Make BATTLEGROUNDS alive again :)

We have some great improvements now with the new RvR system and teleporting and so on.

But Battlegrounds are pretty dead, which is unfortunate.
BGs are a lot of fun at lower levels! (like Caledonia till RR3).

So i'm wondering if there wouldn't be an option to have the RvR tasks active in Caledonia as well, at least the Task completion bonusses when killing/dying in RvR.
Maybe with only 50% effectivity compared to RvR to slow down the RR3 achievement.

At least people who wanna have a bit of lower level fighting still find some fun in Cale.

Just a thought..

Fri 1 Mar 2019 12:29 PM by Zeus

With the actual task system in place, there is no need to visit battlegrounds just for the RPs. People who go there do it for fun only and once you hit the RP-cap, you´re out. Implementing a battleground-task-system would be a bad idea, since it would contribute to reaching the RP-cap sooner.

Getting rid of the task system completely would help the battlegrounds, because then you could have some fun in between leveling and gain some RPs (which you couldn´t get otherwise) at the same time. But since leveling is so easy, many would skip the battlegrounds even with no task system in place and beeline directly towards big boy s rvr.

Fri 1 Mar 2019 1:18 PM by Rhoedric

With one rvr task at lvl 20 (and usually just dying to a grey ganker) you’re already above the first bg...
Since some of the best xp spot are in frontier, even if you don’t actively search to do task you will outrank first couple of bg in no time.
I don’t really see the point of going in bg now with a fast xp rate, no quests here and rvr task

Fri 1 Mar 2019 4:03 PM by chryso

Battlegrounds were a nice diversion on the long trek to 50. Now 50 comes fast so most people don't care about the battlegrounds.

Fri 1 Mar 2019 5:29 PM by Kyosji

That and vanilla BGs were, in my opinion, never good. Not big enough, bad center keep terrain, and hard to ever tell who owned it. NF BGs were great,. and why people begged for the ability to turn off experience.

Fri 1 Mar 2019 8:00 PM by semadin

They could certain restrict task rewards for rvr to much higher level. 45 or 48+
It's pretty silly seeing greys out there getting RPS for just foddering themselves.

Sat 2 Mar 2019 1:58 PM by moe_Jiller

NF BGs were pretty dope indeed!

Sat 2 Mar 2019 4:23 PM by jg777

semadin wrote: ↑
Fri 1 Mar 2019 8:00 PM
They could certain restrict task rewards for rvr to much higher level. 45 or 48+
It's pretty silly seeing greys out there getting RPS for just foddering themselves.

Yes, several of us have suggested that in various threads the past few weeks, either restricting the task bonuses to those above 35. Low levels aren’t “contributing” to the frontier RvR and shouldn’t get credit for it. This would make BG’s more active, reduce non contributing players in Frontier RvR zergs, and I feel create a better RvR environment for all.

Sat 2 Mar 2019 4:26 PM by Quik

jg777 wrote: ↑
Sat 2 Mar 2019 4:23 PM
semadin wrote: ↑
Fri 1 Mar 2019 8:00 PM
They could certain restrict task rewards for rvr to much higher level. 45 or 48+
It's pretty silly seeing greys out there getting RPS for just foddering themselves.

Yes, several of us have suggested that in various threads the past few weeks, either restricting the task bonuses to those above 35. Low levels aren’t “contributing” to the frontier RvR and shouldn’t get credit for it. This would make BG’s more active, reduce non contributing players in Frontier RvR zergs, and I feel create a better RvR environment for all.

The problem with your argument is that I see JUST as many lvl 35-50's not contributing in any way, just standing at the flag afk waiting for the xp doing.

Singling out the lowbies seems awful petty when even the high lvls are doing it.

Sat 2 Mar 2019 4:54 PM by pollojack

Tasks are a nice way to get RPs and avoid twinks. I get one/two shotting someone without capped resists or grey/green armor is fun but given the choice to avoid it, it is avoided 9/10. Like there are complaints about people standing on a flag for xp when you might come across a guy that can survive two or three DDs or one perf, similar difficulty I'd say.

