[Suggestion] Make the event less painful for pugs...

and grant them a bit more xp and rp gain(not double the amount but enough to stay motivated still) during the event vs premades, so that dying through the event has still a little reward to it rather than being the fodder for the premades only.

Sat 9 Jan 2021 7:44 PM by ExcretusMaximus

I was coming in here to say "you really don't get it, do you?" after you had two threads closed, but this is actually a decent idea. I don't know if it's really possible given the spaghetti code that is Mythic/EA/Broadsword/Phoenix's programming over 20 years, but it's a nice idea.

Sat 9 Jan 2021 7:46 PM by Wakefield

Agreed,its tedious and dull to be run over time and time again with little reward as a pug.

Die, half group disband, reform up with 0 speed or cc. Port out, get splatted by a premade assist train, might get lucky if you have tagged anything and get SOMETHING.

Its painful at times to do it, you end up taking a break with /autogroup off after a couple of runs constantly due to frustration and just lack of entertainment.

We pretty much stuck like this till Monday as regular xp zones are just nonexistent.

RVR is not that much different, end up running out to cide on a keep or hand in branches. Then back to the to run craftqeue for the free bubble of xp every 30 mins.

Sun 10 Jan 2021 1:35 AM by Sepplord

Considering the event isn't always active and everything still takes time, i would also suggest a small XP/RP payout for the losing Team.

I am not in general a fan of huge freebies, but imo here the spirit is to let players jumpstart a new character into RvR. (The levelling is also awesome don't get me wrong, but imo the biggest bonus is not being really low RR for your first 400-500k). With a decent premade you will reach RR5 quite fast and before the event ist over, without one it slows down considerable. And while it is still very good XP/RP, it isn't much fun anymore.

And the bigger timeframe makes it much harder to reach the RR Cap before the event end....so the casuals that need a jumpstart the most might not be able to finish despite wanting to Put the time in overall. They can't just finish it next Event If they don't make it now

Sun 10 Jan 2021 7:37 AM by dbeattie71

ExcretusMaximus wrote: ↑
Sat 9 Jan 2021 7:44 PM
I was coming in here to say "you really don't get it, do you?" after you had two threads closed, but this is actually a decent idea. I don't know if it's really possible given the spaghetti code that is Mythic/EA/Broadsword/Phoenix's programming over 20 years, but it's a nice idea.

So you’ve been in the code eh? Lol

Sun 10 Jan 2021 7:47 AM by gotwqqd

Does anyone know how long damage on enemy can lead to credit on their death?

For instance if a cabby or another aoe caster(or aoe damage dd caster by that matter) goes out solo and tags 30 enemies....will he get credit regardless of how long it takes for death?

Sun 10 Jan 2021 8:24 AM by Jerrian

I played druid, ranger, animist and now VW in these events. In the first runs with the previous 3 characters it was kinda ok to level and advance. The druid ofc was the easiest as druid always is a win in groups. I just played in random groups and enjoyed the fun. The experience with animist in previous event wasn ´t already fun anymore, I had maybe 5x times a CC or heal in group that not disbanded immediatly and was stuck all time with tanks and stealth classes, don ´t know how I made it to 50 but it was very hard and painful.

This time I play with some friends, we got discord, an medicore setup and we´re doing ok, as we are more casual players, but Discord and playing with the same players constantly is a big help. We recognize 90%+ groups are premade now, with perfect setups, mostly guild groups even for us very hard to kill.

I ´m not complaining about it, but just want to state, that it is nearly impossible for random groups to progress now, as this event got claimed by premade groups.
Imho this is a wrong direction as it was formerly designed for new players to get something started and close gaps for being able getting one or more 50 chars , no? This fun event got a bit too serious and leet with all this premade stuff all around.

There might be two ways to get more access to this event for all playertypes, if this is wanted:
- One is to give the killed group some loser bonus as mentioned before
- The other would be to disable the /autogroup off command and maybe disband too, for having all groups complete random and the event more fair and less grindy.

Just my 2 cents.

Sun 10 Jan 2021 9:46 AM by SlowMo

I am a 99% solo player.
Would love to see an solo area within the event.

Sun 10 Jan 2021 12:16 PM by Blitze

There was a lvl 50 solo zone, it was great for 1 day then duels and Low rp rewards ruined it.

A levelling event for solo would be great, I agree.
Or just 1 day solo event for 50s

Sun 10 Jan 2021 1:11 PM by Sepplord

Another big thing is just playermentality though. I am not talking about "Just build a group" or "Stick it out longer" although that helps too

But i have seen several people that are lfg, ranting about premades and then when they start losing a really rare 1vs1 they exploit the middlekeep and escape to safety.

The more people it Happens to, the more people do it themselves or logg frustrated, leaving the initial ranter with even less chances to progress their char.
And i have seen classes so it that would be back in action FASTER If they just died and given others RPs

Sun 10 Jan 2021 3:46 PM by yepyukon

Premades are painful to deal with in pugs. I would like to see premades begin at like lvl 40 or something so everyone has a fair chance of getting to 40 and ~3L0

Sun 10 Jan 2021 3:52 PM by Hedien

But premade enjoy the feeling of rolling over noobs.

Sun 10 Jan 2021 7:12 PM by nineonezero

CowwoC wrote: ↑
Sat 9 Jan 2021 7:17 PM
and grant them a bit more xp and rp gain(not double the amount but enough to stay motivated still) during the event vs premades, so that dying through the event has still a little reward to it rather than being the fodder for the premades only.

sound fair to me give extra rps to PUGs (if really 5 out of 5 is random, not just the last slots filled).
Real pros should be able to be competitive with almost any setup !

Sun 10 Jan 2021 7:46 PM by Sagz

CowwoC wrote: ↑
Sat 9 Jan 2021 7:17 PM
and grant them a bit more xp and rp gain(not double the amount but enough to stay motivated still) during the event vs premades, so that dying through the event has still a little reward to it rather than being the fodder for the premades only.

I guess my question is, why dont you make a premade group? I mean realistically you only need 2,3,4 friends. You do know you can make a character, get 2 friends, play and it will pug the other 2, or stay as three and you will be fine. I ran a 3 man from 1 to 40 yesterday in 4 hours, did not even pug the other 2 to have 5 ppl. Etherbunny did it last event and filmed it, go watch the video in the video section of the forums.

The problem is, people do not want to make a support class, so you have a group with 2 archer, a caster, a tank, and an offtank. no heals no buffs etc. Me personally, I have now 4 bards, 5 clerics, 2 bds, 2 sorcs, etc. because I PLAY WITH FRIENDS and make what it necessary to make a group for fun. Not to mention i made a ranger and SOLOED from level 10 to 45 in one night (that was during the last event)

People are just too selfish and do not want to play the event for fun, they feel they should log in a new character get in a group and get carried to 50 and rr5 in one night, and when it doesn't happen and they have to actually make an effort, its not fair, boohoo, please fix it for me.

Its an MMO, if you do not have a few friends to play with, why are you auto grouping anyway, just play solo. OR here is a novel Idea...MAKE FRIENDS with the pug you got in and make a premade group taking turns with who levels what class etc. for gods sake you can get 40 in a night will little effort, or 50 with a little more effort.

And just in case you are wondering if I dont know what a non premade it like, I made a Shadowblade yesterday, autogrouped from the start, got level 30 in like 2 hours or so?, didnt really keep track of time. did not have a healer/buffer/CC in my group from like 10-25 it felt like, but I had fun in the chaos.....Newsflash you will die, get over it.

I will say it again, this is the best and most fun I have had in this game since the Mordred server circa 2003-2005 on live, the chaos is AMAZING!, the only thing I wish would change is maybe a map change every now and then, but other than that, awesome event.

Sun 10 Jan 2021 8:45 PM by Sepplord

Enjoy the chaos while it lasts, there were already premades breaking up their fight, killing additional groups together and then leaving separate directions today

Mon 11 Jan 2021 12:03 AM by boridi

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Sun 10 Jan 2021 8:45 PM
Enjoy the chaos while it lasts, there were already premades breaking up their fight, killing additional groups together and then leaving separate directions today

LOL. I think my armsman named Elitegvgplayer needs to make an appearance in /region...

Mon 11 Jan 2021 12:11 AM by Sagz

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Sun 10 Jan 2021 8:45 PM
Enjoy the chaos while it lasts, there were already premades breaking up their fight, killing additional groups together and then leaving separate directions today

I highly doubt it, everyone is in this event for xp and rps, killing no one gives them neither. If they were in the 50 zone, I might agree with you but still dont think it happens the lower zones, no way, everyone is trying to get to 50 fast. I mean even if you get jammed and die, you just tag everyone and wait, you get the xp and rps. Not to mention, The chaos is the best part.

Besides, there really is not very many respectable people/ groups on this server anyway, they jammed till rr8 and rr9 and even after they hit rr10 and rr11 and use listing for excuses to jam people and as a shield to not get jammed, and since there is no "list" here to get the extra rps I find it hard to believe they would pull off and and go separate ways.

