RvR Update (wall of text inc) - Phoenix Freeshard

I think its time for an overhaul of the current RvR system. This can be seen with the support of having some kind of change with the last poll. Ill try my best to minimize text.

Overview

1-Keep Changes
2-Task Changes
3-Realm Timer
4-BSC idea for EV

(1) Keep Changes

We need a better system that better aligns with high and low populations. Basically right now EU runs 100+ man bg's, dropping 5 rams and burning through keeps in minutes. NA is lucky to fill 2 rams. Asia/pacific won't even take towers much less keeps.

Ultimately the current system does not adequate compensate for the vast differences in population. I believe this has lead to many sitting at task keeps or merchant keeps waiting for something to come to them.

The following proposals are basic concepts to lessen the effects, though not completely remove them, of high abd low population differences.

(A) Limit # of rams that can target a door.
(A1) adjust door hp to desired to compensate
(A2) increase abs of door to lower player damage significantly.

(A Summary) this will lessen the time difference to take a keep between high pop and low pop. If you want 5 mins per door on level 6 keep, set hp accordingly. Or 10 minutes, or 2.

(B) implement guild bp cost to claim/maintain keep.
(B1) wipe current guild bp count
(B2) take the top earning guilds, figure how man bps they would need to earn to hold level 10 keep, and set bp awarded to that level.
(B3) create "improvents" for higher level keeps, ie purple guards, caster guards, guards in lord room. Better defenses like faster oil or trebs, or more hp on oils.
(B4) make towers mean something other than port, example a high level tower provides a tethered guard to the keep lord that's level is dependent on tower level.

(B Summary) the goal is to make higher level keeps better, but also make it more difficult to get higher level keeps. It encourages being part of a guild, and having stronger guilds hold the more important keeps. It brings more strategy to the game. It also allow for weak keeps to still be taken, even during low pop times.

(C) Change RP reward for keeps/towers.
(C1) significantly reduce rps earned for keep captures
(C2) remove or reduce rp reward for towers.
(C3) significantly INCREASE rps rewarded in the rp pool for fighting near keep or tower.

(C Summary) the goal should be to encourage fights, not taking empty keeps. By reducing the value of empty keeps, and increasing the value of defended keeps, if done significantly, we should see less avoiding fights.

(2) Task Changes

This is probably the biggest issue, while i personally love that it centralizes action, it does it too well, and creates a farming location for defenders too sit inside. The goal of the following changes is to utilize the previous rp changes to spur defenses, while removing much of the need to "camp" a keep.

(A) remove current keep system

(B) replace with new "attack only" system
(B1) each realm has 2 new attack tasks. 1 for each realm.
(B2) example, Hib, 1st task Attack Mid, blend OP, 2nd task Attack Alb, berk OP
(B3) the attack tasks will progress from towers to main keep. If main keep is taken, another keep task will begin in that realm.
(B4) there is no "defend" task. The choice to defend will be rewarded in the increased rp pool reward for fighting, not camping a set keep.

(3) Realm Timer

Not a list here, just a plea. Please lower this again. Will it fix population imbalances? No, probably not. Will it hurt population imbalances? Probably not. I'm going to go out on a limb and say, the overall people who switch from high pop to low pop, will be mostly off set by those switching from weak to strong. However the realm timer does adversely affect people. Example, i have plenty of guild members who like playing a different realm, and are torn between playing with each other, and playing the realm of choice. As a compromise we tend to switch realms every so often to give other players the chance to play the realm they want. This sucks because we tend to get stuck into realms that over dominate just so someone can play their thane or nightshade.

I suggest setting the realm switch timer to 30mins.

(4) EV

EV is mostly dead unused zone. Lets spice it up.

(A) add port from relic towns to center keep in ev
(B) center keep has a npc that can flag you as ffa
(C) you can group with, or kill any player from any realm
(D) passing the first mile gates will immediately end ffa status. Players will be immediately removed from groups.
(E) Players can still rvr in this area, if they dont apply the ffa flag in the center.

Wed 11 Mar 2020 6:33 PM by mattymc

Your realm timer argument makes zero sense -- first, I would say that, anecdotally, it is pretty clear that lower realm timers = worse game play and more pop imbalances. More specifically, when you say ' As a compromise we tend to switch realms every so often to give other players the chance to play the realm they want. This sucks because we tend to get stuck into realms that over dominate just so someone can play their thane or nightshade.' That rings hollow ---- the dynamic pop imbalances are long term <relatively> and easily mapped --- you can decide what to play for a night w/o logging in ... realm timers simply don't effect this.

