Heart of Legion - Phoenix Freeshard

Make it so it needs to be equipped to be used, along with starting on cooldown when it is first equipped to prevent just swapping it into place during the middle of a fight.

Sat 8 Jun 2019 7:05 AM by dbeattie71

Someone lost a fight, nerf something!

Sat 8 Jun 2019 7:06 AM by Druth

In general this should have been the case for all charged items, and would have made the charge item nerf redundant.

But also think it would upset a lot of people if they had to redo their temps...

Sat 8 Jun 2019 10:07 AM by Gorgoroth

How about no?
I have it built into my temp anyways, but why would you impose nonsense restrictions to items and their charges?
You have super cheap access to this item as well so there is literally no poi t to your suggestion?

Also, this would make creating a temp for players potentially more difficult and pricey, which is bad in itself, as we all want to spend our time in rvr and not in a farm team somewhere hitting on mobs.

So please enlighten (at least me) why you think your suggestion is good and what you think this change would improve.

Thank you.

Sat 8 Jun 2019 12:27 PM by lurker

All this would achieve would be to force people spend a lot more plats again on their templates. It wouldn’t change balance / abilities at all.

Sun 9 Jun 2019 6:21 PM by Cadebrennus

I'm all for a change like this. It would force people to be more creative with their templates. Right now they're all too cookie-cutter with no diversity. It's all the same chest + ROGs.

Sun 9 Jun 2019 7:42 PM by Bumbles

Gorgoroth wrote: ↑
Sat 8 Jun 2019 10:07 AM
How about no?
I have it built into my temp anyways, but why would you impose nonsense restrictions to items and their charges?
You have super cheap access to this item as well so there is literally no poi t to your suggestion?

Also, this would make creating a temp for players potentially more difficult and pricey, which is bad in itself, as we all want to spend our time in rvr and not in a farm team somewhere hitting on mobs.

So please enlighten (at least me) why you think your suggestion is good and what you think this change would improve.

Thank you.

Being able to use items in your bag is a custom change on this server and it also allows classes to have access to IP like heals when they shouldn't. But like you said, you have it built in already so it should't bother you at all.

Tue 11 Jun 2019 1:58 PM by Sepplord

Cadebrennus wrote: ↑
Sun 9 Jun 2019 6:21 PM
I'm all for a change like this. It would force people to be more creative with their templates. Right now they're all too cookie-cutter with no diversity. It's all the same chest + ROGs.

forcing more must-have items into specific slots does the opposite of improving creativity.
Having to equip chargeitems definitely would change many temps and require redoing them, but not in a creative way...

the only way to get creativity is to have loads of options, but it being impossible to include the majority or even all of them. THEN people start making decisions but that also adds another layer of balancing on top of the nigh impossible balancing-situation that already exists. Otherwise you only create the new cookie-cutter or even have classmatchups changed completely because some classes (most casters for example) can easily fit more into their temp than others (hybrids/assassins) because they already need a boatload of UT to build a fullcap temp

Wed 12 Jun 2019 11:24 PM by Deekina

Gorgoroth wrote: ↑
Sat 8 Jun 2019 10:07 AM
How about no?
I have it built into my temp anyways, but why would you impose nonsense restrictions to items and their charges?
You have super cheap access to this item as well so there is literally no poi t to your suggestion?

Also, this would make creating a temp for players potentially more difficult and pricey, which is bad in itself, as we all want to spend our time in rvr and not in a farm team somewhere hitting on mobs.

So please enlighten (at least me) why you think your suggestion is good and what you think this change would improve.

Thank you.

I disagree about difficulty in temping. Temps should never be about having everything capped with lots of toys. As people say in this thread, it's better to have players decide on what to prioritise in temps. You've managed a temp with the item in and others can do the same easily if they want.

I never liked the easy access to so many toys that live had, with capped temps easy to attain along with so many options in fights. We had a crazy situation where people could run three ablatives at the same time. I think it is better to limit the toys people have, or at least force a sacrifice to have the bells and whistles.

Thu 13 Jun 2019 6:46 AM by inoeth

Deekina wrote: ↑
Wed 12 Jun 2019 11:24 PM
Gorgoroth wrote: ↑
Sat 8 Jun 2019 10:07 AM
How about no?
I have it built into my temp anyways, but why would you impose nonsense restrictions to items and their charges?
You have super cheap access to this item as well so there is literally no poi t to your suggestion?

Also, this would make creating a temp for players potentially more difficult and pricey, which is bad in itself, as we all want to spend our time in rvr and not in a farm team somewhere hitting on mobs.

So please enlighten (at least me) why you think your suggestion is good and what you think this change would improve.

Thank you.

I disagree about difficulty in temping. Temps should never be about having everything capped with lots of toys. As people say in this thread, it's better to have players decide on what to prioritise in temps. You've managed a temp with the item in and others can do the same easily if they want.

I never liked the easy access to so many toys that live had, with capped temps easy to attain along with so many options in fights. We had a crazy situation where people could run three ablatives at the same time. I think it is better to limit the toys people have, or at least force a sacrifice to have the bells and whistles.

yeah lets all excavate our epic armors

Thu 13 Jun 2019 6:59 AM by Sepplord

Deekina wrote: ↑
Wed 12 Jun 2019 11:24 PM
Gorgoroth wrote: ↑
Sat 8 Jun 2019 10:07 AM
How about no?
I have it built into my temp anyways, but why would you impose nonsense restrictions to items and their charges?
You have super cheap access to this item as well so there is literally no poi t to your suggestion?

