Gambling!

Started 2 Feb 2020
by gruenesschaf
in Planned Changes
Crafty Cows have heard about the huge amounts of wealth accumulated by the 3 realms and applied for casino licenses!

In the near future some gambling mechanics will be introduced, basic summary:
- new currency / token: Lucky Coin
- can purchase 1 Lucky Coin for 5g
- can trade 1 Task Completion Token for 1 Lucky Coin
- can trade 1 Lucky Coin for 4g

We will introduce a new command, /gambling, this will be the primary way to start / play for ingame currency. The alternative, using npc dialogs, would have the huge drawback of causing client side lag after many games and we would expect most people to not only play once but many times and therefore using a command is the less role play more practical solution.

There will be one npc in the relic towns to handle the new command /gambling, to start with we will have these sub commands:
Note that all commands that talk about rolls or /random will already execute the relevant roll or random unless otherwise noted. As for the technical side, the used rng implementation will be the standard .net core System.Random using a single instance server wide without fudging / streak avoidance or anything else.

1) /gambling deathroll <bet of coins>, e. g. /gambling deathroll 100 to bet 100 coins: The npc will do a /random <bet of coin>, you will do a /random <npc result>, the npc will do a /random <your result> etc. until one of you rolls a 1, the one rolling the 1 has lost, if you win you gain <bet of coins>.
/gambling deathroll will execute the correct /random while in a game. Note that the <bet of coin> will be subtracted when you start a round, if you win you will receive twice your bet, this is to avoid people exiting the game or just walking away when they think they will loose or to prevent people starting games over and over again until the npc starts off with a 1 aka instant win.
Full Example:
/gambling deathroll 100
NPC does /random 100 -> 72
/gambling deathroll: You do a /random 72 -> 23
NPC does /random 23 -> 2
/gambling deathroll: You do a /random 2 -> 2
NPC does /random 2 -> 1
You win 100 coins

2) /gambling differenceroll <bet of coin>, e. g. /gambling differenceroll 100 to bet 100 coins: You will do a /random <bet of coin>, the npc will do a /random <bet of coin> and you win/lose the difference. E.g. if you roll a 90 and the npc a 72 you gain 18 coins.

3) /gambling itemroll: similar to trifecta in terms of rewards but flattened to a simple 1 - 1000 instead of 3 questions spamming the dialog. 1 - 499 will give you nothing, 500 - 1000 will give you a price that will range from mugs or flowers over vanity pets to a new type of respec stone (see below for more details on the stone and pets).

Future plans include a daily and/or weekly lottery and probably also typical multiplayer card games.

Vanity pets:
The itemroll will include certain tradeable items that allow you to summon vanity pets, these are invulnerable, cannot be targeted and don't show their name and follow the player with speed 6. The pets will not be realm restricted and will include miniatures of iconic mobs of the 3 realms including the realm dragons. These vanity pets can be active in addition to normal pets.

New respec stone:
A 1000 for the itemroll will give you a new, tradeable respec stone that can be turned in at any trainer and grants 1 gender respec.

New vanity pets
14 new pets were added.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 3:29 PM by Enyore
Did you just give +50 dexterity to all support classes in the game?
Sun 2 Feb 2020 3:32 PM by Meandow
Enyore wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 3:29 PM
Did you just give +50 dexterity to all support classes in the game?

*sighs*
Sun 2 Feb 2020 3:33 PM by raghh
those respec stones are a joke right?
Sun 2 Feb 2020 3:34 PM by Zouz
Lmao imagine beating a sorc to mez as a Firbolg bard because you rolled a 1000 xD

Time to try 2H sav too <3

Shaman doesn't even currently have dex in his stats, so guess it's +45 for them.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 3:40 PM by Chaskha
I think it's nice.
The respec stone is cool but goes against the race maximizing things. Don't know what to think about it.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 3:42 PM by Medzz
This is absolute non sense
Sun 2 Feb 2020 3:56 PM by Stromaxe
next update no race anymore you can just put your point as you want and have a Lurikeen with 100 in strength !! LMFAO
Sun 2 Feb 2020 3:59 PM by jonl
Good change. Looking forward to gambling.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:02 PM by LikeaBoss
Once these stones start popping up - it will become a huge gold sink to remain competitive in competitive scenarios outside of zerg warfare. I can't see this ending up as being good for any but a small few who can afford to purchase these outright at the beginning and then so much so it becomes pre-requisite if you want to do anything but zerg before you're "ready" for RvR. Other stuff is fluff and nice, -1 for the respec stones.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:04 PM by shintacki
Every day we stray further from gods light.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:14 PM by Stimmed
Adding gambling...No issues gold sync away.

Adding gambling to have something randomly drop that effects some classes MUCH more then others. Not to mention specs within those classes is just outright stupid.

Gambling should not have any outcome on RvR it should be a plat sync and thats it.

How do we go from no real updates for ages and this is what we get something no one wanted or asks for. Yet tons of ppl complain about balance/coast guarding/stealth zergs/realm tasks and nothing is touched :/

Sad day.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:21 PM by Teki
gruenesschaf wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 3:04 PM
Crafty Cows have heard about the huge amounts of wealth accumulated by the 3 realms and applied for casino licenses!

In the near future some gambling mechanics will be introduced, basic summary:
- new currency / token: Lucky Coin
- can purchase 1 Lucky Coin for 5g
- can trade 1 Task Completion Token for 1 Lucky Coin
- can trade 1 Lucky Coin for 4g

We will introduce a new command, /gambling, this will be the primary way to start / play for ingame currency. The alternative, using npc dialogs, would have the huge drawback of causing client side lag after many games and we would expect most people to not only play once but many times and therefore using a command is the less role play more practical solution.

There will be one npc in the relic towns to handle the new command /gambling, to start with we will have these sub commands:
Note that all commands that talk about rolls or /random will already execute the relevant roll or random unless otherwise noted. As for the technical side, the used rng implementation will be the standard .net core System.Random using a single instance server wide without fudging / streak avoidance or anything else.

1) /gambling deathroll <bet of coins>, e. g. /gambling deathroll 100 to bet 100 coins: The npc will do a /random <bet of coin>, you will do a /random <npc result>, the npc will do a /random <your result> etc. until one of you rolls a 1, the one rolling the 1 has lost, if you win you gain <bet of coins>.
/gambling deathroll will execute the correct /random while in a game. Note that the <bet of coin> will be subtracted when you start a round, if you win you will receive twice your bet, this is to avoid people exiting the game or just walking away when they think they will loose or to prevent people starting games over and over again until the npc starts off with a 1 aka instant win.
Full Example:
/gambling deathroll 100
NPC does /random 100 -> 72
/gambling deathroll: You do a /random 72 -> 23
NPC does /random 23 -> 2
/gambling deathroll: You do a /random 2 -> 2
NPC does /random 2 -> 1
You win 100 coins

2) /gambling differenceroll <bet of coin>, e. g. /gambling differenceroll 100 to bet 100 coins: You will do a /random <bet of coin>, the npc will do a /random <bet of coin> and you win/lose the difference. E.g. if you roll a 90 and the npc a 72 you gain 18 coins.

3) /gambling itemroll: similar to trifecta in terms of rewards but flattened to a simple 1 - 1000 instead of 3 questions spamming the dialog. 1 - 499 will give you nothing, 500 - 1000 will give you a price that will range from mugs or flowers over vanity pets to a new type of respec stone (see below for more details on the stone and pets).

Future plans include a daily and/or weekly lottery and probably also typical multiplayer card games.

Vanity pets:
The itemroll will include certain tradeable items that allow you to summon vanity pets, these are invulnerable, cannot be targeted and don't show their name and follow the player with speed 6. The pets will not be realm restricted and will include miniatures of iconic mobs of the 3 realms including the realm dragons. These vanity pets can be active in addition to normal pets.

New respec stone:
A 1000 for the itemroll will give you a new, tradeable respec stone that can be turned in at any trainer and grants 1 stat weighting respec, using this respec allows you to change the primary, secondary and tertiary stat for your character via /respec statweight, e. g. /respec statweight dex con pie, this would make dex your primary stat, con your secondary and piety your tertiary. The default stat weights are highlighted in the character customize / create screen and based on your class. The primary stat grants 50, the secondary 23 and the tertiary 15 at level 50. Please note that due to technical reasons the character customize screen will still show the default stat weights.

The idea isnt bad coz u can specialize on certain classes Pretty well but it will Change the RvR just to hard , the pets are a nice Sidekick.... but gotta think twice bout that stat changes cause some would be just to unfair , anyways great work with that free shard , Peace
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:21 PM by Isavyr
I think it's a really bad idea, but has interesting consequences. While perhaps the consequences might justify the means, I think there are severe balance issues that will crop up. For example:

Pac healers are based on instants--this is their strength. They generate momentum through pushing and using instants on specific targets/clumps. Giving them access to caster speed while also having instants would elevate them greatly, and put them too strong in paper DAOC. TBD.

