Not sure why there was such drastical change to it. But can we please have it back it way it was..
Revese the Volly change
Started 2 Jun 2019
by
Quathan
in
Suggestions
Sun 2 Jun 2019 10:23 PM
by
stinsfire
And at the same time Maelstrom and TWF are untouched.
Mon 3 Jun 2019 8:51 PM
by
stinsfire
Its 15s cooldown and you have to spend 8 RA points on it. I havent seen a single person ingame ever complain about volley which does 100-300 dmg to max 6 enemies. TWF and Maelstrom can do 10k dmg with one button press and slows targets in the radius when placed on a zerg.
Mon 3 Jun 2019 8:56 PM
by
Dominus
drastical?
Mon 3 Jun 2019 11:16 PM
by
Luluko
let me do the math fast...15x60=900seconds 900/15s cooldown= 60 volleys and you can move the gt what you cant with twf or maelstrom and 60 volleys would be 6000-18000 damage. Meanwhile twf does 250 every 3 secs for 30secs so 2500 damage in total rank5 which would cost hm....30ra points compared to 8ra points from volley. Maybe twf does a little more if it scales with acuity but even than it will prolly never come close to 10k damage. Seems pretty balanced to me for the amount of ra points invested only really an issue if multiple toons use it at the same time and maybe also maelstrom then its devasting but scouts can also assist with volley I assume? Volley is certainly not that easy to farm rps with in keep fights like with twf but the rupt all the time is prolly more annoying than 1 twf every 15mins.stinsfire wrote: ↑Mon 3 Jun 2019 8:51 PM
Its 15s cooldown and you have to spend 8 RA points on it. I havent seen a single person ingame ever complain about volley which does 100-300 dmg to max 6 enemies. TWF and Maelstrom can do 10k dmg with one button press and slows targets in the radius when placed on a zerg.
Tue 4 Jun 2019 6:26 AM
by
Sepplord
Luluko wrote: ↑Mon 3 Jun 2019 11:16 PMlet me do the math fast...15x60=900seconds 900/15s cooldown= 60 volleys and you can move the gt what you cant with twf or maelstrom and 60 volleys would be 6000-18000 damage. Meanwhile twf does 250 every 3 secs for 30secs so 2500 damage in total rank5 which would cost hm....30ra points compared to 8ra points from volley. Maybe twf does a little more if it scales with acuity but even than it will prolly never come close to 10k damage. Seems pretty balanced to me for the amount of ra points invested only really an issue if multiple toons use it at the same time and maybe also maelstrom then its devasting but scouts can also assist with volley I assume? Volley is certainly not that easy to farm rps with in keep fights like with twf but the rupt all the time is prolly more annoying than 1 twf every 15mins.stinsfire wrote: ↑Mon 3 Jun 2019 8:51 PMLuluko wrote: ↑Mon 3 Jun 2019 7:32 PMoh the cooldown on volley is 15mins and you have to spend ra points on it?
Its 15s cooldown and you have to spend 8 RA points on it. I havent seen a single person ingame ever complain about volley which does 100-300 dmg to max 6 enemies. TWF and Maelstrom can do 10k dmg with one button press and slows targets in the radius when placed on a zerg.
uhhh...are you really comparing perma-vollying a spot with enemies for 15minutes to the damage a single button press of TWF does within 30sec?
regardless of how ridiculous that comparison is, you ALSO ignore quite a few key characteristic:
a) 15sec cooldown volley doesn't fire every 15seconds. You have to preload, shoot your arrows, and then the 15sec cooldown starts before you can preload again.
b) you average the damage of one volley to 100-300 dmg? Care to elaborate?
c) you calculate TWF dmg, but only single target. You are aware that TWF hits ALL targets in its area? Aka scales heavily with size of the enemy forces, while volley doesn't?
