Nerf bard amnesia Yay or nay? - Phoenix Freeshard

It's been a year, its gotta go.

Seriously though, 2300 range insta AOE rupt/speed break is just silly. make it casted or something

Sat 1 Feb 2020 4:35 PM by Quik

Sure as soon as you nerf minstrel red/purple pet I'm all for it!!

Sat 1 Feb 2020 5:56 PM by Wolfir666

Admittedly its silly, but its the bard way to counter boltrange-aemezz of sorcs that you by the way also shouldn't be able to rupt with using quickcast.
And midgard got a whole insta-battery on the pac but just a cast amnesia.
So in truth i think it's just like this, if you nerf insta amnesia, you need to nerf other realms too. Each has their own special.

Sat 1 Feb 2020 6:31 PM by rocketait

Maybe it needs replaced with something, if your doing a mezz on Inc I find hibs are the best (because of that), mids are second (we just don't hit without a hill or something), and albs last (they only have a chance in the open, and that's countered by what we are talking about). Now if we are talking about a casual groups with let's say sub optimal skill mids/albs have the edge with range and oh crap insta, (though getting a demezz on alb can be hard with the demezz not being a secondary heal, so sorc tend to get mezzed, but there are always minis with charm pet.. maybe I just play with dumb minis who knows).

And I think this may be the issue with just removing it, the field is not even for all skill levels (if anyone plays StarCraft it's the same issues with terran battlecruisers last session, crushes low mmr, never used in pro games).

To make a long story short no don't remove it, but I wouldn't mind seeing it changed.. so it's not used to "catch" people so much.. maybe bolt range not 2300?

Sat 1 Feb 2020 6:48 PM by necrolove1

There are many things that can be done to it, but the way it is currently is needs attention.

Definate problems

1. it should not break speed (this is probably this number 1 problem the small man community has tbh )

2. agreed from the post above, it should atleast not negate quickcasted abilities ( albs have no insta mez back up, while the other 2 realms do , though albs remedy to this was the bolt range mez, having a 2300 insta amnesia the way it is currently is a balance issue.

Sat 1 Feb 2020 6:49 PM by Kurbsen

necrolove1 wrote: ↑
Sat 1 Feb 2020 4:05 PM
It's been a year, its gotta go.

its been 20 years. Still an insta.

Sat 1 Feb 2020 8:49 PM by keen

Kurbsen wrote: ↑
Sat 1 Feb 2020 6:49 PM
necrolove1 wrote: ↑
Sat 1 Feb 2020 4:05 PM
It's been a year, its gotta go.

its been 20 years. Still an insta.

Range got nerfed on live years ago since it is destroying small men action in this game.

Sat 1 Feb 2020 10:52 PM by Kurbsen

keen wrote: ↑
Sat 1 Feb 2020 8:49 PM
Kurbsen wrote: ↑
Sat 1 Feb 2020 6:49 PM
necrolove1 wrote: ↑
Sat 1 Feb 2020 4:05 PM
It's been a year, its gotta go.

its been 20 years. Still an insta.

Range got nerfed on live years ago since it is destroying small men action in this game.

yea back in 2014 from 2300 to 2000..

2010 - they got mezz dampener, a second DD, and a single target root (I think root/dd was 2010, I couldnt find exact patch notes for it, but seems it was around that time)
2012 - bards confuse got 2 sec cast time and 1500 range

Basically, the nerf to amnesia didnt matter as much since they had another form of CC, another rupt, and a mezz reduction. If amnesia gets messed with (which i doubt), then lets give them all this too

Sun 2 Feb 2020 7:55 AM by Enyore

There are bigger issues that needs to be addressed before this.

Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:07 AM by keen

Enyore wrote: ↑
Sun 2 Feb 2020 7:55 AM
There are bigger issues that needs to be addressed before this.

Do you also tell your boss that you stopped replying to emails cause there are bigger problems than this in your project and you only work on the task with the highest priority and leave everything else aside, so you will start replying as soon as the biggest problem is solved

Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:34 AM by Enyore

keen wrote: ↑
Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:07 AM
Enyore wrote: ↑
Sun 2 Feb 2020 7:55 AM
There are bigger issues that needs to be addressed before this.
Do you also tell your boss that you stopped replying to emails cause there are bigger problems than this in your project and you only work on the task with the highest priority and leave everything else aside, so you will start replying as soon as the biggest problem is solved

Yes sometimes, if i think that too much talk about small stuff is taking focus away from main problems... then yes indeed.

Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:28 PM by Isavyr

keen wrote: ↑
Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:07 AM
Enyore wrote: ↑
Sun 2 Feb 2020 7:55 AM
There are bigger issues that needs to be addressed before this.
Do you also tell your boss that you stopped replying to emails cause there are bigger problems than this in your project and you only work on the task with the highest priority and leave everything else aside, so you will start replying as soon as the biggest problem is solved

It's the other way around for me--bosses assign priority and will direct the grunt to preserve bard amnesia/delay its solution while other issues get completed first.

Mon 3 Feb 2020 11:44 AM by bigne88

Amnesia on bard was never nerfed even on retail. Tough bard got buffed with root to make him on par with paci and sorc.

We talking about crushing small men activity?
Nerf mincer and sorc than?
And what about paci casted and insta mezz, stun, root? Eh! To each their own.

Mon 3 Feb 2020 1:45 PM by Tritri

Again with this ?

Mon 3 Feb 2020 4:46 PM by keen

bigne88 wrote: ↑
Mon 3 Feb 2020 11:44 AM
Amnesia on bard was never nerfed even on retail. Tough bard got buffed with root to make him on par with paci and sorc.

We talking about crushing small men activity?
Nerf mincer and sorc than?
And what about paci casted and insta mezz, stun, root? Eh! To each their own.

Paci range is 1500 same as minstrel. Sorc has cast time. 1.5k u can keep it distance if you pan and are not unlucky. 2.3k insta range will catch u in so many more situations that it destroys small men action.

Mon 3 Feb 2020 6:16 PM by Thisisfubar99

Yes... this is killing smallman action with very little chance of counterplay. Reduce the range to 1850 or remove the speedcut component.

Mon 3 Feb 2020 6:40 PM by Loki

There's a reason top RP farmers tried all realms and settled on Hib. Amnesia means you can pick your fights and dodge whenever you feel like. When PK tried mid, I was watching them chasing duos and not being able to catch up, and I was laughing my ass off. No risk, high reward.

Mon 3 Feb 2020 10:34 PM by Siouxsie

Loki wrote: ↑
Mon 3 Feb 2020 6:40 PM
There's a reason top RP farmers tried all realms and settled on Hib. Amnesia means you can pick your fights and dodge whenever you feel like. When PK tried mid, I was watching them chasing duos and not being able to catch up, and I was laughing my ass off. No risk, high reward.

Absolutely. 100% correct.
Having watched PK farm OF Emain running up and down between APK and MPK constantly.. if you were visible, you were toast. You couldn't get away.
Those stupid blue lights over your head told you you'd be dead in 10 seconds -- usually to stun, debuff, nuke nuke train.

There was a huge, long thread about it too. Did it get addressed by Phoenix staff? Nope. Not a peep.

Mon 3 Feb 2020 10:59 PM by Wolfir666

Siouxsie wrote: ↑
Mon 3 Feb 2020 10:34 PM
Loki wrote: ↑
Mon 3 Feb 2020 6:40 PM
There's a reason top RP farmers tried all realms and settled on Hib. Amnesia means you can pick your fights and dodge whenever you feel like. When PK tried mid, I was watching them chasing duos and not being able to catch up, and I was laughing my ass off. No risk, high reward.

Absolutely. 100% correct.
Having watched PK farm OF Emain running up and down between APK and MPK constantly.. if you were visible, you were toast. You couldn't get away.
Those stupid blue lights over your head told you you'd be dead in 10 seconds -- usually to stun, debuff, nuke nuke train.

There was a huge, long thread about it too. Did it get addressed by Phoenix staff? Nope. Not a peep.

Well that was how OF was going most of the time anyways if you were going to Emain. On Live just the same. one of the reasons, why NF simply is way better than OF, even though also in past people knew, that if they went to emain outside of zerg/well trained 8man, theyd most of the time not even get through MMG/AMG

Mon 3 Feb 2020 11:45 PM by bigne88

Loki wrote: ↑
Mon 3 Feb 2020 6:40 PM
There's a reason top RP farmers tried all realms and settled on Hib. Amnesia means you can pick your fights and dodge whenever you feel like. When PK tried mid, I was watching them chasing duos and not being able to catch up, and I was laughing my ass off. No risk, high reward.