Make the BG 20-40. Participants receive a buff based on their lvl, normalizing them and resists to lvl 34 like ESO. The person that likes to fight with more advantage will have more points at a higher lvl but lower lvls will have a chance and a reason to bother. Might be too much of an undertaking though.

This conglomerate ground will skirt the issue of low pop, bad fights, only stealthers. It may need a change to a larger area if the pop is high enough but ultimately BGs are a victim of poor returns. Low rp and low gold for killing low lvl players when you could spend the time leveling and getting to big kid RvR. The only ones that wouldn't mind are twinks where money doesn't matter anymore.

Sat 2 Mar 2019 5:10 PM by jg777

Quik wrote: ↑
Sat 2 Mar 2019 4:26 PM
jg777 wrote: ↑
Sat 2 Mar 2019 4:23 PM
semadin wrote: ↑
Fri 1 Mar 2019 8:00 PM
They could certain restrict task rewards for rvr to much higher level. 45 or 48+
It's pretty silly seeing greys out there getting RPS for just foddering themselves.

Yes, several of us have suggested that in various threads the past few weeks, either restricting the task bonuses to those above 35. Low levels aren’t “contributing” to the frontier RvR and shouldn’t get credit for it. This would make BG’s more active, reduce non contributing players in Frontier RvR zergs, and I feel create a better RvR environment for all.

The problem with your argument is that I see JUST as many lvl 35-50's not contributing in any way, just standing at the flag afk waiting for the xp doing.

Singling out the lowbies seems awful petty when even the high lvls are doing it.

It's not being petty, it's being realistic in what RvR should be on Phoenix. It's attempting to improve the whole RvR experience on the server. While "afk waiting" may be a thing for 35-50's presently, it's because the task design is flawed- that can (and needs to be) changed. People need to be actively contributing/participating to gain credit for these tasks- and lowbies will rarely if ever meet that criteria. Battlegrounds, which will require active contributing/participating to get realm points, is where players pre 35 need to be to get realm points.

Sat 2 Mar 2019 5:13 PM by Quik

jg777 wrote: ↑
Sat 2 Mar 2019 5:10 PM
Quik wrote: ↑
Sat 2 Mar 2019 4:26 PM
jg777 wrote: ↑
Sat 2 Mar 2019 4:23 PM
Yes, several of us have suggested that in various threads the past few weeks, either restricting the task bonuses to those above 35. Low levels aren’t “contributing” to the frontier RvR and shouldn’t get credit for it. This would make BG’s more active, reduce non contributing players in Frontier RvR zergs, and I feel create a better RvR environment for all.

The problem with your argument is that I see JUST as many lvl 35-50's not contributing in any way, just standing at the flag afk waiting for the xp doing.

Singling out the lowbies seems awful petty when even the high lvls are doing it.

It's not being petty, it's being realistic in what RvR should be on Phoenix. It's attempting to improve the whole RvR experience on the server. While "afk waiting" may be a thing for 35-50's presently, it's because the task design is flawed- that can (and needs to be) changed. People need to be actively contributing/participating to gain credit for these tasks- and lowbies will rarely if ever meet that criteria. Battlegrounds, which will require active contributing/participating to get realm points, is where players pre 35 need to be to get realm points.

Wewill have to agree to disagree on this one.

I really can't see how you can justify a lvl 45 who is going afk and waiting for his free rp's and xp is better then a lvl 20 who is running with a zerg and who is nuking/mezzing and trying to actually get involved...

Grey or not at least the lowbie is actively participating and getting involved while the 45 is literally afk and leeching his free reward.

Sat 2 Mar 2019 6:01 PM by jg777

Quik wrote: ↑
Sat 2 Mar 2019 5:13 PM
jg777 wrote: ↑
Sat 2 Mar 2019 5:10 PM
Quik wrote: ↑
Sat 2 Mar 2019 4:26 PM
The problem with your argument is that I see JUST as many lvl 35-50's not contributing in any way, just standing at the flag afk waiting for the xp doing.

