NF vs OF vote - thoughts?

Started 21 Jun 2019
by vadox
in Ask the Team
1. I say it's rigged in some way. I had a feeling this server is going NF no matter of vote so now it will happen sooner because of so called 'vote'.
2. Majority of people I talked to during NA time prefer OF.
3. 65% said NF - total BS, hard to believe this number.
4. Good luck Phoenix, if you going NF - you are loosing a good chunk of population. However, the idea of introducing NF for a week was the dumbest ever so no surprise.

have fun.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:06 PM by Lasastard
People really need to step outside of their little bubble and accept that not everyone shares their opinion. I know, in times of the internet where it's easy to surround yourself with people with similar opinions, that can be hard to accept. Just because a vote didn't go your way doesn't mean it's rigged.

Actually, those number almost perfectly mirror the "unofficial" straw poll that went up during the NF test week (total votes were a bit lower tho). So very plausible, I'd say.

Personally, I think it's great, NF offers a lot more "options" and with the task system and the porter chains there are very "organic" ways to concentrate action in certain zones. There is no reason why people can't adapt to this new layout.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:07 PM by vadox
I take your opinion and I counter with "i'll check back in 6 months" and see how it goes, ok?
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:14 PM by Numatic
vadox wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 11:59 AM
1. I say it's rigged in some way. I had a feeling this server is going NF no matter of vote so now it will happen sooner because of so called 'vote'.
2. Majority of people I talked to during NA time prefer OF.
3. 65% said NF - total BS, hard to believe this number.
4. Good luck Phoenix, if you going NF - you are loosing a good chunk of population. However, the idea of introducing NF for a week was the dumbest ever so no surprise.

have fun.

1. Then you are saying the devs have no way to convince you otherwise because you would just make excuses for any transparency? You could just as easily be wrong about your assumption as you could be right. Cant lambaste based on opinion.

2. Ironically I saw way more people prefer NF over OF. Your perspective isnt the only one.

3. From what I've seen, it's no surprise. OF is...boring. NF may be no better, but it's new for alot of people. Many never played NF, and if they had even a slightly good experience over a week, it will make them more inclined to keep playing it.

4. Honestly dont see it happening. People may not like it but they will deal because there is no where else to go for your daoc fix.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:17 PM by Turano
Well let's wait what their consequence will be
I fear that if they change permanently to NF this server will be empty soon
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:21 PM by vadox
Just think logically for a minute - introducing NF for a week, w/out proper testing (beta was not NF)
1. Is 1 week enough for people to make a decision vs running OF for years?
2. Do you know all bugs and potential issues with brand new maps and other game dynamics that come with NF.
3. BETA on Phoenix lasted 6+ months? Beta had OF up not NF. I won't go further.

most of you NF fans want quick 'fix' to your boredom - you are not thinking of long term repercussions.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:22 PM by Lasastard
Well, with Unixgeek providing constant tracking of player numbers, any effect should become visible pretty soon. So far none of the changes we have seen has created any dramatic drop in player numbers. Basically, it's following almost the exact trajectory that Uthgard has seen in the same time frame. Lots of people super excited, server full to the brim and then a slow but steady decline. I'd be surprised if NF really creates a massive dent. Either you like the game and the community - and then you play regardless of the zone. Or you are being dogmatic about milegate-camping-or-bust and then yes, sure, I can see how that would be a problem. But I somehow doubt that we are really talking big numbers here.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:25 PM by LordK
Maybe Im a little bit naif but I don't find a real reason to quit because of NF, anyway If I was on devs pants, I will postpone the NF to september, because with normal summer time issues the population will decrease for sure and... Drama Inc.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:41 PM by Gambler
Did I miss anything ?
Everybody agreed when Phoenix started with the way it was , with CLASSIC !!!
And now u get bored after 6 months to play CLASSIC , then go back to LIVE and have fun
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:42 PM by Stoertebecker
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:17 PM
I fear that if they change permanently to NF this server will be empty soon

Because the so called mature ppl are acting like lil children, nothing more, nothing less.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:43 PM by Lasastard
Gambler wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:41 PM
Did I miss anything ?
Everybody agreed when Phoenix started with the way it was , with CLASSIC !!!
And now u get bored after 6 months to play CLASSIC , then go back to LIVE and have fun


Phoenix was never advertised that way. They said from the get-go that they were making a custom version of the game, inspired by a certain patch goal and building from there into the direction that feels natural/sensible. Apparently, almost 2/3 of the player base agree that NF is a sensible next step for Phoenix.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:44 PM by Caver89
“Russian hackers manipulated the vote, some1 at EU time postes it. And my 7 men guild voted for OF, this result cant be real“

people who dont like OF played on OF anways. people who dont like NF: “I hOpE tHe SeRvEr DiEs“

deal with it.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:44 PM by Anelyn77
So what is the point of this thread? You say it's rigged because the results are not what you expected / wanted?

My thoughts? That the votes reflect precisely how players from all 3 realms feel about OF vs NF, and as in any democracy, the winner is the one with most votes.

Can't wait \o/

/Bnotashamed pac healer + Aicha mentalist = <3
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:45 PM by chryso
I see a post by Gruen but I don't see any actual results.

If we do go to NF could we keep OF as xp zones?
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:46 PM by vadox
it's rigged because vote is based on 1 week of "nf testing". That's not how it should be done. Too late.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:46 PM by Numatic
vadox wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:21 PM
Just think logically for a minute - introducing NF for a week, w/out proper testing (beta was not NF)
1. Is 1 week enough for people to make a decision vs running OF for years?
2. Do you know all bugs and potential issues with brand new maps and other game dynamics that come with NF.
3. BETA on Phoenix lasted 6+ months? Beta had OF up not NF. I won't go further.

most of you NF fans want quick 'fix' to your boredom - you are not thinking of long term repercussions.

How long would be long enough? 2 weeks? A month? 2 months? What length of time do you think would be needed to satisfy? What they thought was long enough and what you thought may be different. Beta testing was 6 months because of the state the game was in when they started. It wasnt long into it that they put the server up for everyone. The only thing they did was get it stable enough to be playable. It still had a ton of bugs. Not just OF. By all regards, OF took very little time to bug fix compared to the rest of the game. Anything new will have bugs. What's the big deal? It will get fixed in time.

Noone said NF will always be. How do you know in 6 months they may vote again to go back to OF? I still dont understand the arguement on #3.

I never said I was a fan of NF. Both have pros and cons and honestly didnt matter to me. But the amount of vitriol over the decision is a bit excessive considering the players chose it.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:49 PM by keen
I think the result is luckily pretty clear. Noone says that they might have another vote in future if pop gets naturally lower and NF might be too big.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:51 PM by Turano
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:42 PM
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:17 PM
I fear that if they change permanently to NF this server will be empty soon

Because the so called mature ppl are acting like lil children, nothing more, nothing less.
personally I would never have started playing here if NF had been running from launch
NF was the main reason I eventually quited live years ago and I really don't see me suffering through the same crap again

That has nothing to do with immature behavior, give me (or anyone else that will leave the server) one reason to play a game I don't enjoy. Just one
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:52 PM by ExcretusMaximus
OF Voters: If OF doesn't win, I quit!

NF Voters: Meh, I'll play whatever, I just prefer NF.

Yeah, I'm totally sure it's rigged in favor of alienating the people who threaten to quit if they don't get their way.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:53 PM by Runental
Results fits perfectly to the strawpoll which was spreaded last week.
All those conspiracy idiots about wrong results just stfu!

https://www.strawpoll.me/18146883/r
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:58 PM by Sepplord
i wasn't expecting a 60/40 split
i was expecting something closer

we will have to wait and see what they make out of it, but there is one thing that's fact and probably most people with at least a little bit of common sense can agree on:

The opening post is nothing more than a whine and bar any logic

That said:
To take a completely hypothetical example, if you had an RR10 necro, deleted it and created an hib char and then vote, your vote would count as an alb necro.
This is hilarious (all in good spirit)
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:59 PM by Fugax
Good lord. The crying brings me back to the last US election when the Democrats didn't get there way, and are still crying to this day. The people of the realms have spoken! Deal with it, and lets kill some nerds together!
#Democracy
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:00 PM by labova
I see no reason to spread conspiracy theories. The result is more conclusive than I would have expected. Based on the result, it seems hard to exclude some form of NF. Now, I still think the idea of alternating between NF and OF has some merit.

It will be interesting to see what the devs choose.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:01 PM by Junkyarddawg
Fugax wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:59 PM
Good lord. The crying brings me back to the last US election when the Democrats didn't get there way, and are still crying to this day. The people of the realms have spoken! Deal with it, and lets kill some nerds together!
#Democracy
Amen!
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:02 PM by Sepplord
Fugax wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:59 PM
Good lord. The crying brings me back to the last US election when the Democrats didn't get there way, and are still crying to this day. The people of the realms have spoken! Deal with it, and lets kill some nerds together!
#Democracy

Are you proud as an american that you don't know the difference between their and there?
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:09 PM by Draygon
vadox wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 11:59 AM
1. I say it's rigged in some way. I had a feeling this server is going NF no matter of vote so now it will happen sooner because of so called 'vote'.
2. Majority of people I talked to during NA time prefer OF.
3. 65% said NF - total BS, hard to believe this number.
4. Good luck Phoenix, if you going NF - you are loosing a good chunk of population. However, the idea of introducing NF for a week was the dumbest ever so no surprise.

have fun.

Bye Felicia


In all seriousness though... those that say they are going to quit playing the best freeshard for DAoC just because they don't get their way need to grow up...and I thought we were all mostly adults here.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:10 PM by Roto23
So I wanted OF to win, so I'm bummed. I'll give NF a chance, but reserve the right to bail if I am not enjoying the game. You got 1 month NF
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:14 PM by Draygon
Gambler wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:41 PM
Did I miss anything ?
Everybody agreed when Phoenix started with the way it was , with CLASSIC !!!
And now u get bored after 6 months to play CLASSIC , then go back to LIVE and have fun

Server has never been classic...it launched with NF RAs...that's not classic.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:15 PM by Turano
Draygon wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:09 PM
In all seriousness though... those tasty say they ate going to quit playing the best freeshard for DAoC just because they don't get their way need to grow up...and I thought we were all mostly adults here.
To you as well. Please one reason to all the people that don't enjoy NF to stay. just one I'm still waiting
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:19 PM by Draygon
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:15 PM
Draygon wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:09 PM
In all seriousness though... those tasty say they ate going to quit playing the best freeshard for DAoC just because they don't get their way need to grow up...and I thought we were all mostly adults here.
To you as well. Please one reason to all the people that don't enjoy NF to stay. just one I'm still waiting

Where else are you going to play? You know how many changes that have been made that many dont agree with? But we dont quit, you adapt and move on.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:19 PM by inoeth
Sepplord wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:58 PM
i wasn't expecting a 60/40 split
i was expecting something closer

we will have to wait and see what they make out of it, but there is one thing that's fact and probably most people with at least a little bit of common sense can agree on:

The opening post is nothing more than a whine and bar any logic

That said:
To take a completely hypothetical example, if you had an RR10 necro, deleted it and created an hib char and then vote, your vote would count as an alb necro.
This is hilarious (all in good spirit)

hello relvinian LOL
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:23 PM by Turano
Draygon wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:19 PM
Where else are you going to play? You know how many changes that have been made that many dont agree with? But we dont quit, you adapt and move on.
You think DAoC is the only game to play nowadays?
I don't agree with many things on this server, I still enjoy playing here despite them. But NF could be (and for many people will be) the dealbreaker. I'm still waiting for the one reason people should be playing a game the don't enjoy
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:23 PM by Hejjin
vadox wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:21 PM
Just think logically for a minute - introducing NF for a week, w/out proper testing (beta was not NF)
1. Is 1 week enough for people to make a decision vs running OF for years?
2. Do you know all bugs and potential issues with brand new maps and other game dynamics that come with NF.
3. BETA on Phoenix lasted 6+ months? Beta had OF up not NF. I won't go further.

most of you NF fans want quick 'fix' to your boredom - you are not thinking of long term repercussions.
There had been constant debate about the merits of OF v NF and which would be better / more popular, the 1 week test was to help determine what the majority of active players wanted. To the best of my knowledge, the dev's never stated that the week long test was a beta for NF, nor have they stated when it will launch, or how much testing will be done prior to that.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:26 PM by Draygon
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:23 PM
Draygon wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:19 PM
Where else are you going to play? You know how many changes that have been made that many dont agree with? But we dont quit, you adapt and move on.
You think DAoC is the only game to play nowadays?
I don't agree with many things on this server, I still enjoy playing here despite them. But NF could be (and for many people will be) the dealbreaker. I'm still waiting for the one reason people should be playing a game the don't enjoy
So leave then. This is for active players and will get rid of all the cry babies such as yourself.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:29 PM by Ashenspire
Mythic knew OF was bad for balance and for the health of the game. They fixed it.