The more realm timers were shortened on live the worse the game play got --- here, the same has happened -- not seeing this at least being PART of the problem is rather myopic.

Overall what makes this game GREAT is People fighting People --- not PvE for RP nor massive POP imbalances --- anything that DOESNT improve and support that aspect of the game is adding to the problem not solving it.

Wed 11 Mar 2020 7:32 PM by Alle

Ownnyn wrote: ↑
Wed 11 Mar 2020 6:14 PM
I think its time for an overhaul of the current RvR system. This can be seen with the support of having some kind of change with the last poll. Ill try my best to minimize text.

Overview

1-Keep Changes
2-Task Changes
3-Realm Timer
4-BSC idea for EV

(1) Keep Changes

We need a better system that better aligns with high and low populations. Basically right now EU runs 100+ man bg's, dropping 5 rams and burning through keeps in minutes. NA is lucky to fill 2 rams. Asia/pacific won't even take towers much less keeps.

Ultimately the current system does not adequate compensate for the vast differences in population. I believe this has lead to many sitting at task keeps or merchant keeps waiting for something to come to them.

The following proposals are basic concepts to lessen the effects, though not completely remove them, of high abd low population differences.

(A) Limit # of rams that can target a door.
(A1) adjust door hp to desired to compensate
(A2) increase abs of door to lower player damage significantly.

(A Summary) this will lessen the time difference to take a keep between high pop and low pop. If you want 5 mins per door on level 6 keep, set hp accordingly. Or 10 minutes, or 2.

(B) implement guild bp cost to claim/maintain keep.
(B1) wipe current guild bp count
(B2) take the top earning guilds, figure how man bps they would need to earn to hold level 10 keep, and set bp awarded to that level.
(B3) create "improvents" for higher level keeps, ie purple guards, caster guards, guards in lord room. Better defenses like faster oil or trebs, or more hp on oils.
(B4) make towers mean something other than port, example a high level tower provides a tethered guard to the keep lord that's level is dependent on tower level.

(B Summary) the goal is to make higher level keeps better, but also make it more difficult to get higher level keeps. It encourages being part of a guild, and having stronger guilds hold the more important keeps. It brings more strategy to the game. It also allow for weak keeps to still be taken, even during low pop times.

(C) Change RP reward for keeps/towers.
(C1) significantly reduce rps earned for keep captures
(C2) remove or reduce rp reward for towers.
(C3) significantly INCREASE rps rewarded in the rp pool for fighting near keep or tower.

(C Summary) the goal should be to encourage fights, not taking empty keeps. By reducing the value of empty keeps, and increasing the value of defended keeps, if done significantly, we should see less avoiding fights.

(2) Task Changes

This is probably the biggest issue, while i personally love that it centralizes action, it does it too well, and creates a farming location for defenders too sit inside. The goal of the following changes is to utilize the previous rp changes to spur defenses, while removing much of the need to "camp" a keep.

(A) remove current keep system

(B) replace with new "attack only" system
(B1) each realm has 2 new attack tasks. 1 for each realm.
(B2) example, Hib, 1st task Attack Mid, blend OP, 2nd task Attack Alb, berk OP
(B3) the attack tasks will progress from towers to main keep. If main keep is taken, another keep task will begin in that realm.
(B4) there is no "defend" task. The choice to defend will be rewarded in the increased rp pool reward for fighting, not camping a set keep.

(3) Realm Timer

Not a list here, just a plea. Please lower this again. Will it fix population imbalances? No, probably not. Will it hurt population imbalances? Probably not. I'm going to go out on a limb and say, the overall people who switch from high pop to low pop, will be mostly off set by those switching from weak to strong. However the realm timer does adversely affect people. Example, i have plenty of guild members who like playing a different realm, and are torn between playing with each other, and playing the realm of choice. As a compromise we tend to switch realms every so often to give other players the chance to play the realm they want. This sucks because we tend to get stuck into realms that over dominate just so someone can play their thane or nightshade.

I suggest setting the realm switch timer to 30mins.

(4) EV

EV is mostly dead unused zone. Lets spice it up.

(A) add port from relic towns to center keep in ev
(B) center keep has a npc that can flag you as ffa
(C) you can group with, or kill any player from any realm
(D) passing the first mile gates will immediately end ffa status. Players will be immediately removed from groups.
(E) Players can still rvr in this area, if they dont apply the ffa flag in the center.