and i won't go into detail about adding up one abilities damage over 15minutes of constant use and comparing it to a single use of a 15min CD ability
Tue 4 Jun 2019 1:05 PM
by
stinsfire
Sepplord wrote: ↑Tue 4 Jun 2019 6:26 AMLuluko wrote: ↑Mon 3 Jun 2019 11:16 PMlet me do the math fast...15x60=900seconds 900/15s cooldown= 60 volleys and you can move the gt what you cant with twf or maelstrom and 60 volleys would be 6000-18000 damage. Meanwhile twf does 250 every 3 secs for 30secs so 2500 damage in total rank5 which would cost hm....30ra points compared to 8ra points from volley. Maybe twf does a little more if it scales with acuity but even than it will prolly never come close to 10k damage. Seems pretty balanced to me for the amount of ra points invested only really an issue if multiple toons use it at the same time and maybe also maelstrom then its devasting but scouts can also assist with volley I assume? Volley is certainly not that easy to farm rps with in keep fights like with twf but the rupt all the time is prolly more annoying than 1 twf every 15mins.stinsfire wrote: ↑Mon 3 Jun 2019 8:51 PMIts 15s cooldown and you have to spend 8 RA points on it. I havent seen a single person ingame ever complain about volley which does 100-300 dmg to max 6 enemies. TWF and Maelstrom can do 10k dmg with one button press and slows targets in the radius when placed on a zerg.
uhhh...are you really comparing perma-vollying a spot with enemies for 15minutes to the damage a single button press of TWF does within 30sec?
regardless of how ridiculous that comparison is, you ALSO ignore quite a few key characteristic:
a) 15sec cooldown volley doesn't fire every 15seconds. You have to preload, shoot your arrows, and then the 15sec cooldown starts before you can preload again.
b) you average the damage of one volley to 100-300 dmg? Care to elaborate?
c) you calculate TWF dmg, but only single target. You are aware that TWF hits ALL targets in its area? Aka scales heavily with size of the enemy forces, while volley doesn't?
and i won't go into detail about adding up one abilities damage over 15minutes of constant use and comparing it to a single use of a 15min CD ability
Theres a good bunch of people on this forum who can't see the most obvious logical fallacies which makes discussing kinda painful. Thats why I don't respond to them anymore. Thanks that you did that instead.
Tue 4 Jun 2019 3:39 PM
by
Luluko
yeah no point in arguing if you cant win them anywaystinsfire wrote: ↑Tue 4 Jun 2019 1:05 PMSepplord wrote: ↑Tue 4 Jun 2019 6:26 AMLuluko wrote: ↑Mon 3 Jun 2019 11:16 PMlet me do the math fast...15x60=900seconds 900/15s cooldown= 60 volleys and you can move the gt what you cant with twf or maelstrom and 60 volleys would be 6000-18000 damage. Meanwhile twf does 250 every 3 secs for 30secs so 2500 damage in total rank5 which would cost hm....30ra points compared to 8ra points from volley. Maybe twf does a little more if it scales with acuity but even than it will prolly never come close to 10k damage. Seems pretty balanced to me for the amount of ra points invested only really an issue if multiple toons use it at the same time and maybe also maelstrom then its devasting but scouts can also assist with volley I assume? Volley is certainly not that easy to farm rps with in keep fights like with twf but the rupt all the time is prolly more annoying than 1 twf every 15mins.
uhhh...are you really comparing perma-vollying a spot with enemies for 15minutes to the damage a single button press of TWF does within 30sec?
regardless of how ridiculous that comparison is, you ALSO ignore quite a few key characteristic:
a) 15sec cooldown volley doesn't fire every 15seconds. You have to preload, shoot your arrows, and then the 15sec cooldown starts before you can preload again.
b) you average the damage of one volley to 100-300 dmg? Care to elaborate?
c) you calculate TWF dmg, but only single target. You are aware that TWF hits ALL targets in its area? Aka scales heavily with size of the enemy forces, while volley doesn't?
and i won't go into detail about adding up one abilities damage over 15minutes of constant use and comparing it to a single use of a 15min CD ability
Theres a good bunch of people on this forum who can't see the most obvious logical fallacies which makes discussing kinda painful. Thats why I don't respond to them anymore. Thanks that you did that instead.
@sepplord that 100-300 dam was from the guy I quoted I have no idea how much it really does on phoenix since I dont play an archer
-volley is also ae damage just the area is smaller
-and yes I only calculated it with numbers I had and even if you only use it every 20secs you will still do more damage overtime in the affected area, sure its not as great as twf but archers with twf would be ridiculous and if volley is such crap just dont specc it there are plenty of other ra's archers can make use of just if you want to farm a zerg twf style you are forced to play visible and also take the downsites of that then
Tue 4 Jun 2019 11:39 PM
by
Milchschnidde
I found no reason to spec into vollay 8 RA points as ranger .. those theory crafting annoys me, there is plenty of other stuff that has more value to be skilled.