Phoenix Beta: a poll is held to choose OF or NF. Nostalgia got the best of people. Nostalgia is a mother fucker. OF wins even though it is objectively the worse option. That seems to be popular nowadays.

Phoenix live: Broadsword decides to fuck with the patcher which causes issues with the Phoenix server. Chaos ensues for a few days as people can't follow instructions to properly patch their client. Shit's still fucky.

NF test: Goes really well, people remember how much better it was than OF. Vote happens, active population clearly wants NF.

Better availability of action for all playstyles is, without debate, going to be better for the health of the server.

People that claim they will quit if OF isn't picked a) are blowing smoke or b) would've quit in another month anyways.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:30 PM by Turano
Draygon wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:26 PM
So leave then. This is for active players and will get rid of all the cry babies such as yourself.
I guess with some people you just can't have normal discussions without them starting to throw insults *sigh*
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:33 PM by Draygon
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:30 PM
Draygon wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:26 PM
So leave then. This is for active players and will get rid of all the cry babies such as yourself.
I guess with some people you just can't have normal discussions without them starting to throw insults *sigh*

I guess snowflakes always going to blame others for their own problems or call things rigged, too.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:34 PM by Draygon
Ashenspire wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:29 PM
Mythic knew OF was bad for balance and for the health of the game. They fixed it.

Phoenix Beta: a poll is held to choose OF or NF. Nostalgia got the best of people. Nostalgia is a mother fucker. OF wins even though it is objectively the worse option. That seems to be popular nowadays.

Phoenix live: Broadsword decides to fuck with the patcher which causes issues with the Phoenix server. Chaos ensues for a few days as people can't follow instructions to properly patch their client. Shit's still fucky.

NF test: Goes really well, people remember how much better it was than OF. Vote happens, active population clearly wants NF.

Better availability of action for all playstyles is, without debate, going to be better for the health of the server.

People that claim they will quit if OF isn't picked a) are blowing smoke or b) would've quit in another month anyways.

Exactly
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:37 PM by Turano
Draygon wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:33 PM
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:30 PM
Draygon wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:26 PM
So leave then. This is for active players and will get rid of all the cry babies such as yourself.
I guess with some people you just can't have normal discussions without them starting to throw insults *sigh*

I guess snowflakes always going to blame others for their own problems or call things rigged, too.
I never called anything here rigged. I may be surprised about the result, but rigged? Don't think so.
And who exactly am i blaming? You?
And for what problems? Not liking NF?

Can you pull some more stuff out of your backside, at least now you start becoming entertaining
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:43 PM by Draygon
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:37 PM
Draygon wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:33 PM
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:30 PM
I guess with some people you just can't have normal discussions without them starting to throw insults *sigh*

I guess snowflakes always going to blame others for their own problems or call things rigged, too.
I never called anything here rigged. I may be surprised about the result, but rigged? Don't think so.
And who exactly am i blaming? You?
And for what problems? Not liking NF?

Can you pull some more stuff out of your backside, at least now you start becoming entertaining

Go from thread 1 and read, then you'll know what I meant.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:51 PM by Sixin2082
I like nf better. Keep takes and a little more openness is fun.

I world like to see OF emain be turned into an 8v8 arena.
The events in the past have always been super well received and it might take the sting out of moving to NF of that's how's the devs go.

Also remember, the devs said that the vote would only be part of the decision.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:59 PM by shintacki
The only surprise to me about the vote is that hibs had the highest % in favor of OF. As a hib I can say without a doubt that hibs were more negatively effected by OF than any other realm. Last night when I was on hibs had 1/3 as many 50s in the frontier as mids and half as many as albs. So it at least seemed to me that hibs weren’t enjoying OF as much yet still voted for it the most. And yeah I know sitting in DL doesn’t count towards that number but I checked /who connacht 50 and even including that total didn’t bring the numbers up very much. It’ll be interesting to see if that number levels out if/when NF comes back.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 2:04 PM by PingGuy
Yeah, if you told me ahead of time that Hibs would have the highest OF percentage I'd have never believed it. Sometimes reality just doesn't line up with our expectations.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 2:09 PM by elninost0rm
Great news.

Can't wait for:

1. Buzzing keeps or coast guards and actually making a difference in a small man, instead of eclipsing the keep hill and instantly having 30 enemies all within 1000 units.
2. Not being inhibited by the absolutely worst terrain design in every single encounter.
3. Not having a few awful chokepoints where mostly everyone congregates and there is fuck-all anywhere else
4. Actual realm objectives and meaningful siege situations

Bring it on.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 2:10 PM by Anelyn77
PingGuy wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 2:04 PM
Yeah, if you told me ahead of time that Hibs would have the highest OF percentage I'd have never believed it. Sometimes reality just doesn't line up with our expectations.

I bet you will never guess why hehehe ^_^


/Bnotashamed | Aicha
Fri 21 Jun 2019 2:15 PM by PingGuy
Anelyn77 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 2:10 PM
PingGuy wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 2:04 PM
Yeah, if you told me ahead of time that Hibs would have the highest OF percentage I'd have never believed it. Sometimes reality just doesn't line up with our expectations.

I bet you will never guess why hehehe ^_^


/Bnotashamed | Aicha

Because the Vote OF lever was in Mount Collory and the Vote NF lever was in Emain Macha?
Fri 21 Jun 2019 2:17 PM by cere2
Oh hell yes.
Thank goodness for voting.
And thank goodness for NF!
Fri 21 Jun 2019 2:29 PM by gnefner
Ashenspire wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:29 PM
Mythic knew OF was bad for balance and for the health of the game. They fixed it.

Phoenix Beta: a poll is held to choose OF or NF. Nostalgia got the best of people. Nostalgia is a mother fucker. OF wins even though it is objectively the worse option. That seems to be popular nowadays.

Phoenix live: Broadsword decides to fuck with the patcher which causes issues with the Phoenix server. Chaos ensues for a few days as people can't follow instructions to properly patch their client. Shit's still fucky.

NF test: Goes really well, people remember how much better it was than OF. Vote happens, active population clearly wants NF.

Better availability of action for all playstyles is, without debate, going to be better for the health of the server.

People that claim they will quit if OF isn't picked a) are blowing smoke or b) would've quit in another month anyways.

Amen!
Fri 21 Jun 2019 2:41 PM by Druth
The results did surprise me somewhat, not the %'s which I had expected, well I had actually expected more to want NF.
Which, together with OP, just goes to show that your expectations likely are very colored by who you talked to.

What surprised me the most was the realm difference, and maybe someone can explain why Hibs seem to be less enthusiastic about NF than Albs/Mids?
I thought hibs were dead tired of running to Emain?


I voted for NF, but don't understand why people think 61% is as crystal clear as some seem to think.
61% is enough to win a A or B vote, IF we are debating what to launch as, but remember we are voting to change some that already is in place, and replace it with something that we have not testing much.
I would actually say, as unpopular as it sounds, that we would have needed 2/3rd of the votes to change what we have.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 3:00 PM by Boeserben
The tested version of NF is just terrible, if you want to introduce NF, then it should be the original including all weapons. Otherwise, this version of NF will get a lot of players to leave the server. Note that many players came to this server just because of OF.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 3:02 PM by speedr
Lets see how it goes, but i am not looking forward to the constant keep/tower humping that went on during the NF test.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 3:20 PM by mattymc
Druth wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 2:41 PM
The results did surprise me somewhat, not the %'s which I had expected, well I had actually expected more to want NF.
Which, together with OP, just goes to show that your expectations likely are very colored by who you talked to.

What surprised me the most was the realm difference, and maybe someone can explain why Hibs seem to be less enthusiastic about NF than Albs/Mids?
I thought hibs were dead tired of running to Emain?


I voted for NF, but don't understand why people think 61% is as crystal clear as some seem to think.
61% is enough to win a A or B vote, IF we are debating what to launch as, but remember we are voting to change some that already is in place, and replace it with something that we have not testing much.
I would actually say, as unpopular as it sounds, that we would have needed 2/3rd of the votes to change what we have.

I think OF has become a PvE fest, and there are hibb BG leaders that simply want to do that --- I think NF generated more Player fights --- and that is what the majority wants ---- I see your points, but think OF will lead to a sharp decline..it is silly to just see keeps PvE'd
all day and night with no real reward nor desire to defend --- given the dynamism NF brings --- it's simply more fun. If all your interested in is PvE, not sure why you would play this or any version of DAoC.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 3:47 PM by Stoertebecker
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:51 PM
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:42 PM
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:17 PM
I fear that if they change permanently to NF this server will be empty soon

Because the so called mature ppl are acting like lil children, nothing more, nothing less.
personally I would never have started playing here if NF had been running from launch
NF was the main reason I eventually quited live years ago and I really don't see me suffering through the same crap again

That has nothing to do with immature behavior, give me (or anyone else that will leave the server) one reason to play a game I don't enjoy. Just one

It`s not about a game that someone enjoy or not, it`s about unflexibility. You havn`t looked close or long enough if you didn`t find your niche with NF.
If 150 rvr player/realm on live (last year) were able to generate enough action for every playstyle we should be able to do the same with 250 on each side, if not it`s seems we`re just to dumb.

And there is a reason....Phoenix is the last server where you see a population above 1000 players.
Don`t even think about that Broadsword may release a classic server, Endless Conquest comes first, and if that fail there will be no classic server, never.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 3:54 PM by relvinian
1. Old frontier has an imbalance right now with hibs domination of the keep takes.
2. New Frontier is an annoying piece of crap.
3. If they switch to NF and work on making it less of an annoying piece of crap it might be ok.
4. As to the votes? Nothing surprises me as you really cannot control others and you should not try.

It will all end OK.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 4:01 PM by jackatom74
Agree! I ended up voting nf after much thought. Not because of what it is but because of what it could be with the current devs making changes where live went wrong.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 4:12 PM by cere2
From what I noticed when NF was up, Pilz's BG was a lot smaller than it was in OF.