Breaking the game to accomplish a gold sink seems rather foolish, especially considering the economy doesn't seem particularly bad--new players can involve themselves in it, very easily. So what, exactly, is the hope of removing gold from the economy? Making gold more valuable for.. what reason?
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:28 PM by EclipseThing
Literally no one asked for this.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:35 PM by Seb
Sorry for having to put it this bluntly, but that stat stone is litereally the WORST idea anyone could have come up with.


a) It's gonna be mandatory for ALL supps

b) It totally breaks the game balance (caster like cast speed pacci anyone?)



PLEASE seriously reconsider introducing it.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:35 PM by Primal
Hate the stones idea.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:38 PM by Ashenspire
Guess that's one way to fix:

    Paladins getting Piety that does nothing for them.
    Friars getting Strength that does nothing for them.
    Bards getting Empathy that does nothing for them.

I'm sure there are others.

This opens up a whole bunch of interesting combos tho, with most races now being able to reach the quickness cap with 75 in their template and a potion tier buff.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:42 PM by PteranadonKing
What the...? Nobody asked for this. This isn't DAOC...
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:43 PM by Isavyr
EclipseThing wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:28 PM
Literally no one asked for this.

Without buy-in from experienced 8v8 players (the ones with a sense of balance, and play all 3 realms), why is this even a thing?? It really looks terrible on paper.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:47 PM by Zzang
My reactions to reading this:

Gambling, ok. There might be folks who enjoy this.
Rolls, fine fine, nothing too exciting.
Vanity pets.. How cute, not that I care too much.
Respec stone. Whaaaaaaaaa~?!

Seriously though, if you introduce these kinds of major gameplay changes, don't make it into a chance of winning the lottery. Either everyone or no one should get to choose the stats which your characters get from leveling.

I am not against the idea of choosing, just that it is a bit disappointing for those who either play several different characters and wants to respec or those who don't have the necessary means to get one.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:49 PM by Bicstor
Get rid of the respec stone and replace it with a LA Cleaver reskin
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:53 PM by gruenesschaf
Fine. A boring gender respec it is.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:56 PM by Drakonal
Yay balance is saved!
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:58 PM by Seb
How about RP transfer, name change etc?
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:59 PM by Hypno
Can we fix coastguarding first please and get people moving away from the endless Main keep ---> Bridge ---> Docks circling

Now I'll just have to watch the jackasses do it with vanity pets
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:02 PM by Toadster
Glad to hear we were able to catch this before it went live, as it was going to have a pretty extreme impact on the game.

That said, it did shed some light on how silly certain classes stat tiers are. There are probably a couple of changes that everyone would agree on to make certain classes more viable, but maybe that's too much of a rabbit hole to go down.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:08 PM by eclipse2k
Seriously not a great idea, will create an absolute two-class system for supports into those who can afford a stone / got super lucky and those who don't.

I honestly wouldn't take a healer/druid/cleric/bard into RvR that didn't have dex primary, because it would be kinda gimp. If you want to give supports the opportunity to have like 50 more dex, at least don't tie it to a gambling mechanic.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:12 PM by Frigzy
gruenesschaf wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:53 PM
Fine. A boring gender respec it is.

Wait. You guys were actually serious about it? :O

I'm not sure if you are at all aware, but pulling stuff like this poses a lethal threat to the server's health. If you continue to produce trends like this the server won't last another 2 years. And I'm probably being generous with the timeframe here.

Don't get me wrong, you're obviously free to do as you like of course, just like that other server, but you've got to keep in mind that you have to make a choice:

- a balanced, player-friendly server which aims to finetune the genuine DAoC experience
or
- your own circus playground

You're the boss, so it's your call, but don't be surprised when people get fed up being treated as clowns.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:28 PM by Enyore
gruenesschaf wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:53 PM
Fine. A boring gender respec it is.

Remember to have a gender neutral option... there are players from Sweden that might get offended if you don't.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:40 PM by Taniquetil
Glad you rolled the stat respec back. Thanks. Please think about solves to the mindless coastguarding issue next
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:43 PM by Strikejk
New respec stone:
A 1000 for the itemroll will give you a new, tradeable respec stone that can be turned in at any trainer and grants 1 stat weighting respec, using this respec allows you to change the primary, secondary and tertiary stat for your character via /respec statweight, e. g. /respec statweight dex con pie, this would make dex your primary stat, con your secondary and piety your tertiary. The default stat weights are highlighted in the character customize / create screen and based on your class. The primary stat grants 50, the secondary 23 and the tertiary 15 at level 50. Please note that due to technical reasons the character customize screen will still show the default stat weights.


Why did you remove that? I liked the idea.
I don't want quickness on my wizzard. Let me change it from Int/Dex/quick to Int/Dex/Con
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:44 PM by Strikejk
gruenesschaf wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:53 PM
Fine. A boring gender respec it is.
Boo.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:45 PM by Forlornhope
This is an absolutely terrible idea, and I for one will not be playing if this gets implemented.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:47 PM by Strikejk
Forlornhope wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:45 PM
This is an absolutely terrible idea, and I for one will not be playing if this gets implemented.

Yeah ofc, sucks if you play a class with already perfectly distributed stats and then other can get that too. I would be against that too if that was the case.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:48 PM by Strikejk
Paladin needs no Piety.
Reaver needs no Piety.
Wizard needs no Quickness.
Necromancer needs no Quickness.
Cabalist needs no Quickness.
Friar needs no Strength.
Sorc needs no Quickness.


I see why certain people are against better stat distributions.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:50 PM by Forlornhope
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:47 PM
Forlornhope wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:45 PM
This is an absolutely terrible idea, and I for one will not be playing if this gets implemented.

Yeah ofc, sucks if you play a class with already perfectly distributed stats and then other can get that too. I would be against that too if that was the case.

It's more the fact that there are so many other issues in this game, but they go and spend the time on a bunch of useless crap like gambling and vanity pets? The respec stones are stupid as well, and will break balance for sure. But, this is starting to move far away from what daoc is.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:53 PM by gruenesschaf
Forlornhope wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:50 PM
It's more the fact that there are so many other issues in this game, but they go and spend the time on a bunch of useless crap like gambling and vanity pets? The respec stones are stupid as well, and will break balance for sure. But, this is starting to move far away from what daoc is.

Yes gambling for item prices / vanity pets is super far from daoc.

https://camelotherald.fandom.com/wiki/Patch_Notes:_Version_1.82

Let The Games Begin! Â- A new gaming craze is sweeping the realms. Trifecta has finally arrived! A card game of chance with fabulous prizes awaits the adventurous. Dealers (named "Trifecta Dealer" have appeared in the capital cities (Classic, Shrouded Isles and Catacombs) as well as in the realm festivals. Try your luck today and see if you can get a Trifecta and win the big prizes! (Prizes are awarded randomly based on the number of matches made. Prizes and chances of winning are subject to change at any time. Celebrity voices were impersonated. Void where prohibited. Prohibited where void.) (You will love the prizes!) Â- The Rules of Trifecta: Trifecta is a game of chance where the player is shown three decks of cards and chooses one from each of the decks. The decks are then shuffled and a card at random is chosen from each deck. If the player's choice and the card drawn match, they have a match. Players earn a random prize based on the number of cards matched. There are three tiers of prizes based on one match, two matches, or matching all three; referred to as a Trifecta. Each tier awards a random prize from a pool for that tier. The value of the prizes for each tier is based on how hard it would be to achieve that tier. To play, a character need only buy a token from the dealer and give the token to the dealer when they are ready to start. (Dealers also offer the rules of the game and a list of possible prizes.)
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:57 PM by Forlornhope
gruenesschaf wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:53 PM
Forlornhope wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:50 PM
It's more the fact that there are so many other issues in this game, but they go and spend the time on a bunch of useless crap like gambling and vanity pets? The respec stones are stupid as well, and will break balance for sure. But, this is starting to move far away from what daoc is.

Yes gambling for item prices / vanity pets is super far from daoc.

https://camelotherald.fandom.com/wiki/Patch_Notes:_Version_1.82

Let The Games Begin! Â- A new gaming craze is sweeping the realms. Trifecta has finally arrived! A card game of chance with fabulous prizes awaits the adventurous. Dealers (named "Trifecta Dealer" have appeared in the capital cities (Classic, Shrouded Isles and Catacombs) as well as in the realm festivals. Try your luck today and see if you can get a Trifecta and win the big prizes! (Prizes are awarded randomly based on the number of matches made. Prizes and chances of winning are subject to change at any time. Celebrity voices were impersonated. Void where prohibited. Prohibited where void.) (You will love the prizes!) Â- The Rules of Trifecta: Trifecta is a game of chance where the player is shown three decks of cards and chooses one from each of the decks. The decks are then shuffled and a card at random is chosen from each deck. If the player's choice and the card drawn match, they have a match. Players earn a random prize based on the number of cards matched. There are three tiers of prizes based on one match, two matches, or matching all three; referred to as a Trifecta. Each tier awards a random prize from a pool for that tier. The value of the prizes for each tier is based on how hard it would be to achieve that tier. To play, a character need only buy a token from the dealer and give the token to the dealer when they are ready to start. (Dealers also offer the rules of the game and a list of possible prizes.)

