The Arena - FAQ & Feedback - Phoenix Freeshard

This Monday, Marchst 1st, we'll run another Arena test with group cap 8. There will be 2 runs again:
EU prime time: 8pm cet to midnight cet
NA prime time: 8pm est to midnight est

Starting Event RR will be 7L0.

See here for more information on the event RR: https://forum.playphoenix.online/get-involved/planned-changes/28262-the-arena-faq-feedback?page=3#p155468

Changes from normal RvR:
- style snares that are not follow up styles will now have a 10 second duration + base weapon speed, values subject to change
- follow up style snares will now have a 13 second duration + 2x base weapon speed, values subject to change

====

To participate you have to be in a full group and your group leader has to register at the arena npc. Those npcs can be found in the border keeps as well as in the safe zone of the arena.

It is possible that the short pre test will have a smaller group size to ensure the matchmaking can be tested properly.

Initial ruleset for the arena:
- No realm timer
- Groupsize: 8
- No cross realm groups
- PvP ruleset to allow fights between groups of the same realm
- Matches between groups are instanced and consist of multiple fights (best of 3)
- Cooldowns will be reset only before the first fight against a group, ie at the start of the best of 3
- In addition to the normal kill rp, each fight will also grant 1000 rp to every member of both groups, like gvg
- Groups currently registered in the arena will be listed in /gvg list

arena commands:
/arena queued: shows the arena queue
/arena info: shows arena instruction text
/arena ready: ready up in preparation phase, must be used by group leader
/arena unregister: unregister to avoid getting into new fights

how to - The Arena:
1. form a group of 8
2. the group leader clicks <register> on the registry npc either in your local border keep or in the arena safe zone
3. as soon as a group has been found to fight you, you will get ported to an instance
4. get ready for the fight, pets will spawn automatically on classes that can charm a pet
5. both group leaders have to do /arena ready
6. after a best of 3, both groups will be ported back to the safe zone
7a. if you want to fight again, just wait until the next fight starts
7b. if you want to stop, type /arena unregister and leave the zone via the teleporter

Mon 18 Jan 2021 10:32 AM by DJ2000

Would you consider discussing a change for the Necro for (or during) this Event?

As of now, the Setup that includes a Necro is at a heavy disadvantage.
The Necro pet is, and will be, always Target Nr.1 for every enemy Grp which will grant 99% of the time a win for 2 specific Reasons.

1. The Necro is not picked into a setup because he is wearing fancy shoes, obviously the sole reason is to make him part of the strat (AF Debuff/unbreakable Snare). So he is key part/enabler to make the setup work. Without him, the setup simply wont work. Which is fine all in itself, but it becomes a problem with the other point.
Again, just wanted to point out: The necro is only in setups, where he and his utility are a crucial part of that specific setup. He is not there as an interchangeable DPS class.

2. The very moment the Necro dies, the fight is basically a 7v8 for the rest of the fight.
A Tank gets a PR, 2 or 3 Buffs and a Heal and is then good to go, any Caster the same. A Support has some work ahead of him, but he is back in action also right after.
After a Resurrection of the fallen Teammate, the Fight is back to 8v8.
But not with the Necro. The Necro is "not good to go" after a PR, some buffs and a Heal. Rezzing him does not turn the Fight into a 8v8 again, it remains 7v8.
In fact, it basically forces the Alb grp to "push" in a 6v8 (1 supp is dedicated to the Necro) to give the necro time to be rezzed and resummon his pet.

The "Pet summon" is basically the deciding factor here. Any form of interrupt will keep the necro out of the fight, Which is easy to do with the cast time of 20s.
He will never be able to get back into the fight. The payoff for the enemy grp to focus on a Necro is just to big here.
If his Grp can not defend his position, he is either interrupted, dead or forced to reposition all the time. Unlike any other class, he is basically of 0 benefit to the Grp/fight after a Resurrection.
Not even "worth" the time/resources a support has to invest in. It will remain a 7v8 even if he is resurrected. Might as well just leave him Dead. Every fight.
Its not a fight anymore that revolves around decisions, shot calling or positioning etc. Everytime it simply devolves into "killing the No-recovery Necro".
This outcome can be forced reliably by the enemy.