Great ideas; thanks for this.

Wed 11 Mar 2020 8:20 PM by PlaSmiCNoMaD

Reasons for playing Phoenix DAoC
Official DAoC costs monthly subscription fee
Official DAoC is taking the official servers in the wrong development path

Why this thread is negative, not supportive:
Asking for Official daoc development path suggestions like limits to catapults targetting the keep door.

While it is humanly possible in the real world to target the same target with too many guns and cause the bullets to hit each other and bounce off, messing up the accuracy some, there is still no limit to how many guns can shoot at a single target. And this is similar to how official daoc is turning crossbow on the Armsman into a pulling device, not an actual weapon that does damage.

Haven't mercenaries suffered long enough that their shortbow still does almost nothing in pvp and pve? Nerds are ruining daoc. But we're not asking people to quit playing, just suggesting that they would enjoy Storm DoL server more than Phoenix. We'd love it if Phoenix keeps developing the game to become more like Dark Souls 3 (not 1 or 2, only 3). That would be HOT. If people want it to be COOL, Storm is where it is at, which is currently down due to the servers being destroyed. Things Phoenix should pay attention to from Storm is the AoE melee, but don't do it how they are doing it because it is too PvE based. Make it hot. This is phoenix. Things should be tried like allowing melee swings without a target so we can stab stealthers so we can hear them whine on the forums. And Alchemists pulling their hair because they lose control of the potion market.

Wed 11 Mar 2020 8:51 PM by Forlornhope

Ownnyn wrote: ↑
Wed 11 Mar 2020 6:14 PM
I think its time for an overhaul of the current RvR system. This can be seen with the support of having some kind of change with the last poll. Ill try my best to minimize text.

Overview

1-Keep Changes
2-Task Changes
3-Realm Timer
4-BSC idea for EV

(1) Keep Changes

We need a better system that better aligns with high and low populations. Basically right now EU runs 100+ man bg's, dropping 5 rams and burning through keeps in minutes. NA is lucky to fill 2 rams. Asia/pacific won't even take towers much less keeps.

Ultimately the current system does not adequate compensate for the vast differences in population. I believe this has lead to many sitting at task keeps or merchant keeps waiting for something to come to them.

The following proposals are basic concepts to lessen the effects, though not completely remove them, of high abd low population differences.

(A) Limit # of rams that can target a door.
(A1) adjust door hp to desired to compensate
(A2) increase abs of door to lower player damage significantly.

(A Summary) this will lessen the time difference to take a keep between high pop and low pop. If you want 5 mins per door on level 6 keep, set hp accordingly. Or 10 minutes, or 2.

(B) implement guild bp cost to claim/maintain keep.
(B1) wipe current guild bp count
(B2) take the top earning guilds, figure how man bps they would need to earn to hold level 10 keep, and set bp awarded to that level.
(B3) create "improvents" for higher level keeps, ie purple guards, caster guards, guards in lord room. Better defenses like faster oil or trebs, or more hp on oils.
(B4) make towers mean something other than port, example a high level tower provides a tethered guard to the keep lord that's level is dependent on tower level.

(B Summary) the goal is to make higher level keeps better, but also make it more difficult to get higher level keeps. It encourages being part of a guild, and having stronger guilds hold the more important keeps. It brings more strategy to the game. It also allow for weak keeps to still be taken, even during low pop times.

(C) Change RP reward for keeps/towers.
(C1) significantly reduce rps earned for keep captures
(C2) remove or reduce rp reward for towers.
(C3) significantly INCREASE rps rewarded in the rp pool for fighting near keep or tower.

(C Summary) the goal should be to encourage fights, not taking empty keeps. By reducing the value of empty keeps, and increasing the value of defended keeps, if done significantly, we should see less avoiding fights.

(2) Task Changes

This is probably the biggest issue, while i personally love that it centralizes action, it does it too well, and creates a farming location for defenders too sit inside. The goal of the following changes is to utilize the previous rp changes to spur defenses, while removing much of the need to "camp" a keep.

(A) remove current keep system

(B) replace with new "attack only" system
(B1) each realm has 2 new attack tasks. 1 for each realm.
(B2) example, Hib, 1st task Attack Mid, blend OP, 2nd task Attack Alb, berk OP
(B3) the attack tasks will progress from towers to main keep. If main keep is taken, another keep task will begin in that realm.
(B4) there is no "defend" task. The choice to defend will be rewarded in the increased rp pool reward for fighting, not camping a set keep.