Perhaps that was because the OF players all decided not to play during that week, or....

Perhaps some 8v8's went on their own way trying to look for other 8v8's?

Had some other objective they could accomplish like break port?

Hunt for smallies/solo's from nearest enemy port/beach?

My guess is the latter. So in reality I think the PvDoor will decrease quite a bit when we get NF back.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 4:18 PM by Vilandro
Now that we will get NF, where's ToA ?
ToA was released 8! months before NF (just as a note btw)..
Imo it was a mistake to test NF, because everyone started with OF and was fine with it anyway (otherwise they prolly would never have started on Phoenix).
If it had never been tested, there still would be OF, and no one would give a f*** about it.
But hey, now i can enjoy reallife again lol, or play something else, it was a pleasure ladies and gentleman.

and @ the Staff: regardless to specific things and contents you guys are doing and implementing , you are doing a great work , just to stay noticed !

HF folks and GL with NF, i'm out, keep cool
cya
Fri 21 Jun 2019 4:21 PM by Runental
Vilandro wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 4:18 PM
Now that we will get NF, where's ToA ?
ToA was released 8! months before NF (just as a note btw)..
Imo it was a mistake to test NF, because everyone started with OF and was fine with it anyway (otherwise they prolly would never have started on Phoenix).
If it had never been tested, there still would be OF, and no one would give a f*** about it.
But hey, now i can enjoy reallife again lol, or play something else, it was a pleasure ladies and gentleman.

and @ the Staff: regardless to specific things and contents you guys are doing and implementing , you are doing a great work , just to stay noticed !

HF folks and GL with NF, i'm out, keep cool
cya

Can i have your stuff?
Fri 21 Jun 2019 4:22 PM by Luriella
Hope we get back Of when player count decrease .
And pls, no cows.
And no further votes, we got Trump, we got brexit and now nf.
Poeple are insane.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 4:22 PM by Saroi
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 4:12 PM
From what I noticed when NF was up, Pilz's BG was a lot smaller than it was in OF.

Perhaps that was because the OF players all decided not to play during that week, or....

Perhaps some 8v8's went on their own way trying to look for other 8v8's?

Had some other objective they could accomplish like break port?

Hunt for smallies/solo's from nearest enemy port/beach?

My guess is the latter. So in reality I think the PvDoor will decrease quite a bit when we get NF back.

I don't think so. Especially before NF test week was over there was a bigger patch with reducing amount of guards, their HP and damage. So if NF comes up again, the guards will stay weaker like that which means there will be more free farming.

And Pilzpower BG was sometimes smaller yes but Hibs had at some point 2 BG's up. So no 8v8 or so, just another zerg around.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 4:39 PM by Bobbahunter
Wait 2 weeks with OF.. Do a final test of NF.... have another vote and see if the %%% changes. Then make a decision.

The Devs and people are making / made decision with only a week of playing. Some people didn't log in until that Friday so they only got 3 days of NF...
A lot of people didn't know or understand NF and how to move around but the next NF test everyone should be able to figure crap out!!!

I highly recommend one more round of NF before making such a REAL and DRASTIC change.

Time is free
No Rush.

Patience usually pays off more in the end then irrational decisions.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 4:44 PM by cere2
Bobbahunter wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 4:39 PM
Wait 2 weeks with OF.. Do a final test of NF.... have another vote and see if the %%% changes. Then make a decision.

The Devs and people are making / made decision with only a week of playing. Some people didn't log in until that Friday so they only got 3 days of NF...
A lot of people didn't know or understand NF and how to move around but the next NF test everyone should be able to figure crap out!!!

I highly recommend one more round of NF before making such a REAL and DRASTIC change.

Time is free
No Rush.

Patience usually pays off more in the end then irrational decisions.

There was almost 3000 votes. Who else would we be waiting on to make their decision?

If it was close? Maybe, wasn't really close enough to have a recount.....

This isn't Florida, we are not waiting on another 2000 dead people to make their votes
Fri 21 Jun 2019 4:47 PM by lurker
I would be interested to see breakdown of the vote by realm points (banded account wide) and maybe hours played at 50 (banded account wide).

Is there a difference for those that have invested more time vs those that that are super casual etc.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 5:04 PM by Roto23
Runental wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 4:21 PM
Vilandro wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 4:18 PM
Now that we will get NF, where's ToA ?
ToA was released 8! months before NF (just as a note btw)..
Imo it was a mistake to test NF, because everyone started with OF and was fine with it anyway (otherwise they prolly would never have started on Phoenix).
If it had never been tested, there still would be OF, and no one would give a f*** about it.
But hey, now i can enjoy reallife again lol, or play something else, it was a pleasure ladies and gentleman.

and @ the Staff: regardless to specific things and contents you guys are doing and implementing , you are doing a great work , just to stay noticed !

HF folks and GL with NF, i'm out, keep cool
cya

Can i have your stuff?

c'mon man, that's my job to say that.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 5:04 PM by Roto23
Vilandro wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 4:18 PM
Now that we will get NF, where's ToA ?
ToA was released 8! months before NF (just as a note btw)..
Imo it was a mistake to test NF, because everyone started with OF and was fine with it anyway (otherwise they prolly would never have started on Phoenix).
If it had never been tested, there still would be OF, and no one would give a f*** about it.
But hey, now i can enjoy reallife again lol, or play something else, it was a pleasure ladies and gentleman.

and @ the Staff: regardless to specific things and contents you guys are doing and implementing , you are doing a great work , just to stay noticed !

HF folks and GL with NF, i'm out, keep cool
cya
VILL...... DON"T GO....


can I have your stuff?
Fri 21 Jun 2019 5:16 PM by teiloh
Looks like people prefer the F2P over any other feature of the shard, and the average person is voting in favor of keep battles.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 5:20 PM by relvinian
I hope devs make a bunch of fixes to NF and THEN roll it out.

Leave OF up for a week or 2 at minimum and try and fix major complaints people have about nf and what is buggy.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 5:34 PM by easytoremember
Curious to see vote results by character used to place vote
Expect to see Hibernia's NF-OF ratio spike
Fri 21 Jun 2019 5:36 PM by cere2
relvinian wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 5:20 PM
I hope devs make a bunch of fixes to NF and THEN roll it out.

Leave OF up for a week or 2 at minimum and try and fix major complaints people have about nf and what is buggy.

I sure hope not.
They can get a better handle on fixing something if it is already in place.
Not sure of what these "major complaints" have been as I haven't seen too many on the forums.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 5:40 PM by Stoertebecker
We could make it like the british...,,just ignore the ppl, debate endlessly and vote until it fits
Fri 21 Jun 2019 6:20 PM by BisbyHoughton
Seems like a pretty clear mandate for the server.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 6:30 PM by chryso
ExcretusMaximus wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:52 PM
OF Voters: If OF doesn't win, I quit!

NF Voters: Meh, I'll play whatever, I just prefer NF.

Yeah, I'm totally sure it's rigged in favor of alienating the people who threaten to quit if they don't get their way.

This is not an accurate representation. I saw people on both sides threatening to quit.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 6:36 PM by Luriella
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 5:40 PM
We could make it like the british...,,just ignore the ppl, debate endlessly and vote until it fits
Yeah !!!
Fri 21 Jun 2019 7:29 PM by Turano
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 5:36 PM
Not sure of what these "major complaints" have been as I haven't seen too many on the forums.
You have been all over pretty much every OF/NF thread on this forum over the past 2 weeks and you have not seen too many complaints? That's some selective perception if there ever was one
Fri 21 Jun 2019 7:37 PM by cere2
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 7:29 PM
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 5:36 PM
Not sure of what these "major complaints" have been as I haven't seen too many on the forums.
You have been all over pretty much every OF/NF thread on this forum over the past 2 weeks and you have not seen too many complaints? That's some selective perception if there ever was one

So educate me on what it is that I have missed?
Is it that NF is too big? Since that's a crock o hogwash, I don't consider that a valid complaint.

What major complaints are there that I have been missing?
Also, someone saying there's only action around docks/bridges is just opinions, not valid complaints that can be fixed.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 7:38 PM by Fugax
Sepplord wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 1:02 PM
Fugax wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:59 PM
Good lord. The crying brings me back to the last US election when the Democrats didn't get there way, and are still crying to this day. The people of the realms have spoken! Deal with it, and lets kill some nerds together!
#Democracy

Are you proud as an american that you don't know the difference between their and there?

Because I talked about American politics that you "assume" I am American.... #facepalm
Fri 21 Jun 2019 7:59 PM by Turano
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 7:37 PM
What major complaints are there that I have been missing?
Also, someone saying there's only action around docks/bridges is just opinions, not valid complaints that can be fixed.
-too many guards with too much damage (even after the nerf)
-archers guards dealing insane amounts of damage (even after the nerf)
-archer guards shooting through walls
-docks are the new milegates, and you have to stay there, talk to the damn merchant, fumble around in your inventory and give him the damn ticket to get a boat. By the time you've done that you have been killed 50% of the time, gratz
-(stealther)zergs are now unpredictable and therefor unavoidable, every bridge and dock can and will be their playground now
-8man groups running around for 30+ minutes without inc (of another 8 man, they will farm the solos nontheless)
-you either go to where the zerg is (mostly where something is burning on the map) to get any kind of action or die of boredom. If you avoid that zone(s) you might as well log out
-classes without speed are shafted even more than in OF
-eternal boat sailing tours just to land in a boat dropoff point camp group
-people that don't like keep/towerraids have no real way of avoiding them, because they are EVERYWHERE
-siege weapons deal insane amounts of damage to players while their real purpose, shooting holes in keep walls and bringing down towers, is not even implemented
-some classes are just useless in keepfights (which are the main selling point of NF, yay)

These are just some points I have seen raised over the last 2 weeks both ingame and here on the board.
You have been way more active here than I have and you tell me you havn't seen any of that?
Fri 21 Jun 2019 8:06 PM by Joc
I say go for it. The vote shows the majority want it. Far more places to roam and camp. No more milegates to clog up too. Stealth wars were pretty amazing as far as solo/duo went. Can't wait!
Fri 21 Jun 2019 8:34 PM by rodsta69
Fugax wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:59 PM
Good lord. The crying brings me back to the last US election when the Democrats didn't get there way, and are still crying to this day. The people of the realms have spoken! Deal with it, and lets kill some nerds together!
#Democracy

It's kinda funny that you would use this as an example. It would fit maybe if OF still won the election despite 3 million fewer votes for it.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 8:34 PM by teiloh
BisbyHoughton wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 6:20 PM
Seems like a pretty clear mandate for the server.

Game design should not be a democracy. Why not, for example, offer a trial of ToA and then put it to a vote? What else should the community vote on? I'd also like to see weighted data with player playtime/RPs included in the results.