Right people are lining up for trifecta! lol I played this game for about 15 years and I not only have never played I don't know anyone who even does. It's POINTLESS, I understand it's your server but literally no one asked for this crap.. There are other issues you could have spent your time on that players actually wanted. Like fixing the camping keeps issues.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:00 PM by Hawkaye
No Just NO no gambeling please don't implement this stupidity
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:01 PM by gruenesschaf
Forlornhope wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:57 PM
Right people are lining up for trifecta! lol I played this game for about 15 years and I not only have never played I don't know anyone who even does. It's POINTLESS, I understand it's your server but literally no one asked for this crap.. There are other issues you could have spent your time on that players actually wanted. Like fixing the camping keeps issues.

Like fixing the camping keeps issues. Sure let me just fix it real quick in a way that will not raise any more issues:

Let's make the mazes points of interests, now people will move there, that surely won't raise the issue of speed 5 when not having a speed class, ah nevermind let's fix that by introducing horses, great, now let's fix horses by adding speed warp oh now we must fix caster vs melees via charge and then charge via bodyguard. Amazing. Easy fix.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:03 PM by Forlornhope
gruenesschaf wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:01 PM
Forlornhope wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:57 PM
Right people are lining up for trifecta! lol I played this game for about 15 years and I not only have never played I don't know anyone who even does. It's POINTLESS, I understand it's your server but literally no one asked for this crap.. There are other issues you could have spent your time on that players actually wanted. Like fixing the camping keeps issues.

Like fixing the camping keeps issues. Sure let me just fix it real quick in a way that will not raise any more issues:

Let's make the mazes points of interests, now people will move there, that surely won't raise the issue of speed 5 when not having a speed class, ah nevermind let's fix that by introducing horses, great, now let's fix horses by adding speed warp oh now we must fix caster vs melees via charge and then charge via bodyguard. Amazing.

Obviously it's not going to be fixed over night, don't need the sarcastic little response from you. But the fact that you're putting time and effort into this rather than something actually constructive is disconcerting and I am likely not the only one who thinks so.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:06 PM by gruenesschaf
Forlornhope wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:03 PM
Obviously it's not going to be fixed over night, don't need the sarcastic little response from you. But the fact that you're putting time and effort into this rather than something actually constructive is disconcerting and I am likely not the only one who thinks so.

Then maybe post a solution in suggestions, have people point out why it's the worst idea ever and try again instead of being incredibly helpful in saying plx fix. If these kind of things were something that should be fixed and it were simple to fix we would fix it.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:11 PM by Forlornhope
gruenesschaf wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:06 PM
Forlornhope wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:03 PM
Obviously it's not going to be fixed over night, don't need the sarcastic little response from you. But the fact that you're putting time and effort into this rather than something actually constructive is disconcerting and I am likely not the only one who thinks so.

Then maybe post a solution in suggestions, have people point out why it's the worst idea ever and try again instead of being incredibly helpful in saying plx fix. If these kind of things were something that should be fixed and it were simple to fix we would fix it.

There's already a thread for it with some nice suggestions up. I was just giving it as an example of something that I personally think would be better for the health of the server. All I did was post my opinion of this planned change like this thread is for.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:11 PM by eclipse2k
TBH I don't see where the vitriol towards the devs comes from; they are right in having identified that a lot of stat spreads make no sense.
I just feel like having 50 dex more on certain support classes would be so impactful as to be mandatory, which would defeat the purpose of a gambling item, which IMHO should be at least somewhat optional. Once you're competing against players who have 50 more in an important stat than you, you NEED to get those 50 points. It's like introducing a mini-ToA, everyone playing a class with such a dumb spread will NEED the stone.
I'm not saying don't introduce the stone (even though a couple of Sorcs might not enjoy PacHeals and Bards with way more dex than before), but please don't tie it to gambling.

But also please stop insulting the devs, they're spending a lot of time on running a free server. And the loudest people also being the rudest people really makes the community look worse than it is.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:21 PM by Came
203/5000
We can maybe keep the lottery for pets, the idea is good.
As for the stats, let the aberrant classes / races be adjusted since you can do it, but without going through a rare stone.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:24 PM by Strikejk
gruenesschaf wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:06 PM
Then maybe post a solution in suggestions, have people point out why it's the worst idea ever and try again instead of being incredibly helpful in saying plx fix. If these kind of things were something that should be fixed and it were simple to fix we would fix it.

I believe giving people the option to remove useless stats on their class would make it easier to balance classes in the long run. For example that reaver has no con from levelups really hurt him when everyone got con to hp buff (cause he has so little con in comparison).

For example:
Why should a melee damage dealer like a savage get more HP from the Buff than the melee damage dealer reaver? What justifies that? Nothing. Both are melee, both are dps, but because of the way the con to hp buff worked it now gave the savage a bigger buff. Is that balance? Fuck no, not in the slightest.
So giving us the option to fix that with the respec stone would be good.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:26 PM by Quik
Forlornhope wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:03 PM
gruenesschaf wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:01 PM
Forlornhope wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:57 PM
Right people are lining up for trifecta! lol I played this game for about 15 years and I not only have never played I don't know anyone who even does. It's POINTLESS, I understand it's your server but literally no one asked for this crap.. There are other issues you could have spent your time on that players actually wanted. Like fixing the camping keeps issues.

Like fixing the camping keeps issues. Sure let me just fix it real quick in a way that will not raise any more issues:

Let's make the mazes points of interests, now people will move there, that surely won't raise the issue of speed 5 when not having a speed class, ah nevermind let's fix that by introducing horses, great, now let's fix horses by adding speed warp oh now we must fix caster vs melees via charge and then charge via bodyguard. Amazing.

Obviously it's not going to be fixed over night, don't need the sarcastic little response from you. But the fact that you're putting time and effort into this rather than something actually constructive is disconcerting and I am likely not the only one who thinks so.

Wait...so you post a thread saying the things they are doing are POINTLESS and you emphasize it and basically post a snotty post in general...then you get upset when he gets a little sarcastic?!?!?! Holy crap people, look at yourself before pointing out issues with others...dayum.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:27 PM by Meandow
I don't see the issue with gambling nor the vanity pets, arguing that the devs could've spent their time on something more useful is pretty retarded. I'm sure there are things that can be improved but there are not really any major bugs around, if anything what's left to do is adjustments and those are not easy.

The whole thing with the respec stone I feel like is that it's too much of a change, it would entirely disrupt the balance between the 3 realms, classes that are already part of the core would get even stronger (bard, warden, druid, healer and sham comes to mind). If anything I'd say allow the respec of the third stat, that would make it a lot more balanced, most classes would benefit but it wouldn't be that huge of an imbalance.

Gender respecs seems fine though.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:30 PM by Strikejk
Meandow wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:27 PM
The whole thing with the respec stone I feel like is that it's too much of a change, it would entirely disrupt the balance between the 3 realms,

You mean like the con to Hp buff TOTALLY CHANGED THE BALANCE and gave Midgard as massive buff in comparison?
Funny how that was okay. But this that actually fixes this issue is "so bad"
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:32 PM by Meandow
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:30 PM
Meandow wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:27 PM
The whole thing with the respec stone I feel like is that it's too much of a change, it would entirely disrupt the balance between the 3 realms,

You mean like the con to Hp buff TOTALLY CHANGED THE BALANCE and gave Midgard as massive buff in comparison?
Funny how that was okay. But this that actually fixes this issue is "so bad"

Hm? HP buff benefitted literally every class, this wouldn't, so what's your point?
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:45 PM by Strikejk
Meandow wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:32 PM
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:30 PM
Meandow wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:27 PM
The whole thing with the respec stone I feel like is that it's too much of a change, it would entirely disrupt the balance between the 3 realms,

You mean like the con to Hp buff TOTALLY CHANGED THE BALANCE and gave Midgard as massive buff in comparison?
Funny how that was okay. But this that actually fixes this issue is "so bad"

Hm? HP buff benefitted literally every class, this wouldn't, so what's your point?
From my math they gave everyone 30% more HP from con and 30% more starting HP.
This means classes with a higher base HP benefit more than classes with lower base HP. Midgard has the most classes with 900 base HP (highest value) so on average midgard has the highest amount of base HP that got buffed by 30%, so they got the most out of the 30% compared to all other realms.
Point2: Midgard also has on average the most con on their classes which got buffed by 30%. So they also got more out of the buff than the other 2 realms there too!
TLDR; Midgard got more HP than the other 2 realms from the buff on average. And that doesnt even touch the point that midgard is a primary melee realm and more HP does help melees in general.