Also, this would make creating a temp for players potentially more difficult and pricey, which is bad in itself, as we all want to spend our time in rvr and not in a farm team somewhere hitting on mobs.

So please enlighten (at least me) why you think your suggestion is good and what you think this change would improve.

Thank you.

I disagree about difficulty in temping. Temps should never be about having everything capped with lots of toys. As people say in this thread, it's better to have players decide on what to prioritise in temps. You've managed a temp with the item in and others can do the same easily if they want.

I never liked the easy access to so many toys that live had, with capped temps easy to attain along with so many options in fights. We had a crazy situation where people could run three ablatives at the same time. I think it is better to limit the toys people have, or at least force a sacrifice to have the bells and whistles.

the problem with making it impossible to have everything you create a huge gap in RvR between RvR-players and PvE-farmers. One of the best things in daoc (for me and my friends at least) was that it was NOT a constant gear-spiral to get better gear so you can own people harder. And having caps also makes balancing easier.

TOA kind of ruined that, by increasing the grind needed to achieve the cap-templates immensely, driving loads of people away (yes, i am aware that many many other factors also contributed, and it even worked in pulling in PvE-players that liked the grind)

Thu 13 Jun 2019 7:19 AM by Druth

With a 3.000 pop I would support, forcing to temp in such items, in a heartbeat, but we are not at that point.

Major changes causes people to leave.
People who have left are likely to NOT check out forums for changes that would make them come back.
The result is fewer people to play with.

So items that everyone can use, and that only affect 1v1 situations should be in the absolute bottom of the wish-list.

Thu 13 Jun 2019 7:23 AM by Druth

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Thu 13 Jun 2019 6:59 AM
TOA kind of ruined that, by increasing the grind needed to achieve the cap-templates immensely, driving loads of people away (yes, i am aware that many many other factors also contributed, and it even worked in pulling in PvE-players that liked the grind)

And this, a million times this.
You had people running in templates not even capped BEFORE ToA, suddenly fighting people with +25% spell damage, damage immunity, un-purgable CC, near invisibility items, etc etc... and while most of this was adjusted, the above is what ToA opened up with!
I got 1 extra account with ToA, and I suspect many others did as well, which can't help but have contributed to us not seeing a drop in pop to begin with.

Thu 13 Jun 2019 10:23 AM by Gorgoroth

I still disagree strongly with the reasoning behind limiting access to charges, because of none of the people opposing the access to them (while not being part of your template) actually gave a reason for their opposition, except for their personal taste and or liking. Good thing that you have an opinion, good that to you voice it, but it seems that the majority shares another one.

But let me then give you some reasons why the limitations some propose is very bad:

1. Some people will still use all available charges, however, they will dump a ton of money into the SC, which will make encounters in the Frontiers less of a reflex or skill thing, but rather, how much time you invested in farming plats, to afford super ROGs, so that you can template with all charges available, which gives you a great advantage.

2. As of now, people can use crafted charges (ablatives for example) until they can afford the Feather alternative upgrade. that means, you dont need to do your template twice, as you gather more and more feathers. You have a cheap alternative availabe, just slightly weaker than the feather charge, without the need to have more than one SC to be good to go.

3. Why would anyone want to spend more time than necessary in PvE to grind out some money or RoG to achieve the same goal, as of now somewhat easy to achieve, just with a MUCH higher grind wall? Are you crazy or just blind to those consequences?

Cheers.

Edit: and btw to the dude there saying, that I shouldn't be bothered, as I have the heart of Legion as part of my temp:
Even if something doesn't affect me personally, that doesn't mean that I can't put myself into the situation of someone else and see things from a different angle than mine. This seems to be a skill, that some here lost.

Thu 13 Jun 2019 1:07 PM by gotwqqd

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Thu 13 Jun 2019 6:59 AM
Deekina wrote: ↑
Wed 12 Jun 2019 11:24 PM
Gorgoroth wrote: ↑
Sat 8 Jun 2019 10:07 AM
How about no?
I have it built into my temp anyways, but why would you impose nonsense restrictions to items and their charges?
You have super cheap access to this item as well so there is literally no poi t to your suggestion?

Also, this would make creating a temp for players potentially more difficult and pricey, which is bad in itself, as we all want to spend our time in rvr and not in a farm team somewhere hitting on mobs.

So please enlighten (at least me) why you think your suggestion is good and what you think this change would improve.

Thank you.

I disagree about difficulty in temping. Temps should never be about having everything capped with lots of toys. As people say in this thread, it's better to have players decide on what to prioritise in temps. You've managed a temp with the item in and others can do the same easily if they want.

I never liked the easy access to so many toys that live had, with capped temps easy to attain along with so many options in fights. We had a crazy situation where people could run three ablatives at the same time. I think it is better to limit the toys people have, or at least force a sacrifice to have the bells and whistles.

the problem with making it impossible to have everything you create a huge gap in RvR between RvR-players and PvE-farmers. One of the best things in daoc (for me and my friends at least) was that it was NOT a constant gear-spiral to get better gear so you can own people harder. And having caps also makes balancing easier.

TOA kind of ruined that, by increasing the grind needed to achieve the cap-templates immensely, driving loads of people away (yes, i am aware that many many other factors also contributed, and it even worked in pulling in PvE-players that liked the grind)

There is a MASSIVE difference between not being able to cap everything and constantly moving the bar higher