Mon 11 Jan 2021 1:21 AM by Oddy1979

let the premades get their own bg level event . its getting more and more frustrating.

Mon 11 Jan 2021 11:14 AM by byron

In the previous events I was able to level a Warrior, a Theug, a Blademaster and a SB to 50 only in pugs.... sometimes I was in good groups and the levelling was very fast, sometimes not but it is a part of the game. In this event I leveled a BD with other 2 clan mates plus two randoms: the differences were that we played with voice so there was more coordination, fun and, since we did a caster group, it was easier (still think that caster group is the easy mode in this server with the debuff train, especially in the event where resists are often not capped). So we did from 0 to 50 - 5L2 playing just in three evenings.

Mon 11 Jan 2021 11:29 AM by Lasastard

Considering the amount of players in some of the brackets (>>100), you could also think about a solution in which pre-made groups get ported into a different instance of the same rvr zone when a given bracket is full enough. The devs already indicated that the next event would not have a central keep as a lobby area , so if the lobby area is not directly "in the map" or separated in some form, it would also be possible to port people into separate areas or instances of the same rvr zone.

Mon 11 Jan 2021 2:41 PM by dbeattie71

Sagz wrote: ↑
Sun 10 Jan 2021 7:46 PM
CowwoC wrote: ↑
Sat 9 Jan 2021 7:17 PM
and grant them a bit more xp and rp gain(not double the amount but enough to stay motivated still) during the event vs premades, so that dying through the event has still a little reward to it rather than being the fodder for the premades only.

I guess my question is, why dont you make a premade group? I mean realistically you only need 2,3,4 friends. You do know you can make a character, get 2 friends, play and it will pug the other 2, or stay as three and you will be fine. I ran a 3 man from 1 to 40 yesterday in 4 hours, did not even pug the other 2 to have 5 ppl. Etherbunny did it last event and filmed it, go watch the video in the video section of the forums.

The problem is, people do not want to make a support class, so you have a group with 2 archer, a caster, a tank, and an offtank. no heals no buffs etc. Me personally, I have now 4 bards, 5 clerics, 2 bds, 2 sorcs, etc. because I PLAY WITH FRIENDS and make what it necessary to make a group for fun. Not to mention i made a ranger and SOLOED from level 10 to 45 in one night (that was during the last event)

People are just too selfish and do not want to play the event for fun, they feel they should log in a new character get in a group and get carried to 50 and rr5 in one night, and when it doesn't happen and they have to actually make an effort, its not fair, boohoo, please fix it for me.

Its an MMO, if you do not have a few friends to play with, why are you auto grouping anyway, just play solo. OR here is a novel Idea...MAKE FRIENDS with the pug you got in and make a premade group taking turns with who levels what class etc. for gods sake you can get 40 in a night will little effort, or 50 with a little more effort.

And just in case you are wondering if I dont know what a non premade it like, I made a Shadowblade yesterday, autogrouped from the start, got level 30 in like 2 hours or so?, didnt really keep track of time. did not have a healer/buffer/CC in my group from like 10-25 it felt like, but I had fun in the chaos.....Newsflash you will die, get over it.

I will say it again, this is the best and most fun I have had in this game since the Mordred server circa 2003-2005 on live, the chaos is AMAZING!, the only thing I wish would change is maybe a map change every now and then, but other than that, awesome event.

I agree with their 100%. I also have multiple support classes. On 2nd healer at 41, this bro tank was halfway across the map and cried because he didn’t get heals. I thought, f this and started a SB.

Mon 11 Jan 2021 3:15 PM by watbrif

Sagz wrote: ↑
Sun 10 Jan 2021 7:46 PM
People are just too selfish and do not want to play the event for fun, they feel they should log in a new character get in a group and get carried to 50 and rr5 in one night, and when it doesn't happen and they have to actually make an effort, its not fair, boohoo, please fix it for me.

Tbh I don't think many players who insist on random groups say this, so this is a strawman argument. Many people who play in random groups are casual players from the starter guilds who don't want to use discord and are not interested in min-max semi-professional 8vs8.

I had a number of great random groups and if you internalise the "hit-and-run" mindset then you can have a lot of fun. Many random groups focused on tagging groups (before getting wiped within one second) instead of trying to actually win fights, which after a while just gets very tedious and boring. Again, this is not about casual players wanting to have 10 RR5 toons after the event. The event, because it is messy and because it has an auto-group function, attracts a lot of casual players - which begs the question why include an auto-group function, if this way of playing is basically ridiculed afterwards.

(Again, I still had a lot of fun and the event itself is a brilliant idea. Everyone involved in staging this should get a medal

. But people can play "with their buddies" all the time, so I don't understand 100% why not more effort is being made to accommodate casuals for a three day event).

Mon 11 Jan 2021 4:49 PM by Sepplord

The way XP is distributed there is no downside at all to grouping someone (usually XP gets Split between groupmembers) and it is not awarded proportional to what you did, but just gives full amount as long as you in some way participated in the Fight

I think the complaint that not enough is done for casuals in the event is pretty far fetched.

Do i think there could be improvements, especially for the RR-farm bracket? Yes, for sure. But baseline the event ist really really casualfriendly.

Reading some of the comments about the Event (Not only this thread) we have come full circle and people complain about autogroup just being there to feed the premades etc... It's quite ridiculous

Mon 11 Jan 2021 5:23 PM by goten9033

My love for the event is simply all classes can participle in visible groups . Especially stealthers being allowed to run with the visible groups. Have always found that a blast. It was okay back when Daoc launched and eventually it’s like it became against the law or something for a stealth class to run with the visible groups .

So the event was a blast for me.

Mon 11 Jan 2021 5:38 PM by CowwoC

goten9033 wrote: ↑
Mon 11 Jan 2021 5:23 PM
My love for the event is simply all classes can participle in visible groups . Especially stealthers being allowed to run with the visible groups. Have always found that a blast. It was okay back when Daoc launched and eventually it’s like it became against the law or something for a stealth class to run with the visible groups .

So the event was a blast for me.

The truth is, people still don't want to run with stealther in a group. Premades, unless a stealther premade, don't run with stealthers. Pugs don't want to run with stealthers but are somehow forced to and if the group composition isn't otherwise great, means a healer, cc and a caster dps, people hammer on disband as soon they see a stealther in the group. And this leaves the other visis in that group with more stealther eventually, as they are the only ones who are willing to stay. There are a few exceptions who also at least try, but the majority do not want stealther in a group, bow classes even less than a dual wield class like a shadowblade for example.

But this problem is not only restricted to stealther, there are other classes as well who are not very welcomed. Can i blame those people who hammer the disband macro as soon they dislike the autogroup composition? Partly. I understand that 2 scouts, a savage, an arms and a bonedancer will probably not get very far with the fact that the event is heavily caster and cc dominated and this will make it even more frustrating, since you'll have a hard time even to add and tag everything, because you will most likely stay in cc till you die instead.

But yes, the x-realm component and that -on paper- everyone can play together is awesome.

Mon 11 Jan 2021 5:51 PM by goten9033

Yeah I get other setups are more affective. But with the hunter for the most part I could lockdown 2 people. I ran 0 stealth to try and be more affective.

Your right I’ve seen what your saying about the disband. But it really wasn’t as bad as I thought it would be .

Overall it was welll received and some odd group setups worked well

Mon 11 Jan 2021 6:24 PM by Lollie

The biggest problem I found with stealthers is upon Inc they would go to stealth, which is perfectly normal, but it leaves 3 targets v 5 for a brief moment and it's easier to pick targets and assist down. There were a few who played without stealth and worked a treat, particularly shadowzerkers

Mon 11 Jan 2021 6:56 PM by goten9033

Yes I purposely didn’t stealth . Would rather them not instantly target my healers or casters. And I tried to get them off them if I could.

Mon 11 Jan 2021 8:21 PM by Sagz

CowwoC wrote: ↑
Mon 11 Jan 2021 5:38 PM
goten9033 wrote: ↑
Mon 11 Jan 2021 5:23 PM
My love for the event is simply all classes can participle in visible groups . Especially stealthers being allowed to run with the visible groups. Have always found that a blast. It was okay back when Daoc launched and eventually it’s like it became against the law or something for a stealth class to run with the visible groups .

So the event was a blast for me.

The truth is, people still don't want to run with stealther in a group. Premades, unless a stealther premade, don't run with stealthers. Pugs don't want to run with stealthers but are somehow forced to and if the group composition isn't otherwise great, means a healer, cc and a caster dps, people hammer on disband as soon they see a stealther in the group.

Dont entirely agree with this, the problem is, noone wants to group with the stealther, who while in a group stealths upon port and is nowhere to be seen leaving everyone else standing around. The ones that can spec for group play when they group and stealth when they solo or in stealther groups are just fine. You get basically unlimited respecs, why not change it up. I went full one shadowzerker on my SB (with poisons of course) when grouped then swapped it up when i soloed.

Mon 11 Jan 2021 8:37 PM by Sagz

goten9033 wrote: ↑
Mon 11 Jan 2021 5:51 PM
Yeah I get other setups are more affective. But with the hunter for the most part I could lockdown 2 people. I ran 0 stealth to try and be more affective.