Now if we could all change our stats to pir liking then we could at least fix point #2 - the amount of con we get from levelups. (Midgard would still have the highest base HP and thus the biggest buff from that).
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:58 PM by Sepplord
Meandow wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:27 PM
I'm sure there are things that can be improved but there are not really any major bugs around, if anything what's left to do is adjustments and those are not easy.

I agree that they can spend their time on what they want and it doesnt justify the rudeness some People habe Rewards the staff. But i can understand that this announcement gets a few upset reactions.

I don't want to argue which issues are the most important, but inflation definitely isn't heavily happening. The people hoarding riches apparently are doing jsut that. Hoarding it, and therefor it isn't causing inflation.
On the other hand (and sorry for beating a dead horse) there are still missing event rewards. I have accepted that they will just never come, but vanitypets sound like an easy throwout to everyone who was still missing something.

And as someone who has always tried to stay objective and look at only the pros, i really dont understand how an idea like the respect stone even makes it further than the drawing Board. It heavily screws over balance AND is locked behind gambling? Stuff like that does cast doubts into my usually positive attitude towards this servers developments
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:59 PM by Svekt
I see an April fools like post but it's not April fools
Please tell me this was a joke patch?
Sun 2 Feb 2020 7:03 PM by Forlornhope
Sepplord wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:58 PM
Meandow wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:27 PM
I'm sure there are things that can be improved but there are not really any major bugs around, if anything what's left to do is adjustments and those are not easy.

I agree that they can spend their time on what they want and it doesnt justify the rudeness some People habe Rewards the staff. But i can understand that this announcement gets a few upset reactions.

I don't want to argue which issues are the most important, but inflation definitely isn't heavily happening. The people hoarding riches apparently are doing jsut that. Hoarding it, and therefor it isn't causing inflation.
On the other hand (and sorry for beating a dead horse) there are still missing event rewards. I have accepted that they will just never come, but vanitypets sound like an easy throwout to everyone who was still missing something.

And as someone who has always tried to stay objective and look at only the pros, i really dont understand how an idea like the respect stone even makes it further than the drawing Board. It heavily screws over balance AND is locked behind gambling? Stuff like that does cast doubts into my usually positive attitude towards this servers developments

To b fair they scraped the original respec points thing. It's now just a gender respec.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 7:17 PM by gruenesschaf
Sepplord wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:58 PM
And as someone who has always tried to stay objective and look at only the pros, i really dont understand how an idea like the respect stone even makes it further than the drawing Board. It heavily screws over balance AND is locked behind gambling? Stuff like that does cast doubts into my usually positive attitude towards this servers developments

While the respec is now a gender respec it was never locked behind gambling, at least not to the point that everyone who wants one now has to gamble for it. It's a 1:1000 chance and there are many other things people will likely want -> lots of people would likely use it. The chance then means for every 5p spent on this, server wide, on average one of these respecs would have popped into existence and since they are tradable it would have become available via the housing zone for about ~20p to start with and would probably have gone down to about 7p - 12p over the course of about a week.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 7:23 PM by Strikejk
gruenesschaf wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 7:17 PM
Sepplord wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:58 PM
And as someone who has always tried to stay objective and look at only the pros, i really dont understand how an idea like the respect stone even makes it further than the drawing Board. It heavily screws over balance AND is locked behind gambling? Stuff like that does cast doubts into my usually positive attitude towards this servers developments

While the respec is now a gender respec it was never locked behind gambling, at least not to the point that everyone who wants one now has to gamble for it. It's a 1:1000 chance and there are many other things people will likely want -> lots of people would likely use it. The chance then means for every 5p spent on this, server wide, on average one of these respecs would have popped into existence and since they are tradable it would have become available via the housing zone for about ~20p to start with and would probably have gone down to about 7p - 12p over the course of about a week.
So now that we dont get the stat respec stone, can we expect a fix to the HP buff? I want a flat amount depending on class.
For example
Caster: +100hp
Melee: +200hp
Tank: +300hp

That would be much more fair (numbers are example) This Con to HP modifier thing is absolutely unbalanced. Also CL not only buffed HP but also the Manapool. Nobody wants Caster to instant nuke ppl down (reason of the hp buff) but now caster run into the problem of not having enough mana because you only did the HP buff part of CL but not the mana pool buff of CL.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 7:41 PM by Sepplord
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:45 PM
Meandow wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:32 PM
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:30 PM
You mean like the con to Hp buff TOTALLY CHANGED THE BALANCE and gave Midgard as massive buff in comparison?
Funny how that was okay. But this that actually fixes this issue is "so bad"

Hm? HP buff benefitted literally every class, this wouldn't, so what's your point?
From my math they gave everyone 30% more HP from con and 30% more starting HP.
This means classes with a higher base HP benefit more than classes with lower base HP. Midgard has the most classes with 900 base HP (highest value) so on average midgard has the highest amount of base HP that got buffed by 30%, so they got the most out of the 30% compared to all other realms.
Point2: Midgard also has on average the most con on their classes which got buffed by 30%. So they also got more out of the buff than the other 2 realms there too!
TLDR; Midgard got more HP than the other 2 realms from the buff on average. And that doesnt even touch the point that midgard is a primary melee realm and more HP does help melees in general.

Now if we could all change our stats to pir liking then we could at least fix point #2 - the amount of con we get from levelups. (Midgard would still have the highest base HP and thus the biggest buff from that).

If you believe the initial respeccstone would have helped midgard less than other realms you havent thought that to the end. Just start at healers to get a quick grasp of what could have been with the initial respecc
Sun 2 Feb 2020 8:03 PM by Aminita
Would much rather have you all address the targeting issues at towers, reduce the timers on GTAOE , make a fix so that i dont lose all the player and npc names 2-3 times a day .. I feel that the gambling is strictly FLUFF, and does not add to the game itself.
Aminita
Sun 2 Feb 2020 8:38 PM by Isavyr
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:48 PM
Paladin needs no Piety.
Reaver needs no Piety.
Wizard needs no Quickness.
Necromancer needs no Quickness.
Cabalist needs no Quickness.
Friar needs no Strength.
Sorc needs no Quickness.


I see why certain people are against better stat distributions.

I'd be 100% for fixing these types of imbalances. What I'm not for is radically changing classes to become different roles (ie: healers gain caster speed while wearing chain)
Sun 2 Feb 2020 8:40 PM by Taniquetil
gruenesschaf wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:01 PM
Like fixing the camping keeps issues. Sure let me just fix it real quick in a way that will not raise any more issues:

I have a suite of options on the coastguarding thread in suggestions. EV capture the flag, malus's to farming smaller groups or maluses to rp's when just camping your own keep/area would help for starts. but also opening up a discussion or a vote might work too for a range of suggestions?

I get that its not easy but definitely one worth focussing on instead of vanity items imo. Sorry people have been rude to you guys about it too, that's pretty unfair as well.

Have a think about some of the options and maybe put it to a vote?
Sun 2 Feb 2020 8:57 PM by Isavyr
gruenesschaf wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 6:06 PM
Then maybe post a solution in suggestions, have people point out why it's the worst idea ever and try again instead of being incredibly helpful in saying plx fix. If these kind of things were something that should be fixed and it were simple to fix we would fix it.

There are threads with decent ideas in Suggestions that have zero feedback from staff--this is normal, and it's problematic. For example, take the idea of all players being told how much damage their ram is doing against a keep door. It's simple to code, it's nice to the users, and doesn't have any balance issues. How do we know our more detailed requests aren't falling on deaf ears, when even the simplest ideas aren't going through any public recognition process?

Furthermore, staff have a significant ability to direct the player's suggestions, and I don't see this being used. An example of it being used is, "Staff is interested in addressing coastguarding, and making action for all types of RvR without adverse effects. Please post your detailed suggestions on how you would do this. We are interested in taking the best ideas and improving the server's RvR ecology". Without these directions, people find discussion pointless, or at best moot.

As always, thank you for your time Gruenes. You're one of the strong engines behind Phoenix and I appreciate your work and intentions, even when I disagree.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:37 PM by Strikejk
Sepplord wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 7:41 PM
If you believe the initial respeccstone would have helped midgard less than other realms you havent thought that to the end. Just start at healers to get a quick grasp of what could have been with the initial respecc
Even if it would help midgard at the end (doubt that) I would still want that respec stone. I'm annoyed to have useless stats on classes. I also believe that it is easier to balance classes once they all get their proper full potential unlocked. Otherwise you have to balance classes with full potential vs classes without cause they have a bad stat distribution.
Basically that stone gives every class its full potential so it evens them out in that regard. Then after everyone starts on the same full potential level you can then start to tweak balance if necessary. At least that is how I see it.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:47 PM by Strikejk
Isavyr wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 8:38 PM
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:48 PM
Paladin needs no Piety.
Reaver needs no Piety.
Wizard needs no Quickness.
Necromancer needs no Quickness.
Cabalist needs no Quickness.
Friar needs no Strength.
Sorc needs no Quickness.


I see why certain people are against better stat distributions.

