are higher sustained damage than savages. Savages can burst higher, but it's rare.
A zerkers and savage working together are going to be better than 2 savages or 2 berserkers.
You don't need a shield as a berserker. Shield on bm and Merc is overrated anyway.
Albion should always have a paladin on their assist train, hib has heroes with shield or annihilation, or champions or Valewalker. Light tanks with shield is more redundant than necessary.
Three style chain is fine. Not using hammer is fine. Stop thinking about the game in terms of 1v1 or comparing a class directly to another class.
My Savage is 50 now and I've gone back and forth between my Berserker and Savage, fighting the same mobs.
Here are some anecdotes I've found:
Savage styles tend to be a lot smoother to play (my opinion). Left Axe desperately needs side styles and the back style chain can be awkward to pull off. So it leaves you hoping for an evade or parry. When you finally land all 3 styles in the back chain, it leaves you feeling like you should've done more damage.
Savage self-haste buff makes pulling off various styles smooth and easy. Lots of room for error.
Savage styles have better Growth Rates. My lowest damage style is 0.90 GR.
Savage can feel like a wet noodle if you only single hit something. Berserker feels more consistently powerful.
Again, this is anecdotal, but my TG geared Berserker was killing the same mobs slower and taking the same amount of damage as my freshly 50 (no raid gear) Savage was. My Berserker had his 20% haste proc up and everything.
I know that isn't be-all end-all testing, but it convinced me to focus more on my Savage. Which is a shame, because Berserkers have always been my favorite class. I will miss my traditional weapons. I don't like my sharpened tree limbs
Wed 27 Feb 2019 5:24 PM
by
Ashenspire
DinoTriz wrote: ↑Wed 27 Feb 2019 3:42 PMAshenspire wrote: ↑Wed 27 Feb 2019 3:11 PMZerkers are higher sustained damage than savages. Savages can burst higher, but it's rare.
A zerkers and savage working together are going to be better than 2 savages or 2 berserkers.
You don't need a shield as a berserker. Shield on bm and Merc is overrated anyway.
Albion should always have a paladin on their assist train, hib has heroes with shield or annihilation, or champions or Valewalker. Light tanks with shield is more redundant than necessary.
Three style chain is fine. Not using hammer is fine. Stop thinking about the game in terms of 1v1 or comparing a class directly to another class.
My Savage is 50 now and I've gone back and forth between my Berserker and Savage, fighting the same mobs.
Here are some anecdotes I've found:
Savage styles tend to be a lot smoother to play (my opinion). Left Axe desperately needs side styles and the back style chain can be awkward to pull off. So it leaves you hoping for an evade or parry. When you finally land all 3 styles in the back chain, it leaves you feeling like you should've done more damage.
Savage self-haste buff makes pulling off various styles smooth and easy. Lots of room for error.
Savage styles have better Growth Rates. My lowest damage style is 0.90 GR.
Savage can feel like a wet noodle if you only single hit something. Berserker feels more consistently powerful.
Again, this is anecdotal, but my TG geared Berserker was killing the same mobs slower and taking the same amount of damage as my freshly 50 (no raid gear) Savage was. My Berserker had his 20% haste proc up and everything.
I know that isn't be-all end-all testing, but it convinced me to focus more on my Savage. Which is a shame, because Berserkers have always been my favorite class. I will miss my traditional weapons. I don't like my sharpened tree limbs
Never had an issue with using parry or evade styles. Soloing oranges and losing no health is common.
Side styles would be nice, but every weapon line has a side style anyway. Not the biggest loss there.
At cap swing speed you can get your back chain off in 3 seconds. I've killed casters in just this one chain before. Feels fine.
I've never felt weak on my berserker or inferior to savages. We just operate differently while filling a similar role.