I dont really care that much about the necro, and i stopped playing a long while ago one once everybody jumped on the hype-train for the "broken" part of playing one, but if you want to make the necro part of a hybrid/tanker setup, this needs to be addressed somehow.
The problem is not his death. the problem is not his resurrection. the problem is that he can be effectively forced out of a fight easily. Punishing every Grp that includes a Necro into their setup. Its basically an auto-loss.

The change i would like to propose to you and/or the council of yours to consider testing for/in this event:
Put in every 3 spec lines "Deathsight", "Painworking" and "Death Servant" at LVL46 (or 47 or 48 or w/e) a new spell.
An uninterruptible 3sec Pet Summon with a 5min/10min/15min/whateverbalanceisabitch timer.
To offset this easily exploitable weakness a bit.

Mon 18 Jan 2021 11:58 AM by Sepplord

A dead shaman (drui/cleric too, though you have to know which one the buffer is), surely fucks over a group more than a dead necro does. And those classes aren't "immune" to meleedmg

Mon 18 Jan 2021 12:21 PM by DJ2000

I don't disagree. Every loss of a team member is a detriment to a Grp.
But every class, besides a necro, has a viable recovery/comeback after a rezz. The necro simply doesn't.
I have no desire to strengthen the necro to gain anything from it. But there is an obvious gameplay flaw for a "8v8". The moment a 8v8 turns into a 7v8 by exploiting a weakness in class design.
Focusing down a crucial part of the enemy team has always a pay off (u might lose a member on the other side), but the gain by doing this "trade" for a necro is just to big. The payoff, the gain/loss is too big.

If the devs didn't try to put a necro in 8v8 hybrid/tanker setups, i wouldn't have bothered.
So if those setups fail in this event, i want to make sure it's addressed correctly, and not by upping something else.

That's why i merely asked them if they would consider discussing it.

Mon 18 Jan 2021 12:47 PM by Sepplord

i believe you are underestimating the effect of the whole group losing their speccbuffs
and still buffers don't always get focussed first, because always training the same target also has it's disadvantages.

If necros would actually always become the first target, any decent group could easily abuse that and use it against their opponents

Mon 18 Jan 2021 1:10 PM by DJ2000

Sepplord wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Jan 2021 12:47 PM
i believe you are underestimating the effect of the whole group losing their speccbuffs
and still buffers don't always get focussed first, because always training the same target also has it's disadvantages.

Really, i don't.

I do respect your opinion and also agree that there are different levels, based on the class, a "loss" a Team member can have and that a "loss" of a supporting role is far above of that of a necro.
That's not what my point is about.

Honestly, i really am not here to argue about that or defend anything i said or question anything you say.
I have no desire to change anyone's opinion. I've said my piece.

Mon 18 Jan 2021 5:12 PM by

Uthred

Edited the first post and put in the arena commands and a how to. If you want to have an overview about the commands ingame, just type /arena.

Mon 18 Jan 2021 5:41 PM by

gruenesschaf

Changes between the pre test and later today:
- you can no longer unregister while in a match
- after a match you will have at least 30 seconds in the safe zone before the next match against another group can start
- fixed an issue that caused getting matched against the same group back to back
- region chat is now enabled

Mon 18 Jan 2021 9:50 PM by Peligroso

This event is good but it could do with a slight change.
Is there a way to make it so you port into a random location, and you have to roam a little to find the enemy, rather than straight infront of the opposing teams?. Tank groups stand no chance in this event as all the groups you face just pre kite and can also use the discord bot to find out who they're against prior.
Tank groups do so much better in a normal roaming "inc" rather than a head on fight

Mon 18 Jan 2021 10:06 PM by Simon73

great event boss!

Mon 18 Jan 2021 11:43 PM by CowwoC

This event is a huge rp farming fest for some groups GJ.

Tue 19 Jan 2021 12:44 AM by Chamie

Wow amazing launch of the event!

Didnt expect this many groups to play the EU primetime. RPs are perfect also imo.

I guess not all days will be this great though but this was possibly the most fun I´ve had in a phoenix event. I really love the 5vs5 event but this one is even more fun when there are toooooons of groups.

As everyone else however, I fear that it will die out and only be some super hardcore set groups like the Premade guild left eventually. Its probably important to have a set starting time so that everyone joins at the same time, might be hard to get action going otherwise if one group has to get farmed by same group over and over again to get action going.

Tue 19 Jan 2021 2:23 AM by gotwqqd

CowwoC wrote: ↑
Mon 18 Jan 2021 11:43 PM
This event is a huge rp farming fest for some groups GJ.

