Incentives to run dungeons - Phoenix Freeshard

Hi,

I love Phoenix for its main goal of getting players in a comfortable and quick way to RvR. However, one thing that does not work well with this concept is getting people to do PVE Raids. Besides gold farming, dungeons are abandoned space, and I have trouble finding players interested in killing bosses for credit and/or loot. Since feather events there's barely anyone interested in doing something else than Dark Spire. I would like to discuss if other players made the same experience and if there's a need for a solution.

Kind regards,
Sethor

Thu 3 Jun 2021 5:48 PM by Centenario

The devs tried with the banished quests but failed.

I personally would like dungeons to be more rewarding.

Problems:
You level too fast at low level, so going to the zone is not worth the expensive playtime:
=> need to have insta teleport to dungeons

Some dungeons are weirdly set-up and the gameplay is boring with groups of 4+
=> could have dungeon limited to groups of max 4 players
=> rework mob level and placement

The pve and exp rewards are off
=> need to grant token/feather/ash/tear with a daily cap so that rewards are useful even for veteran players
=> have some dungeon specific task system instead of quests.

Thu 3 Jun 2021 6:08 PM by ExcretusMaximus

Centenario wrote: ↑
Thu 3 Jun 2021 5:48 PM
The devs tried with the banished quests but failed.

Pretty sure they're talking about the epic dungeons and the kind of epic dungeons (Trollheim, Iarn's, AC, etc).

Sethor wrote: ↑
Thu 3 Jun 2021 5:34 PM
However, one thing that does not work well with this concept is getting people to do PVE Raids.

Thu 3 Jun 2021 6:10 PM by Bradekes

Easy way to do this is give some loot for the battlegrounds from the dungeons. Like 100% quality gear with good procs and such and add level caps to enter the dungeons so people can't just farm them.

Thu 3 Jun 2021 8:21 PM by Sethor

ExcretusMaximus wrote: ↑
Thu 3 Jun 2021 6:08 PM
Centenario wrote: ↑
Thu 3 Jun 2021 5:48 PM
The devs tried with the banished quests but failed.

Pretty sure they're talking about the epic dungeons and the kind of epic dungeons (Trollheim, Iarn's, AC, etc).

Sethor wrote: ↑
Thu 3 Jun 2021 5:34 PM
However, one thing that does not work well with this concept is getting people to do PVE Raids.

Exactly. In particular, Galladoria, Tur Suil, Fomor, Tuscaran Glacier, Iarnvidiurs Lair, Trollheim, Caer Sidi, Avalon City, Krondon, Darkness Falls, Passage of Conflict and the bosses in these dungeons.

Thu 3 Jun 2021 8:23 PM by Sethor

Bradekes wrote: ↑
Thu 3 Jun 2021 6:10 PM
Easy way to do this is give some loot for the battlegrounds from the dungeons. Like 100% quality gear with good procs and such and add level caps to enter the dungeons so people can't just farm them.

The intention is to make the dungeons more attractive and not to redistribute the loot.

Thu 3 Jun 2021 8:58 PM by Bradekes

Sethor wrote: ↑
Thu 3 Jun 2021 8:23 PM
The intention is to make the dungeons more attractive and not to redistribute the loot.

Hmm I thought making the loot they contain better would make them more attractive? Why else does one run dungeons?

Only other idea I can come up with is a separate currency gained in each dungeon for special gear skins

Fri 4 Jun 2021 2:14 AM by yepyukon

DS gives a lot of feathers and a % bonus to xp across your account. Maybe make a feather bonus % across your account for dungeon runs? Or maybe give an RP/BP timed bonus for certain high level dungeon completions? Say you clear Sidi, Alb gets 2-5% bonus RP and/or BP for 24 hours to help PvE or PvP contention?

Fri 4 Jun 2021 7:33 AM by Sethor

yepyukon wrote: ↑
Fri 4 Jun 2021 2:14 AM
DS gives a lot of feathers and a % bonus to xp across your account. Maybe make a feather bonus % across your account for dungeon runs? Or maybe give an RP/BP timed bonus for certain high level dungeon completions? Say you clear Sidi, Alb gets 2-5% bonus RP and/or BP for 24 hours to help PvE or PvP contention?

A temporary bonus for completion of a dungeon sounds interesting but I have a few concerns about this solution which areopportunity costs, undermining server goal, and user-centred bonus.

In theory, we are talking multiple hours for clearing 3 SI dungeons + SH + Dragon + DF. The opportunity costs would be missed RP/BP for the duration of raids participated. Also, at least the epic dungeons used to have a weekly timer on them. So, I'm not sure if 2-5% or in general a time-based percentage bonus towards RvR activities would work well. I fear the bonus would have to be too high to actually get people doing these PVE runs, something like +80% total bonus distributed on PvE bosses:

+15% epic dungeon (kill Apocalypse, King Tuscar, Olcasgean)
+10% SI dungeon #1 (kill Xanxicar, Nosdoden, Mydraxxis)
+10% SI dungeon #2 (Balor, Iarnvidiur, Orylle)
+15% dragon (Golestand, Gjalpinulva, Cuuldurach)
+10% Grand Summoner Govannon
+5% DF Prince (Prince Abdin, Asmoien, Ba'alorien)
+5% DF Beliathan
+15% DF Legion

Remember, just playing around with numbers and gathering feedback.

Besides, I'm not sure if a daily bonus would harmonize well with Phoenix's RvR focus. I have no idea how quickly you can do an epic dungeon on this server, but imagine the number of people that potentially is getting taken out of RvR just to fulfil the daily chore of activating such a bonus. Maybe make it a weekly bonus instead?

Last but not least, it is usually not the best solution to incentivize players who actually want to do something else. A user-centred approach that creates an incentive for players who already are open to doing PVE could be better. Items, Gold, Achievement, Reputation, Challenge and just hanging around with friends is what I'd consider the main reasons for PVE players to run dungeons.

=> quick access to non-frontier dungeons (instant port)
=> tradable dungeon completion vouchers
=> increased loot pool
=> add achievements that unlock unique rewards for completing all dungeons or all dungeons X times. There's plenty of item skins and mounts that are not available.
=> add DS mechanic to dungeons including instantiating them and displaying leader boards

Maybe this in combination with an RP bonus would do the trick? What do you think?

Fri 4 Jun 2021 8:21 AM by borodino1812

Considering the tension created within the playerbase when there is the combination of Level Playing Field event + Double feather event, I am not sure how you'd do this. People will vote with their feet. Make it attractive and they will come.

You'd have to keep the effects on RvR in mind.