Infiltrator Optimal Weapon Setup And Stats.

Hi guys, i am playing a infil 50DW slasher.

I have a range of Mh weapons to my use 3.1, 3.3, 3.5, 4.1 and a ton of OH weapons from all over realm with various speeds etc.

My question is and i have asked in game and been told so many different things.

I just want to optimise my weapon dmg over time against swing speed.
i guess i need to 1) know what speed weapons to use in MH / OH and to know what MOA and aug stats to go for to achieve said optimised format..

i also understand that 1) i could go DPS king less swings more dps meaning il trigger enemy evades / procs less OR go Swing master and do less dps but faster with a higher chance to proc there armours and or evade / procs etc.

Any advice welcome

Sun 8 Sep 2019 8:29 PM by Cadebrennus

Literally everyone is going to disagree with me, but go with the slowest offhand you can find.

When Perfing, use a mainhand weapon that is fast enough (with buffs) to get you to the speed cap (1.5 seconds). THEN swap immediately after to the slowest mainhand weapon you can find for the follow-up on Creeping Death. My rationale for this method is that Perf is an additive Growth Rate and isn't affected by weapon speed, whereas Creeping Death is and its high GR benefits from the slowest possible weapon.

For a regular brawl, regarding weapon speed, it all depends on the situation.

/flame shield ON!

Sun 8 Sep 2019 8:48 PM by sabyrtuth

Perfing with a fast weapon is logical, it's only purpose here is to cut through the ablative.

Sun 8 Sep 2019 8:52 PM by Cadebrennus

sabyrtuth wrote: ↑
Sun 8 Sep 2019 8:48 PM
Perfing with a fast weapon is logical, it's only purpose here is to cut through the ablative.

99.999999999% of Assassin players believe (incorrectly) that a Perf should happen with the slowest weapon possible lol

Sun 8 Sep 2019 9:53 PM by Makrist

Cadebrennus wrote: ↑
Sun 8 Sep 2019 8:52 PM
sabyrtuth wrote: ↑
Sun 8 Sep 2019 8:48 PM
Perfing with a fast weapon is logical, it's only purpose here is to cut through the ablative.

99.999999999% of Assassin players believe (incorrectly) that a Perf should happen with the slowest weapon possible lol

I would assume that is because many still believe the modifiers for PA is the same as live and the burst upfront damage is desirable. It seems like (in my admittedly limited experience) that PA was tuned down here and BS2 was tuned up. If my suspicions are correct that changes the math a bit. I NEVER recall BS outdamaging PA in any version of DAoC to include freeshards until this. Not a whine....just an observation.

That, and many are used to massive swing speed modifiers through ToA bonuses that allowed you to run slowest MH possible and still approach swing speed cap.

Sun 8 Sep 2019 10:41 PM by Cadebrennus

Makrist wrote: ↑
Sun 8 Sep 2019 9:53 PM
Cadebrennus wrote: ↑
Sun 8 Sep 2019 8:52 PM
sabyrtuth wrote: ↑
Sun 8 Sep 2019 8:48 PM
Perfing with a fast weapon is logical, it's only purpose here is to cut through the ablative.

99.999999999% of Assassin players believe (incorrectly) that a Perf should happen with the slowest weapon possible lol

I would assume that is because many still believe the modifiers for PA is the same as live and the burst upfront damage is desirable. It seems like (in my admittedly limited experience) that PA was tuned down here and BS2 was tuned up. If my suspicions are correct that changes the math a bit. I NEVER recall BS outdamaging PA in any version of DAoC to include freeshards until this. Not a whine....just an observation.

That, and many are used to massive swing speed modifiers through ToA bonuses that allowed you to run slowest MH possible and still approach swing speed cap.

You're not wrong, but what you're probably remembering from Live is that everyone had haste/celerity/red buffs along with TOAs and Mythirians to get them near speed cap even with 4.1+ speed weapons, along with TOAs and Mythirians that boosted base damage/style damage for some really insane and fast hits, all of which boosted PAs.