Another way to create a power gap

If anything RP’s should be granted at a lower level.
Giving a reason to stay in the main event.

If they truly just want good fights 8v8, they won’t mind reduced points

Tue 19 Jan 2021 4:39 PM by

Uthred

We had yesterday at most 28 groups in the Arena, which is way more than the usual suspects on the daily /gvg list.

We had to move the safe zone from stygia haven to hesperos, the combat area for the stygia / river area was too large and covered the safe zone causing people who released to still be counted as alive thereby preventing the fight from finishing.

Other minor changes:
- after a match (best of 3) there will be at least 1 min before the match making will search another group for you to fight (was 30 secs before)
- then for 60 seconds it will look for other realm group and after 2 total minutes look for same realm groups as well
- there is now a Master Trainer in the safe zone
- instead of getting a single rp reward at the end of each best of 3 you now get a reward at the end of each fight that corresponds to the /gvg cleanfight reward
- there will be a new command which will list the different groups and their setup that are currently in the Arena

Before we will make a final announcement about the Arena and its future on Phoenix, we would like to do another test to see if all bugs have been cleared out. This next test will be on Wednesday, January 20th, at 8pm CET which is in about 26.5 hours from now.

Tue 19 Jan 2021 4:56 PM by Nephamael

First of all great fun, hope this will happen often for both 3v3 and 8v8

Now small ideas for improvements:

After each round the timers for pots and items should reset.

The idea to reset all RAs after each bo3 is a great idea.

How exactly does matchmaking work?
Wouldn't it be great to try and match groups with a low winrate against groups with a low winrate preferably?

I was playing in a full pug yesterday and we were matched against the same real gvg group in a 8v8 bo3 twice in a row, which was so frustrating for some of the pug members so they just gave up after being slaughtered 4 times.

While i personally dont mind losing at all (but mind losing pug members and having to rebuild)i think it would be great for motivation to try and always group a 0:1 group against another 0:1 group as priority.

Tue 19 Jan 2021 5:31 PM by ExcretusMaximus

If this becomes a permanent feature, I know at least a dozen people who are bailing.

DAoC is not an arena game, and intentionally splitting the low population is just silly.

Tue 19 Jan 2021 5:59 PM by

gruenesschaf

ExcretusMaximus wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Jan 2021 5:31 PM
If this becomes a permanent feature, I know at least a dozen people who are bailing.

DAoC is not an arena game, and intentionally splitting the low population is just silly.

It'll never be permanent, it is however a candidate to become a regular thing for a couple hours each time.

Tue 19 Jan 2021 6:07 PM by

gruenesschaf

Nephamael wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Jan 2021 4:56 PM
I was playing in a full pug yesterday and we were matched against the same real gvg group in a 8v8 bo3 twice in a row, which was so frustrating for some of the pug members so they just gave up after being slaughtered 4 times.

Twice in a row should be impossible, there was a 20 minute timeout before the same two groups were considered a valid match again. Only problem is the tracking was locked to the arena registration meaning if either group unregistered and registered again you wouldn't have the timeout.
This will not be the case in the next round as it'll just track the accounts and as long as a group consists of the same 5 (group size / 2 + 1) people it'll be considered the same group for matchmaking purposes, this 20 minute block for rematches will also be greatly increased / scale with the number of participating groups to make it rather unlikely to have any rematches.

Tue 19 Jan 2021 6:08 PM by Iuppiter

gruenesschaf wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Jan 2021 5:59 PM
It'll never be permanent, it is however a candidate to become a regular thing for a couple hours each time.

Will some of those hours include NA prime times?

Tue 19 Jan 2021 6:47 PM by ExcretusMaximus

gruenesschaf wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Jan 2021 5:59 PM
It'll never be permanent, it is however a candidate to become a regular thing for a couple hours each time.

Thank you for the clarification.

Tue 19 Jan 2021 7:20 PM by gotwqqd

gruenesschaf wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Jan 2021 5:59 PM
ExcretusMaximus wrote: ↑
Tue 19 Jan 2021 5:31 PM
If this becomes a permanent feature, I know at least a dozen people who are bailing.

DAoC is not an arena game, and intentionally splitting the low population is just silly.

It'll never be permanent, it is however a candidate to become a regular thing for a couple hours each time.