Singling out the lowbies seems awful petty when even the high lvls are doing it.

It's not being petty, it's being realistic in what RvR should be on Phoenix. It's attempting to improve the whole RvR experience on the server. While "afk waiting" may be a thing for 35-50's presently, it's because the task design is flawed- that can (and needs to be) changed. People need to be actively contributing/participating to gain credit for these tasks- and lowbies will rarely if ever meet that criteria. Battlegrounds, which will require active contributing/participating to get realm points, is where players pre 35 need to be to get realm points.

Wewill have to agree to disagree on this one.

I really can't see how you can justify a lvl 45 who is going afk and waiting for his free rp's and xp is better then a lvl 20 who is running with a zerg and who is nuking/mezzing and trying to actually get involved...

Grey or not at least the lowbie is actively participating and getting involved while the 45 is literally afk and leeching his free reward.

I’m not talking about the current set up but the future set up where no one is afk sitting for free Realm points. Making a point of the occasional lowbie trying to get a spell off or hit an almost dead player or a 45 afk’ing is outside the norm in general and no one will be getting credit to afk once tasks get adjusted (well my hope anyway). It’s not something I consider a valid reason to not implement the presented idea above. The vast majority of lowbies are just looking for a quick death/credit for task then leaving in the current state of the task system.

Can we agree we should aim for all players to actively and meaningfully participate in RvR to get credit (Realm points)? Even if we disagree on how to go about that I’d hope we have that common ground.

Sat 2 Mar 2019 6:03 PM by Frigzy

Make BG keeps drop a serious amount of Feathers/Claws that increase when there are fights in the area.

Like 5000 feathers for a good keepfight and keeptake.

This doesn't risk capping RR too quick yet still incentivize players to stop by and get their first real taste of RvR (and feather income) . Alternatively it can create a new way to generate feather income for 50s who don't like to PvE raid. This will also ensure some action even when a lot of players are mostly 50.

Sat 2 Mar 2019 6:07 PM by Quik

jg777 wrote: ↑
Sat 2 Mar 2019 6:01 PM
Quik wrote: ↑
Sat 2 Mar 2019 5:13 PM
jg777 wrote: ↑
Sat 2 Mar 2019 5:10 PM
It's not being petty, it's being realistic in what RvR should be on Phoenix. It's attempting to improve the whole RvR experience on the server. While "afk waiting" may be a thing for 35-50's presently, it's because the task design is flawed- that can (and needs to be) changed. People need to be actively contributing/participating to gain credit for these tasks- and lowbies will rarely if ever meet that criteria. Battlegrounds, which will require active contributing/participating to get realm points, is where players pre 35 need to be to get realm points.

Wewill have to agree to disagree on this one.

I really can't see how you can justify a lvl 45 who is going afk and waiting for his free rp's and xp is better then a lvl 20 who is running with a zerg and who is nuking/mezzing and trying to actually get involved...

Grey or not at least the lowbie is actively participating and getting involved while the 45 is literally afk and leeching his free reward.

I’m not talking about the current set up but the future set up where no one is afk sitting for free Realm points. Making a point of the occasional lowbie trying to get a spell off or hit an almost dead player or a 45 afk’ing is outside the norm in general and no one will be getting credit to afk once tasks get adjusted (well my hope anyway). It’s not something I consider a valid reason to not implement the presented idea above. The vast majority of lowbies are just looking for a quick death/credit for task then leaving in the current state of the task system.

Can’t we agree we should aim for all players to actively and meaningfully participate in RvR to get credit (Realm points)? Even if we disagree on how to go about that I’d hope we have that common ground.

I 100% agree that as long as someone is participating they should get credit.

The only issue with it is the same for a grey as a lvl 50, say I have a lvl 50 RM who is running out to get task credit and I get to the MMG and a NS stuns and kills me (yeah this never happens lol) right before the timer ends, my feeling is I should get credit.