Thu 28 Feb 2019 11:38 PM
by
sprinkle
savages are double the dps of a ber
Ber is my favorite class and I hate savages, so for me to say it its true : )
Ber is my favorite class and I hate savages, so for me to say it its true : )
Fri 1 Mar 2019 4:32 PM
by
Ashenspire
sprinkle wrote: ↑Thu 28 Feb 2019 11:38 PMsavages are double the dps of a ber
Ber is my favorite class and I hate savages, so for me to say it its true : )
It's not true, and it being your favorite class has no bearing on whether something is true or not. Stop that.
Fri 1 Mar 2019 6:56 PM
by
kmark101
Ashenspire wrote: ↑Fri 1 Mar 2019 4:32 PMsprinkle wrote: ↑Thu 28 Feb 2019 11:38 PMsavages are double the dps of a ber
Ber is my favorite class and I hate savages, so for me to say it its true : )
It's not true, and it being your favorite class has no bearing on whether something is true or not. Stop that.
While not double, but much higher. Also savages scaling upwards bigtime with high RR, while zerkers not so much. So the gap is going to be wider as you play more.
Mon 4 Mar 2019 8:31 PM
by
adamaxis
DinoTriz wrote: ↑Wed 20 Feb 2019 2:24 PMThey're awesome. It feels like Savages were made as a second chance at making a Berserker.
This is exactly how most Mids felt back at the release of SI as well - Savages were the better Berserker.
I don't think Phoenix should follow the example of the main servers. During the era that I played(launch-2003 then briefly late 2003-mid 2004) once SI came out(post-LA dmg nerf), in the face of the superior Savage, Berserkers dried up as a class. Phoenix is much better than Uthgard when it comes to custom balance rules, but I think that if they don't address this, it will end up leading to the same out. Certain classes are majorly disadvantaged at this patch level that were historically painful at this patch level.
Mon 4 Mar 2019 8:48 PM
by
DinoTriz
adamaxis wrote: ↑Mon 4 Mar 2019 8:31 PMThis is exactly how most Mids felt back at the release of SI as well - Savages were the better Berserker.
I don't think Phoenix should follow the example of the main servers. During the era that I played(launch-2003 then briefly late 2003-mid 2004) once SI came out(post-LA dmg nerf), in the face of the superior Savage, Berserkers dried up as a class. Phoenix is much better than Uthgard when it comes to custom balance rules, but I think that if they don't address this, it will end up leading to the same out. Certain classes are majorly disadvantaged at this patch level that were historically painful at this patch level.
Well, they just buffed LA a couple days ago.
It made me compare my 50 Berserker with my 50 Savage (both are similarly geared) and it feels my Berserker is a bit better now (go figure lol)
I only did a little testing in both PVE and RVR, and it felt like my Berserker was either putting up equal or more damage than my Savage. And of course the Savage took more damage (due to self-buffs).
I don't know...I'm at a crossroads again.
I think the Savage has the better styles though. Berserker desperately needs a side chain for LA.
Thu 14 Mar 2019 9:45 PM
by
Drakuz
your problem is related to this as a beserker.
WHEN in the timeline that the original LA nerf came out - there wasn't a Savage class.
as LA is NOT nerfed on this server - this inherently buffs them (the savages), by giving them more than they ever had before.
/repost
here is why you view this, the aforementioned is the main complaint i have effecting many many classes.
the previous LA nurf is link to the other dmg's later on in the patches to the other offhand classes -----
/repost.
it doesnt matter.
shield is broken on this server. its a fact.
LA nerf is viewably/noticably not imposed (prior to 1.65) it was tuned down to -1% so no the LA nerf is not in.
as of patch 1.96a in year 2008 the block cap was 75%
block cap was reduced to 60% at a later date, also due to other changes developing later in the timeline.
so shield has been nerfed far far far too much on this server who's timeline is purposely aimed at one thing:
the main dev is biased, hates shield users and either plays a Beserker or a Shadowblade, while not minding the timeline, or the reasons for why certain changes were made in the chronological order, has chosen to ignore the order, and cherry-pick the patches to show favoritism.
that is the only conclusion that i can draw from the evidence.