Maybe it relies on some mechanic where these 8mans must open up the event by some participation in full world rvr that benefits all play types

Wed 20 Jan 2021 7:32 AM by Sepplord

The following idea could be toally dumb, i haven't decided myself, but maybe it would work out in a positive way:

Link this event to the 5vs5 leveling event so they are active at the same time:

possible positive effects:
-less "elite"-players with premades in the levelling event
-RvR being deserted is less aweful -> there are two different options to play
-less servertime with an active event that impacts RvR (this is twosided though...)

possible negative effects:
-population is split between events....might result in the arena event not being utilized much
-a possibly positive effect on smallmen/solos when most 8mens are in the arena, is negated because the lvl-event is drawing that population anyways
-people who love both events have to split their time onto both events

Thu 21 Jan 2021 3:28 PM by Muse

What would be great for the next arena is the starting position each fight.
At the moment, some starting points are bad for casters to get space. The start of the 2. round or 3. round is the same as on the first round. Which means if you are unlucky and spawn with your castergrp at a position where the hill is behind you (volcanus f.e.) you are fucked, 2 times.

Fri 22 Jan 2021 11:45 AM by Gilbert

Even if I am a big fan of 8vs8, I think the 8vs8-Event is a nice idea, but it should only be an Event and not a permanent thing,
because I think open pvp is a important part of DAOC.

Maybe you should include a system like you did with the BG-Event.
When the people wont the 8vs8 event, they have to do/pay something for that.

Fri 22 Jan 2021 3:41 PM by opossum12

Gilbert wrote: ↑
Fri 22 Jan 2021 11:45 AM
Even if I am a big fan of 8vs8, I think the 8vs8-Event is a nice idea, but it should only be an Event and not a permanent thing,
because I think open pvp is a important part of DAOC.

Maybe you should include a system like you did with the BG-Event.
When the people wont the 8vs8 event, they have to do/pay something for that.

Gruenes already confirmed it isn't a permanent feature. Right now, it's mainly used to quickly test balance changes.

Fri 22 Jan 2021 8:19 PM by Norselaw

How about working The Arena into the task rotation?

You could have it after every EV task (6 45 min Arenas per day)

Give the option to queue as a premade or get put in a random group like the demons breach event. Premades fight other premades, random grps vs random. Also, some kind of system that takes the average RR of the group itself and matches against a similar strength group.

Allow 8v8, 4v4 or 5v5, and 1vs1

If thats too much you could always reduce it to after every full task cycle for roughly 3 1hr arenas per day.

Mon 25 Jan 2021 9:49 PM by

gruenesschaf

This Friday, the 29th, we'll run another Arena test with group cap 8. This time there will be 2 runs:
EU prime time: 8pm cet to midnight cet
NA prime time: 8pm est to midnight est

This round will introduce scheduled starting and ending of the arena at specific times. This round will also start everyone at RR7L0 inside the event zone.

This round will be the first test of a new feature allowing us to set starting realm points / rr for an event. Events utilizing this feature, like the arena in this case, will have a separate set of realm points. Your RA point distribution can also be different while in the event zones and RA respecs for these will be free.
While in the arena you will earn RP at the rate of your event RR for both, your actual RP as well as your event RP. For example, if your actual RR outside of the event is RR10 and in the event you are RR5 you will, inside the event, earn as much RP as an RR5 person would and these earned rp are added to your normal RP as well as your event RP.

Mon 25 Jan 2021 11:37 PM by Sagz

gruenesschaf wrote: ↑
Mon 25 Jan 2021 9:49 PM
This Friday, the 29th, we'll run another Arena test with group cap 8. This time there will be 2 runs:
EU prime time: 8pm cet to midnight cet
NA prime time: 8pm est to midnight est

This round will introduce scheduled starting and ending of the arena at specific times. This round will also start everyone at RR7L0 inside the event zone.

This round will be the first test of a new feature allowing us to set starting realm points / rr for an event. Events utilizing this feature, like the arena in this case, will have a separate set of realm points. Your RA point distribution can also be different while in the event zones and RA respecs for these will be free.
While in the arena you will earn RP at the rate of your event RR for both, your actual RP as well as your event RP. For example, if your actual RR outside of the event is RR10 and in the event you are RR5 you will, inside the event, earn as much RP as an RR5 person would and these earned rp are added to your normal RP as well as your event RP.