Your right I’ve seen what your saying about the disband. But it really wasn’t as bad as I thought it would be .

Overall it was welll received and some odd group setups worked well

Have to remember also, when you log in and are already in the zone, 90% of the time you get autogrouped before you can type /autogroup. So if you are joining friends, it looks like you join then disband. I got a few hate tells for leaving when i was on a support toon haha

Tue 12 Jan 2021 4:20 PM by cabik77

It really comes down to the point of the event. If it's to have fun, something needs to be done with the premades vs pugs as it causes multiple issues and definitely reduces the level of fun for anyone using the pug system.

Some people are going to just say you need to group with friends. The problem is that people will still try to use the system in place. They'll just get frustrated with the game. Not fun. It could be that they want to play something else while their friends are not on. It could be they only have 30 mins and don't want to take the time for a premade. Whatever the case, if the tool is in place, it should focused on being able to have fun.

Premade vs Pug is not fun. When I was in the premade, it just seemed wrong. Sure, it was fun the first few times we crushed the poor pug. After that, where's the challenge? I might as well have been grinding out in PvE. Sure, it got interesting when the inevitable second or third group joined the fight - that's a separate story from premade vs pug though (I found this part of the chaos fun). When in the Pug, watching the full group get CC'ed then individually burned down wasn't fun either.

Back to the original post. I think giving more for the pugs would help some; however, I don't think it'd solve the real problem: Is it fun or not?

Tue 12 Jan 2021 4:45 PM by evert

cabik77 wrote: ↑
Tue 12 Jan 2021 4:20 PM
IThey'll just get frustrated with the game. Not fun.

So frustrated the server population is 150% of what it normally is for three days straight

Mon 1 Feb 2021 4:07 PM by CowwoC

Since the event will be soon again, i'll bump this thread. Thank you for your attention.

Mon 1 Feb 2021 11:40 PM by Sagz

CowwoC wrote: ↑
Mon 1 Feb 2021 4:07 PM
Since the event will be soon again, i'll bump this thread. Thank you for your attention.

Well since you bumped it, I will reiterate what has been said before........get a few friends to play with. You can group with 2 of your friends and let the other 2 be pugs, you will be just fine. Or you can just run with 3 people. 3 people communication can kill 5 pugs no prob, just make a group comp to be competitive. The main problem is, noone wants to play support. But if you expect to die, you can still have fun. ITS SUPPOSED TO BE FUN DAMNIT!!!!!!!!! hahaha

This is an event where you die a lot, it happens, embrace it and have fun. Where else can you get 50 and RR4+ in 2 days without mindless grinding?

Mon 1 Feb 2021 11:42 PM by Sagz

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Sun 10 Jan 2021 1:35 AM
Considering the event isn't always active and everything still takes time, i would also suggest a small XP/RP payout for the losing Team.

I am not in general a fan of huge freebies, but imo here the spirit is to let players jumpstart a new character into RvR. (The levelling is also awesome don't get me wrong, but imo the biggest bonus is not being really low RR for your first 400-500k). With a decent premade you will reach RR5 quite fast and before the event ist over, without one it slows down considerable. And while it is still very good XP/RP, it isn't much fun anymore.

And the bigger timeframe makes it much harder to reach the RR Cap before the event end....so the casuals that need a jumpstart the most might not be able to finish despite wanting to Put the time in overall. They can't just finish it next Event If they don't make it now

Losing team? you already get that, just hit as many people as you can, when you die, dont release until they die, you get xp and rp.....so yea, you already get a reward for losing.

Tue 2 Feb 2021 6:57 AM by Sepplord

Sagz wrote: ↑
Mon 1 Feb 2021 11:42 PM
Sepplord wrote: ↑
Sun 10 Jan 2021 1:35 AM
Considering the event isn't always active and everything still takes time, i would also suggest a small XP/RP payout for the losing Team.

I am not in general a fan of huge freebies, but imo here the spirit is to let players jumpstart a new character into RvR. (The levelling is also awesome don't get me wrong, but imo the biggest bonus is not being really low RR for your first 400-500k). With a decent premade you will reach RR5 quite fast and before the event ist over, without one it slows down considerable. And while it is still very good XP/RP, it isn't much fun anymore.

And the bigger timeframe makes it much harder to reach the RR Cap before the event end....so the casuals that need a jumpstart the most might not be able to finish despite wanting to Put the time in overall. They can't just finish it next Event If they don't make it now

Losing team? you already get that, just hit as many people as you can, when you die, dont release until they die, you get xp and rp.....so yea, you already get a reward for losing.

Since you are nitpicking, no you don't. You get a reward for the dmg you dealt. Merely participating in the fight, for example as a mezzed person that gets assisttrained, gets you nothing.
And RPs are also not rewarded like the XP is, over a simple tag system giving you fixed RPs. RPs are distributed via the normal system, more dmg= more RP.

Personally i had no issue getting my new char to RR5, and the next events i have no plans to start a new char (i will be participating in the event, but not to achieve a new char for RvR). Above suggestion is for people who don't have preset groups and/or enough time during a single event to get to the end with a char.
The event has a huge gap in rewards between the casual players and people that can pour in tons of hours, because chars cannot be taken into the next event. Someone who doesn't reach lvl50 in one event will never be able to boost that char to RR5 in another event. Those people that could need RR5 chars the most, because they don't already have RR8/9/10 toons are the ones that potentially never get a fresh RR5 of the event because they can't just commit 15hours within 3days to play.

Tue 2 Feb 2021 9:24 PM by CowwoC

XP is noticeably slower from level 40 on for pugs(don't know about premades). If you don't want to give a little rp and xp buff, just give us a little xp buff - please. Don't be heartless.

Tue 2 Feb 2021 9:26 PM by cmckenzie1452

Make friends.

Tue 2 Feb 2021 11:47 PM by Sagz

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Tue 2 Feb 2021 6:57 AM
Sagz wrote: ↑
Mon 1 Feb 2021 11:42 PM
Sepplord wrote: ↑
Sun 10 Jan 2021 1:35 AM
Considering the event isn't always active and everything still takes time, i would also suggest a small XP/RP payout for the losing Team.

I am not in general a fan of huge freebies, but imo here the spirit is to let players jumpstart a new character into RvR. (The levelling is also awesome don't get me wrong, but imo the biggest bonus is not being really low RR for your first 400-500k). With a decent premade you will reach RR5 quite fast and before the event ist over, without one it slows down considerable. And while it is still very good XP/RP, it isn't much fun anymore.

And the bigger timeframe makes it much harder to reach the RR Cap before the event end....so the casuals that need a jumpstart the most might not be able to finish despite wanting to Put the time in overall. They can't just finish it next Event If they don't make it now

Losing team? you already get that, just hit as many people as you can, when you die, dont release until they die, you get xp and rp.....so yea, you already get a reward for losing.

Since you are nitpicking, no you don't. You get a reward for the dmg you dealt. Merely participating in the fight, for example as a mezzed person that gets assisttrained, gets you nothing.
And RPs are also not rewarded like the XP is, over a simple tag system giving you fixed RPs. RPs are distributed via the normal system, more dmg= more RP.

Personally i had no issue getting my new char to RR5, and the next events i have no plans to start a new char (i will be participating in the event, but not to achieve a new char for RvR). Above suggestion is for people who don't have preset groups and/or enough time during a single event to get to the end with a char.
The event has a huge gap in rewards between the casual players and people that can pour in tons of hours, because chars cannot be taken into the next event. Someone who doesn't reach lvl50 in one event will never be able to boost that char to RR5 in another event. Those people that could need RR5 chars the most, because they don't already have RR8/9/10 toons are the ones that potentially never get a fresh RR5 of the event because they can't just commit 15hours within 3days to play.

True for mez,but if you whole group is dead just do some dmg instead of mezzing, remember its group damage, if everyone hits someone once you get a pretty decent gain. Also, you can hit RR4 by the time you are 45 with a pug. it will just maybe take a little longer than 1 night, where as premade its 1 night easy. Not that big of a diff.

It does not take 15 hours (5 hours a day) to hit RR5, even with a pug. however, If someone cannot commit for that long, I get it, jobs, family etc, it is still faster than if NOT in this event, even in a pure random no healer /autogroup

Wed 3 Feb 2021 1:02 AM by gotwqqd

Seems to me that pugs get harder each new event

I guess more premadds

Wed 3 Feb 2021 6:22 AM by DJ2000

When compared midweek to weekend = lower Casuals ratio = less true pugs = slower progress as a pug

What timeframe are you even looking at or what timeframe do you think is realistic?

As a casual/pug:
4h of play -> ~Lvl40 ~2L5

As a premade:
2-3h of play -> Lvl45+ ~3L0

But i guess its true that pugs do have a harder time from Lvl40 onwards.

Wed 3 Feb 2021 6:24 AM by Lasastard

It's a competitive game - it shouldn't be a surprise that people will min/max. They have done it basically since the game went live 20 years ago.