("what evidence?!" - you say, wow i must be psychic)
once again i know how i have to restate myself...
LA nerf from 2003 was not imposed.
but a nerf harder than the 2008 block nerf was imposed.
digging further will only render more terrible results.
(1.96a sidenote, while in 1.96a the main servers were at 75% block cap, PENDRAGON had the 60% block cap.)
so the server is pre-biased to make shield users fail here.
(all above stated is for rvr block caps)
WHEN in the timeline that the original LA nerf came out - there wasn't a Savage class.
as LA is NOT nerfed on this server - this inherently buffs them (the savages), by giving them more than they ever had before.
/repost
here is why you view this, the aforementioned is the main complaint i have effecting many many classes.
the previous LA nurf is link to the other dmg's later on in the patches to the other offhand classes -----
/repost.
it doesnt matter.
shield is broken on this server. its a fact.
LA nerf is viewably/noticably not imposed (prior to 1.65) it was tuned down to -1% so no the LA nerf is not in.
as of patch 1.96a in year 2008 the block cap was 75%
block cap was reduced to 60% at a later date, also due to other changes developing later in the timeline.
so shield has been nerfed far far far too much on this server who's timeline is purposely aimed at one thing:
the main dev is biased, hates shield users and either plays a Beserker or a Shadowblade, while not minding the timeline, or the reasons for why certain changes were made in the chronological order, has chosen to ignore the order, and cherry-pick the patches to show favoritism.
that is the only conclusion that i can draw from the evidence.
("what evidence?!" - you say, wow i must be psychic)
once again i know how i have to restate myself...
LA nerf from 2003 was not imposed.
but a nerf harder than the 2008 block nerf was imposed.
digging further will only render more terrible results.
(1.96a sidenote, while in 1.96a the main servers were at 75% block cap, PENDRAGON had the 60% block cap.)
so the server is pre-biased to make shield users fail here.
(all above stated is for rvr block caps)
Thu 14 Mar 2019 9:56 PM
by
Ashenspire
You've posted this on multiple threads now, and in every thread you're wrong. Stop that.
Fri 15 Mar 2019 6:40 AM
by
Wohop
Drakuz wrote: ↑Thu 14 Mar 2019 9:45 PMyour problem is related to this as a beserker.
WHEN in the timeline that the original LA nerf came out - there wasn't a Savage class.
as LA is NOT nerfed on this server - this inherently buffs them (the savages), by giving them more than they ever had before.
/repost
here is why you view this, the aforementioned is the main complaint i have effecting many many classes.
the previous LA nurf is link to the other dmg's later on in the patches to the other offhand classes -----
/repost.
it doesnt matter.
shield is broken on this server. its a fact.
LA nerf is viewably/noticably not imposed (prior to 1.65) it was tuned down to -1% so no the LA nerf is not in.
as of patch 1.96a in year 2008 the block cap was 75%
block cap was reduced to 60% at a later date, also due to other changes developing later in the timeline.
so shield has been nerfed far far far too much on this server who's timeline is purposely aimed at one thing:
the main dev is biased, hates shield users and either plays a Beserker or a Shadowblade, while not minding the timeline, or the reasons for why certain changes were made in the chronological order, has chosen to ignore the order, and cherry-pick the patches to show favoritism.
that is the only conclusion that i can draw from the evidence.
("what evidence?!" - you say, wow i must be psychic)
once again i know how i have to restate myself...
LA nerf from 2003 was not imposed.
but a nerf harder than the 2008 block nerf was imposed.
digging further will only render more terrible results.
(1.96a sidenote, while in 1.96a the main servers were at 75% block cap, PENDRAGON had the 60% block cap.)
so the server is pre-biased to make shield users fail here.
(all above stated is for rvr block caps)
What is all this nonsense? It honestly sounds like you have never played this game before
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