With NF, the team needs serious QOL or F2P live will very clearly compete for population.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 8:40 PM by relvinian
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 7:59 PM
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 7:37 PM
What major complaints are there that I have been missing?
Also, someone saying there's only action around docks/bridges is just opinions, not valid complaints that can be fixed.
-too many guards with too much damage (even after the nerf)
-archers guards dealing insane amounts of damage (even after the nerf)
-archer guards shooting through walls
-docks are the new milegates, and you have to stay there, talk to the damn merchant, fumble around in your inventory and give him the damn ticket to get a boat. By the time you've done that you have been killed 50% of the time, gratz
-(stealther)zergs are now unpredictable and therefor unavoidable, every bridge and dock can and will be their playground now
-8man groups running around for 30+ minutes without inc (of another 8 man, they will farm the solos nontheless)
-you either go to where the zerg is (mostly where something is burning on the map) to get any kind of action or die of boredom. If you avoid that zone(s) you might as well log out
-classes without speed are shafted even more than in OF
-eternal boat sailing tours just to land in a boat dropoff point camp group
-people that don't like keep/towerraids have no real way of avoiding them, because they are EVERYWHERE
-siege weapons deal insane amounts of damage to players while their real purpose, shooting holes in keep walls and bringing down towers, is not even implemented
-some classes are just useless in keepfights (which are the main selling point of NF, yay)

These are just some points I have seen raised over the last 2 weeks both ingame and here on the board.
You have been way more active here than I have and you tell me you havn't seen any of that?

These are valid points. Also mgs are weird have to jump over. guards chase too far, had a archer guard chase me a light year. or was it a parsec?

Many people think about what is best for themselves. As a temped, rr 6+ stealther, it was probably a good old time ganking people on docs or so forth. the siege gear, a guy i know messaged me about getting a huge amount of rps by usuing a catapult during a siege. And this is a great guy. People just want flash too, that is what new frontier is, six flags over DAOC. Flashy, bigger, newer, um Trash.

But if the people want trash, fine. But why not make sure its not going to imbalance the game on roll out and will be stable, and address the biggest issues rather than continuing this as a 5 month beta.

Also, as a token of the ENORMOUS GODDAMN CHANGE, players should get free full and realm respecs.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 8:52 PM by easytoremember
rodsta69 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 8:34 PM
Fugax wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:59 PM
Good lord. The crying brings me back to the last US election when the Democrats didn't get there way, and are still crying to this day. The people of the realms have spoken! Deal with it, and lets kill some nerds together!
#Democracy

It's kinda funny that you would use this as an example. It would fit maybe if OF still won the election despite 3 million fewer votes for it.

Funny you mention that if you consider the 3 realms akin to electoral votes it'd be fun to see how many NF votes originated from active hib players (not highest RR) and then weight each realm's % to their population
Fri 21 Jun 2019 8:53 PM by cere2
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 7:59 PM
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 7:37 PM
What major complaints are there that I have been missing?
Also, someone saying there's only action around docks/bridges is just opinions, not valid complaints that can be fixed.
-too many guards with too much damage (even after the nerf) - Perhaps an issue to some, easily adjusted, not Major.
-archers guards dealing insane amounts of damage (even after the nerf) - Same as above, still not Major
-archer guards shooting through walls - This is the way it has always been, no suprise here.
-docks are the new milegates, and you have to stay there, talk to the damn merchant, fumble around in your inventory and give him the damn ticket to get a boat. By the time you've done that you have been killed 50% of the time, gratz -This is an RvR zone, not a safe zone
-(stealther)zergs are now unpredictable and therefor unavoidable, every bridge and dock can and will be their playground now - This is an RvR zone, not a designated BG where you know where enemies are.
-8man groups running around for 30+ minutes without inc (of another 8 man, they will farm the solos nontheless) - Opinion
-you either go to where the zerg is (mostly where something is burning on the map) to get any kind of action or die of boredom. If you avoid that zone(s) you might as well log out - Somewhat true, if you always rely on others to create action for you. You can always try cutting a port etc to create your own action
-classes without speed are shafted even more than in OF - I would say same as OF but OK I'll give you that.
-eternal boat sailing tours just to land in a boat dropoff point camp group - Huh? drop off somewhere else perhaps? Don't go all the way?
-people that don't like keep/towerraids have no real way of avoiding them, because they are EVERYWHERE - Yeah, totally impossible to get away from a tower or keep...
-siege weapons deal insane amounts of damage to players while their real purpose, shooting holes in keep walls and bringing down towers, is not even implemented - - So getting hit with a stone from a trebuchet should be like a mosquito bite, got it.
-some classes are just useless in keepfights (which are the main selling point of NF, yay) - For example?

These are just some points I have seen raised over the last 2 weeks both ingame and here on the board.
You have been way more active here than I have and you tell me you havn't seen any of that?
Fri 21 Jun 2019 8:59 PM by Saroi
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 7:59 PM
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 7:37 PM
What major complaints are there that I have been missing?
Also, someone saying there's only action around docks/bridges is just opinions, not valid complaints that can be fixed.
-too many guards with too much damage (even after the nerf)
-archers guards dealing insane amounts of damage (even after the nerf)
-archer guards shooting through walls
-docks are the new milegates, and you have to stay there, talk to the damn merchant, fumble around in your inventory and give him the damn ticket to get a boat. By the time you've done that you have been killed 50% of the time, gratz
-(stealther)zergs are now unpredictable and therefor unavoidable, every bridge and dock can and will be their playground now
-8man groups running around for 30+ minutes without inc (of another 8 man, they will farm the solos nontheless)
-you either go to where the zerg is (mostly where something is burning on the map) to get any kind of action or die of boredom. If you avoid that zone(s) you might as well log out
-classes without speed are shafted even more than in OF
-eternal boat sailing tours just to land in a boat dropoff point camp group
-people that don't like keep/towerraids have no real way of avoiding them, because they are EVERYWHERE
-siege weapons deal insane amounts of damage to players while their real purpose, shooting holes in keep walls and bringing down towers, is not even implemented
-some classes are just useless in keepfights (which are the main selling point of NF, yay)

These are just some points I have seen raised over the last 2 weeks both ingame and here on the board.
You have been way more active here than I have and you tell me you havn't seen any of that?

Good points. I am also annoyed that you cannot attack people on a boat. I have seen stealthers camp docks and have tickets ready. If they lose a fight, get a boat and jump on it for safety. (That is really a get out of jail card) and then they jump somewhere off on the other side to reg and come back. But yeah the argument comes then: Annoyed or find no luck? Go somewhere else.

Especially the combination of vanish and boat is just funny to see when someone does it.

Already fun times ahead!
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:02 PM by Stoertebecker
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 7:59 PM
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 7:37 PM
What major complaints are there that I have been missing?
Also, someone saying there's only action around docks/bridges is just opinions, not valid complaints that can be fixed.
-too many guards with too much damage (even after the nerf)
-archers guards dealing insane amounts of damage (even after the nerf)
-archer guards shooting through walls
-docks are the new milegates, and you have to stay there, talk to the damn merchant, fumble around in your inventory and give him the damn ticket to get a boat. By the time you've done that you have been killed 50% of the time, gratz
-(stealther)zergs are now unpredictable and therefor unavoidable, every bridge and dock can and will be their playground now
-8man groups running around for 30+ minutes without inc (of another 8 man, they will farm the solos nontheless)
-you either go to where the zerg is (mostly where something is burning on the map) to get any kind of action or die of boredom. If you avoid that zone(s) you might as well log out
-classes without speed are shafted even more than in OF
-eternal boat sailing tours just to land in a boat dropoff point camp group
-people that don't like keep/towerraids have no real way of avoiding them, because they are EVERYWHERE
-siege weapons deal insane amounts of damage to players while their real purpose, shooting holes in keep walls and bringing down towers, is not even implemented
-some classes are just useless in keepfights (which are the main selling point of NF, yay)

These are just some points I have seen raised over the last 2 weeks both ingame and here on the board.
You have been way more active here than I have and you tell me you havn't seen any of that?

But all your points could be changed, it isn`t carved in stone. It was a test-week, not something final.

btw....Jumping into a boat while in fight isn`t possible on live, the npc won`t talk to you if you are in a fight.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:27 PM by teiloh
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:02 PM
But all your points could be changed, it isn`t carved in stone. It was a test-week, not something final.

btw....Jumping into a boat while in fight isn`t possible on live, the npc won`t talk to you if you are in a fight.

Why not just fix the 2 main problems in OF and see how that works, instead of completely changing everything?

1. Fix porting to one or two forward keeps max
2. Add MG busting mechanic
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:38 PM by Stoertebecker
teiloh wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:27 PM
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:02 PM
But all your points could be changed, it isn`t carved in stone. It was a test-week, not something final.

btw....Jumping into a boat while in fight isn`t possible on live, the npc won`t talk to you if you are in a fight.

Why not just fix the 2 main problems in OF and see how that works, instead of completely changing everything?

1. Fix porting to one or two forward keeps max
2. Add MG busting mechanic

You didn`t get why the phoenix team was forced to test NF , or? Did you missed the memo?
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:40 PM by cere2
teiloh wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:27 PM
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:02 PM
But all your points could be changed, it isn`t carved in stone. It was a test-week, not something final.

btw....Jumping into a boat while in fight isn`t possible on live, the npc won`t talk to you if you are in a fight.

Why not just fix the 2 main problems in OF and see how that works, instead of completely changing everything?

1. Fix porting to one or two forward keeps max
2. Add MG busting mechanic

Because your opinion of keeping OF has shown to be the actual minority...
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:44 PM by teiloh
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:40 PM
teiloh wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:27 PM
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:02 PM
But all your points could be changed, it isn`t carved in stone. It was a test-week, not something final.

btw....Jumping into a boat while in fight isn`t possible on live, the npc won`t talk to you if you are in a fight.

Why not just fix the 2 main problems in OF and see how that works, instead of completely changing everything?

1. Fix porting to one or two forward keeps max
2. Add MG busting mechanic

Because your opinion of keeping OF has shown to be the actual minority...

Game design isn't, and shouldn't be, a democracy. If we let you design the game, it would be dead within weeks.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:45 PM by teiloh
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:38 PM
You didn`t get why the phoenix team was forced to test NF , or? Did you missed the memo?

Nobody forced them to do it, not at this point when they haven't exhausted all options with NF. Population dwindled but it wasn't nosediving.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:48 PM by cere2
teiloh wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:44 PM
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:40 PM
teiloh wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:27 PM
Why not just fix the 2 main problems in OF and see how that works, instead of completely changing everything?

1. Fix porting to one or two forward keeps max
2. Add MG busting mechanic

Because your opinion of keeping OF has shown to be the actual minority...

Game design isn't, and shouldn't be, a democracy. If we let you design the game, it would be dead within weeks.

Says you? Oh, another opinion, not backed up with any facts. Got it.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:52 PM by teiloh
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:48 PM
Says you? Oh, another opinion, not backed up with any facts. Got it.

There's a reason why you're rank 4 without the trillions of RPs Live dumps out.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:55 PM by cere2
teiloh wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:52 PM
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:48 PM
Says you? Oh, another opinion, not backed up with any facts. Got it.

There's a reason why you're rank 4 without the trillions of RPs Live dumps out.

Hey whats your toons name again? Oh, yeah....another keyboard warrior. Got it.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:55 PM by Stoertebecker
teiloh wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:45 PM
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:38 PM
You didn`t get why the phoenix team was forced to test NF , or? Did you missed the memo?

Nobody forced them to do it, not at this point when they haven't exhausted all options with NF. Population dwindled but it wasn't nosediving.

There are reasons behind this change. Maybe someone from the staff should explain that for you.
It wasn`t just for fun or because they nothing else to do.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:57 PM by teiloh
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:55 PM
Hey whats your toons name again? Oh, yeah....another keyboard warrior. Got it.

2 rank 6s with 13,000 kills between them.