That said, the basic complaint seems to be that players that fail to get a group of guildies/friends together, are at a disadvantage. I honestly don't see where that is a problem, since that is basically true for *any* aspect of the game (safe zerging, maybe). DAoC is built around cooperation, especially in a setting where 5 people are thrown together into a snake pit of chaos. I know it sounds annoying to say it, but yes, make friends. It's not the games responsibilty to disadvantage everyone else because you are not able to play nice with 4 other people. Hell, I had to level 2! bards during the last event because the main thing for me was to play with my buddies, not get a particular char leveled up.

Wed 3 Feb 2021 10:37 AM by CowwoC

Lasastard wrote: ↑
Wed 3 Feb 2021 6:24 AM
It's a competitive game - it shouldn't be a surprise that people will min/max. They have done it basically since the game went live 20 years ago.

That said, the basic complaint seems to be that players that fail to get a group of guildies/friends together, are at a disadvantage. I honestly don't see where that is a problem, since that is basically true for *any* aspect of the game (safe zerging, maybe). DAoC is built around cooperation, especially in a setting where 5 people are thrown together into a snake pit of chaos. I know it sounds annoying to say it, but yes, make friends. It's not the games responsibilty to disadvantage everyone else because you are not able to play nice with 4 other people. Hell, I had to level 2! bards during the last event because the main thing for me was to play with my buddies, not get a particular char leveled up.

It's not a competitive game for everyone, at least not to the same degree typical 8-mans wish it would be.

But it's interesting to read how people who play in a premade are defending the premade vs pug scheme as if they would lose anything if pugs would get a little boost in their xp/ rp to compensate the huge gap between both sides and make the suffering a bit more compatible for pugs. And it's not even the disadvantage alone which you have to face as pug and it's certainly not about having friends or not, it's about having fun at both sides and the time or will to commit for a premade or not. If you die through the event, especially after everything slows down a lot with level 40, the fun will simply disappear. Given the fact that you can not keep your toons inside the event zone till the next event, if you cant manage to reach level 50, it undermines the intention to give players a helping hand to make new toons rvr ready, especially for people who actually would benefit from that offer. Most premades probably are not in need to get another toon out there, they just use the event as testing ground and time killer while the rvr and normal xp paths are dead during the event. To have one or several rr5 level 50 toons as outcome is just the cherry on the cake for them.

The suggestion in this thread is not to get rid of premades, as the devs intention seems to be that this is the way how it should be. Maybe because if they would get rid of it or make two different instances for premade vs premade and pug vs pug, there would just as much complaint about it, when the more casual premades get eaten alive by the high effort premades and the lack of pugs as fodder in between - but that's just a guess.

This thread simply asks for a small improvement for all people who are playing in a pug, intentionally or unintentionally. Premades would not lose anything here, they still can farm pugs and probably out farm them xp and rp wise by a lot. There is really no need for ignorant comments like "just make friends" - this comment is almost as unnecessary as "git gud". And you are right, daoc is about cooperation, but this also can mean that people could have fun while being randomized if they face equality among enemy and friend. Maybe the whole server would benefit if people would broadened their horizons a little bit and step out of their bubble for a while.

Imho the event gives away great potential since the chaos and being thrown in a group with other people from all 3 realms randomly is fun for the first 20-30 levels or so and i could imagine the fun would grow if the farming character and all that min-max attitude would be toned down. As you said, the event is a chaotic pit of snakes - so in my humble opinion there should be only snakes and not some are the snakes and the rest are doomed traveler falling into that pit, or at least give those doomed traveler some torches and med kits while trying to survive in that pit - that's all.

Wed 3 Feb 2021 11:00 AM by DJ2000

This discussion will never end.

You simply can not please everybody in all shapes and forms. But you can please the majority, and this is currently the case. Like it or not.
I repeated numerous times my complaints with this kind of event, so much that i barely took part after the very first event till this day.
And yet i still acknowledge what it offers, and how the Server can benefit from it.

Every iteration of the Event may bring something new to the table, maybe things get better on one end, but get worse on the other, only time will tell.

Wed 3 Feb 2021 11:11 AM by Irkeno

You're in an MMO, in a guild, with a group of players, and you're letting yourself suffer through a PUG sometimes without even CC, Speed, Or heals? Not anyone elses fault really. Probably the same people who berate someone for soloing and say 'red is dead bro'

I'm an avid soloer here for the challenge of it, and even I can merrily pick up a set grp for this event with little trouble and still have fun with it.

"Oh shit look, some soloers grped up on visis in the event and did very well.. I am shocked." (*no not as good as some of the properly set 5mans with optimal setups, but we had some hella wicked fights and enjoyed it all with a tiny bit of organisation from 5 people who usually never group... So it cant be that hard for those who tend to play in grps or visis more often)

/rant off

Generally. This new map seems to cater more to set grps as there are more areas to fight in so more space for kiting and isolated encounters. It's fun, unique and creates different challenges but can understand it would be harder for less organised grps than the previous chaos.

I prefer it to the flat bowl personally, reminds me more of Old frontiers Emain or Hadrians with the steep hills and random encounters. <3

Wed 3 Feb 2021 11:26 AM by Lasastard

CowwoC wrote: ↑
Wed 3 Feb 2021 10:37 AM
Lasastard wrote: ↑
Wed 3 Feb 2021 6:24 AM
It's a competitive game - it shouldn't be a surprise that people will min/max. They have done it basically since the game went live 20 years ago.

That said, the basic complaint seems to be that players that fail to get a group of guildies/friends together, are at a disadvantage. I honestly don't see where that is a problem, since that is basically true for *any* aspect of the game (safe zerging, maybe). DAoC is built around cooperation, especially in a setting where 5 people are thrown together into a snake pit of chaos. I know it sounds annoying to say it, but yes, make friends. It's not the games responsibilty to disadvantage everyone else because you are not able to play nice with 4 other people. Hell, I had to level 2! bards during the last event because the main thing for me was to play with my buddies, not get a particular char leveled up.

It's not a competitive game for everyone, at least not to the same degree typical 8-mans wish it would be.

Either, you play to win against your opponent - and then it is a "competitive" game (you vs them, someone wins - and the other loses). Or you don't care about beating your opponent - and then, frankly, there is nothing to complain about in the first place.

Wed 3 Feb 2021 11:40 AM by CowwoC

Lasastard wrote: ↑
Wed 3 Feb 2021 11:26 AM
CowwoC wrote: ↑
Wed 3 Feb 2021 10:37 AM
Lasastard wrote: ↑
Wed 3 Feb 2021 6:24 AM
It's a competitive game - it shouldn't be a surprise that people will min/max. They have done it basically since the game went live 20 years ago.

That said, the basic complaint seems to be that players that fail to get a group of guildies/friends together, are at a disadvantage. I honestly don't see where that is a problem, since that is basically true for *any* aspect of the game (safe zerging, maybe). DAoC is built around cooperation, especially in a setting where 5 people are thrown together into a snake pit of chaos. I know it sounds annoying to say it, but yes, make friends. It's not the games responsibilty to disadvantage everyone else because you are not able to play nice with 4 other people. Hell, I had to level 2! bards during the last event because the main thing for me was to play with my buddies, not get a particular char leveled up.

It's not a competitive game for everyone, at least not to the same degree typical 8-mans wish it would be.

Either, you play to win against your opponent - and then it is a "competitive" game (you vs them, someone wins - and the other loses). Or you don't care about beating your opponent - and then, frankly, there is nothing to complain about in the first place.

Thats not really what competitive means in that matter, really. If you put greater effort to win, then i would call it that way. Otherwise you just play a game, which does not has to mean, that you don't care at all - there is not just black and white.

Wed 3 Feb 2021 1:24 PM by Sagz

CowwoC wrote: ↑
Wed 3 Feb 2021 10:37 AM
Lasastard wrote: ↑
Wed 3 Feb 2021 6:24 AM
It's a competitive game - it shouldn't be a surprise that people will min/max. They have done it basically since the game went live 20 years ago.

That said, the basic complaint seems to be that players that fail to get a group of guildies/friends together, are at a disadvantage. I honestly don't see where that is a problem, since that is basically true for *any* aspect of the game (safe zerging, maybe). DAoC is built around cooperation, especially in a setting where 5 people are thrown together into a snake pit of chaos. I know it sounds annoying to say it, but yes, make friends. It's not the games responsibilty to disadvantage everyone else because you are not able to play nice with 4 other people. Hell, I had to level 2! bards during the last event because the main thing for me was to play with my buddies, not get a particular char leveled up.

It's not a competitive game for everyone, at least not to the same degree typical 8-mans wish it would be.

But it's interesting to read how people who play in a premade are defending the premade vs pug scheme as if they would lose anything if pugs would get a little boost in their xp/ rp to compensate the huge gap between both sides and make the suffering a bit more compatible for pugs. And it's not even the disadvantage alone which you have to face as pug and it's certainly not about having friends or not, it's about having fun at both sides and the time or will to commit for a premade or not. If you die through the event, especially after everything slows down a lot with level 40, the fun will simply disappear. Given the fact that you can not keep your toons inside the event zone till the next event, if you cant manage to reach level 50, it undermines the intention to give players a helping hand to make new toons rvr ready, especially for people who actually would benefit from that offer. Most premades probably are not in need to get another toon out there, they just use the event as testing ground and time killer while the rvr and normal xp paths are dead during the event. To have one or several rr5 level 50 toons as outcome is just the cherry on the cake for them.

