bleed OP - Phoenix Freeshard

bleeds now stack, for pets / players up to a value of 200...

i test it.. now infi and merce can easy do 200 dmg from bleed tick.... this is insane

Fri 19 Jun 2020 12:57 PM by Nunki

canzian wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 12:07 PM
bleeds now stack, for pets / players up to a value of 200...

i test it.. now infi and merce can easy do 200 dmg from bleed tick.... this is insane

How is the damage calulation?

7 damage per tick for 40 seconds?
One tick is every 4 seconds?

Does that mean you need 28 bleeding styles to reach the 200 dmg per tick?
What did I miss?

Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:01 PM by canzian

Nunki wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 12:57 PM
canzian wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 12:07 PM
bleeds now stack, for pets / players up to a value of 200...

i test it.. now infi and merce can easy do 200 dmg from bleed tick.... this is insane

How is the damage calulation?

7 damage per tick for 40 seconds?
One tick is every 4 seconds?

Does that mean you need 28 bleeding styles to reach the 200 dmg per tick?
What did I miss?

duble shadow ( 13 bled for infi 25 for merce, and evade style 15 dmg from dark tendris ) if not for 200, is easy tick for 120-150... and NS and SB not have good bleed style like a infi
and for mercenray, just 8 duble shadow for hit for 200 dmg
this is useles for 8v8 or zerg, but is insane for stealther comunity

Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:34 PM by Nunki

canzian wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:01 PM
Nunki wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 12:57 PM
canzian wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 12:07 PM
bleeds now stack, for pets / players up to a value of 200...

i test it.. now infi and merce can easy do 200 dmg from bleed tick.... this is insane

How is the damage calulation?

7 damage per tick for 40 seconds?
One tick is every 4 seconds?

Does that mean you need 28 bleeding styles to reach the 200 dmg per tick?
What did I miss?

duble shadow ( 13 bled for infi 25 for merce, and evade style 15 dmg from dark tendris ) if not for 200, is easy tick for 120-150... and NS and SB not have good bleed style like a infi
and for mercenray, just 8 duble shadow for hit for 200 dmg
this is useles for 8v8 or zerg, but is insane for stealther comunity

Gosh.

I expected that they would modify bleeding values for all clases. That difference is insance.

Why does the lvl 50 spear style (Hunter) do 11 dmg (with lower attack speed and higher endu cost AND it is a damn sidestyle),
while DoubleShadow of Inf and Merc does 13/25 damage?

What is the argument behind that?

They should scale the damage by "skillpoints required", "type of style" and "attack speed/endu cost" as soon as possible...

Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:39 PM by tommccartney

Mid is mainly Hammer which has no bleed, LA has a crappy back bleed, and h2h has none.

Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:48 PM by joshisanonymous

tommccartney wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:39 PM
Mid is mainly Hammer which has no bleed, LA has a crappy back bleed, and h2h has none.

I'm guessing part of the change is to make other melee lines more appealing. IIRC, Mid axe (regular axe) has a lot of bleed styles?

Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:48 PM by Blitze

It would be nice to see the DPS of a merc with fast weapons swinging at 1.5spd cap with dual shadows 25dmg Stacking bleed....

Should be 25 on first tick then 75 Damage 4sec later on tick 2. Then 125damage on tick 3 then 200ish damage from Tick 4 onwards.

So after a 16seconds Ramp up you have a 200 damage DoT, that won’t break you out of mezz/root.

Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:55 PM by labra

do bleedings from the same style stack or does it need to come from different styles to stacks?

Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:58 PM by Saroi

Blitze wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:48 PM
It would be nice to see the DPS of a merc with fast weapons swinging at 1.5spd cap with dual shadows 25dmg Stacking bleed....

Should be 25 on first tick then 75 Damage 4sec later on tick 2. Then 125damage on tick 3 then 200ish damage from Tick 4 onwards.

So after a 16seconds Ramp up you have a 200 damage DoT, that won’t break you out of mezz/root.

You still have to consider resists. Merc will hit for 18-19 damage per bleed. The cap is 200 without resist, with 26% resist it is 148 damage max.

https://imgur.com/a/XLe2g1A

Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:59 PM by Saroi

labra wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:55 PM
do bleedings from the same style stack or does it need to come from different styles to stacks?

All bleeds stack together, doesn't matter if same style or different

Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:03 PM by labra

maybe the solution is to allow stacking only from different styles.

Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:06 PM by zan

What about bleed not breaking CC anymore? Why do it also need this huge dumb dmg boost?
How about 1 month without some new stupid custom change nobody asked for

Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:12 PM by labra

checking hib styles.
Couldn't find any bleeding anytime.
Many are reactive, few positionnals, and vastly in end of chain.

Only positionnal giving a bleeding is LW Hibernian Force (side), bleeding for... 4

gotta be long to stack to 200 dmg

Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:26 PM by

Uthred

After the next reboot in about 50 mins from now, it will only stack up to a value of 50.

Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:28 PM by labra

Uthred wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:26 PM
After the next reboot in about 50 mins from now, it will only stack up to a value of 50.

good call

what about only allowing stacking from different style?

Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:33 PM by gromet12

joshisanonymous wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:48 PM
tommccartney wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:39 PM
Mid is mainly Hammer which has no bleed, LA has a crappy back bleed, and h2h has none.

I'm guessing part of the change is to make other melee lines more appealing. IIRC, Mid axe (regular axe) has a lot of bleed styles?