(3) Realm Timer

Not a list here, just a plea. Please lower this again. Will it fix population imbalances? No, probably not. Will it hurt population imbalances? Probably not. I'm going to go out on a limb and say, the overall people who switch from high pop to low pop, will be mostly off set by those switching from weak to strong. However the realm timer does adversely affect people. Example, i have plenty of guild members who like playing a different realm, and are torn between playing with each other, and playing the realm of choice. As a compromise we tend to switch realms every so often to give other players the chance to play the realm they want. This sucks because we tend to get stuck into realms that over dominate just so someone can play their thane or nightshade.

I suggest setting the realm switch timer to 30mins.

(4) EV

EV is mostly dead unused zone. Lets spice it up.

(A) add port from relic towns to center keep in ev
(B) center keep has a npc that can flag you as ffa
(C) you can group with, or kill any player from any realm
(D) passing the first mile gates will immediately end ffa status. Players will be immediately removed from groups.
(E) Players can still rvr in this area, if they dont apply the ffa flag in the center.

Your keep changes would likely make it impossible for any sort of keep taking during NA time, like you said we already struggle to fill two rams. So, I fail to see how that would improve anything other than 100 man zergs vs keeps. I also agree that lowering the timer isn't going to help anything, it is likely going to just make things worse. It will allow people to hop almost instantly to the winning realm for easier rp farming. People will probably argue otherwise but we need to be real, based on the people who still play on this server who already go for the easiest rps possible this is only going to hurt the server as a whole. The only thing that might be slightly better is the dwindling 8man community, which doesn't really effect the server as a whole since they don't really participate in anything other than their set up 8v8 fights. I definitely think something needs to be done about the task system, there's an eight page thread the devs started with tons of decent suggestions. However I have heard nothing from them about tests or possible changes since.

Wed 11 Mar 2020 9:23 PM by PlaSmiCNoMaD

Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Wed 11 Mar 2020 8:51 PM
Your keep changes would likely make it impossible for any sort of keep taking during NA time, like you said we already struggle to fill two rams. So, I fail to see how that would improve anything other than 100 man zergs vs keeps. I also agree that lowering the timer isn't going to help anything, it is likely going to just make things worse. It will allow people to hop almost instantly to the winning realm for easier rp farming. People will probably argue otherwise but we need to be real, based on the people who still play on this server who already go for the easiest rps possible this is only going to hurt the server as a whole. The only thing that might be slightly better is the dwindling 8man community, which doesn't really effect the server as a whole since they don't really participate in anything other than their set up 8v8 fights. I definitely think something needs to be done about the task system, there's an eight page thread the devs started with tons of decent suggestions. However I have heard nothing from them about tests or possible changes since.

How to solve Realm Hopping
Look into PvP timers. If a target is killed, they gain PvP immunity and can't be farmed. They can activate it at any time like Embers.
Look into just letting people solo Realm Points from monsters in the frontiers. At a 1-2% drop chance, soloers can manage to get an item that they can turn in. They'll likely only be able to farm 1-4 every hour. So figure out what the average RPs gained is from PvP from a beginner player, or what should be anyways, and then give it to this system. It's a stupid game that depends on Realm Points. Move the competition to who owns the most territory. Don't make special characters who have special rewards that makes their characters better than others.
Would even keep going and say to add Poise to the game and make performing combos useless. Then add Greatbows and give it to Strength mercenaries and Armsman.

Wed 11 Mar 2020 9:27 PM by PlaSmiCNoMaD

It's a Jigsaw puzzle that God made for DAoC. Get it? And Jesus Christ is the only way.

Mordred would have been better with an Embering system by the bye.

Wed 11 Mar 2020 9:38 PM by PlaSmiCNoMaD

Where DAoC departs from Dark Souls 3 is it looks towards First Person Shooters for future development. Needs a crosshair, and the game to be completely playable for people without even using Tab Target. Target lockon systems are stupid. Also needs weapon models and animations so people can tell what weapons that they have selected.

When DAoC development team patched in the Optimization patch that removed final killing blow animations on Mobs, they showed that they no longer cared for DAoC's first person camera anymore lol. This patch was somewhere within the first year of release. So it didn't take long for them to do it, and people complained, but they didn't listen. But it just goes to show that they didn't care.