The suggestion in this thread is not to get rid of premades, as the devs intention seems to be that this is the way how it should be. Maybe because if they would get rid of it or make two different instances for premade vs premade and pug vs pug, there would just as much complaint about it, when the more casual premades get eaten alive by the high effort premades and the lack of pugs as fodder in between - but that's just a guess.

This thread simply asks for a small improvement for all people who are playing in a pug, intentionally or unintentionally. Premades would not lose anything here, they still can farm pugs and probably out farm them xp and rp wise by a lot. There is really no need for ignorant comments like "just make friends" - this comment is almost as unnecessary as "git gud". And you are right, daoc is about cooperation, but this also can mean that people could have fun while being randomized if they face equality among enemy and friend. Maybe the whole server would benefit if people would broadened their horizons a little bit and step out of their bubble for a while.

Imho the event gives away great potential since the chaos and being thrown in a group with other people from all 3 realms randomly is fun for the first 20-30 levels or so and i could imagine the fun would grow if the farming character and all that min-max attitude would be toned down. As you said, the event is a chaotic pit of snakes - so in my humble opinion there should be only snakes and not some are the snakes and the rest are doomed traveler falling into that pit, or at least give those doomed traveler some torches and med kits while trying to survive in that pit - that's all.

So what you are saying in general is, you dont want to make friends and work with other people, by your choice mind you, so you want a "special" bonus for CHOOSING not to make friends and work with other people in a game centered around making friends and working with other people.

Curious question, what characters have you made in this event so far? and what about the last one?

And in your scenario how in the world do you think you would apply this "small improvement for all people playing a pug" ? If people are autogrouped they get more rps/xp? I mean whats next then from you, "my autogroup did not have a healer and someone else group did, now I want more bonuses", or "my group had a stealther, now I want double the bonuses"

Thu 4 Feb 2021 12:16 AM by Pingyongyang

If you want the server to stay healthy and grow you have to throw bones to casuals. The people that spend 10 hours a day playing premades with their guild or friends shouldn't cry that the guy that is 40 with a wife a kid that plays for a hour one night gets a few bonus RPs. It's really short-sighted and childish selfish thinking. And I am saying as someone that plays alot.

Catering to the people that play the most and use every advantage is not what makes a good server, it makes for a good shrinking clique of gaming addicts.

Thu 4 Feb 2021 9:39 PM by Sagz

Another point of view to look at here.

This event is also a time for some new people to try to build a group, such as they would in the frontier, sometimes you just have to ask "need druid/cleric last spot for premade", or "need 2 to fill group, neeed 1 dps and 1 speed" and who knows, someone like me might make a toon and join for fun. Never know, could make a new friend.

I have soooooooooo many support characters I dont know what to do with them, most are not even 50, its fun to play in the event, never know someone might just make one and help you out.

Thu 4 Feb 2021 11:53 PM by Jingo NZ

For an event like this it is good to focus on the casual players. It is the concept of "a level playing field" that is drawing the causal crowd. Quick to set up groups, gear farming is irrelevant, rr is irrelevant, fast port to action, rewards despite deaths (and accelerated char progression) are the draw cards.

It is absolutely the right thing to do to buff the autogroup player experience.

The next thing to level is making the event less about how much you use discord, commit to set play schedules, optimise you group setup, and orient your life just to win moar. Make it more about how you respond to the chaos around you in a pick-up-and-play environment.

I'd suggest limiting premade groups to 4 and offering 4 man groups extra rp/exp bonus (or titles?). Sure some premades will try to game the autogroup mechanic to get their 5 together. But many won't, and that will be good for the event.

Fri 5 Feb 2021 12:09 AM by Pingyongyang

Separate premade and autogroup areans. Have /autogroup commands in the autogroup arena to only group once there is a major healer support and another command for a major CC support. All problems solved.

/autogroup healer (queues waiting for druid, cleric, healer)
/autogroup cc (queues waiting for bard, sorc, minst)

You can always go further but that would solve the majority of group problems. If you get tired of waiting for autogroup to find a healer/cc group then you turn them off and group instantly.

Fri 5 Feb 2021 12:13 AM by Sagz

Pingyongyang wrote: ↑
Fri 5 Feb 2021 12:09 AM
Separate premade and autogroup areans. Have /autogroup commands in the autogroup arena to only group once there is a major healer support and another command for a major CC support. All problems solved.

/autogroup healer
/autogroup cc

If you get tired of waiting for autogroup to find a healer/cc group then you turn them off and group instantly.

How about just everyone solo, no groups since everyone evidently already has too may support toons, there you go prob solved.

Fri 5 Feb 2021 12:15 AM by Pingyongyang

Most people would probably like that.

Fri 5 Feb 2021 12:21 AM by Sagz

Pingyongyang wrote: ↑
Fri 5 Feb 2021 12:15 AM
Most people would probably like that.

I highly doubt that, I was being sarcastic. If that were the case then 1. people wouldn't /autogroup, they would just solo and be done with it you would have 10 premades, and 800 soloers and 2. you would see it in NF, no groups only soloers. Which neither of those are the case. There are more playing the server with the event than without the event. The fact that the 20 people or so complaining on here about their entitlements is crazy to me. Obviously the idea in the point of this thread is in the minority.

Fri 5 Feb 2021 7:37 AM by Sepplord

One thing to consider regarding event population:
The event highly incentives playing a lot and more during the event time, as youhave to "finish" the char during the event and can't take it over. That incentives people to play more during the event, which increases the playernumbers. That doesn't neccessarily mean that they are all completely happy and would hate any changes. (To drive that point home, if there was an event area where you would just get a 1k RP tick every minute while being AFK, that zone would be full as f*** too, that doesn't prove that the majority likes that, or that it is the perfect mechanic.)

That said, i agree that we should not be complaining about the event. And some people are voicing their thoughts in a whiney way, which isn't warranted. But please, don't just lump all feedback together like that, constructive criticism isn't a bad thing and it is just natural that people want to talk about how to improve their favorite toys.

Fri 5 Feb 2021 8:33 AM by Disco

All in all, I think it's a great event. only a few small adjustments should be introduced.

For example:

- xp / rp off function: so u able to wait for left-back friends
- allow characters to be used in multiple events - if u not ported out /leave the event - u get automaticly ported into the next battleground for the next event

- the last instance should be divided into [49-50 RR 4L9] and [50 RR 5L0 +]
so the causual players have longer fun until rr5 and the tryhard / strong premade squads disappear in short term to the next rr5 + zone
maybe extend the "good- RP-gaining" until rr6 then

- on /autogroup seperate stealth classes from the group classes (one u spend at least 1 point into stealth - so minstels can choose)

- (for test!) implement speedwarps in the event: so u slower getting ass-kicked every fight (maybe 30 sec duration/cooldown - so ppl dont spam it all across the map)

i really appreciate the work of the staff, thank you very much

Fri 5 Feb 2021 9:17 AM by CowwoC

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Fri 5 Feb 2021 7:37 AM
One thing to consider regarding event population:
The event highly incentives playing a lot and more during the event time, as youhave to "finish" the char during the event and can't take it over. That incentives people to play more during the event, which increases the playernumbers. That doesn't neccessarily mean that they are all completely happy and would hate any changes. (To drive that point home, if there was an event area where you would just get a 1k RP tick every minute while being AFK, that zone would be full as f*** too, that doesn't prove that the majority likes that, or that it is the perfect mechanic.)

That said, i agree that we should not be complaining about the event. And some people are voicing their thoughts in a whiney way, which isn't warranted. But please, don't just lump all feedback together like that, constructive criticism isn't a bad thing and it is just natural that people want to talk about how to improve their favorite toys.

Agree. It's pretty briefly thought to assume that the majority would not like an improvement overall and that only a minority dislikes dying through the event vs premades just because they participate. It's much more likely that most people just don't use the forums and even fewer use it to voice their opinions. I could run a chatlog and you would read about that topic all the time in region chat or in my group chat. It's a heated discussion that's for sure and i don't mind people being against my or others suggestions, but posts of people who make absolutely no sense or are just created to provoke - i simply ignore. Otherwise i stay open minded to constructive criticism against those suggestion which were made, since i somewhat expect that as well. So far - besides "just make friends" and "no, pugs can suck my premade balls" wasn't much pointed out why this suggestion would be a bad thing.

Fri 5 Feb 2021 10:11 AM by Lollie

Event was fine, managed to get my Shaman to lvl40 which i was pleased with (can only play for 1.5 max on a week night), much prefered the other map, and absolutly hated animist putting shrooms on top of houses (surely that should be bannable?)