You have 300 all time kills and only 24 of them are solo. I have literally RvR'd 10-20x more than you and I only play one or two days a week.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:59 PM by cere2
teiloh wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:57 PM
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:55 PM
Hey whats your toons name again? Oh, yeah....another keyboard warrior. Got it.

2 rank 6s with 13,000 kills between them.

You have 300 all time kills and only 24 of them are solo. I have literally RvR'd 10-20x more than you and I only play one or two days a week.

Wait whats your toons name again? Oh yeah....I forget.

On another toon I don;t have on this list I have 21 rank 9's with 1.9 billion kills between them.
See I can BS too! Weeeeee
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:04 PM by Stoertebecker
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:59 PM
teiloh wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:57 PM
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 9:55 PM
Hey whats your toons name again? Oh, yeah....another keyboard warrior. Got it.

2 rank 6s with 13,000 kills between them.

You have 300 all time kills and only 24 of them are solo. I have literally RvR'd 10-20x more than you and I only play one or two days a week.

Wait whats your toons name again? Oh yeah....I forget.

On another toon I don;t have on this list I have 21 rank 9's with 1.9 billion kills between them.
See I can BS too! Weeeeee

WTF, 2 Options...you are Nate or Herorius !!
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:08 PM by teiloh
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:04 PM
WTF, 2 Options...you are Nate or Herorius !!

Well that would explain everything.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:17 PM by Durandal
I retired my realm rank 12 charge tank which is immensely fun on live, to play on phoenix's old frontiers. It's not that I think NF is the worst thing ever, if if I thought this much, I would of quit daoc in 2004 and never came back. I did the same when Uthgard launched. I go to the server with the most population because it is where the most action is, where the others have less action. I was one of the people who vocalized that I would quit phoenix if NF were launched, not because I have a deep seeded hatred for NF, but because I just have a really fun character on live, and the map there would be the same, and the server with the most population would probably begin to shift back as I know I am not the only one that has characters over there with much more time invested. Once you begin to make the differences less and less, phoenix becomes less unique, those of us from live would rather play live if the population comes back closer to similarity will go there to get our daoc fix if we need it... However, this could have happened regardless as the pop has already been declining. I see many people calling for more changes to make this server more like live, toa, rr5, etc. Yes I hate 900 AF 3k HP casters but I can still destroy them, the map is the same, I can run speed 6 without endo pots or a speed class, and the keep system has no coding flaws with everything already implemented. OF was unique and something that the live service does not have since 15 years ago.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:26 PM by cere2
Durandal wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:17 PM
I retired my realm rank 12 charge tank which is immensely fun on live, to play on phoenix's old frontiers. It's not that I think NF is the worst thing ever, if if I thought this much, I would of quit daoc in 2004 and never came back. I did the same when Uthgard launched. I go to the server with the most population because it is where the most action is, where the others have less action. I was one of the people who vocalized that I would quit phoenix if NF were launched, not because I have a deep seeded hatred for NF, but because I just have a really fun character on live, and the map there would be the same, and the server with the most population would probably begin to shift back as I know I am not the only one that has characters over there with much more time invested. Once you begin to make the differences less and less, phoenix becomes less unique, those of us from live would rather play live if the population comes back closer to similarity will go there to get our daoc fix if we need it... Yes I hate 900 AF 3k HP casters but I can still destroy them, the map is the same, I can run speed 6 without endo pots or a speed class, and the keep system has no coding flaws with everything already implemented. OF was unique and something that the live service does not have since 15 years ago.

I can agree to an extent but this is still quite different from Live, there's no CL's there's no ToA, and like you said no 4800 HP tanks or casters etc, no RR5 (ouch), no changing template every 2 months, etc.
And I agree if Live had close to this pop I would play there too. But it doesn't. And mostly in my opinion because of the constant added PvE crap they shoved down everyone's throats, along with the most recent changes to pets/necros etc. Basically since BS took over it has gone downhill. Prior to that it was for me prolly at it's best point since the beginning.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:28 PM by Kaseylol
Durandal wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:17 PM
I retired my realm rank 12 charge tank which is immensely fun on live, to play on phoenix's old frontiers. It's not that I think NF is the worst thing ever, if if I thought this much, I would of quit daoc in 2004 and never came back. I did the same when Uthgard launched. I go to the server with the most population because it is where the most action is, where the others have less action. I was one of the people who vocalized that I would quit phoenix if NF were launched, not because I have a deep seeded hatred for NF, but because I just have a really fun character on live, and the map there would be the same, and the server with the most population would probably begin to shift back as I know I am not the only one that has characters over there with much more time invested. Once you begin to make the differences less and less, phoenix becomes less unique, those of us from live would rather play live if the population comes back closer to similarity will go there to get our daoc fix if we need it... I see many people calling for more changes to make this server more like live, toa, rr5, etc. Yes I hate 900 AF 3k HP casters but I can still destroy them, the map is the same, I can run speed 6 without endo pots or a speed class, and the keep system has no coding flaws with everything already implemented. OF was unique and something that the live service does not have since 15 years ago.

These are all fair points but the problem is that the population is DYING on OF. For months now. Adding to that the overwhelming majority of players voted for NF, it makes no sense to want OF still if your primary goal is more population.

LIVE is nothing like daoc as we know it. It's basically an arcade game now. Bards have root, sorcs have speed 5, everyone has a no timer full red buff pot, you can port anywhere, everyone is fully capped and the same spec, and there's almost zero good players still playing live. I find it hard to believe the map alone will convince players to switch from here to live, and if they did, it would still be less than if we stayed OF based on the vote.

We may also get new players who quit or have never joined Phoenix due to OF, who don't want to pay a sub for live or don't like mythical stat caps etc, so it's a win win either way.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:29 PM by Durandal
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:26 PM
Durandal wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:17 PM
I retired my realm rank 12 charge tank which is immensely fun on live, to play on phoenix's old frontiers. It's not that I think NF is the worst thing ever, if if I thought this much, I would of quit daoc in 2004 and never came back. I did the same when Uthgard launched. I go to the server with the most population because it is where the most action is, where the others have less action. I was one of the people who vocalized that I would quit phoenix if NF were launched, not because I have a deep seeded hatred for NF, but because I just have a really fun character on live, and the map there would be the same, and the server with the most population would probably begin to shift back as I know I am not the only one that has characters over there with much more time invested. Once you begin to make the differences less and less, phoenix becomes less unique, those of us from live would rather play live if the population comes back closer to similarity will go there to get our daoc fix if we need it... Yes I hate 900 AF 3k HP casters but I can still destroy them, the map is the same, I can run speed 6 without endo pots or a speed class, and the keep system has no coding flaws with everything already implemented. OF was unique and something that the live service does not have since 15 years ago.

I can agree to an extent but this is still quite different from Live, there's no CL's there's no ToA, and like you said no 4800 HP tanks or casters etc, no RR5 (ouch), no changing template every 2 months, etc.
And I agree if Live had close to this pop I would play there too. But it doesn't. And mostly in my opinion because of the constant added PvE crap they shoved down everyone's throats, along with the most recent changes to pets/necros etc. Basically since BS took over it has gone downhill. Prior to that it was for me prolly at it's best point since the beginning.

I agree, BS has gutted the game...Giving static tempest to all kinds of classes was a recent terrible change that drove a lot of long time live players to leave.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:34 PM by Durandal
Kaseylol wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:28 PM
Durandal wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:17 PM
I retired my realm rank 12 charge tank which is immensely fun on live, to play on phoenix's old frontiers. It's not that I think NF is the worst thing ever, if if I thought this much, I would of quit daoc in 2004 and never came back. I did the same when Uthgard launched. I go to the server with the most population because it is where the most action is, where the others have less action. I was one of the people who vocalized that I would quit phoenix if NF were launched, not because I have a deep seeded hatred for NF, but because I just have a really fun character on live, and the map there would be the same, and the server with the most population would probably begin to shift back as I know I am not the only one that has characters over there with much more time invested. Once you begin to make the differences less and less, phoenix becomes less unique, those of us from live would rather play live if the population comes back closer to similarity will go there to get our daoc fix if we need it... I see many people calling for more changes to make this server more like live, toa, rr5, etc. Yes I hate 900 AF 3k HP casters but I can still destroy them, the map is the same, I can run speed 6 without endo pots or a speed class, and the keep system has no coding flaws with everything already implemented. OF was unique and something that the live service does not have since 15 years ago.

These are all fair points but the problem is that the population is DYING on OF. For months now. Adding to that the overwhelming majority of players voted for NF, it makes no sense to want OF still if your primary goal is more population.

LIVE is nothing like daoc as we know it. It's basically an arcade game now. Bards have root, sorcs have speed 5, everyone has a no timer full red buff pot, you can port anywhere, everyone is fully capped and the same spec, and there's almost zero good players still playing live. I find it hard to believe the map alone will convince players to switch from here to live, and if they did, it would still be less than if we stayed OF based on the vote.

We may also get new players who quit or have never joined Phoenix due to OF, who don't want to pay a sub for live or don't like mythical stat caps etc, so it's a win win either way.

I hope you are right, if many continue to play Phoenix 2 months after the implementation of NF, that would be great....The biggest factor between playing here and on live is population much more so then the actual game differences. Both suck when less then a few hundred are in the frontier, although NF sucks a bit more with a low pop.
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:35 PM by Stoertebecker
teiloh wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:08 PM
Stoertebecker wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:04 PM
WTF, 2 Options...you are Nate or Herorius !!

Well that would explain everything.

He`s not, calm down
Fri 21 Jun 2019 11:22 PM by Delegator
I don't understand why the voting results were categorized by class at all. There was one vote per account, not per class. I have 4 level 50 characters, at least two of whom tried NF. What is the point of saying that my vote belonged to one class or the other?
Fri 21 Jun 2019 11:26 PM by cere2
Delegator wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 11:22 PM
I don't understand why the voting results were categorized by class at all. There was one vote per account, not per class. I have 4 level 50 characters, at least two of whom tried NF. What is the point of saying that my vote belonged to one class or the other?

Because your highest RR toon is typically your main.
I think they wanted to show if certain classes enjoyed OF more or NF more etc.
Surprisingly only 2 classes voted more OF than NF and that was warden and Vale-walker.
This somewhat shows that not "just" the zerglings or the soloists or the 8v8's carried the vote.
Pretty much all classes and therefore game styles voted NF.
Sat 22 Jun 2019 12:14 AM by Bumbles
Fugax wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 12:59 PM
Good lord. The crying brings me back to the last US election when the Democrats didn't get there way, and are still crying to this day. The people of the realms have spoken! Deal with it, and lets kill some nerds together!
#Democracy

Curious, who won the popular vote? As in who had the MOST votes? #yourversionofdemocracyisbroken

This is like saying the masses want NF but because the Hib specific vote was a little closer and have less people who voted we will give their voice more weight than the rest of the server..
Sat 22 Jun 2019 12:19 AM by Bumbles
cere2 wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 11:26 PM
Delegator wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 11:22 PM
I don't understand why the voting results were categorized by class at all. There was one vote per account, not per class. I have 4 level 50 characters, at least two of whom tried NF. What is the point of saying that my vote belonged to one class or the other?

Because your highest RR toon is typically your main.
I think they wanted to show if certain classes enjoyed OF more or NF more etc.
Surprisingly only 2 classes voted more OF than NF and that was warden and Vale-walker.
This somewhat shows that not "just" the zerglings or the soloists or the 8v8's carried the vote.
Pretty much all classes and therefore game styles voted NF.