On the flip side if I am a 50 RM and I am just running out to get killed by the first enemy player I see and they hit me just before timer ends, techinally I shouldn't get credit but the only difference between the 2 scenarios is intent.

This is why I find it hard to police this.

If I want to take my 25 Thane out to the mid zerg and get involved and I am actively nuking people and attacking and maybe even stunning a few with my side shield positional, I should get credit. I understand I am not worth RP's and I also understand I should be since I am participating, but in this scenario I am more active then dozens of lvl 50's who simply ran out to suicide before afking at the portal keep.

This is my issue with people saying only 35 and under or 40 and under should get credit, in what world is it better for a lvl 45 to run out and suicide before AFKing then for a lvl 25 Thane who is activily trying to help his realm mates by throwing a few stuns or small interrupting nukes?

Sat 2 Mar 2019 6:10 PM by Quik

Frigzy wrote: ↑
Sat 2 Mar 2019 6:03 PM
Make BG keeps drop a serious amount of Feathers/Claws that increase when there are fights in the area.

Like 5000 feathers for a good keepfight and keeptake.

This doesn't risk capping RR too quick yet still incentivize players to stop by and get their first real taste of RvR (and feather income) . Alternatively it can create a new way to generate feather income for 50s who don't like to PvE raid. This will also ensure some action even when a lot of players are mostly 50.

I vote no on this.

Feathers should be mainly obtained in PvE to keep PvE raids alive and active for everyone and to keep newer players involved and able to get raid gear.

RvR gets you RP's
PvE gets you feathers

You need a balance of both to keep the server healthy.

Sat 2 Mar 2019 6:12 PM by Frigzy

Quik wrote: ↑
Sat 2 Mar 2019 6:10 PM
I vote no on this.

Feathers should be mainly obtained in PvE to keep PvE raids alive and active for everyone and to keep newer players involved and able to get raid gear.

RvR gets you RP's
PvE gets you feathers

You need a balance of both to keep the server healthy.

You get feathers through keeptakes in RvR too.

PvE will still have its use because it provides guaranteed income. Taking a contested keep is not easy at all and definitely not guaranteed.

Sat 2 Mar 2019 6:14 PM by Quik

You don't get nearly as many feathers for keep takes nor should you. Keep takes are rvr based and should give RP's, not feathers.

Again, feathers need to be mainly PvE based while RP's need to be RvR based.

Sat 2 Mar 2019 10:21 PM by Milchschnidde

Double the XP/RPS in Battlegrounds and increase its cap. Participating in BG should be worth something. Currently its not.

Sat 2 Mar 2019 10:42 PM by Quik

Milchschnidde wrote: ↑
Sat 2 Mar 2019 10:21 PM
Double the XP/RPS in Battlegrounds and increase its cap. Participating in BG should be worth something. Currently its not.

I completely agree on this.

Not sure exactly what it would take, but give us a reason to go like a huge xp bonus only in the BG's or something, as it is I just don't have any fun and I can skip the BG's and hit 50 and get all those RP's in a short time.

I have no fun with how many stealthers live there and I tend to run solo in BG's so they feast on me with their full temped toons made to just live in the BG's, and myself with just the leveling gear I have been using and will use after.

Hell, put a miniboss in the BG and if players can get a good enough group to kill him maybe they get a full suit of good armor for that respective BG. Would give a reason for other realms to try to interfere.

Mon 4 Mar 2019 6:26 PM by DABrinkley

Tried this before and somehow my post was lost

Make BG rosters that allow people to have BG specific toons. Like 2-3 extra toon slots that can only load into Thid, do this for each BG. Allow all toons of the appropriate level in. but once a player /bglock or /bgcomit (something like that. The that toon is removed from your main roster and added to that BG but cannot be removed from BG (as in stuck there, no leaving, cannot exceed caps for BG) also allow toons to be rolled directly into BGs so that people that have no open slots can make BG specific toons. Put an account Vault in BG so they can get gear to their BG toons.