One thing that did annoy me, like someone else said, trying to buff your group in the starter area and half of the group port, your then left to buff in the open field, or worse some even run off without buffs.

Sat 6 Feb 2021 3:48 AM by themaskofkoro

Leveled a skald, Hunter, thane, and warrior to rr4 level 50 during the event, autogrouped with everything from 2-3 healer class groups to 2-3 stealth groups. Disbanded some groups cuz they were playing way too head-on and getting sandwiches all the time. Went solo on all while waiting for auto group to reset. Got decent tags and a few solo kills even.
I reckon if one knows the classes and know to pan camera, look for chances to gank or AJ, one could have a lot of fun during the event. Took about 7-8 hours overall to level to 50. Yeah it did get a bit tedious around level 40-50, and I left after getting rr4 cuz I imagine all the pro groups would just farm the 49s and the weak. Still it’s a good event to get rr4 and also level up easily.

Would like to be able to /invite a few players and still be able to fill the rest with /autogroup.

Maybe cap level 49-50 zone at rr5, and add new zone for rr5+ so people can zone there when they think they have enough items to cap melee resists and maybe body. Just a thought.

Personally think the three week break is a bit too short, and people will be bored of it real quick. But I guess people who don’t want to do the event will just not pay for the event, so that works too.

Sat 6 Feb 2021 10:21 AM by CowwoC

themaskofkoro wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Feb 2021 3:48 AM
Leveled a skald, Hunter, thane, and warrior to rr4 level 50 during the event, autogrouped with everything from 2-3 healer class groups to 2-3 stealth groups. Disbanded some groups cuz they were playing way too head-on and getting sandwiches all the time. Went solo on all while waiting for auto group to reset. Got decent tags and a few solo kills even.
I reckon if one knows the classes and know to pan camera, look for chances to gank or AJ, one could have a lot of fun during the event. Took about 7-8 hours overall to level to 50. Yeah it did get a bit tedious around level 40-50, and I left after getting rr4 cuz I imagine all the pro groups would just farm the 49s and the weak. Still it’s a good event to get rr4 and also level up easily.

Would like to be able to /invite a few players and still be able to fill the rest with /autogroup.

Maybe cap level 49-50 zone at rr5, and add new zone for rr5+ so people can zone there when they think they have enough items to cap melee resists and maybe body. Just a thought.

Personally think the three week break is a bit too short, and people will be bored of it real quick. But I guess people who don’t want to do the event will just not pay for the event, so that works too.

Gratz mate.
It's possible without a doubt to bring 4 toons to level 50+rr4 in a pug, if you have some good karma and time on your side, but sadly not everyone has around 5 hours per day to play daoc. Some friends made two rr5L5 toons in a half-premade on the other hand, usually they went with 50-90k per hour. Some others barely reached level 45 with pugs and maybe 1-2 hours. My personal highest count was 50k per hour with a camping ani+healer+caster setup in a house/ tower, otherwise it's always around 20-30k - which is still nice compared to what you get in normal rvr, no doubt. Probably thats why at this event more people stayed in the last zone, rather to roll another toon. The early zones were pretty empty after the first two roll big outs.

Sat 6 Feb 2021 6:19 PM by gotwqqd

CowwoC wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Feb 2021 10:21 AM
themaskofkoro wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Feb 2021 3:48 AM
Leveled a skald, Hunter, thane, and warrior to rr4 level 50 during the event, autogrouped with everything from 2-3 healer class groups to 2-3 stealth groups. Disbanded some groups cuz they were playing way too head-on and getting sandwiches all the time. Went solo on all while waiting for auto group to reset. Got decent tags and a few solo kills even.
I reckon if one knows the classes and know to pan camera, look for chances to gank or AJ, one could have a lot of fun during the event. Took about 7-8 hours overall to level to 50. Yeah it did get a bit tedious around level 40-50, and I left after getting rr4 cuz I imagine all the pro groups would just farm the 49s and the weak. Still it’s a good event to get rr4 and also level up easily.

Would like to be able to /invite a few players and still be able to fill the rest with /autogroup.

Maybe cap level 49-50 zone at rr5, and add new zone for rr5+ so people can zone there when they think they have enough items to cap melee resists and maybe body. Just a thought.

Personally think the three week break is a bit too short, and people will be bored of it real quick. But I guess people who don’t want to do the event will just not pay for the event, so that works too.

Gratz mate.
It's possible without a doubt to bring 4 toons to level 50+rr4 in a pug, if you have some good karma and time on your side, but sadly not everyone has around 5 hours per day to play daoc. Some friends made two rr5L5 toons in a half-premade on the other hand, usually they went with 50-90k per hour. Some others barely reached level 45 with pugs and maybe 1-2 hours. My personal highest count was 50k per hour with a camping ani+healer+caster setup in a house/ tower, otherwise it's always around 20-30k - which is still nice compared to what you get in normal rvr, no doubt. Probably thats why at this event more people stayed in the last zone, rather to roll another toon. The early zones were pretty empty after the first two roll big outs.

I’d just like to reach 5l5 ....wish they allowed going to next event if not left

Sat 6 Feb 2021 8:39 PM by CowwoC

gotwqqd wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Feb 2021 6:19 PM
CowwoC wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Feb 2021 10:21 AM
themaskofkoro wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Feb 2021 3:48 AM
Leveled a skald, Hunter, thane, and warrior to rr4 level 50 during the event, autogrouped with everything from 2-3 healer class groups to 2-3 stealth groups. Disbanded some groups cuz they were playing way too head-on and getting sandwiches all the time. Went solo on all while waiting for auto group to reset. Got decent tags and a few solo kills even.
I reckon if one knows the classes and know to pan camera, look for chances to gank or AJ, one could have a lot of fun during the event. Took about 7-8 hours overall to level to 50. Yeah it did get a bit tedious around level 40-50, and I left after getting rr4 cuz I imagine all the pro groups would just farm the 49s and the weak. Still it’s a good event to get rr4 and also level up easily.

Would like to be able to /invite a few players and still be able to fill the rest with /autogroup.

Maybe cap level 49-50 zone at rr5, and add new zone for rr5+ so people can zone there when they think they have enough items to cap melee resists and maybe body. Just a thought.

Personally think the three week break is a bit too short, and people will be bored of it real quick. But I guess people who don’t want to do the event will just not pay for the event, so that works too.

Gratz mate.
It's possible without a doubt to bring 4 toons to level 50+rr4 in a pug, if you have some good karma and time on your side, but sadly not everyone has around 5 hours per day to play daoc. Some friends made two rr5L5 toons in a half-premade on the other hand, usually they went with 50-90k per hour. Some others barely reached level 45 with pugs and maybe 1-2 hours. My personal highest count was 50k per hour with a camping ani+healer+caster setup in a house/ tower, otherwise it's always around 20-30k - which is still nice compared to what you get in normal rvr, no doubt. Probably thats why at this event more people stayed in the last zone, rather to roll another toon. The early zones were pretty empty after the first two roll big outs.
I’d just like to reach 5l5 ....wish they allowed going to next event if not left

There are pros and cons regarding that matter, but it would be indeed helpful to get one toon 5L5. I don't think they should allow to leave all toons in there but maybe one which you can choose. Like all get ported out but then you can port back with only one toon and it won't be possible with any other toon and you can't change your decision later on, till the next event ends.

Sun 7 Feb 2021 12:18 AM by gotwqqd

CowwoC wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Feb 2021 8:39 PM
gotwqqd wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Feb 2021 6:19 PM
CowwoC wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Feb 2021 10:21 AM
themaskofkoro wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Feb 2021 3:48 AM
Leveled a skald, Hunter, thane, and warrior to rr4 level 50 during the event, autogrouped with everything from 2-3 healer class groups to 2-3 stealth groups. Disbanded some groups cuz they were playing way too head-on and getting sandwiches all the time. Went solo on all while waiting for auto group to reset. Got decent tags and a few solo kills even.
I reckon if one knows the classes and know to pan camera, look for chances to gank or AJ, one could have a lot of fun during the event. Took about 7-8 hours overall to level to 50. Yeah it did get a bit tedious around level 40-50, and I left after getting rr4 cuz I imagine all the pro groups would just farm the 49s and the weak. Still it’s a good event to get rr4 and also level up easily.

Would like to be able to /invite a few players and still be able to fill the rest with /autogroup.

Maybe cap level 49-50 zone at rr5, and add new zone for rr5+ so people can zone there when they think they have enough items to cap melee resists and maybe body. Just a thought.

Personally think the three week break is a bit too short, and people will be bored of it real quick. But I guess people who don’t want to do the event will just not pay for the event, so that works too.