I'd be 100% for fixing these types of imbalances. What I'm not for is radically changing classes to become different roles (ie: healers gain caster speed while wearing chain)
Fair point, I see your issue. But I do believe it would cause more good than harm in that regard because everyone can use the stats best suited for them. If I take your example as example: When healers go for more dex (as primary stat), to cast quicker, they have to trade that off for less mana or less con so they lose something for that. And so can the casters. Ofc the casters who already have dex as their primary couldnt but they can go for more con instead (instead of quick for example) and that evens it out imo

Ofc it will change the balance and its hard to tell how the outcome is, but currently the balance honestly isnt good. So a change to balance is welcome. If its good or bad at the end we will see, but I know one thing for certain; letting the balance like it is now is definitely bad.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:49 PM by Sepplord
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:37 PM
Sepplord wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 7:41 PM
If you believe the initial respeccstone would have helped midgard less than other realms you havent thought that to the end. Just start at healers to get a quick grasp of what could have been with the initial respecc
Even if it would help midgard at the end (doubt that) I would still want that respec stone. I'm annoyed to have useless stats on classes. I also believe that it is easier to balance classes once they all get their proper full potential unlocked. Otherwise you have to balance classes with full potential vs classes without cause they have a bad stat distribution.
Basically that stone gives every class its full potential so it evens them out in that regard. Then after everyone starts on the same full potential level you can then start to tweak balance if necessary. At least that is how I see it.

Yes, if this was the alpha/bet a stage of an upcoming MMO i would definately agree. But since it is a privately managed revival Project i dont think investing work into fixing stat-per-level gains and adjusting starting stats so the same happens in the end. If you dont change the classbalance then it ends up being a cosmetic change of a hidden feature somewhere in the Charakter statscreen.

Regarding full potential of classes, all classes are at their full stat potential. Actually the Statweight-respecc would create different powerlevels between naked lvl50s of the same class. Currently classes get worthless stats but since there is no way to get usefull stats instead they are still at their full potential.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:55 PM by Sepplord
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:47 PM
Isavyr wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 8:38 PM
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 5:48 PM
Paladin needs no Piety.
Reaver needs no Piety.
Wizard needs no Quickness.
Necromancer needs no Quickness.
Cabalist needs no Quickness.
Friar needs no Strength.
Sorc needs no Quickness.


I see why certain people are against better stat distributions.

I'd be 100% for fixing these types of imbalances. What I'm not for is radically changing classes to become different roles (ie: healers gain caster speed while wearing chain)
Fair point, I see your issue. But I do believe it would cause more good than harm in that regard because everyone can use the stats best suited for them. If I take your example as example: When healers go for more dex (as primary stat), to cast quicker, they have to trade that off for less mana or less con so they lose something for that. And so can the casters. Ofc the casters who already have dex as their primary couldnt but they can go for more con instead (instead of quick for example) and that evens it out imo

Ofc it will change the balance and its hard to tell how the outcome is, but currently the balance honestly isnt good. So a change to balance is welcome. If its good or bad at the end we will see, but I know one thing for certain; letting the balance like it is now is definitely bad.

Come on...starting Stats already have such a huge impact that People completely levelled new Chars to get out of gimpstats of 5-10points. Every castingclass goes 15dex because castspeed>>>>all in rvr.
Are you really telling me a healer will actually think about switching to dex because he loses strength?

And no, even if balance really was bad (which i disagree on), doesnt mean any change is a good one worth testing
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:15 PM by Strikejk
Sepplord wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:55 PM
Are you really telling me a healer will actually think about switching to dex because he loses strength?

And no, even if balance really was bad (which i disagree on), doesnt mean any change is a good one worth testing

No? I never said a healer will think about switching from strength to dex. Please dont try to make me defend points I never made, that is a shady way of discussion and you know that.

Yes I do believe the balance isn't very good atm.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:20 PM by Strikejk
Sepplord wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:49 PM
Yes, if this was the alpha/bet a stage of an upcoming MMO i would definately agree. But since it is a privately managed revival Project i dont think investing work into fixing stat-per-level gains and adjusting starting stats so the same happens in the end. If you dont change the classbalance then it ends up being a cosmetic change of a hidden feature somewhere in the Charakter statscreen.

I disagree. Your point is basically to not change it because it is already done the way it is and that way is the correct way.
And that is exactly what I do not believe. The way it was made original is not 100% perfect. Furthermore the way the balance is now on this server is also far from perfect. So if everything isn't perfect, in my opinion, why should I not want something that seemingly improves the current situation? Why would I want to leave something "as it is" just because thats how it has been in the past, thats nuts. Only because it has been this way doesnt automatically mean it couldnt be improved.
If we all followed that logic we shouldn't invent anything because we dont live in ancient times anymore so we are out of humanity beta and better not change anything now and leave everything at it is!
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:22 PM by Sepplord
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:15 PM
Sepplord wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:55 PM
Are you really telling me a healer will actually think about switching to dex because he loses strength?

And no, even if balance really was bad (which i disagree on), doesnt mean any change is a good one worth testing

No? I never said a healer will think about switching from strength to dex. Please dont try to make me defend points I never made, that is a shady way of discussion and you know that.

Yes I do believe the balance isn't very good atm.

You literally said that going for dex in healers has a downside that they have to consider. I said that the downside is irrelevant and pointed out that on top of dex being the no-brainer most important stat for healers, that they currently even again Str, which doesnt give Mana or HP as in your example. (we all know that all healers would go for max-dex but in theory they could get a dexgain without sacrificing any Mana or Health at all)
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:25 PM by jcambros
The stat growths might not make much sense, but you have to realize that the classes were balanced around those specific stats, and the caps they could reach.
Changing them will have drastic impacts on balance, which will cause more whack-a-mole types of fixes to fix those new issues.

People play DAOC to relive what DAOC was in 2003.
Id prefer any change that makes the game work more like it did back then rather than breaking something that will have unforeseen consequences.

Sidenote: Primary Stats should only give +45 to a stat, not +50.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:25 PM by Strikejk
I honestly wonder why people in here define the word "change" automatically with the word "bad". Change isn't inherently bad. It never has been and it never will be. Our entire life is based on constant changes, developing, improving. Heck humans wouldn't exist.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:26 PM by Strikejk
jcambros wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:25 PM
The stat growths might not make much sense, but you have to realize that the classes were balanced around those specific stats, and the caps they could reach.
Changing them will have drastic impacts on balance, which will cause more whack-a-mole types of fixes to try and balance more.

People play DAOC to relive what DAOC was in 2003.
Id prefer any change that makes the game work more like it did back then rather than breaking something that will have unforeseen consequences.

Sidenote: Primary Stats should only give +45 to a stat, not +50.

Yes it was balanced around that, but this server is far away from original balance there is literally no point to bring original balance into the discussion. We dont have it so it doesnt matter to this server anymore.

You want to protect a balance that doesnt even exist anymore. Its like discussing about protecting a tree cause it could hurt the forest if you get rid of it, while you stand infront of a giant industry complex and the entire forest is GONE for years.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:28 PM by Sepplord
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:20 PM
Sepplord wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:49 PM
Yes, if this was the alpha/bet a stage of an upcoming MMO i would definately agree. But since it is a privately managed revival Project i dont think investing work into fixing stat-per-level gains and adjusting starting stats so the same happens in the end. If you dont change the classbalance then it ends up being a cosmetic change of a hidden feature somewhere in the Charakter statscreen.

I disagree. Your point is basically to not change it because it is already done the way it is and that way is the correct way.
And that is exactly what I do not believe. The way it was made original is not 100% perfect. Furthermore the way the balance is now on this server is also far from perfect. So if everything isn't perfect, in my opinion, why should I not want something that seemingly improves the current situation? Why would I want to leave something "as it is" just because thats how it has been in the past, thats nuts. Only because it has been this way doesnt automatically mean it couldnt be improved.
If we all followed that logic we shouldn't invent anything because we dont live in ancient times anymore so we are out of humanity beta and better not change anything now and leave everything at it is!

Where did i was it is the correct way? I said it doesnt make sense to change the per-level-stats just to then apply other changes to öffnet the new stats so the balanced isnt screwed.

And according to your logic, increasing the dex of (for example) midgard healers is a good balancing change? You believe it would increase class- or realm-balance to buff healers?
According to that vague reasoning why not give necros more lifeleech, and increase monströs pet-dmg. I have read those classes are imbalanced, so any change should be a good one if i believe you... ops:


PS: I never said any change is bad. I am just opposing the stance off every change is good
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:30 PM by Sepplord
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:26 PM
jcambros wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:25 PM
The stat growths might not make much sense, but you have to realize that the classes were balanced around those specific stats, and the caps they could reach.
Changing them will have drastic impacts on balance, which will cause more whack-a-mole types of fixes to try and balance more.

People play DAOC to relive what DAOC was in 2003.
Id prefer any change that makes the game work more like it did back then rather than breaking something that will have unforeseen consequences.

Sidenote: Primary Stats should only give +45 to a stat, not +50.