They should move Volley to 50 Archery, so you when you skill 50 into archery you get at least a small reward. beside discussing volley you should also talk about long shot, which total useless in the current meta.
They should move Volley to 50 Archery, so you when you skill 50 into archery you get at least a small reward. beside discussing volley you should also talk about long shot, which total useless in the current meta.
Wed 5 Jun 2019 6:18 AM
by
Sepplord
Luluko wrote: ↑Tue 4 Jun 2019 3:39 PM-volley is also ae damage just the area is smaller
-and yes I only calculated it with numbers I had and even if you only use it every 20secs you will still do more damage overtime in the affected area, sure its not as great as twf but archers with twf would be ridiculous and if volley is such crap just dont specc it there are plenty of other ra's archers can make use of just if you want to farm a zerg twf style you are forced to play visible and also take the downsites of that then
it's not an AOE afaik, unless it got changed without mention or updating the charplaner
Volley shoots 5arrows into an area hitting random targets, if you shoot into a zerg with 50people you still only hit 5targets, one after another. And the next volley will more often than not hit different targets. It's basically like you would imagine a medieval archer vollying a couple of arrows in a huge arc onto the enemy. They can't really aim specific targets, but benefit from saving lots of time by skipping aim.
And seriously, please stop comparing 15min cooldown abilities with spammable abilities....that's like looking at VolcanicPillar and claiming it should be buffed up to 5000dmg since it has a 15minute cooldown and even at 5000dmg it would still only do 5.5DPS per target. Compare it to their cast-nuke which can do hundredthousands of damage on a single target if you just cast it on them for 15minutes
<--yes that IS bullshit, i don't know how to better show how shitty that approach of comparison is
Wed 5 Jun 2019 6:39 AM
by
Lillebror
Milchschnidde wrote: ↑Tue 4 Jun 2019 11:39 PMI found no reason to spec into vollay 8 RA points as ranger .. those theory crafting annoys me, there is plenty of other stuff that has more value to be skilled.
They should move Volley to 50 Archery, so you when you skill 50 into archery you get at leat a small reward. beside discussing volley you should also talk about long shot, which total useless in the current meta.
I will never roll a sniper, but that sounds good, give Volley/long shot for speccing high in bow.
Wed 5 Jun 2019 7:08 AM
by
Hejjin
TWF is on a 10 minute timer.Luluko wrote: ↑Mon 3 Jun 2019 11:16 PMlet me do the math fast...15x60=900seconds 900/15s cooldown= 60 volleys and you can move the gt what you cant with twf or maelstrom and 60 volleys would be 6000-18000 damage. Meanwhile twf does 250 every 3 secs for 30secs so 2500 damage in total rank5 which would cost hm....30ra points compared to 8ra points from volley. Maybe twf does a little more if it scales with acuity but even than it will prolly never come close to 10k damage. Seems pretty balanced to me for the amount of ra points invested only really an issue if multiple toons use it at the same time and maybe also maelstrom then its devasting but scouts can also assist with volley I assume? Volley is certainly not that easy to farm rps with in keep fights like with twf but the rupt all the time is prolly more annoying than 1 twf every 15mins.stinsfire wrote: ↑Mon 3 Jun 2019 8:51 PMLuluko wrote: ↑Mon 3 Jun 2019 7:32 PMoh the cooldown on volley is 15mins and you have to spend ra points on it?
Its 15s cooldown and you have to spend 8 RA points on it. I havent seen a single person ingame ever complain about volley which does 100-300 dmg to max 6 enemies. TWF and Maelstrom can do 10k dmg with one button press and slows targets in the radius when placed on a zerg.
Wed 5 Jun 2019 7:19 AM
by
Hejjin
You are correct, volley is not a true AoE in that it sequentially fires 5 arrows into a small area over the course of the duration of the volley, if all 5 arrows were launched, and landed in the same area at the same time, then yes it would be an AoE, but that is not how it works.Sepplord wrote: ↑Wed 5 Jun 2019 6:18 AMit's not an AOE afaik, unless it got changed without mention or updating the charplaner
Volley shoots 5arrows into an area hitting random targets,
snip...
Volley damage per hit is not that high, unless the target is sitting, I have been hit for 500 damage on my Friar when sat down on keep defences when trying to recover power after resurrecting defenders. The previous incarnation of Volley was a problem for defenders in the keep towers as the area is so small it is hard to move to a safe position when multiple archers are volleying into it. So IMHO the change to volley was needed, and I say this despite having a Scout...