Gratz mate.
It's possible without a doubt to bring 4 toons to level 50+rr4 in a pug, if you have some good karma and time on your side, but sadly not everyone has around 5 hours per day to play daoc. Some friends made two rr5L5 toons in a half-premade on the other hand, usually they went with 50-90k per hour. Some others barely reached level 45 with pugs and maybe 1-2 hours. My personal highest count was 50k per hour with a camping ani+healer+caster setup in a house/ tower, otherwise it's always around 20-30k - which is still nice compared to what you get in normal rvr, no doubt. Probably thats why at this event more people stayed in the last zone, rather to roll another toon. The early zones were pretty empty after the first two roll big outs.
I’d just like to reach 5l5 ....wish they allowed going to next event if not left

There are pros and cons regarding that matter, but it would be indeed helpful to get one toon 5L5. I don't think they should allow to leave all toons in there but maybe one which you can choose. Like all get ported out but then you can port back with only one toon and it won't be possible with any other toon and you can't change your decision later on, till the next event ends.

Why should it matter?
Another thing is it will spread out the event population on day 1

Sun 7 Feb 2021 7:59 AM by Jingo NZ

Just thought of something;

For the next 24 hours (/played time) after your character leaves the event, you give a buff to all players you group with of +20% rps (players under 5l5 only) and +20% exp. Stackable.

Sun 7 Feb 2021 9:34 AM by CowwoC

gotwqqd wrote: ↑
Sun 7 Feb 2021 12:18 AM
CowwoC wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Feb 2021 8:39 PM
gotwqqd wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Feb 2021 6:19 PM
CowwoC wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Feb 2021 10:21 AM
themaskofkoro wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Feb 2021 3:48 AM
Leveled a skald, Hunter, thane, and warrior to rr4 level 50 during the event, autogrouped with everything from 2-3 healer class groups to 2-3 stealth groups. Disbanded some groups cuz they were playing way too head-on and getting sandwiches all the time. Went solo on all while waiting for auto group to reset. Got decent tags and a few solo kills even.
I reckon if one knows the classes and know to pan camera, look for chances to gank or AJ, one could have a lot of fun during the event. Took about 7-8 hours overall to level to 50. Yeah it did get a bit tedious around level 40-50, and I left after getting rr4 cuz I imagine all the pro groups would just farm the 49s and the weak. Still it’s a good event to get rr4 and also level up easily.

Would like to be able to /invite a few players and still be able to fill the rest with /autogroup.

Maybe cap level 49-50 zone at rr5, and add new zone for rr5+ so people can zone there when they think they have enough items to cap melee resists and maybe body. Just a thought.

Personally think the three week break is a bit too short, and people will be bored of it real quick. But I guess people who don’t want to do the event will just not pay for the event, so that works too.

Gratz mate.
It's possible without a doubt to bring 4 toons to level 50+rr4 in a pug, if you have some good karma and time on your side, but sadly not everyone has around 5 hours per day to play daoc. Some friends made two rr5L5 toons in a half-premade on the other hand, usually they went with 50-90k per hour. Some others barely reached level 45 with pugs and maybe 1-2 hours. My personal highest count was 50k per hour with a camping ani+healer+caster setup in a house/ tower, otherwise it's always around 20-30k - which is still nice compared to what you get in normal rvr, no doubt. Probably thats why at this event more people stayed in the last zone, rather to roll another toon. The early zones were pretty empty after the first two roll big outs.
I’d just like to reach 5l5 ....wish they allowed going to next event if not left

There are pros and cons regarding that matter, but it would be indeed helpful to get one toon 5L5. I don't think they should allow to leave all toons in there but maybe one which you can choose. Like all get ported out but then you can port back with only one toon and it won't be possible with any other toon and you can't change your decision later on, till the next event ends.
Why should it matter?
Another thing is it will spread out the event population on day 1

People could stop grinding xp the normal way if they can let all their toons in the event zone, but hey - that's a little bit off-topic to my suggestion, even tho it's an idea devs should think off at least.

Sun 7 Feb 2021 10:55 AM by Patron

CowwoC wrote: ↑
Sun 7 Feb 2021 9:34 AM
People could stop grinding xp the normal way if they can let all their toons in the event zone, but hey - that's a little bit off-topic to my suggestion, even tho it's an idea devs should think off at least.

thats damn right and a serious danger... stop this event before its too late

Sun 7 Feb 2021 8:27 PM by Venithrax

Just some thoughts here.

I don't know for sure what the Phoenix team has in terms of analytics, but my guess is that a lack of population in the upper levels is what drives the formation of premade groups. Prime-time, in which there are more players may affect this variable as well in terms of the Pick-up-group's (PUG's) to Premade group ratio.

Population issues aside, the mechanic "/autogroup" allows individuals to depart or join a PUG in the event - this allows for the formation of premade group's. Whether or not this function should be disabled is perhaps up to the player community at large. The policy of the phoenix team has historically been one of decision by poll or vote, so it may come to that. Personally, I am not opposed to Premade groups, it can be a very enjoyable gaming experience when playing against another similarly coordinated team that is truly competitive.

My proposed solutions are: 1. If playing in a premade in the event, a handicap will be implemented. Said handicap's will be discussed and voted on by the community and if the Phoenix team is in agreeance, then shall be implemented at next event. 2. When population begins to trend lower, NPC's or mini bosses will be generated in the central town and will equate to player XP/RP - this will bring up the population to primetime numbers. Mixing the PvE and PvP elements can add a new dimension of challenge, but also serves to bring everyone in the level range together for a large scale skirmish. The result being, XP and RP for everyone.

Lastly, not directly related with the above, I also propose a 20-30 second debuff for anyone porting to the playing field. This debuff makes the character worth no XP and no RP and further more places upon the attacker a debuff for "X minutes" where they are unable to earn XP or RP. This debuff may be lost from the character porting to the field by taking any action against an un-flagged player. Furthermore, characters will be unable to port to another group member residing in the large central town.

I'm sure there are issues with my suggestions or the software may not be able to support some of these requirements. I hope that constructive discussion and voting with Phoenix team approval, we can make this already fun event, even more fun!

Lastly, and certainly not least, I want to thank the Phoenix team for all their thankless work and support to make this a great community and a great gaming experience.

Thank you and respect to all.

Sun 7 Feb 2021 9:33 PM by Krulmaddenn

I'm a "casual" player in the sense that I dont have high RR toons, I just started phoenix a few weeks ago and I'm not a min-maxer. I played live and had an RR3 armsman. Im by no stretch of the imagination a skilled RvR player , in fact I still mostly feel like a total n00b and I am to most classes.

That said I do have more time to play right now than a lot of people since I've been off work due to covid.

I took an infi to 50 and have a mini to 46 right now both during this event. All autogrouped. I was in some bad ones...but even in an autogroup IF the group communicates when it is safe to port, sticks together and designates an MA they can get some pretty decent kills. This morning the only people that I was consistently rolled by were an obvious pre-made guild group by members of "Blacks II". They're good. Even my best groups couldn't take them out but thats DAoC. The trick is getting autogroups to communicate amd assist.

Ive got 4 more levels to grind out tonight or tomorrow and I'll have gotten 2 toons to 50 even though I suck. It doesnt take an elite pre-made to take advantage of the event. Wanna give pugs more XP/RPs? Thats ok by me...but with some effort pugs can do better than this thread seems to think.

Mon 8 Feb 2021 11:53 AM by CowwoC

Krulmaddenn wrote: ↑
Sun 7 Feb 2021 9:33 PM
It doesnt take an elite pre-made to take advantage of the event. Wanna give pugs more XP/RPs? Thats ok by me...but with some effort pugs can do better than this thread seems to think.

True, but nobody said you can't do anything in a pug. As already stated before - yes you can participate at the event and get a toon or even several to level 50 if you have enough time. But what this event enables for premades in comparison to pugs - there are worlds in between. Which means that premades farm double or tripple of that what pugs do in the same time and most likely just do it because rvr is dead during the event and some of their new toons you'll never see in rvr, simply because they just rolled them because they can't use their 8v8 setup during the event and still want to play their beloved game.

Anyway, it seems that devs want this event between pugs and premades so pugs can be the fodder - fine - but imho it would not hurt the premades if the pugs would get encouragement in form of more xp/ rp for their effort to die through the event and making it possible that premades can farm their way up beyond rr7 or several rr5L5 toons(which you simply can't as casual in a pug unless you play that game 24/7). The other option is to disable the premades for one event and pugs for another - as a test. Let's see how many still participate in each case. If you wan't to encourage people to build their own groups, maybe there is no need for autogroup at all, as autogroup at first was not planned anyway. If the numbers go down, you'll know that the event only exists because pugs keep it alive for everyone, so maybe stop leaving them behind with the argument that they still xp faster than the normal xp path.

Should friends be able to play together? Yes of course. Should premades be able to abuse the event to gain even further advantage over casual players? I don't think so. Is it possible to balance this event so that everyone is happy? Probably not. Does that mean that there is no way to improve the event? No, there are still plenty options to improve it for everyone. What do i suggest? Close the gap between premades and pugs xp/ rp wise, it does not have to be on the same level, but closer together than it is now. Why do i suggest that? Because i thought that one of the goals was to make it possible for casuals, who have not the time nor commitment for a several long hour build premade, to toss out new toons with a decent realm rank and inject them into the rvr and to make it easier for those people to try new classes they otherwise would never start, because of the grind to reach level 50+rr5L5.