Wed 11 Mar 2020 10:24 PM by Ownnyn

mattymc wrote: ↑
Wed 11 Mar 2020 6:33 PM
Your realm timer argument makes zero sense -- first, I would say that, anecdotally, it is pretty clear that lower realm timers = worse game play and more pop imbalances. More specifically, when you say ' As a compromise we tend to switch realms every so often to give other players the chance to play the realm they want. This sucks because we tend to get stuck into realms that over dominate just so someone can play their thane or nightshade.' That rings hollow ---- the dynamic pop imbalances are long term <relatively> and easily mapped --- you can decide what to play for a night w/o logging in ... realm timers simply don't effect this.

The more realm timers were shortened on live the worse the game play got --- here, the same has happened -- not seeing this at least being PART of the problem is rather myopic.

Overall what makes this game GREAT is People fighting People --- not PvE for RP nor massive POP imbalances --- anything that DOESNT improve and support that aspect of the game is adding to the problem not solving it.

I would disagree, shortening the realm timer has had no significant impact, whether it be from 7 days to 12 hrs, 12 hrs to 4 hrs, or, by my estimation, from 4 hrs to 30 mins.

The closest weve had to this is when mythic did it years ago,when they made clustered servers, and i dont recall any major issues.

The most you can say is that years after the fact....a roaming zerg would switch realms taking empty keeps. I would say thats another problem that was only allowed to happen bc short realm timers, rather than realm timers being the cause.

And if you read other aspects from this post youll notice im attempting to address those aswell

Wed 11 Mar 2020 10:28 PM by Ownnyn

Forlornhope wrote: ↑
Wed 11 Mar 2020 8:51 PM
Ownnyn wrote: ↑
Wed 11 Mar 2020 6:14 PM
I think its time for an overhaul of the current RvR system. This can be seen with the support of having some kind of change with the last poll. Ill try my best to minimize text.

Overview

1-Keep Changes
2-Task Changes
3-Realm Timer
4-BSC idea for EV

(1) Keep Changes

We need a better system that better aligns with high and low populations. Basically right now EU runs 100+ man bg's, dropping 5 rams and burning through keeps in minutes. NA is lucky to fill 2 rams. Asia/pacific won't even take towers much less keeps.

Ultimately the current system does not adequate compensate for the vast differences in population. I believe this has lead to many sitting at task keeps or merchant keeps waiting for something to come to them.

The following proposals are basic concepts to lessen the effects, though not completely remove them, of high abd low population differences.

(A) Limit # of rams that can target a door.
(A1) adjust door hp to desired to compensate
(A2) increase abs of door to lower player damage significantly.

(A Summary) this will lessen the time difference to take a keep between high pop and low pop. If you want 5 mins per door on level 6 keep, set hp accordingly. Or 10 minutes, or 2.

(B) implement guild bp cost to claim/maintain keep.
(B1) wipe current guild bp count
(B2) take the top earning guilds, figure how man bps they would need to earn to hold level 10 keep, and set bp awarded to that level.
(B3) create "improvents" for higher level keeps, ie purple guards, caster guards, guards in lord room. Better defenses like faster oil or trebs, or more hp on oils.
(B4) make towers mean something other than port, example a high level tower provides a tethered guard to the keep lord that's level is dependent on tower level.

(B Summary) the goal is to make higher level keeps better, but also make it more difficult to get higher level keeps. It encourages being part of a guild, and having stronger guilds hold the more important keeps. It brings more strategy to the game. It also allow for weak keeps to still be taken, even during low pop times.

(C) Change RP reward for keeps/towers.
(C1) significantly reduce rps earned for keep captures
(C2) remove or reduce rp reward for towers.
(C3) significantly INCREASE rps rewarded in the rp pool for fighting near keep or tower.

(C Summary) the goal should be to encourage fights, not taking empty keeps. By reducing the value of empty keeps, and increasing the value of defended keeps, if done significantly, we should see less avoiding fights.

(2) Task Changes

This is probably the biggest issue, while i personally love that it centralizes action, it does it too well, and creates a farming location for defenders too sit inside. The goal of the following changes is to utilize the previous rp changes to spur defenses, while removing much of the need to "camp" a keep.

(A) remove current keep system

(B) replace with new "attack only" system
(B1) each realm has 2 new attack tasks. 1 for each realm.
(B2) example, Hib, 1st task Attack Mid, blend OP, 2nd task Attack Alb, berk OP
(B3) the attack tasks will progress from towers to main keep. If main keep is taken, another keep task will begin in that realm.
(B4) there is no "defend" task. The choice to defend will be rewarded in the increased rp pool reward for fighting, not camping a set keep.

