Let's continue to talk about Shadowblades

I think Shadowblade need a new weapon type just for them that has a special damage type that is resisted by every armor class.. I think this will even the playing field and make other suggestions atleast have a valid point instead of people complaining about things that aren't an issue.

Thanks!

Tue 2 Apr 2019 7:19 PM by stinsfire

So you SBs are the new Archers of the forum. We already gave up and dont even ask to receive some QoL/Buffs anymore.
I truly dont understand why e.g. Thane gets major improvements because he was so underperforming in 1.65. The earth wizard line also got buffed and received new spells, but hey hunter still gets useless buffs and a mostly useless pet. SBs still only have Slash and Archery calculation is flawed(no real dmg increase above 35, some are even lowering bow to 27 now) and two useless lines with BC/PF. Self-Buffs are worthless in an environment with 75d/q charges and pots, last pet is at 32 and the slowest and weakest in the game.

Sorry I had to bring this up, but I am reading the forum a lot and when I read the SB threads it just gives me flashbacks to 1 to 2 months ago when Archers were clearly describing how flawed everything about them is, but the devs didnt care and went on to buff the Friar.

Don't want to downplay the achievements of the devs but I truly dont understand why QOL/Buff changes are handed out so inconsistently. Some underperforming classes get adjusted and others are left in the rain.

Sry, for the slight off-topic post.

Tue 2 Apr 2019 7:38 PM by Ceen

stinsfire wrote: ↑
Tue 2 Apr 2019 7:19 PM
So you SBs are the new Archers of the forum. We already gave up and dont even ask to receive some QoL/Buffs anymore.
I truly dont understand why e.g. Thane gets major improvements because he was so underperforming in 1.65. The earth wizard line also got buffed and received new spells, but hey hunter still gets useless buffs and a mostly useless pet. SBs still only have Slash and Archery calculation is flawed(no real dmg increase above 35, some are even lowering bow to 27 now) and two useless lines with BC/PF. Self-Buffs are worthless in an environment with 75d/q charges and pots, last pet is at 32 and the slowest and weakest in the game.

Sorry I had to bring this up, but I am reading the forum a lot and when I read the SB threads it just gives me flashbacks to 1 to 2 months ago when Archers were clearly describing how flawed everything about them is, but the devs didnt care and went on to buff the Friar.

Don't want to downplay the achievements of the devs but I truly dont understand why QOL/Buff changes are handed out so inconsistently. Some underperforming classes get adjusted and others are left in the rain.

Sry, for the slight off-topic post.

When I look into the Herald top 30
SB 9l3 - 6l3
Infi 8l5 - 6l3
NS 8l9 - 6l2

Apparently Shadow Blades work quite well. Access to Emain port 24/7, Mid domination realm, close to amg.
I don't see any buff inc and that's for good reasons

Tue 2 Apr 2019 7:49 PM by Bradekes

stinsfire wrote: ↑
Tue 2 Apr 2019 7:19 PM
So you SBs are the new Archers of the forum. We already gave up and dont even ask to receive some QoL/Buffs anymore.

Maybe read my post more carefully, because my post is of the facetious nature..

Tue 2 Apr 2019 9:18 PM by Shadowblade1

I'd like to see our 2h made valid. Give it a Crit Strike bonus.

Wed 3 Apr 2019 5:54 AM by Slarsen2

Shadowblades are the Apex assasien on phoenix

Wed 3 Apr 2019 7:14 AM by Warlay

Again, sure a sb can kill blues and do really much RPS with that, the herald is not a valid proof that the class is awesome how it is, compared to the other realms.
In real sb does good but as I already mentioned compared to ns or infi, sb sucks.

Wed 3 Apr 2019 1:28 PM by Amp_Phetamine

Warlay wrote: ↑
Wed 3 Apr 2019 7:14 AM
Again, sure a sb can kill blues and do really much RPS with that, the herald is not a valid proof that the class is awesome how it is, compared to the other realms.
In real sb does good but as I already mentioned compared to ns or infi, sb sucks.

Let's be real. Shadowblades don't hold 3 of the top 11 spots in stealther realm points earned all time for farming blue's all day. ANY class can run around farming blues all day, that logic is flawed to begin with and thrown around like a cure-all response to why shadow blades continue to perform well, especially when multiple threads are created stating how under performing they are.

Wed 3 Apr 2019 1:59 PM by Bradekes

The biggest arguement against any changes to me is the fact that people don't tend to play gimp classes.. In MOBA competetive players don't play gimp characters. Shooter games no one runs around with gimp guns.. DAoC is no different... People wouldn't be playing SB if they were as gimp as all these people say they are...