I wasn't surprised that 70% of Scouts voted for NF. And it was great to see the class specific votes cast. No surprise as well to see that Assassins were almost 50/50 due to how easy they have it in OF being hand fed kills from PKs.
Sat 22 Jun 2019 3:00 AM by Leandrys
Nice stats combined to the vote, gj team Phoenix, very interesting. Pretty ok with the population's decision, even if i think NF needs few tweaks to satisfy more people than what it did in last test (bit easier keeps to capture and archer NPC's LOS fix !!).


Kaseylol wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:28 PM
sorcs have speed 5


Erg, WAT ?
Sat 22 Jun 2019 4:37 AM by Pendalith
Classic bait and switch
Sat 22 Jun 2019 5:23 AM by Myllasia
Democracy is the dictatorship of the majority...
Sat 22 Jun 2019 5:31 AM by dbeattie71
I haven’t logged for a while because of summer and stuff but I’d log if you’re giving away your stuff.
Sat 22 Jun 2019 6:17 AM by AngelRose
Funny thread. Just some random thoughts

1. USA is not a democracy
2. Ywain is garbage. A similar map does not make Phoenix similar to the garbage heap known as ywain.
3. Some of the complaints about finding action, stealth zergs, etc, are valid. But it is mainly just getting used a new map. For example, in OF the 8mans went to emain. On live, they went to the island - same results, just different locations. And if your solo, be very leary of bridges - there will always be stealthers camping. Maybe some of you never played live? Just a couple of suggestions.
4. Why the hell would you ride a boat till the drop off, especially if you have found it dangerous?
Sat 22 Jun 2019 6:30 AM by Nachtfee
I'm curious how it goes now, for me would still Option 3 with changing FZ been the best solution. With NF I treat myself first a well deserved time out
Sat 22 Jun 2019 7:17 AM by teiloh
AngelRose wrote: ↑
Sat 22 Jun 2019 6:17 AM
Funny thread. Just some random thoughts

1. USA is not a democracy
2. Ywain is garbage. A similar map does not make Phoenix similar to the garbage heap known as ywain.
3. Some of the complaints about finding action, stealth zergs, etc, are valid. But it is mainly just getting used a new map. For example, in OF the 8mans went to emain. On live, they went to the island - same results, just different locations. And if your solo, be very leary of bridges - there will always be stealthers camping. Maybe some of you never played live? Just a couple of suggestions.
4. Why the hell would you ride a boat till the drop off, especially if you have found it dangerous?

I learned the map for years. Even if you know it, it's tedious.
Sat 22 Jun 2019 8:22 AM by Hejjin
relvinian wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 8:40 PM
snip...
the siege gear, a guy i know messaged me about getting a huge amount of rps by usuing a catapult during a siege. And this is a great guy.
I am not sure I have ever been accused of being a great guy, but I was certainly the one that sent you a message about the crazy amount of RPs I received during one siege.

relvinian wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 8:40 PM
People just want flash too, that is what new frontier is, six flags over DAOC. Flashy, bigger, newer, um Trash
But if the people want trash, fine.
.
Actually, I mostly want keeps that we are able to defend, if NF keeps could have been placed into OF, then I would have been content with that, but the devs said that was not possible without a huge amount of effort on their part. I was at 2 keep defences yesterday on Dhavon, and both time it ended up the same as previous defences against Hib zergs, shrooms in windows, and GTAoE's blasting the inner keep tower every few seconds making it extremely difficult to recover power / hps as you almost never got out of combat. As someone that was mostly resurrecting and doing spot heals it was horrendous, but hey, I am sure it was good for the Hib Zerg, why else would 140+ of them be on it...

relvinian wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 8:40 PM
But why not make sure its not going to imbalance the game on roll out and will be stable, and address the biggest issues rather than continuing this as a 5 month beta.

Also, as a token of the ENORMOUS GODDAMN CHANGE, players should get free full and realm respecs.
Despite the vote, I do not believe we should immediately swap over to NF, instead I would prefer they initially offer NF as event weekends to start with as that will allow them more time for testing on areas that need to be addressed. NPC archers are most certainly an issue, they appear to have only an initial LoS check on them, once they have seen you, they can fire at you repeatedly regardless of where you go.

I also wonder if it is possible to have both OF and NF, have one be the default, the other be treated like the ToA event where you are required to teleport to those zones. That way those that love OF could stay in that, those that prefer NF could play. Obviously there would still be a lot of unhappy assassins because they will no longer have as few choke-points to gank people...
Sat 22 Jun 2019 11:24 AM by zan
I can't believe this is happening.
Sat 22 Jun 2019 11:29 AM by Durandal
I honestly think the best way to go about it would require a little bit of work, but using both frontiers. The worst way to go about that is by just having it alternate after a given time, need to get the playerbase involved by having it switch based off a victory condition...kind of like continent locking in planetside, but not as fast and drastic...

OF Victory Condition: Realm holds 12 keeps including all of their own, one relic from each realm, and has scored 10000+ kills, 300 solo kills since the switch happened. All conditions met simultaneously

NF Victory Condition: I'm not too sure what the right victory condition should be....Maybe holding all your own keeps, EV structures, having the supply keep and both beach heads in a realm and having 10k kills, 300 solo kills accumulated since the swap...not too sure here what would be the right condition to keep the map up for a decent time but not too long.

Like I said, the right conditions may be different, and could be adjusted. The winning realm could get some kind of bonus applied, and could even be given every single keep in the entire frontier map for the next time it is activated to make things interesting the next time it is swapped to....Just some ideas, but I believe that both frontiers can be used with the right system in place and the rvr gameplay around it could be really engaging and exciting to be apart of, like relic takes of the old times when they actually meant something. Most importantly, don't just have it switch without condition, there needs to be a trigger for a rvr objective...
Sat 22 Jun 2019 7:06 PM by Druth
Well, looking at /servernews it seems which direction we'll go.

Glad they'll at least be improving before we switch.
Sat 22 Jun 2019 7:14 PM by cere2
Druth wrote: ↑
Sat 22 Jun 2019 7:06 PM
Well, looking at /servernews it seems which direction we'll go.

Glad they'll at least be improving before we switch.

I saw the patch notes, but nothing said as to when we are switching....
Sat 22 Jun 2019 7:17 PM by cere2
Hejjin wrote: ↑
Sat 22 Jun 2019 8:22 AM
relvinian wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 8:40 PM
snip...
the siege gear, a guy i know messaged me about getting a huge amount of rps by usuing a catapult during a siege. And this is a great guy.
I am not sure I have ever been accused of being a great guy, but I was certainly the one that sent you a message about the crazy amount of RPs I received during one siege.

relvinian wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 8:40 PM
People just want flash too, that is what new frontier is, six flags over DAOC. Flashy, bigger, newer, um Trash
But if the people want trash, fine.
.
Actually, I mostly want keeps that we are able to defend, if NF keeps could have been placed into OF, then I would have been content with that, but the devs said that was not possible without a huge amount of effort on their part. I was at 2 keep defences yesterday on Dhavon, and both time it ended up the same as previous defences against Hib zergs, shrooms in windows, and GTAoE's blasting the inner keep tower every few seconds making it extremely difficult to recover power / hps as you almost never got out of combat. As someone that was mostly resurrecting and doing spot heals it was horrendous, but hey, I am sure it was good for the Hib Zerg, why else would 140+ of them be on it...

relvinian wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 8:40 PM
But why not make sure its not going to imbalance the game on roll out and will be stable, and address the biggest issues rather than continuing this as a 5 month beta.

Also, as a token of the ENORMOUS GODDAMN CHANGE, players should get free full and realm respecs.
Despite the vote, I do not believe we should immediately swap over to NF, instead I would prefer they initially offer NF as event weekends to start with as that will allow them more time for testing on areas that need to be addressed. NPC archers are most certainly an issue, they appear to have only an initial LoS check on them, once they have seen you, they can fire at you repeatedly regardless of where you go.

I also wonder if it is possible to have both OF and NF, have one be the default, the other be treated like the ToA event where you are required to teleport to those zones. That way those that love OF could stay in that, those that prefer NF could play. Obviously there would still be a lot of unhappy assassins because they will no longer have as few choke-points to gank people...

So 38% of the population that didn't want NF will never play there? And vise versa? How would that be fun for anyone....
I can agree to them having an OF event every now and then but past that, NF was voted on.
If people are going to quit over it so be it, but I highly doubt it is anywhere close to the 38% mark.

PS. Before anyone says something, yes I was going to quit again if OF stayed. But guess what, you all wouldn't have noticed. Kind of like when I quit 2 months ago.
Server will survive and perhaps even rebound a bit, we shall see.
Sat 22 Jun 2019 7:19 PM by Druth
cere2 wrote: ↑
Sat 22 Jun 2019 7:14 PM
Druth wrote: ↑
Sat 22 Jun 2019 7:06 PM
Well, looking at /servernews it seems which direction we'll go.

Glad they'll at least be improving before we switch.

I saw the patch notes, but nothing said as to when we are switching....

So they are changing how boats work because...?
Sat 22 Jun 2019 7:21 PM by cere2
Druth wrote: ↑
Sat 22 Jun 2019 7:19 PM
cere2 wrote: ↑
Sat 22 Jun 2019 7:14 PM
Druth wrote: ↑
Sat 22 Jun 2019 7:06 PM
Well, looking at /servernews it seems which direction we'll go.

Glad they'll at least be improving before we switch.

I saw the patch notes, but nothing said as to when we are switching....

So they are changing how boats work because...?

No I get that, I was just wondering if you had some info I didn't about when they were switching...like what day etc.
Sun 23 Jun 2019 3:12 AM by relvinian
NF will be less shroom cheese during keep takes.
Sun 23 Jun 2019 9:09 AM by Hejjin
relvinian wrote: ↑
Sun 23 Jun 2019 3:12 AM
NF will be less shroom cheese during keep takes.
Something for both of us to rejoice over, unless of course you have gone to the Dark Side on Hib and you are now playing an Animist ;-?.
Sun 23 Jun 2019 10:06 AM by Warlay
Kaseylol wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:28 PM
Durandal wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:17 PM
I retired my realm rank 12 charge tank which is immensely fun on live, to play on phoenix's old frontiers. It's not that I think NF is the worst thing ever, if if I thought this much, I would of quit daoc in 2004 and never came back. I did the same when Uthgard launched. I go to the server with the most population because it is where the most action is, where the others have less action. I was one of the people who vocalized that I would quit phoenix if NF were launched, not because I have a deep seeded hatred for NF, but because I just have a really fun character on live, and the map there would be the same, and the server with the most population would probably begin to shift back as I know I am not the only one that has characters over there with much more time invested. Once you begin to make the differences less and less, phoenix becomes less unique, those of us from live would rather play live if the population comes back closer to similarity will go there to get our daoc fix if we need it... I see many people calling for more changes to make this server more like live, toa, rr5, etc. Yes I hate 900 AF 3k HP casters but I can still destroy them, the map is the same, I can run speed 6 without endo pots or a speed class, and the keep system has no coding flaws with everything already implemented. OF was unique and something that the live service does not have since 15 years ago.

These are all fair points but the problem is that the population is DYING on OF. For months now. Adding to that the overwhelming majority of players voted for NF, it makes no sense to want OF still if your primary goal is more population.