(3) Realm Timer

Not a list here, just a plea. Please lower this again. Will it fix population imbalances? No, probably not. Will it hurt population imbalances? Probably not. I'm going to go out on a limb and say, the overall people who switch from high pop to low pop, will be mostly off set by those switching from weak to strong. However the realm timer does adversely affect people. Example, i have plenty of guild members who like playing a different realm, and are torn between playing with each other, and playing the realm of choice. As a compromise we tend to switch realms every so often to give other players the chance to play the realm they want. This sucks because we tend to get stuck into realms that over dominate just so someone can play their thane or nightshade.

I suggest setting the realm switch timer to 30mins.

(4) EV

EV is mostly dead unused zone. Lets spice it up.

(A) add port from relic towns to center keep in ev
(B) center keep has a npc that can flag you as ffa
(C) you can group with, or kill any player from any realm
(D) passing the first mile gates will immediately end ffa status. Players will be immediately removed from groups.
(E) Players can still rvr in this area, if they dont apply the ffa flag in the center.

Your keep changes would likely make it impossible for any sort of keep taking during NA time, like you said we already struggle to fill two rams. So, I fail to see how that would improve anything other than 100 man zergs vs keeps. I also agree that lowering the timer isn't going to help anything, it is likely going to just make things worse. It will allow people to hop almost instantly to the winning realm for easier rp farming. People will probably argue otherwise but we need to be real, based on the people who still play on this server who already go for the easiest rps possible this is only going to hurt the server as a whole. The only thing that might be slightly better is the dwindling 8man community, which doesn't really effect the server as a whole since they don't really participate in anything other than their set up 8v8 fights. I definitely think something needs to be done about the task system, there's an eight page thread the devs started with tons of decent suggestions. However I have heard nothing from them about tests or possible changes since.

The way it makes it easier is 2 fold

First, by requiring bps to maintain keeps, few keeps will be high rank, meaning more level 4 or 5 keeps to hit

2nd, by balancing the door around 1 ram instead of 5, we can, during na time....take a door down at roughly the same speed as eu time, since numbers play less of a factor.

Bonus points, an updated task system will spread the action out across more zones.

Wed 11 Mar 2020 10:43 PM by mattymc

Ownnyn wrote: ↑
Wed 11 Mar 2020 10:24 PM
mattymc wrote: ↑
Wed 11 Mar 2020 6:33 PM
Your realm timer argument makes zero sense -- first, I would say that, anecdotally, it is pretty clear that lower realm timers = worse game play and more pop imbalances. More specifically, when you say ' As a compromise we tend to switch realms every so often to give other players the chance to play the realm they want. This sucks because we tend to get stuck into realms that over dominate just so someone can play their thane or nightshade.' That rings hollow ---- the dynamic pop imbalances are long term <relatively> and easily mapped --- you can decide what to play for a night w/o logging in ... realm timers simply don't effect this.

The more realm timers were shortened on live the worse the game play got --- here, the same has happened -- not seeing this at least being PART of the problem is rather myopic.

Overall what makes this game GREAT is People fighting People --- not PvE for RP nor massive POP imbalances --- anything that DOESNT improve and support that aspect of the game is adding to the problem not solving it.

I would disagree, shortening the realm timer has had no significant impact, whether it be from 7 days to 12 hrs, 12 hrs to 4 hrs, or, by my estimation, from 4 hrs to 30 mins.

The closest weve had to this is when mythic did it years ago,when they made clustered servers, and i dont recall any major issues.

The most you can say is that years after the fact....a roaming zerg would switch realms taking empty keeps. I would say thats another problem that was only allowed to happen bc short realm timers, rather than realm timers being the cause.

And if you read other aspects from this post youll notice im attempting to address those aswell

While the differences have been significant across the board, it is MOST noticeable during NA time. The population fluctuation has been broad and notable; exacerbated, perhaps, by some balance decisions. You can literally WATCH the pop shifts happen --
Regardless --- the key is PEOPLE fighting People ---- there is NO evidence that shortening realm times effects this.

Wed 11 Mar 2020 10:58 PM by Ownnyn

mattymc wrote: ↑
Wed 11 Mar 2020 10:43 PM
Ownnyn wrote: ↑
Wed 11 Mar 2020 10:24 PM
mattymc wrote: ↑
Wed 11 Mar 2020 6:33 PM
Your realm timer argument makes zero sense -- first, I would say that, anecdotally, it is pretty clear that lower realm timers = worse game play and more pop imbalances. More specifically, when you say ' As a compromise we tend to switch realms every so often to give other players the chance to play the realm they want. This sucks because we tend to get stuck into realms that over dominate just so someone can play their thane or nightshade.' That rings hollow ---- the dynamic pop imbalances are long term <relatively> and easily mapped --- you can decide what to play for a night w/o logging in ... realm timers simply don't effect this.