Soo if I am reading this right, if you are RR3, and enter the event you are boosted to RR7 and if you are RR11 you are knocked down to RR7. So the RR3 guys will gain less rps than he normally would and the RR11 would gain more rps than he normally would....Did I misinterpret that?

Mon 25 Jan 2021 11:47 PM by

Uthred

You are correct. You will get rps like being rr7.

Ofc you can argue that you will get less rps because of being rr7 and not rr3. But on the other hand, you are having the same rank as the rr11 player and hence (in theory) you should have way better chances to win the fight (rr7 vs rr7 instead of rr3 vs rr11) and getting rps for killing players and not just getting rps for the cleanfight.

Mon 25 Jan 2021 11:54 PM by Sagz

Uthred wrote: ↑
Mon 25 Jan 2021 11:47 PM
You are correct. You will get rps like being rr7.

Ofc you can argue that you will get less rps because of being rr7 and not rr3. But on the other hand, you are having the same rank as the rr11 player and hence (in theory) you should have way better chances to win the fight (rr7 vs rr7 instead of rr3 vs rr11) and getting rps for killing players and not just getting rps for the cleanfight.

K thanks, just making sure I wasn't interpenetrating that wrong, I was assuming you wanted to have more low RR players for more group diversity for testing, not just the standard high RR groups running the same setups in an instanced battleground. But your point makes sense as well.

Tue 26 Jan 2021 12:05 AM by

Uthred

Hopefully more players will play/test different setups as the rr is the same for everyone. Many (set-)groups have different setups in different realms but often decide to play the one with the highest rr. This is not an argument any more for this arena test.

Also we hope to see more lower ranks/new players to join the Arena as they will have the same realm rank as everyone else in there and the rr-gap will not be a thing there.

Tue 26 Jan 2021 1:53 AM by Sleepwell

Doesnt really account for the fact that set groups are set groups. Casuals are not joining as often due to being farmed. Nothing wrong with that. I dont have a solid 8 logging in at the moment, so i am choosing not to test. Hope your adjustment works for those who wanna partake though.

Tue 26 Jan 2021 9:16 AM by

Uthred

The last two tests we did there were a lot of pugs and casuals joining the test. At some point we had about 30 groups listed compared to the 8-14 groups that are /gvg listed on a daily basis. So I strongly doubt that all of them were setgroups.

Tue 26 Jan 2021 12:50 PM by sav

If the area is for testing: why do minstrel only have yellow pets, which does not represent the reality? Make it orange, red or what ever based on the skill in instruments to see real world performance.

Tue 26 Jan 2021 1:27 PM by utaz

sav wrote: ↑
Tue 26 Jan 2021 12:50 PM
If the area is for testing: why do minstrel only have yellow pets, which does not represent the reality? Make it orange, red or what ever based on the skill in instruments to see real world performance.

Well since the minstrels got their fundamental core ability removed, to break CC on pet when releasing it. The class is far from representing reality.

Tue 26 Jan 2021 1:54 PM by Sepplord

utaz wrote: ↑
Tue 26 Jan 2021 1:27 PM
sav wrote: ↑
Tue 26 Jan 2021 12:50 PM
If the area is for testing: why do minstrel only have yellow pets, which does not represent the reality? Make it orange, red or what ever based on the skill in instruments to see real world performance.

Well since the minstrels got their fundamental core ability removed, to break CC on pet when releasing it. The class is far from representing reality.

Difference between phoenix-balancetesting arena and phoenix-openRvR is more important than a difference to the live servers

Tue 26 Jan 2021 4:05 PM by keen

Good news, i like that idea.
I also agree to, the arena setting should reflect phoenix open rvr (+ balance changes that need to be tested). This includes pets and setups used in gvg list, e.g. speed 5 class within the setup.

Tue 26 Jan 2021 7:26 PM by Sagz

utaz wrote: ↑
Tue 26 Jan 2021 1:27 PM
sav wrote: ↑
Tue 26 Jan 2021 12:50 PM
If the area is for testing: why do minstrel only have yellow pets, which does not represent the reality? Make it orange, red or what ever based on the skill in instruments to see real world performance.

Well since the minstrels got their fundamental core ability removed, to break CC on pet when releasing it. The class is far from representing reality.

So Minstrels dont run red pets anymore? I dont think I understand your point here other than to cry about a much needed change. Red pets still interrupt MOC and unless I am wrong harder to kill than a yellow/orange pet haha. Thats like only giving mind sorcs yellow pets and say eh...good enough for testing.