Yes it was balanced around that, but this server is far away from original balance there is literally no point to bring original balance into the discussion. We dont have it so it doesnt matter to this server anymore.

Uhhh...Every balance change on this server was also done with the current Stats in mind.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:30 PM by Strikejk
Sepplord wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:30 PM
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:26 PM
jcambros wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:25 PM
The stat growths might not make much sense, but you have to realize that the classes were balanced around those specific stats, and the caps they could reach.
Changing them will have drastic impacts on balance, which will cause more whack-a-mole types of fixes to try and balance more.

People play DAOC to relive what DAOC was in 2003.
Id prefer any change that makes the game work more like it did back then rather than breaking something that will have unforeseen consequences.

Sidenote: Primary Stats should only give +45 to a stat, not +50.

Yes it was balanced around that, but this server is far away from original balance there is literally no point to bring original balance into the discussion. We dont have it so it doesnt matter to this server anymore.

Uhhh...Every balance change on this server was also done with the current Stats in mind.

As is this change.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:36 PM by Strikejk
Sepplord wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:28 PM
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:20 PM
Sepplord wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 9:49 PM
Yes, if this was the alpha/bet a stage of an upcoming MMO i would definately agree. But since it is a privately managed revival Project i dont think investing work into fixing stat-per-level gains and adjusting starting stats so the same happens in the end. If you dont change the classbalance then it ends up being a cosmetic change of a hidden feature somewhere in the Charakter statscreen.

I disagree. Your point is basically to not change it because it is already done the way it is and that way is the correct way.
And that is exactly what I do not believe. The way it was made original is not 100% perfect. Furthermore the way the balance is now on this server is also far from perfect. So if everything isn't perfect, in my opinion, why should I not want something that seemingly improves the current situation? Why would I want to leave something "as it is" just because thats how it has been in the past, thats nuts. Only because it has been this way doesnt automatically mean it couldnt be improved.
If we all followed that logic we shouldn't invent anything because we dont live in ancient times anymore so we are out of humanity beta and better not change anything now and leave everything at it is!

Where did i was it is the correct way? I said it doesnt make sense to change the per-level-stats just to then apply other changes to öffnet the new stats so the balanced isnt screwed.

And according to your logic, increasing the dex of (for example) midgard healers is a good balancing change? You believe it would increase class- or realm-balance to buff healers?
According to that vague reasoning why not give necros more lifeleech, and increase monströs pet-dmg. I have read those classes are imbalanced, so any change should be a good one if i believe you... ops:

PS: I never said any change is bad. I am just opposing the stance off every change is good
Necros have lifeleech. And I never said what you claimed I said or what my logic was. I also see no point in discussing this any further as everything I wanted to say is already said. You can either understand it, or not. You can agree to it, or not. Your choice.

It just surprised me that apparently lots of people think the balance and the overall state of the game is just perfect now and does not need a change.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:42 PM by Sepplord
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:36 PM
Sepplord wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:28 PM
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:20 PM
I disagree. Your point is basically to not change it because it is already done the way it is and that way is the correct way.
And that is exactly what I do not believe. The way it was made original is not 100% perfect. Furthermore the way the balance is now on this server is also far from perfect. So if everything isn't perfect, in my opinion, why should I not want something that seemingly improves the current situation? Why would I want to leave something "as it is" just because thats how it has been in the past, thats nuts. Only because it has been this way doesnt automatically mean it couldnt be improved.
If we all followed that logic we shouldn't invent anything because we dont live in ancient times anymore so we are out of humanity beta and better not change anything now and leave everything at it is!

Where did i was it is the correct way? I said it doesnt make sense to change the per-level-stats just to then apply other changes to öffnet the new stats so the balanced isnt screwed.

And according to your logic, increasing the dex of (for example) midgard healers is a good balancing change? You believe it would increase class- or realm-balance to buff healers?
According to that vague reasoning why not give necros more lifeleech, and increase monströs pet-dmg. I have read those classes are imbalanced, so any change should be a good one if i believe you... ops:

PS: I never said any change is bad. I am just opposing the stance off every change is good
Necros have lifeleech. And I never said what you claimed I said or what my logic was. I also see no point in discussing this any further as everything I wanted to say is already said. You can either understand it, or not. You can agree to it, or not. Your choice.

No need to say it again, that answers first half already showed that you dont properly read anyways, so it wasnt even a discussion to begin with.

Have a Good Night
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:46 PM by l00ri
Maybe we should start with fixing smaller bugs that were reported like one year ago instead of something like this. ;-)
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:47 PM by Strikejk
Sepplord wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:42 PM
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:36 PM
Sepplord wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:28 PM
Where did i was it is the correct way? I said it doesnt make sense to change the per-level-stats just to then apply other changes to öffnet the new stats so the balanced isnt screwed.

And according to your logic, increasing the dex of (for example) midgard healers is a good balancing change? You believe it would increase class- or realm-balance to buff healers?
According to that vague reasoning why not give necros more lifeleech, and increase monströs pet-dmg. I have read those classes are imbalanced, so any change should be a good one if i believe you... ops:

PS: I never said any change is bad. I am just opposing the stance off every change is good
Necros have lifeleech. And I never said what you claimed I said or what my logic was. I also see no point in discussing this any further as everything I wanted to say is already said. You can either understand it, or not. You can agree to it, or not. Your choice.

No need to say it again, that answers first half already showed that you dont properly read anyways, so it wasnt even a discussion to begin with.

Have a Good Night
Its okay, Im a honest person and I know I missread a single word which was "more" about your necro lifeleech comment. But now that we are honest here, I realized with your first response that you do not want to have a proper discussion, that you do not want to understand my points and that you deliberatly give wrong examples seemingly based on my points, only to force me to correct that which is a very annoying and asshole like way to have a discussion. So I honestly stopped carying about your responses afterwards. Just as you didnt care about mine to begin with.
Have a good night
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:55 PM by The Skies Asunder
I was late to this party, clearly, but thought I would throw in my two cents: I was immediately excited to see that statweight stone, as a way to fix all the worthless quickness on casters, or a way to make some melee classes have better damage potential, but before I could even finish the thought all of the dexterity swapping for every support class crept into my mind, and I was entirely opposed to the idea. If this were a beta phase for Phoenix (Some people still think it is) then I would be on board for sure, to let us test how things went with that. There are so many worthless stats out there, on a lot of classes, but implementing this way doesn't seem like the right idea. Especially gating it behind gambling when we know full well every single person will need one, on almost every character they play.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 11:06 PM by Pao
The gambling is cool and it opens a new gold sink. Many atrictive things can be distributed like this.

The stone was a very bad idea. Way too strong.

Thanks for creating something new to make Phoenix something unique. The future of daoc.
Sun 2 Feb 2020 11:43 PM by Prometheus
It seems like the argument is the changes would only be good if this was beta, honestly, it should never be too late to make improvements, at least IMO.
Mon 3 Feb 2020 5:36 AM by Meandow
Strikejk wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:47 PM
*rant*

So correct me if I'm wrong, you want to see these changes go through to correct the imbalance that the HP change caused? Because Midgard benefited a lot more than the other realms did? Did you miss the part where this change would once again favour mid the most? Have fun playing vs healers with 370 dex.. As I said, this change would mainly buff support classes such as healers, shamans, bards, druids and wardens, they'd go from +0 to +45 dex which is huge, and on top of that it would be at no cost to valuable stats whereas for example a sorc could get a bit more dex but it'd be at the cost of int.

I get why people want to see some balance changes, especially to classes like friar, wizard, VW etc that's not being played that much but what I don't understand is how you can argue for giving this huge of a buff to classes that are already the core part of every group on mid and hib?
Mon 3 Feb 2020 7:21 AM by Keyoke
Am I missing something in the OP about the statweight respecs? or did they edit it out after negative feedback?
Mon 3 Feb 2020 8:56 AM by Tritri
Btw if people are looking for a money sink, I really need to get new weapons and procs and have no money, so feel free to pm me
Mon 3 Feb 2020 12:26 PM by Seb
gruenesschaf wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:53 PM
Fine. A boring gender respec it is.
Any chance of tying a name change to this?
Mon 3 Feb 2020 12:50 PM by Uthred
Seb wrote:
Mon 3 Feb 2020 12:26 PM
gruenesschaf wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 4:53 PM
Fine. A boring gender respec it is.
Any chance of tying a name change to this?

This is not possible. For several reason we only change names if they violate our rules.
Mon 3 Feb 2020 2:02 PM by Salidry
I am going against the stream but i think it would have been an excellent idea.

There was a tendency since the start of the server to buff tanks more and more to balance versus caster groups ( don't get me wrong, hp buffs etc are really good changes). But the more you buff tanks, the more it creates stereotyped fights. Also, if you buff tanks too much they will eventually be too OP in solo and smallman.

But with this idea supports will be buffed more than anything else. And for me balancing around supports is the way to go. Allowing pach, off droods, shamans and such to have more outplay potential is a great thing.