Sun 8 Sep 2019 10:57 PM by Makrist

Cadebrennus wrote: ↑
Sun 8 Sep 2019 10:41 PM
Makrist wrote: ↑
Sun 8 Sep 2019 9:53 PM
Cadebrennus wrote: ↑
Sun 8 Sep 2019 8:52 PM
99.999999999% of Assassin players believe (incorrectly) that a Perf should happen with the slowest weapon possible lol

I would assume that is because many still believe the modifiers for PA is the same as live and the burst upfront damage is desirable. It seems like (in my admittedly limited experience) that PA was tuned down here and BS2 was tuned up. If my suspicions are correct that changes the math a bit. I NEVER recall BS outdamaging PA in any version of DAoC to include freeshards until this. Not a whine....just an observation.

That, and many are used to massive swing speed modifiers through ToA bonuses that allowed you to run slowest MH possible and still approach swing speed cap.

You're not wrong, but what you're probably remembering from Live is that everyone had haste/celerity/red buffs along with TOAs and Mythirians to get them near speed cap even with 4.1+ speed weapons, along with TOAs and Mythirians that boosted base damage/style damage for some really insane and fast hits, all of which boosted PAs.

I understand that, but they also boosted BS on Live, and BS never used to hit as hard as PA even with all other modifiers being equal.

Sun 8 Sep 2019 11:21 PM by Cadebrennus

Makrist wrote: ↑
Sun 8 Sep 2019 10:57 PM
Cadebrennus wrote: ↑
Sun 8 Sep 2019 10:41 PM
Makrist wrote: ↑
Sun 8 Sep 2019 9:53 PM
I would assume that is because many still believe the modifiers for PA is the same as live and the burst upfront damage is desirable. It seems like (in my admittedly limited experience) that PA was tuned down here and BS2 was tuned up. If my suspicions are correct that changes the math a bit. I NEVER recall BS outdamaging PA in any version of DAoC to include freeshards until this. Not a whine....just an observation.

That, and many are used to massive swing speed modifiers through ToA bonuses that allowed you to run slowest MH possible and still approach swing speed cap.

You're not wrong, but what you're probably remembering from Live is that everyone had haste/celerity/red buffs along with TOAs and Mythirians to get them near speed cap even with 4.1+ speed weapons, along with TOAs and Mythirians that boosted base damage/style damage for some really insane and fast hits, all of which boosted PAs.

I understand that, but they also boosted BS on Live, and BS never used to hit as hard as PA even with all other modifiers being equal.

That's true. I liked BS2 though when I was attacking players who were very good or had a script set up that could QC stun you before you could use CD on them.

Mon 9 Sep 2019 12:43 AM by easytoremember

Is PA damage ignoring haste/qui buffs?

Mon 9 Sep 2019 1:05 AM by Makrist

easytoremember wrote: ↑
Mon 9 Sep 2019 12:43 AM
Is PA damage ignoring haste/qui buffs?

Not as far as i know. I believe what they did is adjust the damage modifier through growth rate to tone down the damage on PA. They also may have slightly tuned up damage on BS2 because the damage seems almost inverted from what live and other freeshards were. Creeping Death seems on par from what i know so i dont think it was a full critical strike nerf. It seems to be an adjustment on frontal burst damage only.

Mon 9 Sep 2019 8:58 AM by Cadebrennus

PA and Backstab damage are a flat damage add (no growth rate multiplier) whereas Creeping Death and all other styles use a growth rate multiplier. This is why slower weapons = much higher damage per hit on styled hits. You will also see more damage per hit with a Perf or BS as well, but the increased damage is only an increase in Base Damage, not Styled Damage, so it is less significant.

Mon 9 Sep 2019 9:17 AM by inoeth

Cadebrennus wrote: ↑
Sun 8 Sep 2019 8:29 PM
Literally everyone is going to disagree with me, but go with the slowest offhand you can find.