The bigest problem with BG population is people leveling out, but these would be extra toon that cannot be leveled out ever so if they want to play thid... they just hit the BG tab and load a BG toon.

Mon 4 Mar 2019 7:55 PM by cuuchulain79

To me, the bgs are the only place for experience-driven gaming. The rewards are smaller, but it's fun, and the people there actually want to be there.

Another style of gaming is reward-driven gaming...which is heavily present in task style level 50 rvr...players want to essentially feel rewarded, even if they don't contribute:

Quik wrote: a lvl 50 RM who is running out to get task credit and I get to the MMG and a NS stuns and kills me (yeah this never happens lol) right before the timer ends, my feeling is I should get credit.

There doesn't need to be some giant task overhaul to the BGs...please keep focusing on the level 50 tasks, and let people who want to play in the BGs be unencumbered with the "I need realm points for losing" crowd.

Fri 8 Mar 2019 3:46 AM by rubaduck

BG's should be active in such as that they are attractive to people who want to get a jist of big boii rvr as well as progress levels or stay there. The number 1 BG killer right now is the RVR tasks. Make RVR tasks level restricted to level 40 and you'll see that the BG's are filling up again.

Fri 8 Mar 2019 1:33 PM by chryso

Battlegrounds will never be big a thing here because leveling to 50 is fast.

Fri 8 Mar 2019 6:03 PM by The Skies Asunder

chryso wrote: ↑
Fri 8 Mar 2019 1:33 PM
Battlegrounds will never be big a thing here because leveling to 50 is fast.

This argument seems pretty out of place to me. Leveling to 50 on the Live servers was ridiculously fast, much faster than here even, for most of the game's life, yet Molvik, and Thid were hugely popular on Live. People play the BGs because they want a different feel from the Frontiers, not because they can't make it to level 50.

Fri 8 Mar 2019 6:57 PM by chryso

I haven't played live in about 12ish years. I don't remember leveling being fast.

Fri 8 Mar 2019 8:32 PM by Kralin

Battlegrounds are fun when they are populated; they are not fun when it's dead. I have been in many times and it's either me solo or 35 people. It seems people go when they see others there. I frequently get messaged (or message others) "How is the action looking?".

We do need more of an incentive to go, and I agree a way to achieve that is by making tasks not count for people under 40. Maybe the GMs could do events once in a while to lure people to BGs for a night/weekend (boss npc that drops lvl 24, 29, or 34 or feathers or something; or a special event focused on the Central Keep). Surely the Devs and GMs must agree the BGs are a good thing otherwise why did they even include them in the game?

While leveling is fast on this server, I don't think that is a reason people skip the BGs. In fact it's the opposite, you can level a character to be Thid or Cale ready fast and that's a good thing. The problem is the rvr tasks are too easy to complete and lower levels get way more rps from tasks than by spending 6 hours in Caledonia.

Sat 9 Mar 2019 6:19 AM by Losse

Lets go back to classic classic and just remove BGs. I know some will hate the idea and some will love it.

Sat 9 Mar 2019 7:02 PM by Vindicator

I think the BG's are great. One of the reasons to use them on other servers was to exp and level. Now the leveling part is irrelevant. The rps are largely irrelevant because of the free tasks participating. Another reason other than 'for the love of it' would be nice to reinvigorate them.

It has to centre around combat so I suggest making the keep Lord worth a random epic drop. Feathers chest an idea as well. Basically a reason to take the keep. Also I feel the keep should be neutral at all times and it's basically a 'Dungeon' to conquer. An Outpost near each of the tk's for each realm which are open to capture. To gain access to the centre isle you need at least two outposts. Capturing the centre would also provide the captors with a 100% rp boost with maybe a feather earning buff. As well as the random chance of a single epic mob drop Dragon/Legion/TG item.

I'd like to see the siege warfare part encouraged more. Like having to use each of the siege equipment pieces to capture an Outpost. (Door must be hit with ram once at least before open) A target in centre of keep that needs to be hit with a ballista, treb & catapult. Puts pre cursor's to capturing and forces people to use the equipment. The amount of people who have never used siege equipment is mad.