The fact that there are many high RR SB means people are playing them and succeeding... However you want to try to twist their success is your own delusions, and hearsay.. If all you focus on is that you may lose in stealth fights sometines it means you need to broaden your horizins a bit..

Yes maybe they could make only stealther fights all neutrsl damage and that is probably fair, but it really sounds like you SBs need to start a thread about changing all are resist tables or remove the tables all together and make everything neutral and dependant on racials not armor type...

Wed 3 Apr 2019 2:22 PM by Sepplord

That is true to some extent, the thing is that there is no other assassin class on midgard.
midgard players that also want an assassin do not have a different choice (and considering the reputation hunters have on phoenix most that just want a stealther in midgard flock to the SB...no matter what problems they have in the mirror-matchups).
Something being unbalanced has nuances, there are many shade between gimp and OP

Also applying the same logic-approach to the counterside of the argument: Why are there no threads about NS/Infs demanding buffs? Why is it only SB-threads, if everything is fine, and it's just unprompted whining, wouldn't there be whiners on NS/Infs too?

What confuses me is, that this part sounds as if you think SBs are fine and advocating for buffs is ridicolous

Bradekes wrote: The biggest arguement against any changes to me is the fact that people don't tend to play gimp classes.. In MOBA competetive players don't play gimp characters. Shooter games no one runs around with gimp guns.. DAoC is no different... People wouldn't be playing SB if they were as gimp as all these people say they are...

The fact that there are many high RR SB means people are playing them and succeeding... However you want to try to twist their success is your own delusions, and hearsay.. If all you focus on is that you may lose in stealth fights sometines it means you need to broaden your horizins a bit..

but the following part sounds as if you agree that there is an unbalance and advocating for normalisation of resistance-tables is reasonable?

Bradekes wrote: Yes maybe they could make only stealther fights all neutrsl damage and that is probably fair, but it really sounds like you SBs need to start a thread about changing all are resist tables or remove the tables all together and make everything neutral and dependant on racials not armor type...

That said, the flood of threads imo does seem a bit over the top. Devs are intentionally avoiding the topic, and all main arguments have been made. Having a few days before bumping the topic might not be the worst

Wed 3 Apr 2019 2:50 PM by Bradekes

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Wed 3 Apr 2019 2:22 PM
Also applying the same logic-approach to the counterside of the argument: Why are there no threads about NS/Infs demanding buffs? Why is it only SB-threads, if everything is fine, and it's just unprompted whining, wouldn't there be whiners on NS/Infs too?

Because someone chose to complain about the armor table issue..

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Wed 3 Apr 2019 2:22 PM
That said, the flood of threads imo does seem a bit over the top. Devs are intentionally avoiding the topic, and all main arguments have been made. Having a few days before bumping the topic might not be the worst

The only real problem across the whole game I see that concerns everyone is the armor table.. There is no real reason for the table to exist.. If all armor were neutral like cloth it wouldn't affect balance.. As it's the same for everyone and racial resists/armor type would be the only factor.

Wed 3 Apr 2019 3:02 PM by Roto23

stinsfire wrote: ↑
Tue 2 Apr 2019 7:19 PM
So you SBs are the new Archers of the forum. We already gave up and dont even ask to receive some QoL/Buffs anymore.
I truly dont understand why e.g. Thane gets major improvements because he was so underperforming in 1.65. The earth wizard line also got buffed and received new spells, but hey hunter still gets useless buffs and a mostly useless pet. SBs still only have Slash and Archery calculation is flawed(no real dmg increase above 35, some are even lowering bow to 27 now) and two useless lines with BC/PF. Self-Buffs are worthless in an environment with 75d/q charges and pots, last pet is at 32 and the slowest and weakest in the game.

Sorry I had to bring this up, but I am reading the forum a lot and when I read the SB threads it just gives me flashbacks to 1 to 2 months ago when Archers were clearly describing how flawed everything about them is, but the devs didnt care and went on to buff the Friar.

Don't want to downplay the achievements of the devs but I truly dont understand why QOL/Buff changes are handed out so inconsistently. Some underperforming classes get adjusted and others are left in the rain.

Sry, for the slight off-topic post.

Please stop calling that QOL changes. QOL is having free horse rides, account vaults, teleporters, etc. What you are describing is game balance.