Also, these changes would have benefited a lot less played classes.

I would have gone more into detail if the discussion was still open.
Mon 3 Feb 2020 5:09 PM by Enyore
Salidry wrote:
Mon 3 Feb 2020 2:02 PM
I am going against the stream but i think it would have been an excellent idea.

There was a tendency since the start of the server to buff tanks more and more to balance versus caster groups ( don't get me wrong, hp buffs etc are really good changes). But the more you buff tanks, the more it creates stereotyped fights. Also, if you buff tanks too much they will eventually be too OP in solo and smallman.

But with this idea supports will be buffed more than anything else. And for me balancing around supports is the way to go. Allowing pach, off droods, shamans and such to have more outplay potential is a great thing.

Also, these changes would have benefited a lot less played classes.

I would have gone more into detail if the discussion was still open.

The way it is now works pretty well... Some might say this or that is OP, but let's be honest Phoenix is pretty well balanced between the realms - more balanced than live servers ever was at any point.

I agree playing support myself that the chance to redo stats like this and get +50 dex would be awesome, but I worry it will also change the meta for a bunch of other classes too and most likely end up shaking the foundations of the server.

The dreadful scenario i see by doing this is a year long process of re-balancing the server to adjust to these changes as it will have consequences that was not foreseen and as such a quickly ever changing meta.
Worst case scenario is a return to the FOTM years of DAoC, around the time of catacombs, where every month a new change and a new flavour of the month.

I think it would be bad for the server. It doesn't matter that wizards get quickness as a stat when leveling or that druids get Strength - it has always been so and as such the game has developed and been balanced around these facts.
Tue 4 Feb 2020 1:18 AM by Prometheus
I did like the idea of being able to customize your character to suit your playstyle, especially those that were trying to achieve that 250 quickness.
Tue 4 Feb 2020 4:20 AM by easytoremember
I'd give up secondary and tertiary stats for extra base resists tbh
Tue 4 Feb 2020 5:46 AM by Vkejai
Probably not the greatest idea since it's a real life problem for many people...
Tue 4 Feb 2020 8:35 AM by Sepplord
Prometheus wrote:
Tue 4 Feb 2020 1:18 AM
I did like the idea of being able to customize your character to suit your playstyle, especially those that were trying to achieve that 250 quickness.

that really sounds nice, but i can't see people making decisions according to their "playstyle". There are clear better stats for each class, and everyone would simply follow the best setup
Tue 4 Feb 2020 10:02 AM by watbrif
The Skies Asunder wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:55 PM
I was late to this party, clearly, but thought I would throw in my two cents: I was immediately excited to see that statweight stone, as a way to fix all the worthless quickness on casters, or a way to make some melee classes have better damage potential, but before I could even finish the thought all of the dexterity swapping for every support class crept into my mind, and I was entirely opposed to the idea. If this were a beta phase for Phoenix (Some people still think it is) then I would be on board for sure, to let us test how things went with that. There are so many worthless stats out there, on a lot of classes, but implementing this way doesn't seem like the right idea. Especially gating it behind gambling when we know full well every single person will need one, on almost every character they play.

If this is such a big problem, why not allow the respec EXCEPT on dex for certain classes?
Tue 4 Feb 2020 1:45 PM by Tyrlaan
watbrif wrote:
Tue 4 Feb 2020 10:02 AM
The Skies Asunder wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:55 PM
I was late to this party, clearly, but thought I would throw in my two cents: I was immediately excited to see that statweight stone, as a way to fix all the worthless quickness on casters, or a way to make some melee classes have better damage potential, but before I could even finish the thought all of the dexterity swapping for every support class crept into my mind, and I was entirely opposed to the idea. If this were a beta phase for Phoenix (Some people still think it is) then I would be on board for sure, to let us test how things went with that. There are so many worthless stats out there, on a lot of classes, but implementing this way doesn't seem like the right idea. Especially gating it behind gambling when we know full well every single person will need one, on almost every character they play.

If this is such a big problem, why not allow the respec EXCEPT on dex for certain classes?

While Dex on support (with Acu/Con/Str) is the most obvious, there´s plenty other classes where changing the rising stats is unbalancing (+30 Str on assassins, especially the strongest of them with low Str races; +22 Dex on all casters if they want to swap their Acu with Dex etc).

And once you start with exceptions to the rule because you deem some of these changes way too powerful, you might as well scrap the idea and just fix the obvious stuff which got ignored 20 years, like Emp on Bards (make it Str like on all the other support) and Qui on casters (make it Con, even Mythic thought it was a stupid idea too and changed it on most of their expansion classes, Animists, Warlocks and Bainshees came with an Acu/Dex+Con distribution).
Tue 4 Feb 2020 2:29 PM by Sepplord
watbrif wrote:
Tue 4 Feb 2020 10:02 AM
The Skies Asunder wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:55 PM
I was late to this party, clearly, but thought I would throw in my two cents: I was immediately excited to see that statweight stone, as a way to fix all the worthless quickness on casters, or a way to make some melee classes have better damage potential, but before I could even finish the thought all of the dexterity swapping for every support class crept into my mind, and I was entirely opposed to the idea. If this were a beta phase for Phoenix (Some people still think it is) then I would be on board for sure, to let us test how things went with that. There are so many worthless stats out there, on a lot of classes, but implementing this way doesn't seem like the right idea. Especially gating it behind gambling when we know full well every single person will need one, on almost every character they play.

If this is such a big problem, why not allow the respec EXCEPT on dex for certain classes?

... the argument is the same for other classes too, dex on healers is just the biggest one that makes it clear to most people (sadly not all, but you always lose a few). If you go down that road, why not just buff the classes that seem to need it and leave the ones that are fine alone? Seems like a much more reasonable approach compared to implementing a gamble-reward that allows respeccs, but only for certain classes and stats etc...
And i am not even talking about how the forum would be flooded with post that: class X needs to be restricted for Y and the restriction of A on class B is too harsh etc... Why open a complicated pandorras box just so you can point and say: look we fixed useless levelup stats, the OCD people can sleep better tonight
Tue 4 Feb 2020 4:08 PM by Roto23
What am i missing.... How does gambling give someone plus 50 dex? No where in Uth's post mentions this
Tue 4 Feb 2020 5:10 PM by Sepplord
Roto23 wrote:
Tue 4 Feb 2020 4:08 PM
What am i missing.... How does gambling give someone plus 50 dex? No where in Uth's post mentions this

initially the gender-respecc was meant to be a stone that lets you change the priority of stats gained per level up.
Because of the overly negative feedback regarding that, they quickly changed it to a quote "boring" respec.

The discussion that was sparked though is continuing to burn and also starting more fires in other threads about the topic now
Tue 4 Feb 2020 5:18 PM by Quik
Vkejai wrote:
Tue 4 Feb 2020 5:46 AM
Probably not the greatest idea since it's a real life problem for many people...

Not really fair to pick and choose addictive habits.

Gaming is JUST as addictive as gambling to many people so using your logic we should just remove DAoC to help with the addiction.

My lord how many people on this server would be going through withdrawals within hours!!
Wed 5 Feb 2020 12:32 AM by The Skies Asunder
Tyrlaan wrote:
Tue 4 Feb 2020 1:45 PM
watbrif wrote:
Tue 4 Feb 2020 10:02 AM
The Skies Asunder wrote:
Sun 2 Feb 2020 10:55 PM
I was late to this party, clearly, but thought I would throw in my two cents: I was immediately excited to see that statweight stone, as a way to fix all the worthless quickness on casters, or a way to make some melee classes have better damage potential, but before I could even finish the thought all of the dexterity swapping for every support class crept into my mind, and I was entirely opposed to the idea. If this were a beta phase for Phoenix (Some people still think it is) then I would be on board for sure, to let us test how things went with that. There are so many worthless stats out there, on a lot of classes, but implementing this way doesn't seem like the right idea. Especially gating it behind gambling when we know full well every single person will need one, on almost every character they play.

If this is such a big problem, why not allow the respec EXCEPT on dex for certain classes?

While Dex on support (with Acu/Con/Str) is the most obvious, there´s plenty other classes where changing the rising stats is unbalancing (+30 Str on assassins, especially the strongest of them with low Str races; +22 Dex on all casters if they want to swap their Acu with Dex etc).

And once you start with exceptions to the rule because you deem some of these changes way too powerful, you might as well scrap the idea and just fix the obvious stuff which got ignored 20 years, like Emp on Bards (make it Str like on all the other support) and Qui on casters (make it Con, even Mythic thought it was a stupid idea too and changed it on most of their expansion classes, Animists, Warlocks and Bainshees came with an Acu/Dex+Con distribution).