LIVE is nothing like daoc as we know it. It's basically an arcade game now. Bards have root, sorcs have speed 5, everyone has a no timer full red buff pot, you can port anywhere, everyone is fully capped and the same spec, and there's almost zero good players still playing live. I find it hard to believe the map alone will convince players to switch from here to live, and if they did, it would still be less than if we stayed OF based on the vote.

We may also get new players who quit or have never joined Phoenix due to OF, who don't want to pay a sub for live or don't like mythical stat caps etc, so it's a win win either way.
several time i read now that ppl are quitting cause of OF. NO they quitted cause of several strange changes. for example buff changes. Has nothing to do with OF.
Sun 23 Jun 2019 1:24 PM by Shamissa
Warlay wrote: ↑
Sun 23 Jun 2019 10:06 AM
Kaseylol wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:28 PM
Durandal wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 10:17 PM
I retired my realm rank 12 charge tank which is immensely fun on live, to play on phoenix's old frontiers. It's not that I think NF is the worst thing ever, if if I thought this much, I would of quit daoc in 2004 and never came back. I did the same when Uthgard launched. I go to the server with the most population because it is where the most action is, where the others have less action. I was one of the people who vocalized that I would quit phoenix if NF were launched, not because I have a deep seeded hatred for NF, but because I just have a really fun character on live, and the map there would be the same, and the server with the most population would probably begin to shift back as I know I am not the only one that has characters over there with much more time invested. Once you begin to make the differences less and less, phoenix becomes less unique, those of us from live would rather play live if the population comes back closer to similarity will go there to get our daoc fix if we need it... I see many people calling for more changes to make this server more like live, toa, rr5, etc. Yes I hate 900 AF 3k HP casters but I can still destroy them, the map is the same, I can run speed 6 without endo pots or a speed class, and the keep system has no coding flaws with everything already implemented. OF was unique and something that the live service does not have since 15 years ago.

These are all fair points but the problem is that the population is DYING on OF. For months now. Adding to that the overwhelming majority of players voted for NF, it makes no sense to want OF still if your primary goal is more population.

LIVE is nothing like daoc as we know it. It's basically an arcade game now. Bards have root, sorcs have speed 5, everyone has a no timer full red buff pot, you can port anywhere, everyone is fully capped and the same spec, and there's almost zero good players still playing live. I find it hard to believe the map alone will convince players to switch from here to live, and if they did, it would still be less than if we stayed OF based on the vote.

We may also get new players who quit or have never joined Phoenix due to OF, who don't want to pay a sub for live or don't like mythical stat caps etc, so it's a win win either way.
several time i read now that ppl are quitting cause of OF. NO they quitted cause of several strange changes. for example buff changes. Has nothing to do with OF.

They might quit for while in cause they are mad. But truly Daoc player will always come back.
Sun 23 Jun 2019 6:11 PM by Lordzolio
Why did we come to Phoenix ??

https://www.reddit.com/r/CamelotUnchained/comments/a6d8zx/phoenix_daoc_dark_age_of_camelot_freeshard/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HztPIrS5UZc

This is why i came to play OLD SCHOOL DAOC if i wanted to play NF I would have stayed on live......

Populations is already down, and bet your ass even more when NF goes Live...

This is why people came to phoenix in the first place OLD SCHOOL DAOC OLD FRONTIERS.. No ToA .. etc...

Honestly, how many people would have left live and Uthgard to come phoenix if it was NF from day one ??

Half ? more ? less ?
Sun 23 Jun 2019 6:16 PM by cere2
Lordzolio wrote: ↑
Sun 23 Jun 2019 6:11 PM
Why did we come to Phoenix ??

https://www.reddit.com/r/CamelotUnchained/comments/a6d8zx/phoenix_daoc_dark_age_of_camelot_freeshard/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HztPIrS5UZc

This is why i came to play OLD SCHOOL DAOC if i wanted to play NF I would have stayed on live......

Populations is already down, and bet your ass even more when NF goes Live...

This is why people came to phoenix in the first place OLD SCHOOL DAOC OLD FRONTIERS.. No ToA .. etc...

Honestly, how many people would have left live and Uthgard to come phoenix if it was NF from day one ??

Half ? more ? less ?

Mr. Wizard,
Please enlighten us all on how if 61.55% voted for NF that it is a detriment to the server?
And perhaps you came to phoenix for old school Daoc, but not all of us did.
Some came because it was going to be custom server and they promised to listen to the community.
Which by seeing how the vote was by far NF, they are listening.
Saying that population will decrease in the future is not rocket science, that is happening regardless of what is or is not implemented.
Sorry you didn't get your way but either adjust or there is always OF still in Uthgard.
Had it stayed OF, I would have bailed back to Live, but it didn't so here I am.
Sun 23 Jun 2019 6:39 PM by Lordzolio
cere2 wrote: ↑
Sun 23 Jun 2019 6:16 PM
Lordzolio wrote: ↑
Sun 23 Jun 2019 6:11 PM
Why did we come to Phoenix ??

https://www.reddit.com/r/CamelotUnchained/comments/a6d8zx/phoenix_daoc_dark_age_of_camelot_freeshard/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HztPIrS5UZc

This is why i came to play OLD SCHOOL DAOC if i wanted to play NF I would have stayed on live......

Populations is already down, and bet your ass even more when NF goes Live...

This is why people came to phoenix in the first place OLD SCHOOL DAOC OLD FRONTIERS.. No ToA .. etc...

Honestly, how many people would have left live and Uthgard to come phoenix if it was NF from day one ??

Half ? more ? less ?

Mr. Wizard,
Please enlighten us all on how if 61.55% voted for NF that it is a detriment to the server?
And perhaps you came to phoenix for old school Daoc, but not all of us did.
Some came because it was going to be custom server and they promised to listen to the community.
Which by seeing how the vote was by far NF, they are listening.
Saying that population will decrease in the future is not rocket science, that is happening regardless of what is or is not implemented.
Sorry you didn't get your way but either adjust or there is always OF still in Uthgard.
Had it stayed OF, I would have bailed back to Live, but it didn't so here I am.

I am sorry i dont remember saying it was a " detriment to the server" My reason for coming to phoenix is what they advertised.
So i wont be staying but you are GRATZ ... you win , but u would be going if OF won so whats your point really.. NF won OF lost ...THE PEOPLE HAVE SPOKEN......
Sun 23 Jun 2019 7:06 PM by Draygon
Lordzolio wrote: ↑
Sun 23 Jun 2019 6:39 PM
cere2 wrote: ↑
Sun 23 Jun 2019 6:16 PM
Lordzolio wrote: ↑
Sun 23 Jun 2019 6:11 PM
Why did we come to Phoenix ??

https://www.reddit.com/r/CamelotUnchained/comments/a6d8zx/phoenix_daoc_dark_age_of_camelot_freeshard/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HztPIrS5UZc

This is why i came to play OLD SCHOOL DAOC if i wanted to play NF I would have stayed on live......

Populations is already down, and bet your ass even more when NF goes Live...

This is why people came to phoenix in the first place OLD SCHOOL DAOC OLD FRONTIERS.. No ToA .. etc...

Honestly, how many people would have left live and Uthgard to come phoenix if it was NF from day one ??

Half ? more ? less ?

Mr. Wizard,
Please enlighten us all on how if 61.55% voted for NF that it is a detriment to the server?
And perhaps you came to phoenix for old school Daoc, but not all of us did.
Some came because it was going to be custom server and they promised to listen to the community.
Which by seeing how the vote was by far NF, they are listening.
Saying that population will decrease in the future is not rocket science, that is happening regardless of what is or is not implemented.
Sorry you didn't get your way but either adjust or there is always OF still in Uthgard.
Had it stayed OF, I would have bailed back to Live, but it didn't so here I am.

I am sorry i dont remember saying it was a " detriment to the server" My reason for coming to phoenix is what they advertised.
So i wont be staying but you are GRATZ ... you win , but u would be going if OF won so whats your point really.. NF won OF lost ...THE PEOPLE HAVE SPOKEN......

To say you came for an old school DAoC experience is such a bad statement. The server has never been "old daoc" it went live with NF RAs, it went live with a much better/faster exp than old daoc, it went live with many more custom changes. This has NEVER been a classic server. Perhaps you may have thought it was but in case you havent noticed the dev's listen to what the community wants and over half of those playing voted to have NF. Does this mean some will be butthurt and leave, sure, but I'd counter with I think other players will come to/come back for NF and in the end the server will find balance. Your choices are Pheonix or Uthgard, by all means you can go back to the other server, but I would hope that all the butthurt people realize that "classic" is not wanted and would never survive in today's gaming climate. It is/was far to restrictive and did not allow for multiple choices in terms of how you RvR. I hope people learn to adapt and move on.
Mon 24 Jun 2019 10:43 AM by Lev
Turano wrote: ↑
Fri 21 Jun 2019 7:59 PM
-too many guards with too much damage (even after the nerf)
-archers guards dealing insane amounts of damage (even after the nerf)
-archer guards shooting through walls
-docks are the new milegates, and you have to stay there, talk to the damn merchant, fumble around in your inventory and give him the damn ticket to get a boat. By the time you've done that you have been killed 50% of the time, gratz
-(stealther)zergs are now unpredictable and therefor unavoidable, every bridge and dock can and will be their playground now
-8man groups running around for 30+ minutes without inc (of another 8 man, they will farm the solos nontheless)
-you either go to where the zerg is (mostly where something is burning on the map) to get any kind of action or die of boredom. If you avoid that zone(s) you might as well log out
-classes without speed are shafted even more than in OF
-eternal boat sailing tours just to land in a boat dropoff point camp group
-people that don't like keep/towerraids have no real way of avoiding them, because they are EVERYWHERE
-siege weapons deal insane amounts of damage to players while their real purpose, shooting holes in keep walls and bringing down towers, is not even implemented
-some classes are just useless in keepfights (which are the main selling point of NF, yay)

These are just some points I have seen raised over the last 2 weeks both ingame and here on the board.
You have been way more active here than I have and you tell me you havn't seen any of that?
great post. exactly my thoughts, especially the bold part.
Mon 24 Jun 2019 1:24 PM by Bobbahunter
Old frontiers. New Frontiers.

It’s alllllllll old school DAoC Lol. This game is old. But there is no TOA. Way easier to lvl. This server is an idea of what old school was with QOL for us old farts that can’t spend years leveling and tweaking toon.
Yes NF might be here but so are the people that you love to hate or hate to love.
I play for the nostalgia and to play with friends.
Mon 24 Jun 2019 3:06 PM by Anelyn77
Bobbahunter wrote: ↑
Mon 24 Jun 2019 1:24 PM
Old frontiers. New Frontiers.

It’s alllllllll old school DAoC Lol. This game is old. But there is no TOA. Way easier to lvl. This server is an idea of what old school was with QOL for us old farts that can’t spend years leveling and tweaking toon.
Yes NF might be here but so are the people that you love to hate or hate to love.
I play for the nostalgia and to play with friends.

That's what it all comes down to. As long as you're here with your friends (be in on alb hib or mid) and having fun doing whatever you're doing, that's all that matters. You got it right bud <3

/Bnotashamed 4L7 Pac Healer + Aicha 5L5 Mentalist
Mon 24 Jun 2019 7:15 PM by Pirhana7
Some things to consider

Alot of people who logged in to find the NF test thought that it was a normal patch and that the game was now NF from here on out. They logged off mad and didn't log back in. I remember seeing alot of rage quiting that week. So a lot of those people never came back to vote for OF. as well as a lot of people who were going to take a break because of it. ( I did, and I missed the vote)


I also feel that if you keep OF the players that want NF will still keep playing because OF was what it already was and they played through it and have already dealt with it. BUT if you change to NF a huge number of OF fans will quit.