Thu 4 Apr 2019 11:01 AM by Peister

Bradekes wrote: ↑
Tue 2 Apr 2019 6:42 PM
I think Shadowblade need a new weapon type just for them that has a special damage type that is resisted by every armor class.. I think this will even the playing field and make other suggestions atleast have a valid point instead of people complaining about things that aren't an issue.

Thanks!

So you say slash is resisted by every armor type,, what game are you playing? It sure aint daoc

Thu 4 Apr 2019 12:16 PM by Bradekes

Peister wrote: ↑
Thu 4 Apr 2019 11:01 AM
So you say slash is resisted by every armor type,, what game are you playing? It sure aint daoc

I never said it was.. I simply suggested giving them a special weapon line with a weapon that gets resisted by every armor type.. Because that's what the SBs act like... So I think we should make it a reality so they have something valid to complain about..

Thu 4 Apr 2019 12:21 PM by Peister

Bradekes wrote: ↑
Thu 4 Apr 2019 12:16 PM
Peister wrote: ↑
Thu 4 Apr 2019 11:01 AM
So you say slash is resisted by every armor type,, what game are you playing? It sure aint daoc

I never said it was.. I simply suggested giving them a special weapon line with a weapon that gets resisted by every armor type.. Because that's what the SBs act like... So I think we should make it a reality so they have something valid to complain about..

That is a very good suggestion

Thu 4 Apr 2019 1:10 PM by armath

Funny seeing all the infs and NS's, who clearly know there is a balance issue, not wanting the balance.

How would you guys feel about even armor tables, so you lose your "extra base" damage bonus :-)

Thu 4 Apr 2019 1:15 PM by Peister

armath wrote: ↑
Thu 4 Apr 2019 1:10 PM
Funny seeing all the infs and NS's, who clearly know there is a balance issue, not wanting the balance.

How would you guys feel about even armor tables, so you lose your "extra base" damage bonus :-)

How would you feel about loosning your ekstra hp?
Your off hånd allways hitting?
On top of that, what about thrust infils? They have - on your armour, hello? Are you still crying?
Learn to play your class before u Come here and cry your salty tears!

Thu 4 Apr 2019 1:34 PM by armath

Peister wrote: ↑
Thu 4 Apr 2019 1:15 PM
armath wrote: ↑
Thu 4 Apr 2019 1:10 PM
Funny seeing all the infs and NS's, who clearly know there is a balance issue, not wanting the balance.

How would you guys feel about even armor tables, so you lose your "extra base" damage bonus :-)

How would you feel about loosning your ekstra hp?
Your off hånd allways hitting?
On top of that, what about thrust infils? They have - on your armour, hello? Are you still crying?
Learn to play your class before u Come here and cry your salty tears!

Nice insults, you nailed it.

You can get that extra hp with a few realm points, if you think thats what matters. The absurd evade ratio on this server negates all benefits of having a 100% guarenteed swing - which hit for like half the damage of inf/ns offhand anyhow... Its pretty obvious, that if you did do a math on this, even with 50LA, the shadowblade would come out at the very bottom with the combined damage over time amoungst assassins.

Atleast the infil and NS has the OPTION to decide which assassin he wants to perform better against by choosing damage type., and even with thrust most infils do really well vs. SB due to the extra spec points and direct evade stun.

Theres a reason they added Blunt on Live to the SB, and that was because the SB is obviously underpowered from a armor resist table point of view at this patch level. From when they added blunt, there was a pretty well balanced assassin meta on Live for many years, but perhaps you didnt play so long so you cant remember... I played a nightshade back then, and I still managed to deal with every equal or lower rank SB 9/10 times. That changed when legendary weapons came out though, THAT was when SB was really strong if you ask me.

We dont need Blunt here. But we need something changed., and I think an equalizer in the armor resist tables is where they should begin - as stated by someone else, it takes 30 seconds to change - and it would require 30 seconds to change back if it tips the scale.

Thu 4 Apr 2019 1:45 PM by Peister

armath wrote: ↑
Thu 4 Apr 2019 1:34 PM
Peister wrote: ↑
Thu 4 Apr 2019 1:15 PM
armath wrote: ↑
Thu 4 Apr 2019 1:10 PM
Funny seeing all the infs and NS's, who clearly know there is a balance issue, not wanting the balance.

How would you guys feel about even armor tables, so you lose your "extra base" damage bonus :-)
[/quote

We dont need Blunt here. But we need something changed., and I think an equalizer in the armor resist tables is where they should begin - as stated by someone else, it takes 30 seconds to change - and it would require 30 seconds to change back if it tips the scale.