Pretty much exactly this. While I don't have an entirely negative outlook on allowing you to choose your characters primary, secondary, and tertiary rising stats, it just seems like a very poor way to implement them. The useless ones, like those mentioned previously such as quickness on casters, or empathy on bard could easily be changed to constitution, or strength to match other classes in at least having a stat with a small function for you. It's the +30 strength on assassins (Celt NS please), and the +45 dex on druid/cleric/healer is where the majority of people complaining would come from. If they simply allowed us to respec our rising stats for free or a low feather cost as a trial period for a couple weeks to see how it went, I think that would be a much better way to approach the subject. Gambling simply made the idea absolutely terrible, as opposed to just risky.
Wed 5 Feb 2020 7:26 PM by daytonchambers
Of all the QoL suggestions listed in the Suggestions forum.... you spend your limited development time adding gambling, which nobody wanted or needed.

It's as if you are intentionally pointing out that you do not care what your playerbase thinks. This is a bad sign.
Wed 5 Feb 2020 7:34 PM by chryso
daytonchambers wrote:
Wed 5 Feb 2020 7:26 PM
Of all the QoL suggestions listed in the Suggestions forum.... you spend your limited development time adding gambling, which nobody wanted or needed.

It's as if you are intentionally pointing out that you do not care what your playerbase thinks. This is a bad sign.

I completely disagree. I see it as they are trying to think outside of the box. While I may not be interested in gambling they are putting thought into the game. Coming up with fresh new ideas shows that they are trying.
Wed 5 Feb 2020 8:28 PM by Riac
chryso wrote:
Wed 5 Feb 2020 7:34 PM
daytonchambers wrote:
Wed 5 Feb 2020 7:26 PM
Of all the QoL suggestions listed in the Suggestions forum.... you spend your limited development time adding gambling, which nobody wanted or needed.

It's as if you are intentionally pointing out that you do not care what your playerbase thinks. This is a bad sign.

I completely disagree. I see it as they are trying to think outside of the box. While I may not be interested in gambling they are putting thought into the game. Coming up with fresh new ideas shows that they are trying.

considering the quality of these new/fresh ideas, id rather they just stop. no one is this game is a fan of extreme changes, that should be quite obvious by now. tbh they should just announce proposed changes before they even bother to put the man hours in at this point (idk maybe they do). theyve probably wasted a fair bit of man hours only for them to scrap the "outside of the box idea."
just go back and look at that monstrosity that was the proc idea. all these changes just seem like things that are gonna hurt the casual player anyways; which i dont really care about tbh. im rich, i can afford to retemp my sb in w/e the good shit is. just imagine the ppl who bitch about lvling getting to 50 only to realize they still need to farm an outrageous amount of plat to get the new stat stones and the crazy ass proc shit. youd never hear the end of it. then again, they never hear the end of it anyways. there is always some random idiot with a fresh new terrible idea they want to propose or the idiots advocating for impossibilities (like OF lol).
Thu 6 Feb 2020 6:17 AM by Cadebrennus
Riac wrote:
Wed 5 Feb 2020 8:28 PM
chryso wrote:
Wed 5 Feb 2020 7:34 PM
daytonchambers wrote:
Wed 5 Feb 2020 7:26 PM
Of all the QoL suggestions listed in the Suggestions forum.... you spend your limited development time adding gambling, which nobody wanted or needed.

It's as if you are intentionally pointing out that you do not care what your playerbase thinks. This is a bad sign.

I completely disagree. I see it as they are trying to think outside of the box. While I may not be interested in gambling they are putting thought into the game. Coming up with fresh new ideas shows that they are trying.

considering the quality of these new/fresh ideas, id rather they just stop. no one is this game is a fan of extreme changes, that should be quite obvious by now. tbh they should just announce proposed changes before they even bother to put the man hours in at this point (idk maybe they do). theyve probably wasted a fair bit of man hours only for them to scrap the "outside of the box idea."
just go back and look at that monstrosity that was the proc idea. all these changes just seem like things that are gonna hurt the casual player anyways; which i dont really care about tbh. im rich, i can afford to retemp my sb in w/e the good shit is. just imagine the ppl who bitch about lvling getting to 50 only to realize they still need to farm an outrageous amount of plat to get the new stat stones and the crazy ass proc shit. youd never hear the end of it. then again, they never hear the end of it anyways. there is always some random idiot with a fresh new terrible idea they want to propose or the idiots advocating for impossibilities (like OF lol).

This is pretty much what killed Live.
Thu 6 Feb 2020 7:07 AM by easytoremember
daytonchambers wrote:
Wed 5 Feb 2020 7:26 PM
Of all the QoL suggestions listed in the Suggestions forum.... you spend your limited development time adding gambling, which nobody wanted or needed.

It's as if you are intentionally pointing out that you do not care what your playerbase thinks. This is a bad sign.

Wasn't it you bitching about evil rich players having no gold sink?
Thu 6 Feb 2020 2:43 PM by Chihuahua
It's pretty much a cosmetic change, which doesn't change any incremental issues. Also, I do not see wealth to really be an issue anymore, as new players keep finding this server, people level and template alts and so on. I personally have dropped from ~300p to 5p.

And the primary stat respec stone was a joke.
Thu 6 Feb 2020 2:47 PM by Sepplord
Chihuahua wrote:
Thu 6 Feb 2020 2:43 PM
I personally have dropped from ~300p to 5p.

What did you drop so much money on?

constantly racerespeccing? or is there any other thing to burn huge amounts of money?
Thu 6 Feb 2020 4:20 PM by Roto23
Sepplord wrote:
Tue 4 Feb 2020 5:10 PM
Roto23 wrote:
Tue 4 Feb 2020 4:08 PM
What am i missing.... How does gambling give someone plus 50 dex? No where in Uth's post mentions this

initially the gender-respecc was meant to be a stone that lets you change the priority of stats gained per level up.
Because of the overly negative feedback regarding that, they quickly changed it to a quote "boring" respec.

The discussion that was sparked though is continuing to burn and also starting more fires in other threads about the topic now

ty
Thu 6 Feb 2020 7:54 PM by daytonchambers
easytoremember wrote:
Thu 6 Feb 2020 7:07 AM
Wasn't it you bitching about evil rich players having no gold sink?


Pretty sure that was not me, prove me wrong and post a link to where I said that please? If you are referring to the repair cost increases I was not a fan of that either.

And as far as gold sinks go there are plenty of things already asked for in the Suggestions section, like I said, that could easily be set up to take plat out of the economy.
Fri 7 Feb 2020 5:53 AM by Cadebrennus
daytonchambers wrote:
Thu 6 Feb 2020 7:54 PM
easytoremember wrote:
Thu 6 Feb 2020 7:07 AM
Wasn't it you bitching about evil rich players having no gold sink?


Pretty sure that was not me, prove me wrong and post a link to where I said that please? If you are referring to the repair cost increases I was not a fan of that either.

And as far as gold sinks go there are plenty of things already asked for in the Suggestions section, like I said, that could easily be set up to take plat out of the economy.

For one thing, allowing the cosmetic stuff to be purchased with feathers/BP/AND GOLD would be an excellent gold sink without affecting the economy
Fri 7 Feb 2020 7:14 AM by Chihuahua
Sepplord wrote:
Thu 6 Feb 2020 2:47 PM
Chihuahua wrote:
Thu 6 Feb 2020 2:43 PM
I personally have dropped from ~300p to 5p.

What did you drop so much money on?

constantly racerespeccing? or is there any other thing to burn huge amounts of money?

Weaponless VW temp ~100p
Reaver temp ~50p
Nightshade temp ~120p+ (12 weapons)
+ other cheaper templates, pots etc and nightshade running costs

The suggestion above about cosmetic changes to increase goldsink is a great idea - allow effects/reskins to be also bought for gold. For example 4-5p = 10K bp reskin/effect.
Sat 8 Feb 2020 4:29 AM by siylent1
bad idea!
Sat 29 Feb 2020 12:07 AM by yepyukon
I was not sure where to post this as most of the other topics are locked, but I was wondering if there could be a guild only porter for guild members who own the main keep? This would allow for great defense and give a reason to claim a keep over a tower. By making it guild only, it shouldn't really be overpowered for most keeps.
Thu 9 Apr 2020 7:59 AM by Centenario
Pet Ides:
Shredder/Boogey pet
Spider Pet
Rabbit Pet
FloorPlasm Pet
Centurion Pet

Gambling Ideas:
Have Soil/Midgard/Hibernia/Alb thingies become gambling currency.
Thu 25 Feb 2021 2:55 PM by Uthred
Bruno was very busy the last few days and was able to catch 14 new vanity pets for his gambling business.

As we are going to introduce the 3rd pve instance very soon (after the next Playing Field), we thought it would be nice for you to win some of your most favorite monsters and bosses from Darkspire and Halls of Helgardh. Besides them there are also some others monsters in the pool now. To even increase your excitement and the tension, we are not going to tell you (for now) which mobs made it into the pool. You have to find out for yourself.

We added some of the pets to the dragon & legion pool and the rest of the pets to the remaining pool for vanity pets. So the chance to win a vanity pet stays the same, but the chance to win a certain pet got a little lower.

Happy Gambling!

PS: I updated the first post.
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