Wed 5 Jun 2019 7:35 AM
by
Sepplord
Hejjin wrote: ↑Wed 5 Jun 2019 7:19 AMYou are correct, volley is not a true AoE in that it sequentially fires 5 arrows into a small area over the course of the duration of the volley, if all 5 arrows were launched, and landed in the same area at the same time, then yes it would be an AoE, but that is not how it works.Sepplord wrote: ↑Wed 5 Jun 2019 6:18 AMit's not an AOE afaik, unless it got changed without mention or updating the charplaner
Volley shoots 5arrows into an area hitting random targets,
snip...
Volley damage per hit is not that high, unless the target is sitting, I have been hit for 500 damage on my Friar when sat down on keep defences when trying to recover power after resurrecting defenders. The previous incarnation of Volley was a problem for defenders in the keep towers as the area is so small it is hard to move to a safe position when multiple archers are volleying into it. So IMHO the change to volley was needed, and I say this despite having a Scout...
I agree on the second half, but the first half is not correct because the 5arrows still only hit 5people. An AoE would hit everyone. That is imo a far bigger difference, than the damage not coming in at the same second but a bit staggered. Volley is actually BETTER on fewer targets, because it increases the chance to have a target actually die from multiple arrows/volleys while an AoE gets better the more enemies there are in the target area. (side remark: for example increasing the radius for volley would be a nerf)
Wed 5 Jun 2019 9:37 AM
by
Hejjin
I disagree, if all arrows arrived into an area at the same time, it would be an AoE, just one that is limited to a maximum of 5 targets. However none of this is relevant because that is not how Volley works, instead it is more like a version of rapid fire where 5 arrows are released sequentially into a small area over a period of 15 seconds.Sepplord wrote: ↑Wed 5 Jun 2019 7:35 AMI agree on the second half, but the first half is not correct because the 5arrows still only hit 5people. An AoE would hit everyone. That is imo a far bigger difference, than the damage not coming in at the same second but a bit staggered.
Possibly, but hitting the same person more than twice in the same volley round does not occur frequently, so deaths in one volley are incredibly rare (unless they are grey or sitting and afk). Most deaths occur over the span of multiple volleys, whether from the same archer or multiple archers, so I am not convinced that a sequential volley is always or even mostly better. IMHO an AoE where all arrows arrived at the same time would be a substantial improvement when multiple archers either used the same ground-target or coordinated their volleys.Sepplord wrote: ↑Wed 5 Jun 2019 7:35 AMVolley is actually BETTER on fewer targets, because it increases the chance to have a target actually die from multiple arrows/volleys while an AoE gets better the more enemies there are in the target area. (side remark: for example increasing the radius for volley would be a nerf)
Wed 5 Jun 2019 9:48 AM
by
REVOLTE
i personally am really happy about the volley changes. it used to be too strong when in the right hands.
making it a plain AoEDD so to speak would make it incredibly op and i highly doubt that the devs would make the mistake of moving down this path.
that said...its still a very potent ability to put pressure on deffers by wearing down healers manapools and restricting their movement while deffing - but not to a point where its super abuseable anymore. if i played an archer id gladly spend 8pts to gain access to volley.
making it a plain AoEDD so to speak would make it incredibly op and i highly doubt that the devs would make the mistake of moving down this path.
that said...its still a very potent ability to put pressure on deffers by wearing down healers manapools and restricting their movement while deffing - but not to a point where its super abuseable anymore. if i played an archer id gladly spend 8pts to gain access to volley.
Wed 5 Jun 2019 4:31 PM
by
Hejjin
I agree, moving volley to 50 Archery would be a nice incentive for those that actually want to play as archers to spec that deeply into Archery. I also thought that longshot should have been added to base archery, perhaps at 42 and 47, each to add .25 range, and then finally to convert Longshot RA into an ability that will cause any normal attack to have range of 1.5 x normal. That way crit shot and even volley could be used, if only once, at ended range.Milchschnidde wrote: ↑Tue 4 Jun 2019 11:39 PMI found no reason to spec into vollay 8 RA points as ranger .. those theory crafting annoys me, there is plenty of other stuff that has more value to be skilled.
They should move Volley to 50 Archery, so you when you skill 50 into archery you get at least a small reward. beside discussing volley you should also talk about long shot, which total useless in the current meta.
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