You Will see All infils respec to thrust if you take out the armour weakness aspect, which Will result in a river of chain users tears.. You cant simply look at this small a narrow perspektiv of only 1v1 on this måtter. There is more depth to it, if you want equal terms on every class and 1v1 go play wow.

Thu 4 Apr 2019 4:11 PM by stinsfire

Roto23 wrote: ↑
Wed 3 Apr 2019 3:02 PM
stinsfire wrote: ↑
Tue 2 Apr 2019 7:19 PM
So you SBs are the new Archers of the forum. We already gave up and dont even ask to receive some QoL/Buffs anymore.
I truly dont understand why e.g. Thane gets major improvements because he was so underperforming in 1.65. The earth wizard line also got buffed and received new spells, but hey hunter still gets useless buffs and a mostly useless pet. SBs still only have Slash and Archery calculation is flawed(no real dmg increase above 35, some are even lowering bow to 27 now) and two useless lines with BC/PF. Self-Buffs are worthless in an environment with 75d/q charges and pots, last pet is at 32 and the slowest and weakest in the game.

Sorry I had to bring this up, but I am reading the forum a lot and when I read the SB threads it just gives me flashbacks to 1 to 2 months ago when Archers were clearly describing how flawed everything about them is, but the devs didnt care and went on to buff the Friar.

Don't want to downplay the achievements of the devs but I truly dont understand why QOL/Buff changes are handed out so inconsistently. Some underperforming classes get adjusted and others are left in the rain.

Sry, for the slight off-topic post.

Please stop calling that QOL changes. QOL is having free horse rides, account vaults, teleporters, etc. What you are describing is game balance.

But the balance changes on the wiki are literally under QOL section

I mean.. you just gotta see it like this. Classes like the thane were so terribly bad that it caused physical and mental pain to the player, thus reducing his quality of life. Now that they are buffed our IRL quality has actually been raised since we thane/friar/whatever players were suffering immensly

Fri 5 Apr 2019 10:07 PM by Riac

Peister wrote: ↑
Thu 4 Apr 2019 1:45 PM
armath wrote: ↑
Thu 4 Apr 2019 1:34 PM
Peister wrote: ↑
Thu 4 Apr 2019 1:15 PM
You Will see All infils respec to thrust if you take out the armour weakness aspect, which Will result in a river of chain users tears.. You cant simply look at this small a narrow perspektiv of only 1v1 on this måtter. There is more depth to it, if you want equal terms on every class and 1v1 go play wow.

greun has posted they could make this interaction only between stealthers, this will spare everyone the tears.

Fri 5 Apr 2019 10:25 PM by Bradekes

Riac wrote: ↑
Fri 5 Apr 2019 10:07 PM
greun has posted they could make this interaction only between stealthers, this will spare everyone the tears.

This wouldn't really spare anyone tears and would start a chain reaction of complaints for other class interactions.. That's why every armor type should be neutral to all damage like cloth is.

Fri 5 Apr 2019 10:50 PM by Riac

Bradekes wrote: ↑
Fri 5 Apr 2019 10:25 PM
Riac wrote: ↑
Fri 5 Apr 2019 10:07 PM
greun has posted they could make this interaction only between stealthers, this will spare everyone the tears.

This wouldn't really spare anyone tears and would start a chain reaction of complaints for other class interactions.. That's why every armor type should be neutral to all damage like cloth is.

i def wouldnt be opposed to that but i think ppl would still bitch about it and say things like "that isnt daoc" they bitch about race respecs for god sakes, somthing that has no impact on them what so ever.

Sat 6 Apr 2019 12:00 AM by The Skies Asunder

Riac wrote: ↑
Fri 5 Apr 2019 10:50 PM
Bradekes wrote: ↑
Fri 5 Apr 2019 10:25 PM
Riac wrote: ↑
Fri 5 Apr 2019 10:07 PM
greun has posted they could make this interaction only between stealthers, this will spare everyone the tears.

This wouldn't really spare anyone tears and would start a chain reaction of complaints for other class interactions.. That's why every armor type should be neutral to all damage like cloth is.

i def wouldnt be opposed to that but i think ppl would still bitch about it and say things like "that isnt daoc" they bitch about race respecs for god sakes, somthing that has no impact on them what so ever.

I don't like the idea of armor being neutral to all melee damage types, but it also wouldn't be the worst thing ever. The biggest issue with the armor tables was that Mythic wanted each realm to be unique on their neutral damage, but gave them some of the same armor names/types. So you end up with Chain armor giving different bonuses from Alb to Mid, and Leather giving different bonuses from all three realms. Just normalize the armor damage tables so that all leather is the same, all chain is the same etc. and forget about making all of them different from realm to realm. Taking them all out would be quite boring though.