The more realm timers were shortened on live the worse the game play got --- here, the same has happened -- not seeing this at least being PART of the problem is rather myopic.

Overall what makes this game GREAT is People fighting People --- not PvE for RP nor massive POP imbalances --- anything that DOESNT improve and support that aspect of the game is adding to the problem not solving it.

I would disagree, shortening the realm timer has had no significant impact, whether it be from 7 days to 12 hrs, 12 hrs to 4 hrs, or, by my estimation, from 4 hrs to 30 mins.

The closest weve had to this is when mythic did it years ago,when they made clustered servers, and i dont recall any major issues.

The most you can say is that years after the fact....a roaming zerg would switch realms taking empty keeps. I would say thats another problem that was only allowed to happen bc short realm timers, rather than realm timers being the cause.

And if you read other aspects from this post youll notice im attempting to address those aswell

While the differences have been significant across the board, it is MOST noticeable during NA time. The population fluctuation has been broad and notable; exacerbated, perhaps, by some balance decisions. You can literally WATCH the pop shifts happen --
Regardless --- the key is PEOPLE fighting People ---- there is NO evidence that shortening realm times effects this.

Thats my point, shortening the realm timer doesnt fix it, or make it worse, its a wash.

Heres what i see

6pm, 120 hibs, 120 mids, 100 albs
7pm, 90 hibs, 140 mids. 85 albs
8pm, 90 hibs, 120 mids, 80 albs
9pm, 95 hibs. 105 mids, 85 albs
10pm, 100 hibs, 90 mids, 85 albs
11pm, 95 hibs. 70 mids. 80 albs
12pm, 90 hibs, 70 mids, 70 albs
1am, 70 hibs, 65 mids. 75 albs
2am, 50 hibs, 55 mids. 70 albs
3am, 35 hibs. 50 mids, 75 albs

Whos in the lead changes as the night goes, usually mids have most until grumpy or odin log, then hibs until ffejani or bayerz or whoever is leading logs, usually about an hr after grumpy, then the albs maintains best while the others drop throughout the night.

So no, a 4 hr timer wont have any impact on that at all. And id suggest....neither would a 30, bc the popsfollow the leaders, more than anything. If oden or grumpy dont lead, then mid pop drops to 70 by 8 instead of 10. If nobody leads in hib, pop drops to 60 by 8 rather than 1am.

I dont think realm timer will impact it nearly as much as people on BOTH sides think.

Wed 11 Mar 2020 11:08 PM by PlaSmiCNoMaD

Yep and then just add friendly fire problem solved once people learn who the realm hoppers are that are hopping too much. There will always be realm hoppers but they better duck and cover or they will be found out as traitors. Like we said before, DAoC's problems are solved not by unrealistic balancing but by making it hotter. And the people who keep whining like little special snowflakes are going to die in the fire when the other side burns them up if they don't stop. See how fun fire is? One letter away from sun.

Even better, turn players a dark glow red if they are hopping too much and killable by their own realm for RPs.

Wed 11 Mar 2020 11:19 PM by PlaSmiCNoMaD

Speaking of Dark Phantom Invasions, let solo players invade other people's realms in specific areas for PvP invasions. Primary farming spots and things for all levels. This allows people to check on other people's realms and add competitive play in search of an enemy realm player in their realms.

Wed 11 Mar 2020 11:24 PM by PlaSmiCNoMaD

Player Clipping so that no one can stand on top of each other. Projectiles hit if they hit another player.

Thu 12 Mar 2020 1:39 PM by mattymc

Ownnyn wrote: ↑
Wed 11 Mar 2020 10:58 PM
mattymc wrote: ↑
Wed 11 Mar 2020 10:43 PM
Ownnyn wrote: ↑
Wed 11 Mar 2020 10:24 PM
I would disagree, shortening the realm timer has had no significant impact, whether it be from 7 days to 12 hrs, 12 hrs to 4 hrs, or, by my estimation, from 4 hrs to 30 mins.

The closest weve had to this is when mythic did it years ago,when they made clustered servers, and i dont recall any major issues.