A lot of people have said it . If I want to play NF I can go play on Broadsword. But if I want to play OF I cant really go play on Uthgard because it has like 20-50 players left. Those are actual numbers if you go to the site and check.
Mon 24 Jun 2019 7:57 PM by Kaseylol
Pirhana7 wrote: ↑
Mon 24 Jun 2019 7:15 PM
Some things to consider

Alot of people who logged in to find the NF test thought that it was a normal patch and that the game was now NF from here on out. They logged off mad and didn't log back in. I remember seeing alot of rage quiting that week. So a lot of those people never came back to vote for OF. as well as a lot of people who were going to take a break because of it. ( I did, and I missed the vote)


I also feel that if you keep OF the players that want NF will still keep playing because OF was what it already was and they played through it and have already dealt with it. BUT if you change to NF a huge number of OF fans will quit.

A lot of people have said it . If I want to play NF I can go play on Broadsword. But if I want to play OF I cant really go play on Uthgard because it has like 20-50 players left. Those are actual numbers if you go to the site and check.

Alot of people who logged in to find the OF setting over the past year thought that it was a normal patch and that the game was OF from here on out. They logged off mad and didn't log back in. I remember seeing alot of rage quiting that year. So a lot of those people never came back to vote for NF. as well as a lot of people who were going to take a break because of it. ( I did, and I missed the vote)

Applies both ways, mate.
Mon 24 Jun 2019 8:13 PM by cere2
Pirhana7 wrote: ↑
Mon 24 Jun 2019 7:15 PM
Some things to consider

Alot of people who logged in to find the NF test thought that it was a normal patch and that the game was now NF from here on out. They logged off mad and didn't log back in. I remember seeing alot of rage quiting that week. So a lot of those people never came back to vote for OF. as well as a lot of people who were going to take a break because of it. ( I did, and I missed the vote)


I also feel that if you keep OF the players that want NF will still keep playing because OF was what it already was and they played through it and have already dealt with it. BUT if you change to NF a huge number of OF fans will quit.

A lot of people have said it . If I want to play NF I can go play on Broadsword. But if I want to play OF I cant really go play on Uthgard because it has like 20-50 players left. Those are actual numbers if you go to the site and check.

If the vote was within 4% you might have an argument there. But it wasn't even close.
Everyone in /advice /region all responded it was a week long test with a /vote at the end.
People rage quit because they couldn't read?
Come on now....you can do better, this doesn't pass the smell test.
Mon 24 Jun 2019 8:25 PM by Anelyn77
Wait what? A HUGE NUMBER OF PLAYERS WILL QUIT? If they move to NF?

Where do you get this from Piranha? Do you have any factual evidence, or your magic 8-ball let you in to the future?

Come on guys stop with the nonsense.

It's summer. For past week our huge alliance had very few active players - because holidays / trips / breaks what not. Nobody quit. It's expected. That does not mean BOOO NF coming we all quit.

Want a reality check? Start a thread and name it "I quit when NF comes who is with me?". Let's see how many active players not forum surfers / trolls will post there and quit if NF comes. Do it, I dare you.

Peace out.

/Bnotashamed + Aicha
Mon 24 Jun 2019 10:24 PM by cuuchulain79
Anelyn77 wrote: ↑
Mon 24 Jun 2019 8:25 PM
Wait what? A HUGE NUMBER OF PLAYERS WILL QUIT? If they move to NF?

Where do you get this from Piranha? Do you have any factual evidence, or your magic 8-ball let you in to the future?

Come on guys stop with the nonsense.

It's summer. For past week our huge alliance had very few active players - because holidays / trips / breaks what not. Nobody quit. It's expected. That does not mean BOOO NF coming we all quit.

Want a reality check? Start a thread and name it "I quit when NF comes who is with me?". Let's see how many active players not forum surfers / trolls will post there and quit if NF comes. Do it, I dare you.

Peace out.

/Bnotashamed + Aicha

It's so sweet to see the 'it's just summer' explanation. <3

Followed by asking somebody else to do a reality check....priceless
Tue 25 Jun 2019 4:29 PM by tweedledumb99
cuuchulain79 wrote: ↑
Mon 24 Jun 2019 10:24 PM
Anelyn77 wrote: ↑
Mon 24 Jun 2019 8:25 PM
Wait what? A HUGE NUMBER OF PLAYERS WILL QUIT? If they move to NF?

Where do you get this from Piranha? Do you have any factual evidence, or your magic 8-ball let you in to the future?

Come on guys stop with the nonsense.

It's summer. For past week our huge alliance had very few active players - because holidays / trips / breaks what not. Nobody quit. It's expected. That does not mean BOOO NF coming we all quit.

Want a reality check? Start a thread and name it "I quit when NF comes who is with me?". Let's see how many active players not forum surfers / trolls will post there and quit if NF comes. Do it, I dare you.

Peace out.

/Bnotashamed + Aicha

It's so sweet to see the 'it's just summer' explanation. <3

Followed by asking somebody else to do a reality check....priceless

It's summer in NA and EU which is 80%+ of Phoenix pop, and people play less video games during summer.

It's that simple.
Tue 25 Jun 2019 4:37 PM by Runental
No summer for PK at least, - they live deep down in Siberia! 😁
Tue 25 Jun 2019 8:01 PM by Sushi
Adios Phoenix..
Tue 25 Jun 2019 8:04 PM by cere2
Sushi wrote: ↑
Tue 25 Jun 2019 8:01 PM
Adios Phoenix..

Te veo manana.
Tue 25 Jun 2019 8:05 PM by Sushi
cere2 wrote: ↑
Tue 25 Jun 2019 8:04 PM
Sushi wrote: ↑
Tue 25 Jun 2019 8:01 PM
Adios Phoenix..

Te veo manana.

No... I think it's over now...
Tue 25 Jun 2019 8:31 PM by imissswg
Pirhana7 wrote: ↑
Mon 24 Jun 2019 7:15 PM
Some things to consider

Alot of people who logged in to find the NF test thought that it was a normal patch and that the game was now NF from here on out. They logged off mad and didn't log back in. I remember seeing alot of rage quiting that week. So a lot of those people never came back to vote for OF. as well as a lot of people who were going to take a break because of it. ( I did, and I missed the vote)


I also feel that if you keep OF the players that want NF will still keep playing because OF was what it already was and they played through it and have already dealt with it. BUT if you change to NF a huge number of OF fans will quit.

A lot of people have said it . If I want to play NF I can go play on Broadsword. But if I want to play OF I cant really go play on Uthgard because it has like 20-50 players left. Those are actual numbers if you go to the site and check.

I missed the vote as well because I didn't log that week (or this week for that matter), but for different reasons. The combo of damage shield nerfs, salvage nerfs, and their inexplicable refusal to up the duration of the buff pots has killed my motivation to log in.

By the way, if I did vote, it would have been for NF, so I would have cancelled your vote out
Tue 25 Jun 2019 8:50 PM by Ashenspire
Damage shields were over tuned. That's not nerfing, that's fixing. They never should've performed that well to begin with, and they certainly never did on live.

Salvage issues caused Hibernia's economy to become massively over inflated. Unfortunately the damage was already done at this point so this change did suck.

Potion timers are fine as a gold sink. The game needs one.
Tue 25 Jun 2019 8:51 PM by Ashenspire
Also, I don't understand bringing up Broadsword and Uthgard.

If 20-50 people on Uthgard is a problem for those that want to go play OF, why isn't 20-50 people PLUS a subscription not a problem for those that should go play on Live if they want NF?
Tue 25 Jun 2019 10:05 PM by gotwqqd
Ashenspire wrote: ↑
Tue 25 Jun 2019 8:50 PM
Damage shields were over tuned. That's not nerfing, that's fixing. They never should've performed that well to begin with, and they certainly never did on live.

Salvage issues caused Hibernia's economy to become massively over inflated. Unfortunately the damage was already done at this point so this change did suck.

Potion timers are fine as a gold sink. The game needs one.
No
Potion timers are a complete pita!
Gold sink fine...up the cost x3 and have them last 30 min.
You could likely have them last 45-60 min and still have the same overall cost in gold as you may die in the first 5 minutes
Wed 26 Jun 2019 12:40 AM by Solicfear
I think people need to take a step back here and see that Phoenix devs and the team are trying to make this game fair. They've been brilliant at communicating with the community and engaging with them and continue to poll the community on what they want. I don't think NF is a bad thing and if 65% of the community wanted it then it should be implemented.

I think it's really unfair to tell Phoenix they are wrong. They listen to the community and they implement what you want. If you went back to live servers such as Broadsword, nothing get's implemented or decided for 2-3 years until its to late. Phoenix are working hard to keep the population afloat and if they don't make changes here and there then the population will decline fast. They need to keep the game moving or players will be demotivated and move onto something else.

I understand NF isn't everyone cup of tea but since the population is declining it is probably the best way to go as OF is so big. NF has it's good points and bad points but I think for the time being I think it's a good idea they are switching. It's quite possibly they might bring OF back after the summer when population rises. They may ask the question again if they want OF to return, so it's not all dead and buried.

I think Phoenix are doing a brilliant job, just a shame I don't have much time for this game anymore.

Keep up the good work Phoenix, u have made this game amazing again for those that lost faith in Broadsword live servers!

/salute
Wed 26 Jun 2019 8:00 PM by imissswg
Overall, I think the Phoenix staff has done a fantastic job. I mean, it took them a few months to add a feature (Jewelcrafting) that live hasn't done in 18 years, along with a few other things Live should have done. I just wish they'd either do away with pots, up the timer (even if it meant higher material cost), or add NPC buffers like live has.

Ashenspire wrote: ↑
Tue 25 Jun 2019 8:50 PM
Damage shields were over tuned. That's not nerfing, that's fixing. They never should've performed that well to begin with, and they certainly never did on live.

Salvage issues caused Hibernia's economy to become massively over inflated. Unfortunately the damage was already done at this point so this change did suck.

Potion timers are fine as a gold sink. The game needs one.

I hadn't played live in 8 years and when I did, I always had a bot for my damage shield farmers, so I'm not in the position to argue if you're correct or not, but it was a PvE, issue, so who cares?

My understanding was the issue with Hib was level 50 mobs were dropping the 10/15 arc salvage items, while Mid and Alb only OJ and up mobs were dropping them. How hard would it have been to just nerf the level 50 mobs in Hib dropping those items instead of screwing everyone?

I'm fine with gold sinks. I'm not fine with constantly having to rebuff every 10 minutes even when I don't die.
Wed 26 Jun 2019 8:24 PM by Kaseylol
https://playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?t=9941
Sat 29 Jun 2019 12:16 AM by Moid
AngelRose wrote: ↑
Sat 22 Jun 2019 6:17 AM
Funny thread. Just some random thoughts

1. USA is not a democracy

As was Rome, at least for a time, the USA is in fact a Republic guaranteed so by our very own constitution. I fondly remember (sarcasm) learning all about how ours is a democracy while being forced by law to attend our indoctrination system, er I mean education system. I’m an old guy so I shudder to think how bad our kids have it now in the re-education camps they are forced to attend.

Article IV Section 4
The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened), against domestic Violence.
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