Sat 6 Apr 2019 12:02 AM by Riac

The Skies Asunder wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Apr 2019 12:00 AM
Riac wrote: ↑
Fri 5 Apr 2019 10:50 PM
Bradekes wrote: ↑
Fri 5 Apr 2019 10:25 PM
This wouldn't really spare anyone tears and would start a chain reaction of complaints for other class interactions.. That's why every armor type should be neutral to all damage like cloth is.

i def wouldnt be opposed to that but i think ppl would still bitch about it and say things like "that isnt daoc" they bitch about race respecs for god sakes, somthing that has no impact on them what so ever.

I don't like the idea of armor being neutral to all melee damage types, but it also wouldn't be the worst thing ever. The biggest issue with the armor tables was that Mythic wanted each realm to be unique on their neutral damage, but gave them some of the same armor names/types. So you end up with Chain armor giving different bonuses from Alb to Mid, and Leather giving different bonuses from all three realms. Just normalize the armor damage tables so that all leather is the same, all chain is the same etc. and forget about making all of them different from realm to realm. Taking them all out would be quite boring though.

i dont find amor resist tables to be terribly interesting, that being said im not really for removing them either. i jsut dont think it should be a 20% spread for some matchups, it should be a 10% at the most.

Sat 6 Apr 2019 4:12 AM by dante`afk

Ceen wrote: ↑
Tue 2 Apr 2019 7:38 PM
When I look into the Herald top 30
SB 9l3 - 6l3
Infi 8l5 - 6l3
NS 8l9 - 6l2

Apparently Shadow Blades work quite well. Access to Emain port 24/7, Mid domination realm, close to amg.
I don't see any buff inc and that's for good reasons

This has no weight and says nothing without knowing their playtime.

Sat 6 Apr 2019 4:25 AM by dante`afk

Peister wrote: ↑
Thu 4 Apr 2019 1:15 PM
How would you feel about loosning your ekstra hp?
Your off hånd allways hitting?
On top of that, what about thrust infils? They have - on your armour, hello? Are you still crying?
Learn to play your class before u Come here and cry your salty tears!

I would not mind losing all of that for equality.

Ceen wrote: ↑
Tue 2 Apr 2019 7:38 PM
When I look into the Herald top 30
SB 9l3 - 6l3
Infi 8l5 - 6l3
NS 8l9 - 6l2

Apparently Shadow Blades work quite well. Access to Emain port 24/7, Mid domination realm, close to amg.
I don't see any buff inc and that's for good reasons

This has no weight and says nothing without knowing their playtime.

--------------

Under the line now, I learned to live with the differences, whatever. SB is fiiiiiine. But hey, give us blunt, for real

Sat 6 Apr 2019 6:52 AM by Clartiex

Can we talk about that friar buff? Hitting us for almost 400 a hit and healing 15-30% even with highest disease poison on them. 😭. Tired of the SB QQ.

Sat 6 Apr 2019 7:00 AM by Riac

dante`afk wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Apr 2019 4:25 AM
Peister wrote: ↑
Thu 4 Apr 2019 1:15 PM
How would you feel about loosning your ekstra hp?
Your off hånd allways hitting?
On top of that, what about thrust infils? They have - on your armour, hello? Are you still crying?
Learn to play your class before u Come here and cry your salty tears!

I would not mind losing all of that for equality.

Ceen wrote: ↑
Tue 2 Apr 2019 7:38 PM
When I look into the Herald top 30
SB 9l3 - 6l3
Infi 8l5 - 6l3
NS 8l9 - 6l2

Apparently Shadow Blades work quite well. Access to Emain port 24/7, Mid domination realm, close to amg.
I don't see any buff inc and that's for good reasons

This has no weight and says nothing without knowing their playtime.

--------------

Under the line now, I learned to live with the differences, whatever. SB is fiiiiiine. But hey, give us blunt, for real

im assuming this is satire? you cant say sb is fine and the ask for a buff in the same breath. obv there is a deficiency here, as pointed out by your lolipop video, but your posts are becoming quite confusing.

Sat 6 Apr 2019 7:02 AM by dante`afk

I might have become numb since we hear nothing from our devs.

Mon 8 Apr 2019 2:08 PM by Amp_Phetamine

dante`afk wrote: ↑
Sat 6 Apr 2019 7:02 AM
I might have become numb since we hear nothing from our devs.

I think there's a reason for that