The most you can say is that years after the fact....a roaming zerg would switch realms taking empty keeps. I would say thats another problem that was only allowed to happen bc short realm timers, rather than realm timers being the cause.

And if you read other aspects from this post youll notice im attempting to address those aswell

While the differences have been significant across the board, it is MOST noticeable during NA time. The population fluctuation has been broad and notable; exacerbated, perhaps, by some balance decisions. You can literally WATCH the pop shifts happen --
Regardless --- the key is PEOPLE fighting People ---- there is NO evidence that shortening realm times effects this.

Thats my point, shortening the realm timer doesnt fix it, or make it worse, its a wash.

Heres what i see

6pm, 120 hibs, 120 mids, 100 albs
7pm, 90 hibs, 140 mids. 85 albs
8pm, 90 hibs, 120 mids, 80 albs
9pm, 95 hibs. 105 mids, 85 albs
10pm, 100 hibs, 90 mids, 85 albs
11pm, 95 hibs. 70 mids. 80 albs
12pm, 90 hibs, 70 mids, 70 albs
1am, 70 hibs, 65 mids. 75 albs
2am, 50 hibs, 55 mids. 70 albs
3am, 35 hibs. 50 mids, 75 albs

Whos in the lead changes as the night goes, usually mids have most until grumpy or odin log, then hibs until ffejani or bayerz or whoever is leading logs, usually about an hr after grumpy, then the albs maintains best while the others drop throughout the night.

So no, a 4 hr timer wont have any impact on that at all. And id suggest....neither would a 30, bc the popsfollow the leaders, more than anything. If oden or grumpy dont lead, then mid pop drops to 70 by 8 instead of 10. If nobody leads in hib, pop drops to 60 by 8 rather than 1am.

I dont think realm timer will impact it nearly as much as people on BOTH sides think.

None of this has been true for months. Regardless --- if changing the realm timer has no effect --- then WHY change it??? The reality is, it WILL have an effect, and there is more evidence than not it will be a negative impact

Fri 13 Mar 2020 5:03 PM by PlaSmiCNoMaD

New Game Plus Mode for PvP: but how does it work?
Once activated, unable to turn it off or reverse it.
Play through the entire game again but with all levels gained and all gear and skills specced to what they were.
Lowers a Player’s gear and level to the level of the zone that they are in, allowing invasions to more easily effect them. Hence, lower level dark phantom invasions can compete and try to kill any player using this mode. Lowering gear score attempts to move the game to based on player skill and opportune success.
This also has the effect on PvE allowing people to collect loot from lower level monsters again, as it sets player monsters to either reds or yellows depending how many times players have beaten the game and began new game plus. NG+ can be done two times, making a total of three times played.
On third new game, all monsters have double damage and double health equivalent to playing a game on Hardest Difficulty. So they might use and have special attacks and AI behaviors now too. Like the Brownies in camelot hills may start using weapon styles every swing and there may be some spellcaster brownies now. Again this is all mostly PvP mechanics.

Possible Additions to NG+
Three or One free for all Keeps are added inside of all three realms homes somewhere. People can be automatically teleported to these places for free for all Mordred style PvP. Including dark invader phantom forces.

Fri 13 Mar 2020 9:37 PM by Azuell

PlaSmiCNoMaD wrote: ↑
Fri 13 Mar 2020 5:03 PM
New Game Plus Mode for PvP: but how does it work?
Once activated, unable to turn it off or reverse it.
Play through the entire game again but with all levels gained and all gear and skills specced to what they were.
Lowers a Player’s gear and level to the level of the zone that they are in, allowing invasions to more easily effect them. Hence, lower level dark phantom invasions can compete and try to kill any player using this mode. Lowering gear score attempts to move the game to based on player skill and opportune success.
This also has the effect on PvE allowing people to collect loot from lower level monsters again, as it sets player monsters to either reds or yellows depending how many times players have beaten the game and began new game plus. NG+ can be done two times, making a total of three times played.
On third new game, all monsters have double damage and double health equivalent to playing a game on Hardest Difficulty. So they might use and have special attacks and AI behaviors now too. Like the Brownies in camelot hills may start using weapon styles every swing and there may be some spellcaster brownies now. Again this is all mostly PvP mechanics.

Possible Additions to NG+
Three or One free for all Keeps are added inside of all three realms homes somewhere. People can be automatically teleported to these places for free for all Mordred style PvP. Including dark invader phantom forces.

Based on the things you say in some of your posts, I don't think dark age is the game for you.