When Perfing, use a mainhand weapon that is fast enough (with buffs) to get you to the speed cap (1.5 seconds). THEN swap immediately after to the slowest mainhand weapon you can find for the follow-up on Creeping Death. My rationale for this method is that Perf is an additive Growth Rate and isn't affected by weapon speed, whereas Creeping Death is and its high GR benefits from the slowest possible weapon.

For a regular brawl, regarding weapon speed, it all depends on the situation.

/flame shield ON!

slow offhand only applies to low cd/dw specs on ranger, in any other case use the fastest offhand you can get

Mon 9 Sep 2019 1:32 PM by Devastated

Thanks guys, So for general brawl? MH / OH setup? with what MOA and quick?

Tue 10 Sep 2019 8:41 AM by Devastated

Yeh so having looked at a few calculators i dont see any that work for this server...

take Pa BS out of the mix and focus on just weapons and Ra's

how do i tell if im close to my DPS / Swing Speed cap with or without haste if i know what weapons i have eqquiped?

wish char plan had this feature on it...

Tue 10 Sep 2019 8:57 AM by Cadebrennus

Devastated wrote: ↑
Tue 10 Sep 2019 8:41 AM
Yeh so having looked at a few calculators i dont see any that work for this server...

take Pa BS out of the mix and focus on just weapons and Ra's

how do i tell if im close to my DPS / Swing Speed cap with or without haste if i know what weapons i have eqquiped?

wish char plan had this feature on it...

I use Charplan for the calculators it has built in. I downloaded an older version that is close to whatever patch level is close enough to this server. There are some inconsistencies such as Wardens having Shield and extra spec points, but the calculators in the program are accurate. I've tested them against a log parser and they check out.

http://daoctb.sourceforge.net/Charplan__EN.htm

In the case of dual wielding your best bet is to run the numbers twice. First, with main hand only swinging. Then, average the offhand and mainhand speeds together and then put that number into the calculator. Then you can compare swing speed difference when you only swing one hand vs both hands.

Fri 11 Oct 2019 9:18 AM by mrdaoc

Hello all

I received some very good advice on changing my Infiltrator spec from a 50+15 Thrust & 44+15 Critical Strike to a 37+15 Thrust & 50+15 Critical Strike with an increase in DW. Very pleased with the setup. It was a definitely an improvement.

I am now approaching RR6. When I hit that do I change to 36+16 Thrust? Is the optimal figure 37 Thrust or a total of 52 "composite"? (I hope this makes sense)

Any advice would be appreciated!

Cheers all!

Fri 11 Oct 2019 10:33 AM by Lillebror

Sounds like good advise, 52comp weapon 50 cs and rest dw.

I do close to same just swap dw/cs but same thing

Fri 11 Oct 2019 1:07 PM by Cadebrennus

Lillebror wrote: ↑
Fri 11 Oct 2019 10:33 AM
Sounds like good advise, 52comp weapon 50 cs and rest dw.

I do close to same just swap dw/cs but same thing

What do you like better about DW as opposed to CS and how does your playstyle differ from a 50 CS player?

Fri 11 Oct 2019 8:39 PM by Lillebror

i went for max offhand swingchance with slow mh and slow oh with high moa (i thought that was highest possible dps.
PA/BS burst damage in CS sucks balls here so that aint a big lose ( thought i got PA+cd with 34cs anyway)

and it relay less on makeing opner, plan was to be good in assassin fights.

Sat 12 Oct 2019 2:24 AM by Cadebrennus

Lillebror wrote: ↑
Fri 11 Oct 2019 8:39 PM
i went for max offhand swingchance with slow mh and slow oh with high moa (i thought that was highest possible dps.
PA/BS burst damage in CS sucks balls here so that aint a big lose ( thought i got PA+cd with 34cs anyway)

and it relay less on makeing opner, plan was to be good in assassin fights.

Is there a good calculator out there that shows increased dps for faster swing time? On Live everyone could hit cap speed with 4.2 speed weapons anyways (without MOA) so it didn't really matter, but here on Phoenix that's probably impossible, making RA choices much more important.