Tue 12 Mar 2019 8:40 PM by lolhisup

BGs were fun here for a few weeks but the realm tasks are simpler I guess. I did the BGs for the sake of doing the BGs, I really enjoyed doing pvp in there. From what I heard most people say they would be there 80% priority to get the realm cap and 20% for fun. So I guess if it is so easy to get decent RP at low level doing the realm tasks, majority will just do that. I did it for like 99% fun, 1% feathers. Feathers were a nice little bonus I guess.

I have no idea what to do to make the BGs worthwhile to most people to the point that they will be more populated again. I haven't really been able to have a good time in a BG for a couple of weeks I think. There just aren't enough people. The only people there are usually just stealthers and speed classes. Every once in a while, one realm will have a fg and try to take the keep or something but that is about it.

RIP the BGs

Thu 14 Mar 2019 6:35 AM by Roks

Zeus wrote: ↑
Fri 1 Mar 2019 12:29 PM
With the actual task system in place, there is no need to visit battlegrounds just for the RPs. People who go there do it for fun only and once you hit the RP-cap, you´re out. Implementing a battleground-task-system would be a bad idea, since it would contribute to reaching the RP-cap sooner.

Getting rid of the task system completely would help the battlegrounds, because then you could have some fun in between leveling and gain some RPs (which you couldn´t get otherwise) at the same time. But since leveling is so easy, many would skip the battlegrounds even with no task system in place and beeline directly towards big boy s rvr.

Also making BGs eligible for credit might increase activity. But we should increase thid RR to 1L6.

Sat 23 Mar 2019 3:52 AM by wyan69

Roks wrote: ↑
Thu 14 Mar 2019 6:35 AM
Zeus wrote: ↑
Fri 1 Mar 2019 12:29 PM
With the actual task system in place, there is no need to visit battlegrounds just for the RPs. People who go there do it for fun only and once you hit the RP-cap, you´re out. Implementing a battleground-task-system would be a bad idea, since it would contribute to reaching the RP-cap sooner.

Getting rid of the task system completely would help the battlegrounds, because then you could have some fun in between leveling and gain some RPs (which you couldn´t get otherwise) at the same time. But since leveling is so easy, many would skip the battlegrounds even with no task system in place and beeline directly towards big boy s rvr.

Also making BGs eligible for credit might increase activity. But we should increase thid RR to 1L6.

True classic THID RR cap was 2L0, they should bring that back!

Fri 29 Mar 2019 12:39 AM by rok1

BGs are dead.

I've logged in a few nights in a row at 8pm CDT (Texas) and got this:

/who Thid
0

/who Caled
0

I loved BGs on live because it was a good spot to get a little experience playing your class. Over the last month it's been reduced to stealthers or essentially nothing during US prime time.

Fri 29 Mar 2019 2:57 AM by Signus

rok1 wrote: ↑
Fri 29 Mar 2019 12:39 AM
BGs are dead.

I've logged in a few nights in a row at 8pm CDT (Texas) and got this:

/who Thid
0

/who Caled
0

I loved BGs on live because it was a good spot to get a little experience playing your class. Over the last month it's been reduced to stealthers or essentially nothing during US prime time.

It happened almost overnight too.

Part of it is more people getting to level 50.

Part of it is this server population dying/dropping off now that its not new.

But really it's design killing the BGs.

Fri 29 Mar 2019 12:20 PM by jg777

Yeah weekends seem to be the only time you’ll have any reasonable activity and even then it’s spotty at best because if one realm shows up with 8-10 players they usually overwhelm whoever is on in the opposing realms and the action vanishes. Phoenix staff definitely could take steps to make BG’s more attractive and increase the action there but it’s highly possible they want as many RvR’ers to be playing endgame RvR. That, and they are quite busy with other server developments. However some simple changes like adding a nice boss in the Battlegrounds, or higher bonus XP mobs, would go a long way towards increasing the BG action.