Thu 28 Jan 2021 11:19 AM by MeatBicycle

With yellow pets in the arena the minstrel could even be balanced

Fri 5 Feb 2021 8:58 AM by iamsaitam

Thanks for the event, it had it's fun parts. Please consider adding some kind of on-the-fly ELO score to groups based on performance. The tendency should be for tough groups to fight each other, not steamroll the weakest links till they log out.

Sat 6 Feb 2021 1:21 AM by gotwqqd

Sucks when you go out 5+ times and done get any credit because you are slammed by premades

Can they fix the additional problem of auto group afk?
Try quitting 20 times and same guy holed up in a keep unreachable leeching from the other four players

Also how about in the safe zone if you don’t move for 1 min you are removed from group and auto group is turned off

Sat 6 Feb 2021 2:21 PM by ExcretusMaximus

Guys, this is the Arena feedback thread, as in the 8man event they hold every few days.

If you want to give feedback on the PvP event, it's the thread titled "A Level Playing Field - Feedback & Suggestions" in the Suggestions forum.

Fri 12 Feb 2021 10:43 AM by

gruenesschaf

This Monday, February 15, we'll run another Arena test with group cap 8. There will be 2 runs again:
EU prime time: 8pm cet to midnight cet
NA prime time: 8pm est to midnight est

Starting Event RR will be 7L0.

See here for more information on the event RR: https://forum.playphoenix.online/get-involved/planned-changes/28262-the-arena-faq-feedback?page=3#p155468

Changes from normal RvR:
- style snares that are not follow up styles will now have a 10 second duration + base weapon speed, values subject to change
- follow up style snares will now have a 13 second duration + 2x base weapon speed, values subject to change

Fri 12 Feb 2021 3:54 PM by Lerox

gruenesschaf wrote: ↑
Fri 12 Feb 2021 10:43 AM
This Monday, February 15, we'll run another Arena test with group cap 8. There will be 2 runs again:
EU prime time: 8pm cet to midnight cet
NA prime time: 8pm est to midnight est

Starting Event RR will be 7L0.

See here for more information on the event RR: https://forum.playphoenix.online/get-involved/planned-changes/28262-the-arena-faq-feedback?page=3#p155468

Changes from normal RvR:
- style snares that are not follow up styles will now have a 10 second duration + base weapon speed, values subject to change
- follow up style snares will now have a 13 second duration + 2x base weapon speed, values subject to change

Will the minstrel get higher pets for arena instead of yellow ones?

Fri 12 Feb 2021 4:57 PM by Nephamael

Changes from normal RvR:
- style snares that are not follow up styles will now have a 10 second duration + base weapon speed, values subject to change
- follow up style snares will now have a 13 second duration + 2x base weapon speed, values subject to change

Great change, looking forward to seeing it in frontier 8v8.

Ofc Midgard has a celerity advantage here, with the snare duration being based on weapon speed, not swing speed, but i guess that is intended.

Same for friars, wardens and svg (if speccing stylesnare) with selfhaste.

Fri 12 Feb 2021 5:04 PM by Nephamael

Would you consider discussing a change for the Necro for (or during) this Event?

The change i would like to propose to you and/or the council of yours to consider testing for/in this event:
Put in every 3 spec lines "Deathsight", "Painworking" and "Death Servant" at LVL46 (or 47 or 48 or w/e) a new spell.
An uninterruptible 3sec Pet Summon with a 5min/10min/15min/whateverbalanceisabitch timer.
To offset this easily exploitable weakness a bit.

I think what you suggest is far beyond reasonable.

I have been on the other side of necro hybrid and necro tanker groups and can't say they don't perform exceptionally well.

I think you have a point tho and suggest to make the standard pet casttime 10s instead to give the necro a chance to get back into the fight but keep it a reasonable challenge.

-Going with your way it would have to be a 5 min cooldown interruptable 5 or 6 sec pet recast, that does only deactivate the casttime reduction when sucessfully casting the pet or dying. -

Both ways have their advantage, but i personally favor the non cooldown option, as it might be 2 strong in zergfights.

Fri 12 Feb 2021 6:35 PM by DJ2000

It was for the testing period of the Arena only, and not meant to be part of regular RvR.
To make sure that an early-downed-necro would not be considered underperforming in the final assessment. Implications of this should be obvious.