Dude, dunno if you are just salty or have no idea what you talking about.
Soooo you are saying that if a bard isnt involved when 2 groups meets, people will be always be able to dodge or run away?
Daoc would be named "dodge online" if anyone can escape easly anytime.
But yea, I would drop my insta amnesia that makes me loosing speed and breaks mezz for a couple of roots or a red pet and stuns.

Tue 4 Feb 2020 12:44 AM by teiloh

It'd be fair. Just shore up the Bard lines a little bit, maybe as part of a healer/support class review.

Tue 4 Feb 2020 3:54 AM by gotwqqd

bigne88 wrote: ↑
Mon 3 Feb 2020 11:45 PM
Loki wrote: ↑
Mon 3 Feb 2020 6:40 PM
There's a reason top RP farmers tried all realms and settled on Hib. Amnesia means you can pick your fights and dodge whenever you feel like. When PK tried mid, I was watching them chasing duos and not being able to catch up, and I was laughing my ass off. No risk, high reward.

Dude, dunno if you are just salty or have no idea what you talking about.
Soooo you are saying that if a bard isnt involved when 2 groups meets, people will be always be able to dodge or run away?
Daoc would be named "dodge online" if anyone can escape easly anytime.
But yea, I would drop my insta amnesia that makes me loosing speed and breaks mezz for a couple of roots or a red pet and stuns.

Sure because then you would be the solo god with far more utility than the pathetic minstrel.
But for group....the amnesia is far better than the pet +stun

Tue 4 Feb 2020 7:13 AM by bigne88

gotwqqd wrote: ↑
Tue 4 Feb 2020 3:54 AM
bigne88 wrote: ↑
Mon 3 Feb 2020 11:45 PM
Loki wrote: ↑
Mon 3 Feb 2020 6:40 PM
There's a reason top RP farmers tried all realms and settled on Hib. Amnesia means you can pick your fights and dodge whenever you feel like. When PK tried mid, I was watching them chasing duos and not being able to catch up, and I was laughing my ass off. No risk, high reward.

Dude, dunno if you are just salty or have no idea what you talking about.
Soooo you are saying that if a bard isnt involved when 2 groups meets, people will be always be able to dodge or run away?
Daoc would be named "dodge online" if anyone can escape easly anytime.
But yea, I would drop my insta amnesia that makes me loosing speed and breaks mezz for a couple of roots or a red pet and stuns.
Sure because then you would be the solo god with far more utility than the pathetic minstrel.
But for group....the amnesia is far better than the pet +stun

Right. Better than an unCCable red pet followed by a guy full of stuns and mezz...keep repeating yourself.

Tue 4 Feb 2020 7:18 AM by keen

What does minst have to do with bard amnesia ruining small men rvr?

Tue 4 Feb 2020 8:03 AM by Sepplord

keen wrote: ↑
Tue 4 Feb 2020 7:18 AM
What does minst have to do with bard amnesia ruining small men rvr?

didn't you get the memo?
It's how the world is run nowadays. If you don't like a thing someone says...you just derail the discussion or make up a few lies.
A considerable amount of people here are learning that from their president everyday (<- ironic example of above mentioned behavior)

to be honest though, bard amnesia's range is far too big and anyone who claims to not understand that it gives Hibs a huge advantage of picking their fights is not being honest imo. Not saying that bards in generel need a nerf, maybe they need a compensation for it. I am too far from the 8vs8 scene to estimate if changing the range from 2300 to 1850 actually has impact during an already running fight. I doubt that much would change outside of hibs having the ability to pick far more fights than the other two realms

That said though, i fear we are beating a dead horse. I am not expecting anything to be changed

Tue 4 Feb 2020 6:53 PM by teiloh

bigne88 wrote: ↑
Tue 4 Feb 2020 7:13 AM
Right. Better than an unCCable red pet followed by a guy full of stuns and mezz...keep repeating yourself.

Just trade Bards and Minstrels for a bit, see how much Hib likes that.

Tue 4 Feb 2020 7:37 PM by Sepplord

teiloh wrote: ↑
Tue 4 Feb 2020 6:53 PM
bigne88 wrote: ↑
Tue 4 Feb 2020 7:13 AM
Right. Better than an unCCable red pet followed by a guy full of stuns and mezz...keep repeating yourself.

Just trade Bards and Minstrels for a bit, see how much Hib likes that.

That's a really bad argument, even when adjusting for the telioh-bullshit-factor.
You should feel bad that you actually submitted that