Axe does not have a lot of bleeds, it has them but not to easy effect as Alb

50 style follow-up frontal does 9
Back style does 6 positional
Evade style does 7 positional

The only ones that get a decent DPS boost from this change are mercs and Infy, which have higher bleed on dual shadows frontal

Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:35 PM by joshisanonymous

gromet12 wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:33 PM
joshisanonymous wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:48 PM
tommccartney wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:39 PM
Mid is mainly Hammer which has no bleed, LA has a crappy back bleed, and h2h has none.

I'm guessing part of the change is to make other melee lines more appealing. IIRC, Mid axe (regular axe) has a lot of bleed styles?
Axe does not have a lot of bleeds, it has them but not to easy effect as Alb

50 style follow-up frontal does 9
Back style does 6 positional
Evade style does 7 positional

The only ones that get a decent DPS boost from this change are mercs and Infy, which have higher bleed on dual shadows frontal

I see. If that's the case, I'm curious if that'll be addressed at all when styles are changed.

Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:37 PM by gromet12

Uthred wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:26 PM
After the next reboot in about 50 mins from now, it will only stack up to a value of 50.

Give the 25 bleed to all lite tanks and heavy tanks, there DPS suffered here by moving a lot of hybrids up on the dmg factor table. Same spec warrior vs skald does 20% higher dmg using same weapon and same styles with str difference being less than 15, but when you add skald dmg add its more dmg on the skald vs warrior, when you add DD every 15secs the war is not even close anymore

Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:45 PM by gromet12

labra wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:28 PM
Uthred wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:26 PM
After the next reboot in about 50 mins from now, it will only stack up to a value of 50.

good call

what about only allowing stacking from different style?

Bleeds should add up, but it should be a way to increase dmg of the tanks (lite and heavy) vs the hybrid luxury that exists here

Fri 19 Jun 2020 3:15 PM by Cadebrennus

gromet12 wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:33 PM
joshisanonymous wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:48 PM
tommccartney wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:39 PM
Mid is mainly Hammer which has no bleed, LA has a crappy back bleed, and h2h has none.

I'm guessing part of the change is to make other melee lines more appealing. IIRC, Mid axe (regular axe) has a lot of bleed styles?
Axe does not have a lot of bleeds, it has them but not to easy effect as Alb

50 style follow-up frontal does 9
Back style does 6 positional
Evade style does 7 positional

The only ones that get a decent DPS boost from this change are mercs and Infy, which have higher bleed on dual shadows frontal

Inf gets 13 per tick, Merc 40. This barely helps the Merc (negligible). It does help other classes catch up with their positionals and styles other than positionals.

Fri 19 Jun 2020 3:42 PM by gromet12

Cadebrennus wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 3:15 PM
gromet12 wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:33 PM
joshisanonymous wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:48 PM
I'm guessing part of the change is to make other melee lines more appealing. IIRC, Mid axe (regular axe) has a lot of bleed styles?
Axe does not have a lot of bleeds, it has them but not to easy effect as Alb

50 style follow-up frontal does 9
Back style does 6 positional
Evade style does 7 positional

The only ones that get a decent DPS boost from this change are mercs and Infy, which have higher bleed on dual shadows frontal

Inf gets 13 per tick, Merc 40. This barely helps the Merc (negligible). It does help other classes catch up with their positionals and styles other than positionals.

I don't think any other class has such easy to apply bleeds as the Merc/Infy (frontal requirement) and those are the hardest hitting bleeds for some reason with a good GR style. It should get addressed, and the simple solution is to up the bleed dmg of the lite and heavy tanks to help their dmg, hybrids typically have something else already. Ie...Skald w/ dmg add song running hits harder than warrior using same styles/same weapon and that is not even taking into account the 2 15sec rut DD's

Fri 19 Jun 2020 4:09 PM by Blitze

In the current state this change has made bleeds not a negative In 8v8.

It seems Merc/inf are the only classes that will be able to get some damage rewards. Merc especially as
1V1s usually last 30s to a 1 min and doing 148 tick every 4 sec will add up to ~1500 damage over 40s (after initial 20s ramp)

Fri 19 Jun 2020 4:28 PM by Saroi

Blitze wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 4:09 PM
In the current state this change has made bleeds not a negative In 8v8.

It seems Merc/inf are the only classes that will be able to get some damage rewards. Merc especially as
1V1s usually last 30s to a 1 min and doing 148 tick every 4 sec will add up to ~1500 damage over 40s (after initial 20s ramp)

It has already been changed and the cap is 50 now

Fri 19 Jun 2020 4:31 PM by tommccartney

joshisanonymous wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:48 PM
tommccartney wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 1:39 PM
Mid is mainly Hammer which has no bleed, LA has a crappy back bleed, and h2h has none.

I'm guessing part of the change is to make other melee lines more appealing. IIRC, Mid axe (regular axe) has a lot of bleed styles?

I guess so but all of Mids melee utility is in hammer line

where as a thrust merc/BM can have bleeds/snares/slam, I dunno I guess we’ll see how it all pans out

Fri 19 Jun 2020 7:10 PM by gotwqqd

Uthred wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 2:26 PM
After the next reboot in about 50 mins from now, it will only stack up to a value of 50.

I think 75 would have been correct choice

Fri 19 Jun 2020 7:10 PM by gotwqqd

Blitze wrote: ↑
Fri 19 Jun 2020 4:09 PM
In the current state this change has made bleeds not a negative In 8v8.

It seems Merc/inf are the only classes that will be able to get some damage rewards. Merc especially as
1V1s usually last 30s to a 1 min and doing 148 tick every 4 sec will add up to ~1500 damage over 40s (after initial 20s ramp)

CD has a high bleed style