Mon 15 Feb 2021 8:15 AM by Sepplord

Nephamael wrote:
Changes from normal RvR:
- style snares that are not follow up styles will now have a 10 second duration + base weapon speed, values subject to change
- follow up style snares will now have a 13 second duration + 2x base weapon speed, values subject to change

Great change, looking forward to seeing it in frontier 8v8.

Ofc Midgard has a celerity advantage here, with the snare duration being based on weapon speed, not swing speed, but i guess that is intended.

Same for friars, wardens and svg (if speccing stylesnare) with selfhaste.

Isn't it quite the opposite?
With midgard commonly having hammer snares, and not much else in the hammer line, being shafted the most?
Serious question, because looking at a few classes with snares that are commonly included in groupsetups already, to me it looks like this buffs the snares of some classes (bard, minstrel) while heavily nerfing hammer backsnare.

I mean, i get what you are saying is that when the new system equalizes the realms, then cele will be the only difference and giving an advantage to midgard...but that ignores that the current balance isn't based on all realms having equal snares and other realms having other advantages/downsides.

Fri 26 Feb 2021 5:16 PM by Nephamael

I mean, i get what you are saying is that when the new system equalizes the realms, then cele will be the only difference and giving an advantage to midgard...but that ignores that the current balance isn't based on all realms having equal snares and other realms having other advantages/downsides.

The new snare system is a huge nerf to all mainpeelclasses and yes, midgard has the celerity advantage in an elsewise fair snare game then.

Right now Midgard has the strongest snare ingame (1.5s swing speed 23s backsnare), followed by Albion with the 2 style thrust anytime 27s snare. The new celtic spear and lw sidesnares (with a 2h weapon) at 19s snare are closing the gap but are still far off if you compare the swing speeds at which the long Alb and Mid snares can be performed.
Not to speak of BM with his gimp snares at 1s short of half the duration of conquer and the hib endu problem on top of all.

The situation right now is Mid having a slight advantage over Alb with Hib far behind both, so if we don't want the new gimp snares for everyone we have to look at a significant snare buff for snow shower (cd backsnare) and increase the lw and celtic spear sidesnares to at least 23s to match conquer (2h vs 1h swing speeds imo equalize the "low" 85% hitchance of conquer)
Also the Blunt 2 style sidesnare would have to get a 27s duration.
And if we wanted to make Axe Sword and other off meta peels viable we would have to raise all of those to somewhere around the op snare duration we got now.

The result would be the extraordinary impact of long snares across all3 realms, imo generally overpowering peeltanks in comparison to other roles.

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I think the DEVs want a system that does not require to rework every single style - however if they want to rework every single snare in the game another way to get it balanced would be to tune down the op snares to reasonable durations and tune up the underpowered ones. The result would be about the same as following the new arena snare system and add a bit more duration to the snares.

For example:

-1 style anytime to 5s+weapon speed (example: 5s+5.9 pole = 10.9s)

-1 style positional snares to 12s+1x weapon speed (example: blade sidesnare: 12s+3.0 = 15s)

- Followup styles to 15s+2x weapon speed (example: thrust anytime 2 style snare: 15s+2x3.3 = 23.6s)

Sat 27 Feb 2021 5:03 AM by daytonchambers

This whole arena concept for a game designed for open world RvR is absolutely stupid.

The fact that classes are being mangled to accommodate arena play is doubly so.

Sun 28 Feb 2021 10:14 AM by

Uthred

This Monday, March 1st, we'll run another Arena test with group cap 8. There will be 2 runs again:
EU prime time: 8pm cet to midnight cet
NA prime time: 8pm est to midnight est

Starting Event RR will be 7L0.

Sun 28 Feb 2021 3:43 PM by Fordie02

Since you all keep trying to kill the solo game, but say you aren't, why don't you open up the arena for solo players to see how all these changes hurt the soloers. Let us farm RP's for hours like all the 8v8's are doing in the arena.

Tue 2 Mar 2021 4:10 AM by Nephamael

Since you all keep trying to kill the solo game, but say you aren't, why don't you open up the arena for solo players to see how all these changes hurt the soloers. Let us farm RP's for hours like all the 8v8's are doing in the arena.

That would hurt the 8v8 arena participation.

I suggest to host a wild 1v1 event instead now and then.