So no clue why pro premades make such a drama out of a boost for pugs, since they wouldn't lose anything and if they feel disadvantaged because of that - then it seems to me that they really have to compensate something while rolling over pugs.

Mon 8 Feb 2021 2:33 PM by dbeattie71

Krulmaddenn wrote: ↑
Sun 7 Feb 2021 9:33 PM
I'm a "casual" player in the sense that I dont have high RR toons, I just started phoenix a few weeks ago and I'm not a min-maxer. I played live and had an RR3 armsman. Im by no stretch of the imagination a skilled RvR player , in fact I still mostly feel like a total n00b and I am to most classes.

That said I do have more time to play right now than a lot of people since I've been off work due to covid.

I took an infi to 50 and have a mini to 46 right now both during this event. All autogrouped. I was in some bad ones...but even in an autogroup IF the group communicates when it is safe to port, sticks together and designates an MA they can get some pretty decent kills. This morning the only people that I was consistently rolled by were an obvious pre-made guild group by members of "Blacks II". They're good. Even my best groups couldn't take them out but thats DAoC. The trick is getting autogroups to communicate amd assist.

Ive got 4 more levels to grind out tonight or tomorrow and I'll have gotten 2 toons to 50 even though I suck. It doesnt take an elite pre-made to take advantage of the event. Wanna give pugs more XP/RPs? Thats ok by me...but with some effort pugs can do better than this thread seems to think.

There’s a huge difference fighting a group that might have bases but usually don’t have any buffs except self. Versus a group with moarcane specs. Heals and specs will destroy.

This is the last event I’ll try and auto group. I play with a buddy and even though it’s still really fast to auto the game becomes, tag as many as possible before we get smashed.

Mon 8 Feb 2021 3:58 PM by Krulmaddenn

dbeattie71 wrote: ↑
Mon 8 Feb 2021 2:33 PM
Krulmaddenn wrote: ↑
Sun 7 Feb 2021 9:33 PM
I'm a "casual" player in the sense that I dont have high RR toons, I just started phoenix a few weeks ago and I'm not a min-maxer. I played live and had an RR3 armsman. Im by no stretch of the imagination a skilled RvR player , in fact I still mostly feel like a total n00b and I am to most classes.

That said I do have more time to play right now than a lot of people since I've been off work due to covid.

I took an infi to 50 and have a mini to 46 right now both during this event. All autogrouped. I was in some bad ones...but even in an autogroup IF the group communicates when it is safe to port, sticks together and designates an MA they can get some pretty decent kills. This morning the only people that I was consistently rolled by were an obvious pre-made guild group by members of "Blacks II". They're good. Even my best groups couldn't take them out but thats DAoC. The trick is getting autogroups to communicate amd assist.

Ive got 4 more levels to grind out tonight or tomorrow and I'll have gotten 2 toons to 50 even though I suck. It doesnt take an elite pre-made to take advantage of the event. Wanna give pugs more XP/RPs? Thats ok by me...but with some effort pugs can do better than this thread seems to think.

There’s a huge difference fighting a group that might have bases but usually don’t have any buffs except self. Versus a group with moarcane specs. Heals and specs will destroy.

This is the last event I’ll try and auto group. I play with a buddy and even though it’s still really fast to auto the game becomes, tag as many as possible before we get smashed.

I dont disagree. After this many days I'm a little burned out on it. Its repetitive at this point too. A pug isn't going to roll a pre-made. Im not saying its perfect. Im just saying that it is not as dire as some in the thread make it out to be. I went from 46 to 49 in the last 2 hours and Im almost rr4. A casual player even with the increased XP on this server could not do that without this event. The premades and guild groups are going to do better...of course they are. But if I roll out in a pug and we get 4 or 5 kills and then leach after we die Id still say we did well. Thats all.

That said...Im looking forward to the event being over so the world goes back to normal.

Wed 10 Feb 2021 10:39 AM by Svekt

Sagz wrote: ↑
Sun 10 Jan 2021 7:46 PM
CowwoC wrote: ↑
Sat 9 Jan 2021 7:17 PM
and grant them a bit more xp and rp gain(not double the amount but enough to stay motivated still) during the event vs premades, so that dying through the event has still a little reward to it rather than being the fodder for the premades only.

I guess my question is, why dont you make a premade group? I mean realistically you only need 2,3,4 friends. You do know you can make a character, get 2 friends, play and it will pug the other 2, or stay as three and you will be fine. I ran a 3 man from 1 to 40 yesterday in 4 hours, did not even pug the other 2 to have 5 ppl. Etherbunny did it last event and filmed it, go watch the video in the video section of the forums.

Just to clarify it’s Etherbunni ;P there is an Etherbunny that is not me.

This time I did auto grouping and I did it from two perspectives. Tank and CCheal. I chose warrior and bard and pretty much stuck to autogrouping.

I think what we see naturally occurring is that people who decide to organize and put in some effort to playing classes that support a working build reap a higher reward. I think this is a pretty accurate reward structure honestly. I don’t think we should highly reward truly lazy behavior and grant anyone bonus rps for dying because they tried running as 5 random classes that have no cohesiveness.

There is a reason more and more people shift towards abandoning the auto group mechanism and ask to be a part of and or build their own pug or premade.

We should in all actuality be rewarding those that seek to build groups of strangers that are effective guilds as we want people to establish more relationships so that they have more people to play with.

It logically only makes sense to have a naturally higher reward for the players who put in more effort to have a higher reward as long as it’s smart effort.

Honestly even if some of these auto groups just got in coms and had a working knowledge of game mechanics you would see even better fights.

You know when this event happened the first time, I slammed premade groups because I wanted to try meeting strangers and I somehow expected everyone else to want to do the same. I grew and realized that they gave us all the same tools and it was Truely a level playing field but only if we all used the tools the same way.

What I mean by this is that we all have the same tools at our disposal. All of us are capable of premades. All we have to do is /autogroup off and /region lfg premade lvl 1.

Yet a lot of us decide that hey, just because a function like autogrouping exists we must all use it to be fair. Even this mechanic would produce unfair match ups all the time but nobody wants to admit that because it hurts their argument.

Honestly more should just embrace the action and the glory of the old days similar to old emain. If we just show up, say we are lfg or start building ones from the existing lfg we will all have fun. It’s always beautiful to port out and see a fight on your left and one on your right and people scrambling to get the upper hand on positioning and then having to decide in a split moment what you’re going to do next with your group.

Leave autogrouping in tho.... let people continue to die until they learn to make new friends or organize existing one because this is after all a massive multiplayer online role playing game and should be played as one. Or leave it in for people like me who chose it as a challenge since I had already ran a group of 4 in the last event as a challenge... just my 2 cents tho.

Thu 11 Feb 2021 2:48 AM by dbeattie71

Yeah, a discord will level the playing field with buffed vs unbuffed lol.

Thu 11 Feb 2021 7:09 AM by Sepplord

dbeattie71 wrote: ↑
Thu 11 Feb 2021 2:48 AM
Yeah, a discord will level the playing field with buffed vs unbuffed lol.

not level but discord probably has a bigger influence than buffs have....or well coordination has a bigger impact, but that is impossible without a voice program. Simply being in discord and complaining after being dead will ofcourse not have any positive effects

Thu 11 Feb 2021 6:21 PM by Svekt

dbeattie71 wrote: ↑
Thu 11 Feb 2021 2:48 AM
Yeah, a discord will level the playing field with buffed vs unbuffed lol.

I never said it would level the playing field between buffed and unbuffed at all in any way... what I said was

Honestly even if some of these auto groups just got in coms and had a working knowledge of game mechanics you would see even better fights.

This is two things: it’s not just get in coms, it’s also having a working understanding of the game mechanics. Believe it or not there is still a large majority of people who don’t know enough mechanics. They may know what to do but not why to do it. Furthermore if you know how to use coms it’s easy to say we are getting flanked move north than it is to type it and magically have everyone see it despite their tunnel vision on the target in front of them.

Perhaps try reading what you try to paraphrase

Thu 11 Feb 2021 8:16 PM by gotwqqd

Svekt wrote: ↑
Thu 11 Feb 2021 6:21 PM
dbeattie71 wrote: ↑
Thu 11 Feb 2021 2:48 AM
Yeah, a discord will level the playing field with buffed vs unbuffed lol.

I never said it would level the playing field between buffed and unbuffed at all in any way... what I said was

Honestly even if some of these auto groups just got in coms and had a working knowledge of game mechanics you would see even better fights.

This is two things: it’s not just get in coms, it’s also having a working understanding of the game mechanics. Believe it or not there is still a large majority of people who don’t know enough mechanics. They may know what to do but not why to do it. Furthermore if you know how to use coms it’s easy to say we are getting flanked move north than it is to type it and magically have everyone see it despite their tunnel vision on the target in front of them.

Perhaps try reading what you try to paraphrase

And tactics
If you take away comms from the premades they will likely still wipe the floor of pugs....tactics make the biggest difference

Fri 12 Feb 2021 7:51 AM by dbeattie71

Tactics, most skilled groups in the proving grounds are the ones that show up to a fight last. Lol